Peter Casey's beliefs of Travellers' ethnicity Part II

givyjoe · 07-11-2018 12:33pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

There are 22 democracies in the world where voting is compulsory, yet you pull North Korea to make a point about something something something. :rolleyes:

You are correct, your 'point' sailed happily over my head, to be gone forever one hopes.

Perhaps you can do some more Googling to find your next relevant 'opinion'.

xi5yvm0owc1s2b · 07-11-2018 12:35pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

We are looking at a 'protest' and how big that vote is.

You're the one saying that 342,727 people came out to protest, and then downplaying the extent of that protest.

When 300,000 marched through Dublin during the PAYE protests of 1979, the BBC called it "the largest peaceful protest in post-war Europe."

Now, according to you, more people than that are protesting, and you don't think it's particularly significant.

Idbatterim · 07-11-2018 12:47pm

That nimby pat Kenny now objecting to a development beside his house. I’ve a simple solution, use the land to house travelers, no construction and low rise and all his other ****ing hypocrite mates in the media can go down to welcome them to their new home. I doubt Kenny would have said he had an issue living beside them!

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/broadcaster-pat-kenny-objects-to-ill-thought-housing-development-next-to-his-dalkey-home-883587.html

FrancieBrady · 07-11-2018 12:47pm

Hattie Puny Litterbug wrote: »

You're the one saying that 342,727 people came out to protest, and then downplaying the extent of that protest.

When 300,000 marched through Dublin during the PAYE protests of 1979, the BBC called it "the largest peaceful protest in post-war Europe."

Now, according to you, more people than that are protesting, and you don't think it's particularly significant.

I didn't compare it to other protests, I simply stated what it was as a percentage of the total electorate = 10%.
I can see how it will precipitate some media examination of the issues,(the media have been highlighting rural crime for a long time now, but that seems to be ignored in the red mist) but will it motivate real change at government level - I doubt it.

Is that a significant protest vote? - i would argue that, no, it isn't particularly.

MrMusician18 · 07-11-2018 12:48pm

Idbatterim wrote: »

That nimby pat Kenny now objecting to a development beside his house. I’ve a simple solution, use the land to house travelers, no construction and low rise and all his other ****ing hypocrite mates in the media can go down to welcome them to their new home. I doubt Kenny would have said he had an issue living beside them!

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/broadcaster-pat-kenny-objects-to-ill-thought-housing-development-next-to-his-dalkey-home-883587.html

In fairness to Kenny, I don't think he really has joined the virtue signalling chorus.

Una Mullally, Fintin O'Toole and Matt Cooper however...

Idbatterim · 07-11-2018 12:53pm

What good would compulsory voting do here? You can choose from useless moron a , b or c! Great!

blanch152 · 07-11-2018 12:54pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

:D I am not downplaying it, I simply stated what it was in actuality...10% of the electorate and the knicker twisting started.

Another statistic for you to ponder.

More people voted for Peter Casey than have ever voted for Sinn Fein in an election.

The highest number of people to ever vote for Sinn Fein was way back in 2014 when 323,300 voted for them.

342,727 voted for Peter Casey.

I suspect that is the statistic that is most annoying you. However, I am willing to accept that the vote for Peter Casey is as insignificant as you claim, so long as you agree to apply the same insignificance to the totality of Sinn Fein's election performances in the South.

FrancieBrady · 07-11-2018 1:00pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Another statistic for you to ponder.

More people voted for Peter Casey than have ever voted for Sinn Fein in an election.

The highest number of people to ever vote for Sinn Fein was way back in 2014 when 323,300 voted for them.

342,727 voted for Peter Casey.

I suspect that is the statistic that is most annoying you. However, I am willing to accept that the vote for Peter Casey is as insignificant as you claim, so long as you agree to apply the same insignificance to the totality of Sinn Fein's election performances in the South.

If we agree to agree, can we agree that FG's performance in the last Presidential election represents the totality of their performance in the South?

Go away with that ****e blanch...tiresome.

xi5yvm0owc1s2b · 07-11-2018 1:10pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I didn't compare it to other protests, I simply stated what it was as a percentage of the total electorate = 10%.

It's already been pointed out to you numerous times that this 10 percent figure is a complete fiction. Assuming that this is the full extent of the so-called protest vote also assumes that no non-voters would have voted Casey had they gone to the polls -- which is nonsense. If every eligible voter in the country had cast a vote, the likelihood is that Casey still would have received around 23 percent. That is how statistical sampling works.

The relevant figure for people who understand maths is 23%, not 10%. So we're talking close to a quarter of the electorate here -- which is highly significant for anyone involved in politics.

A recent Red C poll showed support for Fine Gael at 33%, Fianna Fáil 22%, Sinn Féin 14%, Independents 13%, Labour 6%, the Social Democrats, the Green Party and Solidarity/People Before Profit 2% each, and Renua 1%. It's very evident, then, that a Casey-like surge could push many of these parties ahead of many others -- and so you can bet your bottom dollar that we will see more politicians speaking out about Travellers and entitlement culture in the next general election campaign so as to capture that same sentiment that drove Casey from 1 percent to 23 percent in the space of a week.

Politicians in recent times have assumed that they could capture votes by pandering to Travellers and welfare claimants, trotting out the "most vulnerable in society" and "disadvantaged minority" rhetoric. Now, they're seeing that a significant portion of the electorate is fed up of the pandering, and that there's a potential advantage in doing the opposite. So get ready to hear politicians talk a lot more about getting tough on crime, cracking down on welfare fraud, and creating more incentives for people to get up in the morning and go to work. Others have noted above that this is, in fact, already starting to happen -- all because of a candidate who in your mind can be dismissed because he got "only" 10 percent of the total electorate.

blanch152 · 07-11-2018 1:15pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

If we agree to agree, can we agree that FG's performance in the last Presidential election represents the totality of their performance in the South?

Go away with that ****e blanch...tiresome.

That was a one-off underperformance from FG just as the European elections in 2014 were a one-off overperformance by SF, as seen by how incredibly weak their MEP from the South turned out to be.

What I am saying here is that SF have NEVER achieved the number of votes that Peter Casey got. If Peter Casey is insignificant, then SF are less than that.

It really must hurt SF supporters and workers that all of the work over decades to take over residents associations, community groups, etc. and go round door-to-door means nothing compared to a few choice words from an outsider in an election campaign. The pain comes through loud and clear everytime I open this thread.

MrMusician18 · 07-11-2018 1:18pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

If we agree to agree, can we agree that FG's performance in the last Presidential election represents the totality of their performance in the South?

Go away with that ****e blanch...tiresome.

The FG backed/endorsed candidate romped home

Edward M · 07-11-2018 1:18pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Another statistic for you to ponder.

More people voted for Peter Casey than have ever voted for Sinn Fein in an election.

The highest number of people to ever vote for Sinn Fein was way back in 2014 when 323,300 voted for them.

342,727 voted for Peter Casey.

I suspect that is the statistic that is most annoying you. However, I am willing to accept that the vote for Peter Casey is as insignificant as you claim, so long as you agree to apply the same insignificance to the totality of Sinn Fein's election performances in the South.

If you go back to the 2011 presidential election, there was a 56% turnout.
MMG ran for SF, he got 243000 votes, over 100000 short of casey's total from a smaller turnout.
That wouldn't leave SF supporters with anything else to do but whinge after this election would it.
Hence Francies wearing down his keyboard and poor fingers.

FrancieBrady · 07-11-2018 1:18pm

Hattie Puny Litterbug wrote: »

It's already been pointed out to you numerous times that this 10 percent figure is a complete fiction. Assuming that this is the full extent of the so-called protest vote also assumes that no non-voters would have voted Casey had they gone to the polls -- which is nonsense. If every eligible voter in the country had cast a vote, the likelihood is that Casey still would still have received around 23 percent. That is how statistical sampling works.

The relevant figure for people who understand maths is 23%, not 10%. So we're talking close to a quarter of the electorate here -- which is highly significant for anyone involved in politics.

A recent Red C poll showed support for Fine Gael at 33%, Fianna Fáil 22%, Sinn Féin 14%, Independents 13%, Labour 6%, the Social Democrats, the Green Party and Solidarity/People Before Profit 2% each, and Renua 1%. It's very evident, then, that a Casey-like surge could push many of these parties ahead of many others -- and so you can bet your bottom dollar that we will see more politicians speaking out about Travellers and entitlement culture in the next general election campaign so as to capture that same sentiment that drove Casey from 1 percent to 23 percent in the space of a week.

Politicians in recent times have assumed that they could capture votes by pandering to Travellers and welfare claimants, trotting out the "most vulnerable in society" and "disadvantaged minority" rhetoric. Now, they're seeing that a significant portion of the electorate is fed up of the pandering, and that there's a potential advantage in doing the opposite. So get ready to hear a lot more rhetoric about getting tough on crime, cracking down on welfare fraud, and creating more incentives for people to get up in the morning and go to work. Others have noted above that this is, in fact, already starting to happen -- all because of a candidate who in your mind can be dismissed because he got "only" 10 percent of the total electorate.

Funny, this voter has been listening to that rethoric for a long time.

I suspect more will come, but little will change unfortunately.

Anyway, have made my point. Off to engage with our health system, will report back if protest vote required there. Maybe someone will give the great avenger a ring?

Edward M · 07-11-2018 1:20pm

MrMusician18 wrote: »

The FG backed/endorsed candidate romped home

FrancieBrady · 07-11-2018 1:24pm

blanch152 wrote: »

That was a one-off underperformance from FG just as the European elections in 2014 were a one-off overperformance by SF, as seen by how incredibly weak their MEP from the South turned out to be.

What I am saying here is that SF have NEVER achieved the number of votes that Peter Casey got. If Peter Casey is insignificant, then SF are less than that.

It really must hurt SF supporters and workers that all of the work over decades to take over residents associations, community groups, etc. and go round door-to-door means nothing compared to a few choice words from an outsider in an election campaign. The pain comes through loud and clear everytime I open this thread.

SF never targeted travellers either, it has to be said. As I repeatedly said, that vote of support for bias and prejudice was always out there for the taking for those without integrity. Kudos to all the other candidates (regardless of what I thought of their individual pitches) for not following Casey.

I was behind Higgins since the start here, SF simply picked the wrong candidate, like FG in 2011.

I am sure they will, like all political parties, pick themselves up and keep going. That seems to annoy some too.

FrancieBrady · 07-11-2018 1:26pm

MrMusician18 wrote: »

The FG backed/endorsed candidate romped home

The pedant strikes again.

'The FG candidate in the 2011 presidential election....'

Edward M · 07-11-2018 1:27pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

SF never targeted travellers either, it has to be said. As I repeatedly said, that vote of support for bias and prejudice was always out there for the taking for those without integrity. Kudos to all the other candidates (regardless of what I thought of their individual pitches) for not following Casey.

I was behind Higgins since the start here, SF simply picked the wrong candidate, like FG in 2011.

I am sure they will, like all political parties, pick themselves up and keep going. That seems to annoy some too.

Yes SF did target travellers, in the opposite way to Casey, they brought a motion proposing SEMS didn't they?

FrancieBrady · 07-11-2018 1:29pm

Edward M wrote: »

Yes SF did target travellers, in the opposite way to Casey, they brought a motion proposing SEMS didn't they?

Yes, they did. They haven't forgotten the importance of inclusiveness and parity of esteem, like certain Derry men have.

Anyway, must go.

Edward M · 07-11-2018 1:30pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Yes, they did. They haven't forgotten the importance of inclusiveness and parity of esteem, like certain Derry men have.

Anyway, must go.

From what I know of travellers their esteem of themselves is high, very high.

Roger Hassenforder · 07-11-2018 1:47pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Don't vote? Then you abdicate any right to complain about what you get. Simple as that for me.

If it were me, then voting would be compulsory like it is in some other democracy's.

But hes not complaining about what he got..

Hmm, complusory voting. That's a sure sign of a functional democracy

omega man · 07-11-2018 1:49pm

I see the local councils are under pressure to explain why in many cases they haven't used their full traveller budget allocations (for accododation I think). Was there always such dedicated budgets or was that an outcome of SEMS?

Just another example of how they get preferential treatment over other Irish citizens.

KrustyUCC · 07-11-2018 1:52pm

Traveller specific budgets was in well before SEMS

Traveller accommodation even has it's own specific act

Roger Hassenforder · 07-11-2018 1:53pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Anyway, must go.

Doubt it.

xi5yvm0owc1s2b · 07-11-2018 2:24pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Yes, they did. They haven't forgotten the importance of inclusiveness and parity of esteem, like certain Derry men have.

Parity of esteem? I haven't seen Peter Casey on YouTube bragging about how he bate every Quinn-McDonagh in the land.

Edward M · 07-11-2018 2:32pm

omega man wrote: »

I see the local councils are under pressure to explain why in many cases they haven't used their full traveller budget allocations (for accododation I think). Was there always such dedicated budgets or was that an outcome of SEMS?

Just another example of how they get preferential treatment over other Irish citizens.

Yes, it's in the times.

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/councils-could-face-sanctions-over-traveller-accommodation-budgets-1.3688827%3fmode=amp

Now have a look at the measures proposed if councils don't spend their allocation.
Cutting of road budgets, FFS, we will have to endure potholes and untreated or maintained roads if the money for travellers isn't spent, they have to be joking, right?
That suggestion by SF TD Eoin O Broin BTW.

givyjoe · 07-11-2018 2:33pm

Hattie Puny Litterbug wrote: »

Parity of esteem? I haven't seen Peter Casey on YouTube bragging about how he bate every Quinn-McDonagh in the land.

A youtube video of Casey calling out Mickey D would have actually been hilarious.

KrustyUCC · 07-11-2018 2:36pm

Edward M wrote: »

Yes, it's in the times.

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/councils-could-face-sanctions-over-traveller-accommodation-budgets-1.3688827%3fmode=amp

Now have a look at the measures proposed if councils don't spend their allocation.
Cutting of road budgets, FFS, we will have to endure potholes and untreated or maintained roads if the money for travellers isn't spent, they have to be joking, right?

The roads are in bad enough condition as it is

Good luck to any politician who calls to the door after cutting budgets which will affect everybody just because enough money wasn't spent on travellers

I'm sure there will be plenty of votes in it for Sinn Fein

"Sinn Féin TD Eoin Ó Broin said the consultative process for delivering Traveller accommodation had “clearly failed” in many councils.
“Should we be thinking about sanctions for local authorities in other areas of their expenditure if they fail to spend Traveller accommodation budgets and meet statutory requirements? I think if a local authority knew, for example, that its roads budget would be withheld if it didn’t spend its Traveller budget that might focus the minds of elected representatives to do what they are legally required to do.”

Deebles McBeebles · 07-11-2018 2:38pm

Hattie Puny Litterbug wrote: »

Parity of esteem? I haven't seen Peter Casey on YouTube bragging about how he bate every Quinn-McDonagh in the land.

I like how the travellers have kept up with the English footballers with double barrelled names.

givyjoe wrote: »

A youtube video of Casey calling out Mickey D would have actually been hilarious.

I'll feed ya to your dogs ya little baldy b*stard

Plumbthedepths · 07-11-2018 2:45pm

Casey's outbursts are in the past, people have moved on (well most one lad hasn't) . The politicians have taken note of Casey's vote as noted in the Indo that FF is examining their policy regarding Travellers even today's Times has a piece slightly critical of Travellers. A light has been turned on, lots of attmeps to turn it off . A few on this thread have sought it have discussion closed one is repeatedly attempting to provoke negative reactions for this purpose aswell. The most blatant and stupid attempt was Tubs amatuer attack on Casey aided by the Pavee Point posse followed by Jenny Zammadildo lie on twitter.
Casey to be honest is irrelevant, it's what he said that resonated throughout the country and that message is what has a certain democrat on here getting his own knickers in a twist.
Anyway this thread is gone stale time to unfollow.

Roger Hassenforder · 07-11-2018 2:58pm

omega man wrote: »

I see the local councils are under pressure to explain why in many cases they haven't used their full traveller budget allocations (for accododation I think). Was there always such dedicated budgets or was that an outcome of SEMS?

Just another example of how they get preferential treatment over other Irish citizens.

Is the money in the Councils accounts ready to be spent, or waiting to be drawn down. I wonder is it easy to draw down....

Ive an idea, draw down the entire Cork allocation and spend the lot CPOing the property next door to a mouthy Green here, and build a lavish halting site.
Feck value for money.

Peter Casey's beliefs of Travellers' ethnicity Part II

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