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Nature in the News

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  • #1322
    keps
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,324 ✭✭✭keps


    Today's Guardian




    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/oct/13/price-list-shoot-rare-deer-trophy-hunting-woburn-abbey


  • #1323
    New Home
    Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 78,100 Mod ✭✭✭✭New Home


    :( :mad:


  • #1324
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 52,279 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    i have read comment online that the headline and many conclusions reported are premature - here's hoping:

    Britain faces brown hare extinction as myxomatosis ‘leaps species’
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/britain-faces-brown-hare-extinction-as-myxomatosis-leaps-species-rkphfzpl0?shareToken=976c7be16d23a0d0e7ce2e9122d4f7d5


  • #1325
    Graces7
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,634 ✭✭✭✭Graces7


    New Home wrote: »
    :( :mad:

    you are right. there are no words. totally barbaric. Was there not something much lesser here in Killarney National Park a few years ago g


  • #1326
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,989 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    The deer are specially bred for their antlers. Check out the headgear on these (which are in NZ but there is an international trade in the stud deer)..
    http://peelforestestate.co.nz/trophy-masters-looking-pretty-sharp-video/


    IMO you can't really complain unless you are already a vegan. selective breeding of livestock for various purposes has been going on for millennia.


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  • #1327
    New Home
    Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 78,100 Mod ✭✭✭✭New Home


    Don't their antlers fall off?


  • #1328
    deise08
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,330 ✭✭✭deise08


    They look abnormal! Like those Belgian blue bulls... That's not natural selection.


  • #1329
    Base price
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,623 ✭✭✭✭Base price


    Graces7 wrote: »
    you are right. there are no words. totally barbaric. Was there not something much lesser here in Killarney National Park a few years ago g
    Deer have to be culled (manually) in order to maintain the herds health status as they do not have any natural predators. NPWS are the authorised body who carry out these culls.


  • #1330
    New Home
    Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 78,100 Mod ✭✭✭✭New Home


    That to me is the difference. Having to cull animals that wouldn't otherwise be there to maintain numbers within manageable levels is bad enough when done by official bodies, but trophy hunting, to me, is despicable. Killing anything shouldn't be done for fun, in my view.


  • #1331
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    Base price wrote: »
    Deer have to be culled (manually) in order to maintain the herds health status as they do not have any natural predators. NPWS are the authorised body who carry out these culls.

    And that is the difference - a huge difference. The comparison between this story and needful culls in Killarney is muddying the waters unnecessarily. You are perfectly correct on the necessary culling and the proper role of NPWS in it.


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  • #1332
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    New Home wrote: »
    Don't they their antlers fall off?

    These people want the complete rack of antlers for mounting, as opposed to single antlers. I've a fair selection of antlers here, that have all been naturally shed.


  • #1333
    Base price
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,623 ✭✭✭✭Base price


    Moses Faithful Slime wrote: »
    These people want the complete rack of antlers for mounting, as opposed to single antlers. I've a fair selection of antlers here, that have all been naturally shed.
    Is it not the case that trophy hunters want the antlers still attached to the scull.


  • #1334
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,989 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    deise08 wrote: »
    They look abnormal! Like those Belgian blue bulls... That's not natural selection.
    No its not, its selective breeding. There are various strains of "domesticated" red deer now, some bred for antlers and some for meat.
    Also you have to consider that in NZ these are not a native species to be "managed" for any ecological reason. They are farmed livestock. Same goes for a wildlife park/deer farm in the UK. Also I assume the meat is consumed after they have been shot.

    If you oppose killing animals for sport, then you have do ask yourself whether wearing leather or fur is really a necessity for you, or whether you can survive without eating hamburgers and/or rashers. Its not easy to draw that line in the sand.
    I'm not a vegetarian by the way, nor do I hunt.


  • #1335
    Base price
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,623 ✭✭✭✭Base price


    recedite wrote: »
    No its not, its selective breeding. There are various strains of "domesticated" red deer now, some bred for antlers and some for meat.
    Also you have to consider that in NZ these are not a native species to be "managed" for any ecological reason. They are farmed livestock. Same goes for a wildlife park/deer farm in the UK. Also I assume the meat is consumed after they have been shot.

    If you oppose killing animals for sport, then you have do ask yourself whether wearing leather or fur is really a necessity for you, or whether you can survive without eating hamburgers and/or rashers. Its not easy to draw that line in the sand.
    I'm not a vegetarian by the way, nor do I hunt.
    In fairness leather/skins are a byproduct of the meat industry. Wearing fur is a personal choice.
    I do hunt/fish and other than vermin I cook and eat everything.
    ** I don't hunt deer as I don't possess a suitable rifle but I do enjoy venison.


  • #1336
    keps
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,324 ✭✭✭keps


    The 'crazy' desire to shoot wildlife can have a bad ending


    Today's Guardian



    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/oct/14/british-man-shot-dead-by-hunter-in-france


  • #1337
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    Base price wrote: »
    Is it not the case that trophy hunters want the antlers still attached to the scull.

    That's what makes it a rack.


  • #1338
    keps
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,324 ✭✭✭keps


    More bad news I'm afraid


    Today's Guardian


    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/oct/15/humanity-is-cutting-down-the-tree-of-life-warn-scientists


  • #1339
    New Home
    Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 78,100 Mod ✭✭✭✭New Home


    :mad: :( again...


  • #1340
    Graces7
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,634 ✭✭✭✭Graces7


    Base price wrote: »
    Deer have to be culled (manually) in order to maintain the herds health status as they do not have any natural predators. NPWS are the authorised body who carry out these culls.

    That is not the incident I was talking about.

    although there was deep concern also about the way they "disposed" of the remains which is what sparked the row in the press.

    A separate event when the right to kill a stag in the National park was sold to a US hunter. Same idea as this article. I was deeply involved with the NPWS at that time.


  • #1341
    Graces7
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,634 ✭✭✭✭Graces7


    Base price wrote: »
    Is it not the case that trophy hunters want the antlers still attached to the scull.

    Indeed yes. My own father had such a pair of "trophies" mounted. Tiny antlers...skull bones and all..they haunted me all my childhood


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  • #1342
    Graces7
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,634 ✭✭✭✭Graces7


    recedite wrote: »
    No its not, its selective breeding. There are various strains of "domesticated" red deer now, some bred for antlers and some for meat.
    Also you have to consider that in NZ these are not a native species to be "managed" for any ecological reason. They are farmed livestock. Same goes for a wildlife park/deer farm in the UK. Also I assume the meat is consumed after they have been shot.

    If you oppose killing animals for sport, then you have do ask yourself whether wearing leather or fur is really a necessity for you, or whether you can survive without eating hamburgers and/or rashers. Its not easy to draw that line in the sand.
    I'm not a vegetarian by the way, nor do I hunt.

    Re your last para. survive? meat is not a necessity and easy to live without harm nor hurt. and without fur or leather. each to their own..

    but yes you are right. needs must be consistent


  • #1343
    OpenYourEyes
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,080 Mod ✭✭✭✭OpenYourEyes


    Mod Note:

    This thread is for Nature/News - if people want to continue the above convo DM me and I'll move it to its own thread. Otherwise, lets stick to News in here!

    Cheers!


  • #1344
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    As if we didn't know....

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/twenty-three-birds-of-prey-poisioned-and-shot-in-state-last-year-1.3665526?localLinksEnabled=false


  • #1345
    New Home
    Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 78,100 Mod ✭✭✭✭New Home


    Good God... 23?

    When I read stuff like that, I really hate people.


  • #1346
    cd07
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 466 ✭✭cd07


    23 is a drop in the ocean if u ask me....


  • #1347
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    cd07 wrote: »
    23 is a drop in the ocean if u ask me....

    Agreed, the odds of finding a dead bird are huge.


  • #1348
    New Home
    Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 78,100 Mod ✭✭✭✭New Home


    Oceans are made up of drops, though.

    EDIT: Sorry, I misread your posts, I thought you meant that 23 was only a small number and nothing to worry about, whereas I think you actually meant that way more birds are killed but are never found.


  • #1349
    cd07
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 466 ✭✭cd07


    Moses Faithful Slime wrote:
    Agreed, the odds of finding a dead bird are huge.


    And the odds finding the culprit of a shooting or poisoning are bigger again


  • #1350
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 52,279 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    ‘Hyperalarming’ study shows massive insect loss
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/science/2018/10/15/hyperalarming-study-shows-massive-insect-loss


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  • #1351
    New Home
    Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 78,100 Mod ✭✭✭✭New Home


    On a happier note...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXMfbY8CawY


    It's probably old news, but still...


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