Madeleine McCann

Franz Von Peppercorn · 03-11-2018 07:11PM

cnocbui wrote: »

I don't think the parents were negligent. The actual incidence of strangers abducting children from their bed is incredibly rare - probably the chance is one in one million

True dat.

Dog Man Star · 03-11-2018 07:17PM

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

True dat.

They were certainly negligent. The fact they admitted Madeline woke up looking for them the night before is very significant.

So Madeline says where were you when I woke up last night and their response was to do the same thing again, potentially dosing her up even more.

The twins didn't wake once despite the commotion.

Gerry McCann knows exactly what happened to Madeline McCann and knows where she is buried. Kate McCann has been a passenger to this.

I don't wish ill on them. They have suffered enough to lose their daughter.

Dog Man Star · 03-11-2018 07:21PM

Same here as in Trump forum. Loads of people who have read the case files and loads of morons. Uneducated people who form opinions on nothing versus educated people.

ozzy jr · 03-11-2018 07:24PM

Something Else

cnocbui wrote: »

I don't think the parents were negligent. The actual incidence of strangers abducting children from their bed is incredibly rare - probably the chance is one in 100 million.

They were the one and that's why you don't take that chance.

With all the myths and confusion knocking about regarding this case, the one thing that is absolutely certain is that the parents were negligent.

It's ridiculous to suggest otherwise.

iamwhoiam · 03-11-2018 07:30PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

ozzy jr wrote: »

They were the one and that's why you don't take that chance.

With all the myths and confusion knocking about regarding this case, the one thing that is absolutely certain is that the parents were negligent.

It's ridiculous to suggest otherwise.

Absolutley . Even if we put abduction aside the risks of leaving small children alone are huge . Falling , fitting , choking , vomiting or simply crying in fear . No one can deny those risks are far to high to take to go out to dinner night after night

Deusexmachina · 03-11-2018 07:58PM

tinpib wrote: »

It appears to me like you have posted this without watching any of his videos. Saying "eejits" and he has not "come up with a reasonable explanation themselves that does not complete collapse under the most basic scrutiny."

There are 14 hours of videos there, I watched maybe 8 hours of videos well over a year ago. I started watching a recent 3 part 90 minute set where he sets out what he thinks happened to her based on the evidence available.

I find it interesting that you dismiss him without watching them. That doesn't seem like an open-minded rational thing to do.

There are inconsistencies and then there are the sheer volume of inconsistencies in stories here which leads me to only one thing. What witnessses said happened did not happen.

As I say it was over a year ago but my lightbulb moment was when he examined the account of the last independent witness to see Madeleine alive.

This is from memory, he called round to their apartment at 8pm on the night it was claimed she was kidnapped and saw her there with Kate.

One account[either Kate or yer man] was that he remained outside the apartment door and had a quick chat for about 30 seconds, the other account was that he came inside and sat down on the couch and chatted for 5 minutes.

That type of inconsistency points to only one thing to me, it never happened, and they are coming up with a cock and bull story to police.

That's just from memory, watch the 14 hours of videos and make up your own mind before dismissing him.

He seems to have exhaustively researched everything.

I watched the first one as you suggested in your post just to be fair. Total crap about ‘the mainstream media and who controls them’. The usual conspiracy theory nonsense, sorry.

Deusexmachina · 03-11-2018 08:02PM

Dog Man Star wrote: »

They were certainly negligent. The fact they admitted Madeline woke up looking for them the night before is very significant.

So Madeline says where were you when I woke up last night and their response was to do the same thing again, potentially dosing her up even more.

The twins didn't wake once despite the commotion.

Gerry McCann knows exactly what happened to Madeline McCann and knows where she is buried. Kate McCann has been a passenger to this.

I don't wish ill on them. They have suffered enough to lose their daughter.

How does Gerry Mc Cann know where she is buried? how did he take her body out of the apartment and when? How did he manage to bury her so successfully despite the media and police being with or around them and the apartment constantly.
The car was only rented 3 weeks after her disappearance. Did he wait until she was 3 weeks hidden in the apartment?

Deusexmachina · 03-11-2018 08:07PM

ozzy jr wrote: »

They were the one and that's why you don't take that chance.

With all the myths and confusion knocking about regarding this case, the one thing that is absolutely certain is that the parents were negligent.

It's ridiculous to suggest otherwise.

They don’t deny that. They feel awful guilt. Now what?

iamwhoiam · 03-11-2018 08:14PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Deusexmachina wrote: »

They don’t deny that. They feel awful guilt. Now what?

Well Gerry maintained it was like dining in your back garden . It wasn't , unless you had a very large back garden with shrubs , a path , a flower bed , a swimming pool and another path between the house and your patio table

MonkieSocks · 03-11-2018 08:15PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Charmeleon wrote: »

Simple misunderstanding of how the dogs work. They detect molecules of cadaver scent and blood scent that start being released within an hour or so of death. It’s an indication that a body was there at some point.

http://www.csst.org/cadaver_scent.html

From that site:

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]*All post-mortem scent samples consist of sterile gauze pads, (sealed until just prior to use) placed on abdominal area of decedent for exactly 20 minutes.

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Gauze pads are then placed in unused plastic bags and double sealed with packing tape.
[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]All post-mortem scent samples are handled with latex gloves, and at no time do these samples come in skin contact with live human scent.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif] *All Live Human scent samples are placed on the abdominal area of a living person for exactly 20 minutes, then placed in unused plastic bags and double sealed in the same manner as the post-mortem samples.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif] All trials are conducted using a lineup method:

Each consists of a line of three gauze pads - one exposed to post-mortem scent, one exposed to live human scent, and one sterile unused pad opened with gloved hands just prior to each trial.

All trials are done on a hard surface, either asphalt, cement, or hard packed dry dirt ground.

Each dog is given the "cadaver" command by its handler and walked through the lineup.

The dog is then asked to choose and indicate to the handler which gauze contains post-mortem scent.

Every trial was "blind" to each handler working it, that is the handler had no prior knowledge of lineup sequence.

Dogs are given only a single choice per trial.

Choices are recorded as CORRECT or INCORRECT only.

Any dog that appeared unwilling to commit to a single sample was removed from that trial and the choice was recorded as Incorrect.

All samples are properly disposed of after each trial.

TRIALS BEGUN: January 1997
NUMBER OF DOGS USED: Five different dogs

POST-MORTEM INTERVAL RANGE: From 70 minutes to 3 days

NUMBER OF TRIALS COMPLETED: As of July 1997, total of 52 trials completed

PRELIMINARY RESULTS: The shortest post-mortem interval for which we received a correct response was one hour and 25 minutes.

However, the post-mortem interval for which we received a consistently correct response from all dogs involved is 2.5 - 3 hours.

[/FONT][/FONT]

Deusexmachina · 03-11-2018 08:27PM

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Well Gerry maintained it was like dining in your back garden . It wasn't , unless you had a very large back garden with shrubs , a path , a flower bed , a swimming pool and another path between the house and your patio table

Yes they were wrong. We know. They know. Everybody knows.

iamwhoiam · 03-11-2018 08:30PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Deusexmachina wrote: »

Yes they were wrong. We know. They know. Everybody knows.

Yes we do . And what is your point ? It can't be said often enough in my opinion . Loudly and clearly so it never happens another child

Deusexmachina · 03-11-2018 08:33PM

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Yes we do . And what is your point ? It can't be said often enough in my opinion . Loudly and clearly so it never happens another child

My point is that it doesn’t make them killers. They made a really bad error in judgement, really shockingly stupid. But it doesn’t mean they ‘deserve’ to lose their little girl. It doesn’t make them killers. That’s my point.

iamwhoiam · 03-11-2018 08:37PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Deusexmachina wrote: »

My point is that it doesn’t make them killers. They made a really bad error in judgement, really shockingly stupid. But it doesn’t mean they ‘deserve’ to lose their little girl. It doesn’t make them killers. That’s my point.

Why do you keep repeating that point to me ? Not once have I said they were killers , not once . Never have I hinted at it or said anything about taking their child was deserved . Make that point by all means to those who think they are

Deusexmachina · 03-11-2018 08:40PM

When my daughter was about 18 months old, I was putting her in her cot for her nap one afternoon. I thought I had pulled the cot gate up fully. I left her as she was just asleep and I tip toed downstairs to read my book.
10minutes later I heard an almighty thump and ran up the stairs. She had managed to pull the gate door down and fell out of the cot onto the wooden floor.
She was unconscious and bleeding from a head wound.
I nearly died. I got her to hospital at 100mph. She turned out fine. The hospital staff were initially very suspicious that I had hurt her myself. They rightly questioned me quite a bit.
Moral of the story - if my daughter had died, would I have ‘deserved’ it? Which of us are the perfect parent who gets it right every time and never makes a mistake?
Leave these poor parents alone.

Deusexmachina · 03-11-2018 08:42PM

iamwhoiam wrote: »

Why do you keep repeating that point to me ? Not once have I said they were killers , not once . Never have I hinted at it or said anything about taking their child was deserved . Make that point by all means to those who think they are

You know that this is a main narrative amongst the conspiracy theorists. Apologies if this is not your point but I do think everyone acknowledge they were wrong and there is no point repeating it ad nauseum.

iamwhoiam · 03-11-2018 08:44PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Deusexmachina wrote: »

When my daughter was about 18 months old, I was putting her in her cot for her nap one afternoon. I thought I had pulled the cot gate up fully. I left her as she was just asleep and I tip toed downstairs to read my book.
10minutes later I heard an almighty rheum and ran up the stairs. She Han managed to pull the gate door down and fell out of the cot onto the wooden floor.
She was unconscious and bleeding from a head wound.
I nearly died. I got her to hospital at 100mph. She turned out fine. The hospital staff were initially very suspicious that I had hurt her myself. They rightly questioned me quite a bit.
Moral of the story - if my daughter had died, would I have ‘deserved’ it? Which of us are the perfect parent who gets it right every time and never makes a mistake?
Leave these poor parents alone.

There is actually no comparison between human error and planned , thought out risk taking for your own benefit
They don't compare

iamwhoiam · 03-11-2018 08:48PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Deusexmachina wrote: »

You know that this is a main narrative amongst the conspiracy theorists. Apologies if this is not your point but I do think everyone acknowledge they were wrong and there is no point repeating it ad nauseum.

Sorry I don't know what you are trying to say ? And in fairness you are also repeating your point ad nauseum too
If we feel we are right and have an opinion we tend to repeat it when our opinion is challenged

Deusexmachina · 03-11-2018 08:48PM

iamwhoiam wrote: »

There is actually no comparison between human error and planned , thought out risk taking for your own benefit
They don't compare

I am lost now. I thought you just wrote that you don’t think the parents killed her?

the_pen_turner · 03-11-2018 08:50PM

Something Else

Deusexmachina wrote: »

When my daughter was about 18 months old, I was putting her in her cot for her nap one afternoon. I thought I had pulled the cot gate up fully. I left her as she was just asleep and I tip toed downstairs to read my book.
10minutes later I heard an almighty thump and ran up the stairs. She had managed to pull the gate door down and fell out of the cot onto the wooden floor.
She was unconscious and bleeding from a head wound.
I nearly died. I got her to hospital at 100mph. She turned out fine. The hospital staff were initially very suspicious that I had hurt her myself. They rightly questioned me quite a bit.
Moral of the story - if my daughter had died, would I have ‘deserved’ it? Which of us are the perfect parent who gets it right every time and never makes a mistake?
Leave these poor parents alone.

accidents happen. your child fell and hurt itself. thats sad and you wernt responsible.

now if you had went out for the evening or went into town to do the shopping what would have happened to your daughter. i dont know but she wouldnt have gotten better anyway.

iamwhoiam · 03-11-2018 08:50PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Deusexmachina wrote: »

I am lost now. I thought you just wrote that you don’t think the parents killed her?

I don't ? How on earth could you think I did from my post ?

Deusexmachina · 03-11-2018 08:52PM

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I don't ? How on earth could you think I did from my post ?

Jaysus, read it back to yourself.

Deusexmachina · 03-11-2018 08:54PM

the_pen_turner wrote: »

accidents happen. your child fell and hurt itself. thats sad and you wernt responsible.

now if you had went out for the evening or went into town to do the shopping what would have happened to your daughter. i dont know but she wouldnt have gotten better anyway.

No she wouldn’t. What’s your point?

iamwhoiam · 03-11-2018 08:54PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Deusexmachina wrote: »

Jaysus, read it back to yourself.

Give me a bloody break . I can read and write and nothing in my post makes any suggestions that tgey killed her

They took risks , they left three kids on their own for their own benefit of going out with mates for dinner . They planned going out , they thought about it and dismissed the risk . Where do you see anything about killing in that opinion

And I don't appreciate words or thoughts being put in my mouth .

Whispered · 03-11-2018 09:06PM

Deusexmachina wrote: »

You know that this is a main narrative amongst the conspiracy theorists. Apologies if this is not your point but I do think everyone acknowledge they were wrong and there is no point repeating it ad nauseum.

I don't think there is a comparison here. You said yourself you got your girl to hospital at 100km an hour. You were there to do that.

I don't think that they deserve to loose their little girl. My heart aches at the thought of it, however they were negligent whereas your example was simple accident.

the_pen_turner · 03-11-2018 09:15PM

Something Else

Deusexmachina wrote: »

No she wouldn’t. What’s your point?

my point is that any normal person would be there when their child had an accident. just like you were.

the mc canns wernt there . they have left her alone while they went off for the evening. .

had you done the same your child might not have survived.

willowthewisp · 03-11-2018 09:26PM

Deusexmachina wrote: »

When my daughter was about 18 months old, I was putting her in her cot for her nap one afternoon. I thought I had pulled the cot gate up fully. I left her as she was just asleep and I tip toed downstairs to read my book.
10minutes later I heard an almighty thump and ran up the stairs. She had managed to pull the gate door down and fell out of the cot onto the wooden floor.
She was unconscious and bleeding from a head wound.
I nearly died. I got her to hospital at 100mph. She turned out fine. The hospital staff were initially very suspicious that I had hurt her myself. They rightly questioned me quite a bit.
Moral of the story - if my daughter had died, would I have ‘deserved’ it? Which of us are the perfect parent who gets it right every time and never makes a mistake?
Leave these poor parents alone.

The difference is that you made an error and were there right away when something happened.
It’s not like you left the house and went for dinner leaving your child at risk in the house on their own.

tinpib · 03-11-2018 09:29PM

Something Else

Deusexmachina wrote: »

How does Gerry Mc Cann know where she is buried? how did he take her body out of the apartment and when? How did he manage to bury her so successfully despite the media and police being with or around them and the apartment constantly.
The car was only rented 3 weeks after her disappearance. Did he wait until she was 3 weeks hidden in the apartment?

I appreciate you watching the video I suggested but it seems that you instantly dismiss it as "conspiracy theory" rather than examine the points he raises.

You are playing the man and not the ball. But also you would need to watch more than one video.

Regarding above, Richard Hall suggests Madeliene died on the Saturday, giving them time to plan and dispose of the body before she was reported abducted on the following Thursday.

limnam · 03-11-2018 09:34PM

Outside of the tapas gang/McCann's

Who was the last independent witness to see Madeleine alive and what date time was it ?

iamwhoiam · 03-11-2018 09:41PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

limnam wrote: »

Outside of the tapas gang/McCann's

Who was the last independent witness to see Madeleine alive and what date time was it ?

I think it might have been one of the creche workers when Madeleine was picked up that afternoon

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/EMMA_WILDING.htm

Madeleine McCann

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