Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2018/2019 Part Two

Backstreet Moyes · 04-12-2018 01:44PM

When Herrera and Fred play we do move the ball much quicker.

Matic and Fellaini are not quick passers and Pogba takes way to much time on the ball.

Mitch Connor · 04-12-2018 01:51PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Fred performances when he has played pour cold water on the poor movement theory tbh, with good quick simple passing and movement he controls the tempo when he plays, but Pogba takes too much out of the ball constantly and is allergic to simple quick passing it seems

We have very different opinions on Fred's performances. I've seen him struggle to control the ball, never mind the tempo.

I don't think we see good movement from any players when anyone gets on the ball in centre mid - and I include Pogba in that in terms of movement.

Mitch Connor · 04-12-2018 01:53PM

Nuts102 wrote: »

When Herrera and Fred play we do move the ball much quicker.

Matic and Fellaini are not quick passers and Pogba takes way to much time on the ball.

IMO that is cause Pogba is looking to create, Herrera and Fred are looking to move it on.

TheDoc · 04-12-2018 01:53PM

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

I couldn’t have put it better myself, I think there is misplaced fixation on Mourinho from a large part of the fan base just because of the character he is.

Unfortunately it’ll take yet another manager failing before they start to see, I’ll be behind the next manager but it’ll take Fergie 2.0 and a massive change at board level to fix this an we will not be so lucky.

It really isn't.

You only have to look at Arsenal, or Everton, to see what can be achieved quickly with a proper manager with a plan, idea, proper authority and moves to play in a way the players will enjoy.

Talking wider about the clubs issues are correct and valid, but no one should kid themselves that

a) Jose is not the primary and majority share of the issue at the club
b) A proper managerial appointment will bring positive vibes and progress back at the club quickly.

TheDoc · 04-12-2018 01:56PM

Claude Burgundy wrote: »

"we'll finish above Everton"....................wow, just wow.

United's targets have gone from winning the Champions League, to winning the Premier League, to qualifying for the Champions League, to finishing above Everton, all in 10 years. The ambition is truly overwhelming...

He couldnt help himself throwing in about their expenditure aswell.

Such an embarrassment week after week. Really has gone so horribly wrong but just as much as many people predicted.

Doesn't deserve to manage illustrious clubs, let him off to manage underdogs where he can rule the roost and remind everyone how he used to be a big deal

Drumpot · 04-12-2018 01:57PM

yourdeadwright wrote: »

It should happen but United under the Glazer's are all about the stock markets , Pogba is basically a top brand as instead of a top footballer so it ain't going to happen,

Agreed and that in itself sends a message to the squad on what the club values right now.

Chelsea players down tools every 3 seasons but at least they win top honours. How can Chelsea win trophies with all different kind of managers and our fans are content with identifying our managers as our problem ? Is David Moyes a worse coach then Di Matteo who won the champions league ? Is Jose worse then Avram Grant who nearly won the league and champions league double ? Hell look at Pelligrini or Mancini at City, even City's setup lends itself to success no matter who the coach is, its because both clubs are setup to help the first team thrive. The high coach turnover works for these clubs cause they know what they are doing and they don't care about signing big names or marketable players.

How can any united fan , whether they want Jose out or not, not be extremely concerned with the manner in which the clubs resources are being used ? How can any fan not be concerned or suspect that our owners are not buying all players specifically for the team/manager? How can any United fan not see there is no obvious competent footballing strategy at the club? The one constant thing during this poor period for United is the owners taking a more hands on role in the footballing side of things by making Woodward the CEO. These things don't get sorted by Jose being sacked!

TheDoc · 04-12-2018 01:58PM

Your Airbag wrote: »

Josourinho is restricting Manchester United, claims Paul Pogba [Paul Hirst, The Times]

Looks like we got a Mexican standoff on our hands.

Take it with a pinch of salt as it says "Pogba is thought to have responded to Mourinho" and I'm not sure how reliable Hirst is for inside scoops.

This season is just getting messy now and stressful. It wasn't this divided under Moyes and LVG.

I have never, EVER come across a team that has as many dressing room leaks as ours. Its so abundantly clear this is a disgrace.

Manager using his mouth piece to shift blame from him. And players then feeling the need to respond back.

Sack the manager, and stern warning to the players about leaking inside stuff out to the press.

Woodward is the boss here, bollox to the notion he needs to stay out of the football affairs. He is responsible for the reputation of the club being pissed on by this mess. Needs to, if he hasn't already, get personally involved and start lashing some people out of it.

Your Airbag · 04-12-2018 02:00PM

Drumpot wrote: »

I never said I approved of the manner in which Jose trys to motivate or manage players. You are welcome to go through my posts to find me saying that. You guys seem to confuse not presuming the worst on everything on Jose as absolving him of responsibility for his actions. You know what goes on behind closed doors no more then I do, the difference is how we interpret what little information we get.

I have no problem with Pogba talking these things over with the manager either, but thats not what happened is it ? Pogba was whinging in interviews for a month complaining after every game ? How is that progressive or calm ? He looked for a public spat with the manager and when Jose finally responded (he shouldn't have) some people ignored what Pogba had been doing and jumped to "aha, see Jose is a bad manager".

In terms of character, Jose is correct. The amount of times people agree wit what Jose says and then turn it against him in a "you cant say that" is quite remarkable. Feeds into the weak snowflake feel of this squad.

A lot of the united squad has shown a lack of character long before Jose joined so why are people upset with Jose shaking things up?. I don't agree in him making it public but that's what he has always done and its worked for him so what the f**k do I or anybody hear know?. People constantly focusing on it and saying we don't like it doesn't make him a bad manager , its just means we don't approve of his techniques.

Jose doesn't make it easy for players, hes a hard manager to work for but if players respond they come out better for it. That's why Hazzard said hes the best coach and why Deshamps said to to Pogba that Jose will make him a better player . .

As unpopular as this is, I would be happy to see the back of Pogba in January. Sends a massive signal to the squad that any challenge to a manager wont be tolerated. Whether we get a new manager or not, hes a player who wont perform when, to use his own words, hes not happy. He has not been good enough for united on or off field to have the authority to challenge the manager.

You said at least he's going down fighting. Thats hardly disapproval now is it?

You second point, well you try to twist things nicely here. I quoted the exact part of the article where it said Pogba spoke calmly in the dressing room after the game. So I'm clearly talking about this situation in isolation and not what happened before. I criticized Pogba earlier in the season for speaking to the press also.

If your going to reply try do so by replying to what was actually said.

Just for context, your glad to see Jose go down swinging. Just to be clear and unbiased to what your advocating here is a failing manager who is now burning his bridges and insulting everyone on his way out the door because he has done a terrible job.

The sad thing is that these are the very reasons three years ago I was totally opposed to Jose taking over. It was all so predictable, this is what he does, he is toxic at times and has no issue embarrassing a club.

Your Airbag · 04-12-2018 02:11PM

TheDoc wrote: »

I have never, EVER come across a team that has as many dressing room leaks as ours. Its so abundantly clear this is a disgrace.

Manager using his mouth piece to shift blame from him. And players then feeling the need to respond back.

Last season at Chelsea Jose had issues with leaks, he called the team "disgraceful" in one of this final interviews before sacking.

At Madrid he had leaks also. Iniesta gave an interview recently where he talked about the damage the Spanish national team suffered as a result of Jose being the Madrid manager. Jose apparently wanted his "us vs them" thing going on and forbid contact. When the players saw it was hurting them internationally they tried to make up for it, something like a whatsapp group or something. Jose found out about it and put an end to it. Casillas fell out with him as it was believed but never prove he was the leak as he had a tv reporter girlfriend. Casillas is on record saying his biggest regret is not confronting Jose for his treatment, even recently "Jose claimed Iker Casillas was behind a campaign pushing for David de Gea to be dropped by Spain as he escalated his war of words with the former Real Madrid goalkeeper"

This kind of stuff comes hand in hand with Jose.

Some of those El Classicos were some of the most bitter. Jose stuck his finger in Tito's eye ffs. He does not accept defeat well. This is how he operates where ever he goes and is exactly why I never wanted him as manager.

Drumpot · 04-12-2018 02:13PM

Your Airbag wrote: »

You said at least he's going down fighting. Thats hardly disapproval now is it?

You second point, well you try to twist things nicely here. I quoted the exact part of the article where it said Pogba spoke calmly in the dressing room after the game. So I'm clearly talking about this situation in isolation and not what happened before. I criticized Pogba earlier in the season for speaking to the press also.

If your going to reply try do so by replying to what was actually said.

Just for context, your glad to see Jose go down swinging. Just to be clear and unbiased to what your advocating here is a failing manager who is now burning his bridges and insulting everyone on his way out the door because he has done a terrible job.

The sad thing is that these are the very reasons three years ago I was totally opposed to Jose taking over. It was all so predictable, this is what he does, he is toxic at times and has no issue embarrassing a club.

Yes, I am glad that Jose is going down fighting because it exposes the kind of players we have. What did we learn from Moyes, undermined from the start by the squad, who was very polite about his demise. Its like you want to keep the squads issues under wraps. As I said, I don't condone Jose's methods but I do think we learn more from his public spat then we do if he keeps his mouth shut and I am glad he's shaken things up even if I don't like the way he is doing it. He may actually force the hand of the owners/Woodward to actually make some meaningful changes in the ways they run the footballing side of things.

I didn't twist anything at all. You cant make a statement of Pogba being all calm about his concerns at the club and ignore what he has been doing publicly for sometime. You are suggesting Pogba is some innocent lad just expressing concerns privately to the coach, but he didn't keep it private. You may prefer to just focus on that element but that doesn't change the fact that Pogba has been washing his dirty linen in public for sometime at this stage.

Its ironic that Pogba seems to take about as much responsibility for his performances as you guys accuse Jose of taking for the state of the club.

04-12-2018 02:24PM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

IMO that is cause Pogba is looking to create, Herrera and Fred are looking to move it on.

Fred key passes per game is 1 pogbas is 1.4, Pogba averages 60.5 passes per game to Freds 50.3 so they are creating chances per pass at near the same rate and Fred losses the ball an awful lot less.

If Pogba took a leaf out of his book to pass it off quickly and move instead of taking too much out of it we and he would be performing better.

TheDoc · 04-12-2018 02:28PM

Your Airbag wrote: »

Last season at Chelsea Jose had issues with leaks, he called the team "disgraceful" in one of this final interviews before sacking.

At Madrid he had leaks also. Iniesta gave an interview recently where he talked about the damage the Spanish national team suffered as a result of Jose being the Madrid manager. Jose apparently wanted his "us vs them" thing going on and forbid contact. When the players saw it was hurting them internationally they tried to make up for it, something like a whatsapp group or something. Jose found out about it and put an end to it. Casillas fell out with him as it was believed but never prove he was the leak as he had a tv reporter girlfriend. Casillas is on record saying his biggest regret is not confronting Jose for his treatment, even recently "Jose claimed Iker Casillas was behind a campaign pushing for David de Gea to be dropped by Spain as he escalated his war of words with the former Real Madrid goalkeeper"

This kind of stuff comes hand in hand with Jose.

Some of those El Classicos were some of the most bitter. Jose stuck his finger in Tito's eye ffs. He does not accept defeat well. This is how he operates where ever he goes and is exactly why I never wanted him as manager.

I'd imagine its a byproduct of his aggressive, blaming culture, players feel the need to defend themselves.

He's effectively walking himself into retirement as a big time manager

Trigger · 04-12-2018 02:45PM

United have had problems with leaks long before Jose became manager, it's hardly a new thing.

Just saying

Nalz · 04-12-2018 03:01PM

He's looking to buy the socks and shorts for this kit for his kid. He's tried the megastore online but no joy. He got the jersey though. Age 11-12

Any help greatly appreciated!

Thanks

Mitch Connor · 04-12-2018 03:10PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Fred key passes per game is 1 pogbas is 1.4, Pogba averages 60.5 passes per game to Freds 50.3 so they are creating chances per pass at near the same rate and Fred losses the ball an awful lot less.

If Pogba took a leaf out of his book to pass it off quickly and move instead of taking too much out of it we and he would be performing better.

Probably yes - but I would also say that if we had more movement out of the forward players then Pogba (and others) would have more key passes to attempt.

We are very static up front and that affects the ability of the midfield to move the ball on and create for them, imo.

I would also say that Pogba spends too long on the ball - sometimes that is cause he is waiting on a run to play to, sometimes its cause he's just hogging the ball.

Pogba does have his issues, 100%, but I simply think his desire to create (which is somewhat selfish at times in itself) is why he loses the ball - through trying to force a pass that the striker wasn't really moving for or getting caught by the defending players. Whether his selfishness is also down to him be a "me-me" guy or not trusting other midfielders to create anything and feeling he needs to be responsible for midfield creativity only he could really answer - I know people have their camps decided though.

My criticism of Pogba is the amount of time he spends not demanding the ball. If I were in charge I wouldn't have him tied to a position - I would want him roaming midfield, always looking for the line and space to offer himself to the player in possession - always. Him not doing that is certainly partly tactical, but I also have to feel it is just a lack of desire on his part as well.

I know a lot of people would happily see him sold - but given the problems at the club (of which he is a part) I would really like to see Jose gone, a manager with an attacking identity and idea come in, and see how that may affect the games of Rashford, Lukaku, Martial, Sanchez, Pogba, Fred, Herrera.

DM_7 · 04-12-2018 03:17PM

Pogba form is terrible, before now he had some ineffective performances where he was okay but not the quality needed for his fee (as did many team members) but but now he is flat out bad.

Largely that must be due to the breakdown between him and Jose.

I think playing in a team where he has so few good options to pass is making his worst traits even bigger. Imagine a creative player forced to look for a long pass to Lukaku or Rashford every time. They must get broken down by that eventually?

He is not alone, look at Lukaku, Rashford even Martial who look so uninspired when playing for United.

Your Airbag · 04-12-2018 03:39PM

Drumpot wrote: »

Yes, I am glad that Jose is going down fighting because it exposes the kind of players we have. What did we learn from Moyes, undermined from the start by the squad, who was very polite about his demise. Its like you want to keep the squads issues under wraps. As I said, I don't condone Jose's methods but I do think we learn more from his public spat then we do if he keeps his mouth shut and I am glad he's shaken things up even if I don't like the way he is doing it. He may actually force the hand of the owners/Woodward to actually make some meaningful changes in the ways they run the footballing side of things.

I didn't twist anything at all. You cant make a statement of Pogba being all calm about his concerns at the club and ignore what he has been doing publicly for sometime. You are suggesting Pogba is some innocent lad just expressing concerns privately to the coach, but he didn't keep it private. You may prefer to just focus on that element but that doesn't change the fact that Pogba has been washing his dirty linen in public for sometime at this stage.

Its ironic that Pogba seems to take about as much responsibility for his performances as you guys accuse Jose of taking for the state of the club.

No I didn't, your lying. I said earlier in the season the Jose was right to strip Pogba of the captaincy after he said something like "yes we should got forward more as the OT crowd say" after they chanted "attack attack attack". I was on Joes's side there and said it was not right for Pogba to undermine him.

This time I said Pogba is well with in his rights to calmly express his frustration in the DRESING room after a bad result where the manager calls him a VIRUS in front of the squad.

So I took two different situations, judged them individually and made different judgements both for and against Pogba/Jose. I am not painting a picture of Pogba as some "innocent lad".

Your just to biased and stubborn to acknowledge it.

Cantona's Collars · 04-12-2018 03:42PM

Nalz wrote: »

He's looking to buy the socks and shorts for this kit for his kid. He's tried the megastore online but no joy. He got the jersey though. Age 11-12

Any help greatly appreciated!

Thanks

Try the online jersey stores thread. Use parcel motel if ordering as you'll have some hope of getting stuff before March. An post don't give a sh1te about stuff coming in from Asia at this time of year, it's left until last to be sorted.

damowill · 04-12-2018 04:07PM

Drumpot wrote: »

Agreed and that in itself sends a message to the squad on what the club values right now.

Chelsea players down tools every 3 seasons but at least they win top honours. How can Chelsea win trophies with all different kind of managers and our fans are content with identifying our managers as our problem ? Is David Moyes a worse coach then Di Matteo who won the champions league ? Is Jose worse then Avram Grant who nearly won the league and champions league double ? Hell look at Pelligrini or Mancini at City, even City's setup lends itself to success no matter who the coach is, its because both clubs are setup to help the first team thrive. The high coach turnover works for these clubs cause they know what they are doing and they don't care about signing big names or marketable players.

How can any united fan , whether they want Jose out or not, not be extremely concerned with the manner in which the clubs resources are being used ? How can any fan not be concerned or suspect that our owners are not buying all players specifically for the team/manager? How can any United fan not see there is no obvious competent footballing strategy at the club? The one constant thing during this poor period for United is the owners taking a more hands on role in the footballing side of things by making Woodward the CEO. These things don't get sorted by Jose being sacked!

There is a growing discontent among United fans and they lay blame at the Managers door. But there is a bigger picture that they are choosing to ignore. Yes Jose has spent £300m plus in his tenure. However i'd argue that we needed to spend double this. Yes his signings have not lived up to their billing. But you get what you pay for in this new transfer market. Apart from a few marquee signings for big money, much of our spending has been frugal.

This summer we finally went into the market for a right back. We signed Diogo Dalot, a 19 year old costing a mere £19million. I think every United fan is in agreement that Young & Valencia have needed replacing for a long time. never fullbacks and long past their sell by date but why did it take us so long to replace them? And when we did why did we buy a guy nobody had heard of, but perhaps knew he had potential? Compare to Man City a couple of years back, Zabaleta, Clichy & Kolarov were shipped out at the age of 31. And Replaced, not by a teenager, but proven internationals for huge money: Benjamin Mendy £55m, Kyle Walker £50m and Danillo £28m.

Take a look at our problems in defence, we still have Smalling & Jones on the books, and again other clubs would have been ruthless in shipping them out. United buy Bailly & Lindelof for £30 odd million. City buy Stones for £55m, Laporte for £57, Liverpool buy Van Dijk for £75m.

Yes Jose bought these players, and his transfer record is appaling. But in todays world you get what you pay for.

We have been less frugal in buying attacking players. Marquee signings that sell jerseys and appease the fans somewhat. Pogba, Sancez and Lukaku and before them Di Maria and Falcao. You'd wonder were the former Jose signings or part of Ed Woodwards vanity project!

Matic and Fred are also proving unsuccessful and for sure these are Jose's signings so he can soley take the hit.

In attack, we have needed far more investment. Lukaku is our only striker. In Years gone by we had 3-4 strikers.

Cole, Yorke, Sheringham, Solskjaer.
Rooney, Ronaldo, Berbatov, Tevez.
Van Persie, Hernanez, Rooney, Welbeck.

Today we have Lukaku, aided by Rashford & Martial who are both wingers come forwards.

As a whole, we are not competing with City and are miles behind where we should be. If and when Jose is replaced, fans might see an improvement in style of football but unless he gets £500m to spend we will only see a small improvement in honours & league position.

Cookiemunster · 04-12-2018 04:22PM

Nalz wrote: »

He's looking to buy the socks and shorts for this kit for his kid. He's tried the megastore online but no joy. He got the jersey though. Age 11-12

Any help greatly appreciated!

Thanks

Try the Lifestyle, JD Sports and Sports Direct websites.

doc_17 · 04-12-2018 04:23PM

damowill wrote: »

There is a growing discontent among United fans and they lay blame at the Managers door. But there is a bigger picture that they are choosing to ignore. Yes Jose has spent £300m plus in his tenure. However i'd argue that we needed to spend double this. Yes his signings have not lived up to their billing. But you get what you pay for in this new transfer market. Apart from a few marquee signings for big money, much of our spending has been frugal.

This summer we finally went into the market for a right back. We signed Diogo Dalot, a 19 year old costing a mere £19million. I think every United fan is in agreement that Young & Valencia have needed replacing for a long time. never fullbacks and long past their sell by date but why did it take us so long to replace them? And when we did why did we buy a guy nobody had heard of, but perhaps knew he had potential? Compare to Man City a couple of years back, Zabaleta, Clichy & Kolarov were shipped out at the age of 31. And Replaced, not by a teenager, but proven internationals for huge money: Benjamin Mendy £55m, Kyle Walker £50m and Danillo £28m.

Take a look at our problems in defence, we still have Smalling & Jones on the books, and again other clubs would have been ruthless in shipping them out. United buy Bailly & Lindelof for £30 odd million. City buy Stones for £55m, Laporte for £57, Liverpool buy Van Dijk for £75m.

Yes Jose bought these players, and his transfer record is appaling. But in todays world you get what you pay for.

We have been less frugal in buying attacking players. Marquee signings that sell jerseys and appease the fans somewhat. Pogba, Sancez and Lukaku and before them Di Maria and Falcao. You'd wonder were the former Jose signings or part of Ed Woodwards vanity project!

Matic and Fred are also proving unsuccessful and for sure these are Jose's signings so he can soley take the hit.

In attack, we have needed far more investment. Lukaku is our only striker. In Years gone by we had 3-4 strikers.

Cole, Yorke, Sheringham, Solskjaer.
Rooney, Ronaldo, Berbatov, Tevez.
Van Persie, Hernanez, Rooney, Welbeck.

Today we have Lukaku, aided by Rashford & Martial who are both wingers come forwards.

As a whole, we are not competing with City and are miles behind where we should be. If and when Jose is replaced, fans might see an improvement in style of football but unless he gets £500m to spend we will only see a small improvement in honours & league position.

Agree with most this. Reminds me when Liverpool were spending £30m on 4/5 players and Utd were spending the same on 1 real class player like say Rooney or Ferdinand.

Drumpot · 04-12-2018 04:24PM

Your Airbag wrote: »

No I didn't, your lying. I said earlier in the season the Jose was right to strip Pogba of the captaincy after he said something like "yes we should got forward more as the OT crowd say" after they chanted "attack attack attack". I was on Joes's side there and said it was not right for Pogba to undermine him.

This time I said Pogba is well with in his rights to calmly express his frustration in the DRESING room after a bad result where the manager calls him a VIRUS in front of the squad.

So I took two different situations, judged them individually and made different judgements both for and against Pogba/Jose. I am not painting a picture of Pogba as some "innocent lad".

Your just to biased and stubborn to acknowledge it.

I think a fair comment is that perhaps I am as bias against Pogba as you are against Jose. That doesn't invalidate our views but it means we interpret what we read in different ways.

I personally believe the Pogba relationship with Jose is relevant when gauging the reaction. I can see why, given the nature of their relationship, Jose may react like that. . All players would see is Pogba politely chatting with the coach and the coach (whether through paranoia or not) interpreting it as a player looking to undermine them further on front of the team. If it was any other player other then Pogba, I don't think we would of seen that reaction. That's relevant to your point.

I mean I don't know what's the story with Jose blowing up. It actually looks like he's looking to be sacked at this stage or he's forcing the board to choose him or Pogba.

Maybe Pogba was just trying to reason with Jose or maybe he was looking to undermine him further. Maybe Pogba knew it would get under Jose's skin and this is his way of getting Jose out quicker or maybe Jose is having a breakdown and is so paranoid about Pogba that he cant even have a civil conversation with him . . I don't know, but I don't presume Pogba or Jose are innocent in what happened.

What I do know is Pogba has spent an awful lot of time undermining Jose publicly (and possibly privately among players) and hast been playing well for United. I know Pogba gave up his online stuff for France so he could focus on the world cup but he doesn't afford our club the same respect (if its not a distraction or affecting his team or personal performance why stop during the world cup?). I know he was able to play a more reserved defensive role for France but seemingly cant do it for United. I know it doesn't matter who starts or what sort of system Jose has played, that Pogba hasn't been good enough. So I don't trust the f**ker cause he's given united fans little cause to do so.

Econ__ · 04-12-2018 04:47PM

damowill wrote: »

There is a growing discontent among United fans and they lay blame at the Managers door. But there is a bigger picture that they are choosing to ignore. Yes Jose has spent £300m plus in his tenure. However i'd argue that we needed to spend double this. Yes his signings have not lived up to their billing. But you get what you pay for in this new transfer market. Apart from a few marquee signings for big money, much of our spending has been frugal.

This summer we finally went into the market for a right back. We signed Diogo Dalot, a 19 year old costing a mere £19million. I think every United fan is in agreement that Young & Valencia have needed replacing for a long time. never fullbacks and long past their sell by date but why did it take us so long to replace them? And when we did why did we buy a guy nobody had heard of, but perhaps knew he had potential? Compare to Man City a couple of years back, Zabaleta, Clichy & Kolarov were shipped out at the age of 31. And Replaced, not by a teenager, but proven internationals for huge money: Benjamin Mendy £55m, Kyle Walker £50m and Danillo £28m.

Take a look at our problems in defence, we still have Smalling & Jones on the books, and again other clubs would have been ruthless in shipping them out. United buy Bailly & Lindelof for £30 odd million. City buy Stones for £55m, Laporte for £57, Liverpool buy Van Dijk for £75m.

Yes Jose bought these players, and his transfer record is appaling. But in todays world you get what you pay for.

We have been less frugal in buying attacking players. Marquee signings that sell jerseys and appease the fans somewhat. Pogba, Sancez and Lukaku and before them Di Maria and Falcao. You'd wonder were the former Jose signings or part of Ed Woodwards vanity project!

Matic and Fred are also proving unsuccessful and for sure these are Jose's signings so he can soley take the hit.

In attack, we have needed far more investment. Lukaku is our only striker. In Years gone by we had 3-4 strikers.

Cole, Yorke, Sheringham, Solskjaer.
Rooney, Ronaldo, Berbatov, Tevez.
Van Persie, Hernanez, Rooney, Welbeck.

Today we have Lukaku, aided by Rashford & Martial who are both wingers come forwards.

As a whole, we are not competing with City and are miles behind where we should be. If and when Jose is replaced, fans might see an improvement in style of football but unless he gets £500m to spend we will only see a small improvement in honours & league position.

United’s wage & transfer expenditure over the last 5 years has been on par with City’s, and much higher than that of Chelsea, Spurs & Liverpool.

Your argument is muddled. You seem to be arguing that United need to spend more AND spend it better.

I agree with the latter but the former is a nonsense IMO.

xtal191 · 04-12-2018 04:51PM

Nalz wrote: »

He's looking to buy the socks and shorts for this kit for his kid. He's tried the megastore online but no joy. He got the jersey though. Age 11-12

Any help greatly appreciated!

Thanks

I've had a search around and cant find any legit shops/stores selling those shorts or socks. Closest I could find was this seller on dhgate https://www.dhgate.com/product/2018-youth-long-de-gea-goalkeeper-jerseys/409610784.html?skuAttr=977610:1369299#s1-20-7b;searl|0651384680 but dunno if socks are incleded. They might not sell the official shorts or socks.

Maybe give adidas a shout on their Twitter/Facebook or other social media

threein99 · 04-12-2018 04:57PM

TheDoc wrote: »

It really isn't.

You only have to look at Arsenal, or Everton, to see what can be achieved quickly with a proper manager with a plan, idea, proper authority and moves to play in a way the players will enjoy.

Talking wider about the clubs issues are correct and valid, but no one should kid themselves that

a) Jose is not the primary and majority share of the issue at the club
b) A proper managerial appointment will bring positive vibes and progress back at the club quickly.

They have proper structures above the manager and surrounding the manager too.

Nalz · 04-12-2018 05:15PM

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

Try the online jersey stores thread. Use parcel motel if ordering as you'll have some hope of getting stuff before March. An post don't give a sh1te about stuff coming in from Asia at this time of year, it's left until last to be sorted.

He needs it for Xmas. :-/

Whatsisname · 04-12-2018 05:20PM

Nalz wrote: »

He needs it for Xmas. :-/

I follow a guy on instagram who collects United jerseys, maybe shooting him a message might bring you some luck

https://www.instagram.com/manchesterunited_shirts/

Zeek12 · 04-12-2018 05:23PM

damowill wrote: »

In attack, we have needed far more investment. Lukaku is our only striker. In Years gone by we had 3-4 strikers.

Cole, Yorke, Sheringham, Solskjaer.
Rooney, Ronaldo, Berbatov, Tevez.
Van Persie, Hernanez, Rooney, Welbeck.

Today we have Lukaku, aided by Rashford & Martial who are both wingers come forwards.

As a whole, we are not competing with City and are miles behind where we should be. If and when Jose is replaced, fans might see an improvement in style of football but unless he gets £500m to spend we will only see a small improvement in honours & league position.

Don't really agree on the point of the strikers.

Rashford is really a CF.
But rarely gets to play there.
He gets pushed out to wide positions, sometimes to accommodate other more experienced strikers. Or to fit the formation.

Not just by Jose to be fair. LVG did it on occasions.

Two centre forwards at the club isn't really that odd.
Modern formations tend to feature just one traditional no. 9 in the starting XI.

Outside of Aguero and Jesus, who else do City have for that position?

Chelsea only have Morata and Giroud.

Spurs No.9s are Kane and Llorente

DM_7 · 04-12-2018 05:23PM

https://twitter.com/sistoney67/status/1069901815922216960?s=19

Not first rime I have heard him go in about Everton's great investment. I think he is broken.

Drumpot · 04-12-2018 05:43PM

Econ__ wrote: »

United’s wage & transfer expenditure over the last 5 years has been on par with City’s, and much higher than that of Chelsea, Spurs & Liverpool.

Your argument is muddled. You seem to be arguing that United need to spend more AND spend it better.

I agree with the latter but the former is a nonsense IMO.

I don't think the figures back that up.

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/fc-chelsea/alletransfers/verein/631
https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/manchester-united/alletransfers/verein/985
http://www.transfermarkt.com/manchester-city/alletransfers/verein/281

2013 Chelsea £117.32 United £69.42 City £116

2014 Chelsea £123.93 United £175.82 City £88.30

2015 Chelsea £81.45 United £140.40 City £208.30

2016 Chelsea £119.52 United £166.50 City £213.50

2017 Chelsea £234.54 United £178.56 City £317.50

2018 Chelsea £123.30 United £74.43 City £71.19

These figures don't include inflation. If you are going to argue Net spend we need to go back further because Chelsea and City were spending way more for way longer so had more expensive players they could sell. Not just that, the fact that other clubs can get more for players they sell shouldn't impact on how a manager is judged. If anything it asks questions about who we are signing and how good Woodward is at offloading them.

From a United Perspective

Versus City - Total Spend City = 1.014 Bil v United £805 million . Only 2 years have we spent more 2014 (£87mil more) and 2018 (£3.24 more)

Versus Chelsea - Total spend Chelsea = £800 v United £805 . Both clubs have outspent the other equally 3 times in this period. Very interesting fact was the three years United outspent Chelsea was when Jose was their manager. Mad that he can work with less at Chelsea and still win a league!

2014 was the only season United outspent both these rivals. Chelsea were the top spender in 2018 and City all the other years spent more on their squad.

Since Jose Took over, United has spent £419, City £602 and Chelsea £477.

Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2018/2019 Part Two

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