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Family of seven sleep in Garda station Mod note post one

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Comments

  • #5672
    Wheeliebin30
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,593 ✭✭✭Wheeliebin30


    Grab All Association wrote: »
    Ms Cash is not committing fraud. She’s legally entitled to these payments unfortunately. It’s the system that’s wrong here. It’s is set up to be abused.

    Fraud would be claiming JSA whilst working 30 hours a week or purposely faking illness or injury to collect illness or disability. Thankfully both are rare and the majority of welfare fraud you hear of is incorrect information given by either the claimant, department or changes in circumstances not notified.

    Child benefit and lone parent payments are paid when you give birth to a child up until age 7 no jobseeking and CB until 18. All you’ve do is to have a child every 7 years and you can retire. By the time you hit the age you can’t do it anymore you’ll be almost under a decade away from a non contributor pension and the DSP won’t force you to jobseek as nobody will hire you to wipe their ass by then at that age

    She is claiming fraud by changing her status to single the day her story broke.


  • #5673
    Sardine
    Site Banned Posts: 210 ✭✭Sardine


    tom1ie wrote: »
    I wouldn’t feel sorry for her, she probably knows no different and wants to have kids and be a mother. The state promotes this way of life as there is no incentive to go out and work. We are taxed to the hilt to pay for houses and furnishing those houses etc and people in receipt of this live quite a comfortable life.

    Well I feel sorry for her because churning out babies from that age sounds more like Medieval practice than something from the year 2018.
    All the things she'd miss out on that we can do nowadays. Travel, college, all the people you meet, so many things to do in modern Ireland and beyond. I went to school with people from the North Inner City who had sisters like this and they used to think I was from a different planet and were weary of me because I was from a bit further afield and didn't talk the same as them. That's the level of narrow mindedness you're dealing with. I wouldn't wish it on anyone, free gaf or not.


  • #5674
    tom1ie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,629 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Sardine wrote: »
    As much as I find it ridiculous the tax payer has to fund someone who's never worked and is having 8 children, what do people suggest we do at this stage?
    Cutting welfare etc would mean the kids are even more likely to turn to crime no?
    Those kids didn't ask to be in this situation. Maybe the authorities should make sure they get an education and maybe even make sure they are provided with some kind of mentors during their formulative years? A "big brother" mentor type thing? It's the only way they will learn of other ways to live your life. All of this is probably cheaper than keeping them in prison in the future.
    Maybe discouraging girls to have kids so young would also help. I was cycling through the Sheriff St area of Dublin going home yesterday and saw a pregnant girl who looked no more than 18 or 19 and just felt really sorry for her, knowing she'll never get to experience so many things in life and will be stuck in the same narrow minded uneducated way of life for the rest of her days.

    (1) Cap child benefit at two children. Then if one or two parents work 39 hour weeks child benefit can be paid for the remaining kids.
    (2) provide state run childcare (they have this already in areas like jobs town for which you pay a minimal amount) so that parents can go out and work.
    (3) parents that won’t work or partake in community works, will incrementally lose a certain amount of jsa.
    (4) root and branch review of disability allowance. So that people fraudulently acquiring this will be put back into the workforce.


  • #5675
    tom1ie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,629 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Sardine wrote: »
    Well I feel sorry for her because churning out babies from that age sounds more like Medieval practice than something from the year 2018.
    All the things she'd miss out on that we can do nowadays. Travel, college, all the people you meet, so many things to do in modern Ireland and beyond. I went to school with people from the North Inner City who had sisters like this and they used to think I was from a different planet and were weary of me because I was from a bit further afield and didn't talk the same as them. That's the level of narrow mindedness you're dealing with. I wouldn't wish it on anyone, free gaf or not.

    Why is it medieval practice? The country needs a high birth rate. However responsibility needs to go hand in hand with this. Have as many kids as you can afford to support. Don’t expect others to pay for their upkeep.


  • #5676
    Sardine
    Site Banned Posts: 210 ✭✭Sardine


    tom1ie wrote: »
    (1) Cap child benefit at two children.

    And what if they go and have 8 anyway? It's not really fair on the kids that they have to live in poverty due to the actions of their idiot parents. It means the kids will be poorer and have even less chance of a good life.


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  • #5677
    Sardine
    Site Banned Posts: 210 ✭✭Sardine


    tom1ie wrote: »
    Why is it medieval practice? The country needs a high birth rate. However responsibility needs to go hand in hand with this. Have as many kids as you can afford to support. Don’t expect others to pay for their upkeep.

    In my opinion it doesn't need a high birth rate and I'd rather keep the population as is. The world has far too many people already. Is constant economic and population growth the only way?


  • #5678
    tom1ie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,629 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Wheeliebin30 wrote: »
    Have you a link to her actually saying this would happen?

    No I don’t actually, it’s all just paper speak and kite flying at the moment. But I’m just wondering is the best option to hope for, that fg get a large majority and they’ll then go back to the business of being right of centre?


  • #5679
    dermo888
    Site Banned Posts: 160 ✭✭dermo888


    Creidim mise, le n'aice an cailin seo 'Tugann Saothar Saoirse'.
    Ireland was born as a 'Free State', but a certain proportion of its people don't like Work. And we know what work leads to for decent people. It sets them up. It sets them free.


  • #5680
    tom1ie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,629 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Sardine wrote: »
    In my opinion it doesn't need a high birth rate and I'd rather keep the population as is. The world has far too many people already. Is constant economic and population growth the only way?

    So what are you going to do about the impending pension crisis? People living longer and drawing their pensions for longer. That means money has to be found to pay for those pensions or the country goes bust.
    The only way to pay for those pensions is to have more people working or higher taxes on the people working already.
    That’s why it’s so important the likes of ms cash is kept to a minimum as they are a dead weight on the economy.


  • #5681
    PlaneSpeeking
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,106 ✭✭✭PlaneSpeeking


    Sardine wrote: »
    And what if they go and have 8 anyway? It's not really fair on the kids that they have to live in poverty due to the actions of their idiot parents. It means the kids will be poorer and have even less chance of a good life.

    And how exactly is that our problem ????

    Do you just want to continue to pass on the equivalent of six figure salaries to these wasters ? When will it end ?

    Announce the cap at two kids, anyone CHOOSING to have more after that ? Tough.


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  • #5682
    Sardine
    Site Banned Posts: 210 ✭✭Sardine


    tom1ie wrote: »
    So what are you going to do about the impending pension crisis? People living longer and drawing their pensions for longer. That means money has to be found to pay for those pensions or the country goes bust.
    The only way to pay for those pensions is to have more people working or higher taxes on the people working already.
    That’s why it’s so important the likes of ms cash is kept to a minimum as they are a dead weight on the economy.

    I don't know about pensions etc but I do know forever expanding the population isn't a solution to anything. So we're kinda f*cked. Going a bit off topic here though.


  • #5683
    Sardine
    Site Banned Posts: 210 ✭✭Sardine


    PlaneSpeeking wrote: »
    And how exactly is that our problem ????

    Do you just want to continue to pass on the equivalent of six figure salaries to these wasters ? When will it end ?

    Announce the cap at two kids, anyone CHOOSING to have more after that ? Tough.

    Well it will be our problem as they'll end up as criminals etc.
    I'm not condoning Ms Cash's behaviour but the reality is these people will continue to have kids without thinking of the consequences and we'll have to clean up the mess one way or another.


  • #5684
    PlaneSpeeking
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,106 ✭✭✭PlaneSpeeking


    Sardine wrote: »
    Well it will be our problem as they'll end up as criminals etc.
    I'm not condoning Ms Cash's behaviour but the reality is these people will continue to have kids without thinking of the consequences and we'll have to clean up the mess one way or another.

    Forced sterilisation after the third one.

    I would have zero qualms about this, seeing as there are people determined to allow feral scumbags to breed a dozen criminals each.


  • #5685
    Sardine
    Site Banned Posts: 210 ✭✭Sardine


    PlaneSpeeking wrote: »
    Forced sterilisation after the third one.

    I would have zero qualms about this, seeing as there are people determined to allow feral scumbags to breed a dozen criminals each.

    Well there is that option but I'm pretty sure the entire world would turn their backs on us if we were to introduce eugenics into Ireland, so let's face it it's not realistic.


  • #5686
    maynooth_rules
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,514 ✭✭✭maynooth_rules


    smurgen wrote: »
    I'm starting to wonder if this is all a ploy of the government parties to get the working taxpayer angry.turn them anti social welfare and pull the rug from traditionally socialist parties like Sinn Fein. The reporting on this case just seems so bizarre.

    I'm hoping this is the case, otherwise I am getting seriously worried about the country my child will grow up in.


  • #5687
    dermo888
    Site Banned Posts: 160 ✭✭dermo888


    Creidim mise, le n'aice an fhaib air an cailin seo 'Tugann Saothar Saoirse".
    Ireland was born as a Free State, and a certain proportion of its people need to respect the meaning of work and freedom. Its the setting that counts.


  • #5688
    PlaneSpeeking
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,106 ✭✭✭PlaneSpeeking


    Sardine wrote: »
    Well there is that option but I'm pretty sure the entire world would turn their backs on us if we were to introduce eugenics into Ireland, so let's face it it's not realistic.

    I am so sick of reading "that's not realistic", "that won't work", "that is unworkable" etc etc etc - almost as much as I am sick of reading entitled scumbags with near as damnit 5 grand a month tax free to p**s away.

    It IS workable, we just need to show some balls. If it means building workhouses, FINE.


  • #5689
    Sardine
    Site Banned Posts: 210 ✭✭Sardine


    PlaneSpeeking wrote: »
    I am so sick of reading "that's not realistic", "that won't work", "that is unworkable" etc etc etc - almost as much as I am sick of reading entitled scumbags with near as damnit 5 grand a month tax free to p**s away.

    It IS workable, we just need to show some balls. If it means building workhouses, FINE.

    So you want to introduce forced sterilisation in Ireland for certain people?
    You don't think that would have a negative affect on Ireland?


  • #5690
    dermo888
    Site Banned Posts: 160 ✭✭dermo888


    PlaneSpeeking wrote: »
    Sardine wrote: »
    Well there is that option but I'm pretty sure the entire world would turn their backs on us if we were to introduce eugenics into Ireland, so let's face it it's not realistic.

    I am so sick of reading "that's not realistic", "that won't work", "that is unworkable" etc etc etc - almost as much as I am sick of reading entitled scumbags with near as damnit 5 grand a month tax free to p**s away.

    It IS workable, we just need to show some balls.  If it means building workhouses, FINE.
    PlaneSpeeking wrote: »
    Sardine wrote: »
    Well there is that option but I'm pretty sure the entire world would turn their backs on us if we were to introduce eugenics into Ireland, so let's face it it's not realistic.

    I am so sick of reading "that's not realistic", "that won't work", "that is unworkable" etc etc etc - almost as much as I am sick of reading entitled scumbags with near as damnit 5 grand a month tax free to p**s away.

    It IS workable, we just need to show some balls.  If it means building workhouses, FINE.
    Agree - Except these won't be like the awful 19th Century workhouses. Schemes that are socially useful such as building a direct Dublin to Derry railway using the 1942-1945 Japanese 'Burma Siam' system of management could work very well in solving the anti-social Skanger problem


  • #5691
    PlaneSpeeking
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,106 ✭✭✭PlaneSpeeking


    Sardine wrote: »
    So you want to introduce forced sterilisation in Ireland for certain people?
    You don't think that would have a negative affect on Ireland?

    And you think people like her hoovering up the welfare budget and constantly breeding anti social yobs will have a positive effect ????


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  • #5692
    PlaneSpeeking
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,106 ✭✭✭PlaneSpeeking


    dermo888 wrote: »
    Agree - Except these won't be like the awful 19th Century workhouses. Schemes that are socially useful such as building a direct Dublin to Derry railway using the 1942-1945 Japanese 'Burma Siam' system of management could work very well in solving the anti-social Skanger problem

    Oh look, one step from a Godwin. So close.


  • #5693
    Sardine
    Site Banned Posts: 210 ✭✭Sardine


    PlaneSpeeking wrote: »
    And you think people like her hoovering up the welfare budget and constantly breeding anti social yobs will have a positive effect ????

    I certainly don't. I just wouldn't go as far as introducing Nazi policies ffs.


  • #5694
    tom1ie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,629 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Sardine wrote: »
    Well it will be our problem as they'll end up as criminals etc.
    I'm not condoning Ms Cash's behaviour but the reality is these people will continue to have kids without thinking of the consequences and we'll have to clean up the mess one way or another.

    But giving the parents money for nothing isn’t the answer. They have to earn that money from the state, aka us, one way or the other.
    If child benefit is capped from let’s say 2020, I think you’ll find people will choose not to have as many kids. That’ll bring its own problems, but it’ll be a start against the likes of cash.


  • #5695
    Skelet0n
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 372 ✭✭Skelet0n


    Surely the problem stems from just handing out cold currency. Currency that can be used to buy fags or drink or whatever. A credit system where the credits can be used in state run shops to buy necessities.


  • #5696
    Sardine
    Site Banned Posts: 210 ✭✭Sardine


    tom1ie wrote: »
    But giving the parents money for nothing isn’t the answer. They have to earn that money from the state, aka us, one way or the other.
    If child benefit is capped from let’s say 2020, I think you’ll find people will choose not to have as many kids. That’ll bring its own problems, but it’ll be a start against the likes of cash.

    Yeah they'd probably not have as many. Some still would though, what do you do with those ones is what I'm unsure of.


  • #5697
    PlaneSpeeking
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,106 ✭✭✭PlaneSpeeking


    Sardine wrote: »
    I certainly don't. I just wouldn't go as far as introducing Nazi policies ffs.

    Ding ding - we got a Godwin.

    Okay then, what is the way to stop this situation repeating itself ? All some posters have done is say the suggestions made would not work.

    So what would ?


  • #5698
    tom1ie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,629 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    dermo888 wrote: »
    Creidim mise, le n'aice an fhaib air an cailin seo 'Tugann Saothar Saoirse".
    Ireland was born as a Free State, and a certain proportion of its people need to respect the meaning of work and freedom. Its the setting that counts.

    What exactly are you trying to say here?


  • #5699
    Sardine
    Site Banned Posts: 210 ✭✭Sardine


    Skelet0n wrote: »
    Surely the problem stems from just handing out cold currency. Currency that can be used to buy fags or drink or whatever. A credit system where the credits can be used in state run shops to buy necessities.

    I remember trading butter vouchers for John Player Blue's as a child...


  • #5700
    tom1ie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,629 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    PlaneSpeeking wrote: »
    Forced sterilisation after the third one.

    I would have zero qualms about this, seeing as there are people determined to allow feral scumbags to breed a dozen criminals each.

    Well that’s just over the top! Forced sterilization!? We are not nazis.


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  • #5701
    Sardine
    Site Banned Posts: 210 ✭✭Sardine


    PlaneSpeeking wrote: »
    Ding ding - we got a Godwin.

    Okay then, what is the way to stop this situation repeating itself ? All some posters have done is say the suggestions made would not work.

    So what would ?

    Sorry you can't just dismiss something because I pointed it out as being a Nazi policy. I'm unaware of any other regime that sterilised people forcefully so of course I'm going to compare it to that.


This discussion has been closed.
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