Health system, Homelessness, Broadband, Recession Pt2 incoming due to stupidity

whisky_galore · 30-11-2018 04:43PM

PlaneSpeeking wrote: »

Are you blaming the medical professionals there because that is 100% out of line.

I've worked training healthcare professional for over a decade and they work harder, are more committed and care more than people give them a scintilla of credit for.

The reality because of lunatics who constantly demand free housing, allow 50k a year per waster single mother and want to pay for nothing - the health service is sickeningly underfunded.

As to the OP - there is homelessness, to the tune of a few hundred rough sleepers (too many of course but hoe many would be helped by simply handing them over a flat without addressing other issues like addiction ?).

Yes because it's all the single mums fault. Nothing to do with the fact that no matter how much money you shovel into the black hole that is the HSE nothing will improve. You can't fix an already broken system by throwing more money at it.

Cina · 30-11-2018 04:47PM

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

How much should it cost?

How much, as a percentage of the overall budget, goes to health and how does that stack up against other countries?

https://www.oecd.org/health/health-systems/Health-Spending-Latest-Trends-Brief.pdf

We are the sixth highest spenders per capita in the OECD.

To put it into context, France, widely regarded as having the best health service in the world, and the UK, with the NHS, are lower per capita spenders than us.

More than enough money goes to the HSE to give the citizens of Ireland proper healthcare already.

yermanoffthetv · 30-11-2018 05:10PM

PlaneSpeeking wrote: »

Are you blaming the medical professionals there because that is 100% out of line.

I've worked training healthcare professional for over a decade and they work harder, are more committed and care more than people give them a scintilla of credit for.

The reality because of lunatics who constantly demand free housing, allow 50k a year per waster single mother and want to pay for nothing - the health service is sickeningly underfunded.

As to the OP - there is homelessness, to the tune of a few hundred rough sleepers (too many of course but hoe many would be helped by simply handing them over a flat without addressing other issues like addiction ?).

I'd agree with pretty much everything you said there, I've been in hospital myself recently (public patient, no medical card) and the staff were working out of their skin. The problem isn't the health budget, its how its spent. There is a chronic under capacity in A&E, as in infrastructre, physical space to put people and staff to man it. Once you're "in the system" I found the care and facilities excellent.

As i said we need to start looking at how the money is spent and not how much. like medical cards and what exactly they cover. Some people genuinely need and deserve them, some not so much and should make a small contribution based on income, some are taking the piss completely. same with Prescription charges and having free GP care for under 6 blocking up GPs offices with snotty noses and bumped elbows, its costing a fortune.

Geuze · 30-11-2018 05:18PM

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

How much should it cost?

How much, as a percentage of the overall budget, goes to health and how does that stack up against other countries?

According to the OECD, we are the fifth highest spender.

According to Eurostat, fourth in the EU.

https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/products-eurostat-news/-/DDN-20181129-2?inheritRedirect=true&redirect=%2Feurostat%2F

Geuze · 30-11-2018 05:19PM

Health+care+expenditure+per+inhabitant+2016

TallGlass · 30-11-2018 05:38PM

Deleted User wrote: »

why dont you run

As if one person getting elected is going to change the entire system.

FF FG SF LAB, they are all the same.

The system doesn't need a change, it needs a revolution if you ask me.

Out of all the Ministers, Leo and co etc... In all honestly, I could barely see any of them above managerial level in the private sector, let alone heads, directors or CEO level in the private, yet this guys are running the place, and in my eye's doing a bad job for the sums of money, allowances and time off they get.

Think about it, Leo was a doctor in the HSE if he had of stuck at that path, could you really see him branch out to some director level in the HSE. I doubt it. Yet he is running the country.

Some of the solutions they are proposing to problems are bizarre to be honest. That's not just FG either.

Let's not get started with the local level politics, I don't even think the Councillors there know what is going on.

Wanderer78 · 30-11-2018 05:43PM

It ll be a while before we ditch neoliberalism and neoclassical theory, so relax everyone, nothing is gonna change anytime soon

30-11-2018 05:57PM

TallGlass wrote: »

As if one person getting elected is going to change the entire system.

FF FG SF LAB, they are all the same.

The system doesn't need a change, it needs a revolution if you ask me.

Out of all the Ministers, Leo and co etc... In all honestly, I could barely see any of them above managerial level in the private sector, let alone heads, directors or CEO level in the private, yet this guys are running the place, and in my eye's doing a bad job for the sums of money, allowances and time off they get.

Think about it, Leo was a doctor in the HSE if he had of stuck at that path, could you really see him branch out to some director level in the HSE. I doubt it. Yet he is running the country.

Some of the solutions they are proposing to problems are bizarre to be honest. That's not just FG either.

Let's not get started with the local level politics, I don't even think the Councillors there know what is going on.

how many revolutions have you started yourself then?

klaaaz · 30-11-2018 06:08PM

Geuze wrote: »

According to the OECD, we are the fifth highest spender.

According to Eurostat, fourth in the EU.

https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/products-eurostat-news/-/DDN-20181129-2?inheritRedirect=true&redirect=%2Feurostat%2F

The GDP is distorted here, leprachaun economics!

Besides, the population has increased by a over million since the 80's and yet the amount of beds available has not increased in proportion.

Atoms for Peace · 30-11-2018 06:37PM

Graces7 wrote: »

and the actual people working in eg the health service...

See this tragedy

http://www.mayonews.ie/news/32947-desperately-ill-but-discharged

These are common now. A man blinded, babies damaged and dead and all by "medical misadventure"

Tax payers money being spend to train health care workers for the rest of the world while in return we get the dregs of with spurious qualifications. Dosent seem fair to me.

30-11-2018 06:51PM

The minister of health is married to a nurse the irony of it.

Auguste Comte · 30-11-2018 06:59PM

biko wrote: »

vargoo wrote: »

I'm obviously not stupid or corrupt enough to get in, duh.

I am both stupid and corrupt, vote for me

To honest ðŸ˜

Terrlock · 30-11-2018 07:02PM

It's so difficult to see what can be done to help the country to work better.

It feels like any avenue of trying to make a difference is stamped out.

I think there are to many self serving interests in all the various levels of society to make real positive change.

Maybe people who want a better standard of living should all get together and form a new country.

30-11-2018 07:09PM

Terrlock wrote: »

It's so difficult to see what can be done to help the country to work better.

It feels like any avenue of trying to make a difference is stamped out.

I think there are to many self serving interests in all the various levels of society to make real positive change.

Maybe people who want a better standard of living should all get together and form a new country.

You would need two new countries, one a non union, non welfare, free for all libertarian paradise and the other a mandatory sharing caring rights based welfare based paradise.

TallGlass · 30-11-2018 08:34PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

how many revolutions have you started yourself then?

I think your thinking of another meaning of the word. I am talking about it in the content as quoted 'a dramatic and wide-reaching change in conditions, attitudes, or operation.'

The only way for real change unfortunately it seems is a massive incident where change is the only option. At the moment it's a rinse and repeat operation.

Where is this political reform we where told about?

At the moment our elected reps are like a home router, you give them a problem they route it to another person, but in this age I can do that myself, so I fail to see what it is they actually are doing.

Seriously. Go to your local TD and see for yourself how brutal they are. Just enquire about something simple you'd maybe like where you live, like a tree or something planted. Honestly, give it a go you'd be surprised how the smallest things to sort out or fix are blown out of all proportion and how they can't help as its not for them to do so.

To many of us thinking on polling day. 'Oh I see them around a bit in the area, they must do a good job', in fact they are fairying around the place, doing nothing but keeping up appearances.

People should really test who they vote for and see if your happy with there service before giving the number one or two.

dxhound2005 · 30-11-2018 09:01PM

I'm going to blame the 85% of the workforce who are in the private sector for ruining the country. The bankers, lawyers, bookies, publicans, airlines and the rest. The 15% who work in the Public Sector have a constant struggle to try to keep these characters in line.

QuickEmail · 30-11-2018 09:24PM

Geuze wrote: »

The health system is not underfunded.

We spend the fifth most per person across the OECD.

Then why is it like something out of a second world country?

01-12-2018 01:41AM

TallGlass wrote: »

I think your thinking of another meaning of the word.

you think wrong

how many revolutions have you started lately?

Idbatterim · 01-12-2018 02:02AM

You hit the nail on the head op , I’ve stopped watching current affairs programmes etc. we have nothing but the highest level of morons in government here, local and national, the same bull**** debate and issues never addressed, just endless talk and waffle. I’ve acceoted it and moved on. The place is a comedy show!

NIMAN · 01-12-2018 05:09AM

Idbatterim wrote: »

You hit the nail on the head op , I’ve stopped watching current affairs programmes etc. we have nothing but the highest level of morons in government here, local and national, the same bull**** debate and issues never addressed, just endless talk and waffle. I’ve acceoted it and moved on. The place is a comedy show!

I suspect you will find all English, Scottish, Italian, French, American, Aussie ...... people say the same thing.

TallGlass · 01-12-2018 11:59AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

you think wrong

how many revolutions have you started lately?

What are you on about? Clearly none and even if I did it's none of your business. I said it needs one not I was going to start one.

Got anything to contribute here, it's people like you with stupid cheeky replies that put people off posting on here.

01-12-2018 12:52PM

TallGlass wrote: »

What are you on about? Clearly none and even if I did it's none of your business. I said it needs one not I was going to start one.

Got anything to contribute here, it's people like you with stupid cheeky replies that put people off posting on here.

"someone else should do something about this problem i have airily waved a hand towards!"

you have a bit of a cheek yourself criticising anyone's 'contribution' if you consider that valuable input tbph

Ray Palmer · 01-12-2018 01:04PM

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

Probably not.

But everyone who has dealt with any civil service staff or worked in the civil service knows how dsyfunctional, silo cultured, parochial and inefficient they are.

There's no use pretending otherwise.

Have you ever worked in the civil service? Have you worked in large organisations?

I have worked in all sized companies or all ages and I can truly give a rounded view. There is no difference civil servants work no harder or better than private workers and vice versa. You still have incompetent staff and managers. Poor decision making happens all the time everywhere. The biggest difference is age of staff where they are older in the civil service in general.

I always laugh at people saying that one person responsible for an issue and if they were in the private sector they would be fired. It is so not true and I have seen it time an time again. It is incredibly rare for any plans to be the sole responsibility of any individual and it is a series of group decisions. It is actually the decisions made by committees that are usually at fault, everyone's views being considered makes for bad choices.

limnam · 01-12-2018 02:34PM

Ray Palmer wrote: »

Have you ever worked in the civil service? Have you worked in large organisations?

I have worked in all sized companies or all ages and I can truly give a rounded view. There is no difference civil servants work no harder or better than private workers and vice versa. You still have incompetent staff and managers. Poor decision making happens all the time everywhere. The biggest difference is age of staff where they are older in the civil service in general.

This crops up all the time, the difference is in the private sector you can get rid of bad apples/lazy people etc fairly easily.

Also the people around them won't tend to stand for it.

Where in the PS it seems been lazy/slow/useless is the defacto and they all protect each other to the point if someone joins and wants to work "properly" they're basically told what's what and they have to toe the line.

Why would you be eager to do well if you're going to be rewarded regardless.

dxhound2005 · 01-12-2018 02:47PM

limnam wrote: »

This crops up all the time, the difference is in the private sector you can get rid of bad apples/lazy people etc fairly easily.

You can't. The other part of the post you quoted says you can't, and that person has the experience to prove it.

limnam · 01-12-2018 02:48PM

dxhound2005 wrote: »

You can't. The other part of the post you quoted says you can't, and that person has the experience to prove it.

Course you can and it happens _all_ the time.

dxhound2005 · 01-12-2018 02:54PM

limnam wrote: »

Course you can and it happens _all_ the time.

The person who has experience in this area would laugh at your suggestion.

I always laugh at people saying that one person responsible for an issue and if they were in the private sector they would be fired. It is so not true and I have seen it time an time again.

If you got bad service in a shop could you make the owner sack the assistant?

limnam · 01-12-2018 03:25PM

dxhound2005 wrote: »

The person who has experience in this area would laugh at your suggestion.

I always laugh at people saying that one person responsible for an issue and if they were in the private sector they would be fired. It is so not true and I have seen it time an time again.

If you got bad service in a shop could you make the owner sack the assistant?

The big point that you fail to understand is a private company must make money. It _must_ be profitable. Otherwise the business goes under and no one has a job.

Now if you're the owner of a shop and the assistance is constantly providing bad service and it in turn costs the shop money, people can choose to go to another shop etc.

I can't choose to get my passport somewhere else, or do my taxes somewhere else etc.

A shop owner can simply remove the problem.

In the PS there's no onus on making money or providing value for money etc.

Everyone in the PS "shop" including the management team won't lose their job if the service continues to be bad and the shop will stay open no matter what.

Idbatterim · 01-12-2018 03:26PM

NIMAN wrote: »

I suspect you will find all English, Scottish, Italian, French, American, Aussie ...... people say the same thing.

No I don’t accept that. Do they have complaints over there? Sure as hell they do. But the outrageous cost of living , relative poor pay here given living costs and fifty percent of your salary thieved off you from a very low base , you’re totally f**cked here. Hose other countries wouldn’t tolerate it. And it’s the low to mid income workers they are screwed so that the insane welfare system along with all its perks can be maintained. You make life easier and too easy on one group , but it comes at a hell of a cost to the other working poor who qualify for nothing and arguably have a lower standard of living ...

Idbatterim · 01-12-2018 03:31PM

There are now repeated warnings about future government budget proposals. I don’t know when things will crash again. But I do know we have jaw dropping national debt , I don’t even think this budget was balanced , despite the fact the place is allegedly booming and first and foremost , those running the the show are morons beyond belief. When interest rates rise, it will suck more money out of peoples pockets , this insane property shambles is destroying people’s purchasing power ...

Health system, Homelessness, Broadband, Recession Pt2 incoming due to stupidity

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