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Donald Trump is the President Mark IV (Read Mod Warning in OP)

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    #1292
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,481 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    Some more classy tweets yesterday:
    https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1030074380397752320

    https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1030091812495654912

    https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1030094399362007040

    He got fired up by those 300 odd editorials. The last one in particular is a leap and a half and very much a "its only true if I say it" vibe from it.


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    #1293
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 35,956 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    I don't think it's hyperbolic to suggest this continued attack against the press is going to get a journalist killed. His base is ravenous and more than a little zealous, someone's going to take it too far.


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    #1294
    dudara
    Registered Users Posts: 33,519 ✭✭✭✭dudara


    pixelburp wrote: »
    I don't think it's hyperbolic to suggest this continued attack against the press is going to get a journalist killed. His base is ravenous and more than a little zealous, someone's going to take it too far.

    There's no doubt in my head that his attacks contributed to the Ananapolis attack. It's not a case of if or when he'll get a journalist killed, he already has.


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    #1295
    Patser
    Registered Users Posts: 7,963 ✭✭✭Patser


    pixelburp wrote: »
    I'd totally forgotten about Trumps demand for a military parade, and looks like it's still going ahead (4 days after the midterms) - though the cost has gone from an estimated 12 to 92 million. A lot of money being wasted on an ego stroking exercise, for a president who dodged the Vietnam draft over 'bone spurs'

    https://www.cnbc.com/2018/08/16/trump-military-parade-expected-to-cost-80-million-more-than-estimated.html

    It's now being pushed back to 'sometime' in 2019.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-45217286


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    #1296
    Hande hoche!
    Registered Users Posts: 7,522 ✭✭✭Hande hoche!


    With regards the military parade could see the can being kicked down the road again next year. The excuse of the hundred year anniversary of the first world war ending also won't be there. Shy of say a US withdrawal from Syria and Afghanistan, can't see them having a reason to throw one anyway.

    Wouldn't read too much into the Brennan timing, it was long predicted. Same reason the man had an opinion piece lined up and ready to go to print in the NYT.


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    #1297
    everlast75
    Registered Users Posts: 19,165 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    Apparently Omarosa has 200 tapes.

    While she is no martyr, I can't help but feel a little schadenfreude in how she has played Trump. She was fired 3 or 4 times so it takes no genius to know prior to her last firing, what was coming. On that basis, it was time to stock up on the recordings.

    Plus, she was with him for years. He made it known that he recorded conversations (or at least said he did), so she learned that from him.

    The way she is leaking them too is quite clever, tactically. It keeps her in the headlines and keeps him responding, which gives her book publicity.

    The Trump Administration is a bunch of rats, and they are turning on each other. Its not pretty, but I have zero sympathy for any of them.


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    #1298
    amandstu
    Registered Users Posts: 3,436 ✭✭✭amandstu


    everlast75 wrote: »
    Apparently Omarosa has 200 tapes.

    While she is no martyr, I can't help but feel a little schadenfreude in how she has played Trump. She was fired 3 or 4 times so it takes no genius to know prior to her last firing, what was coming. On that basis, it was time to stock up on the recordings.

    Plus, she was with him for years. He made it known that he recorded conversations (or at least said he did), so she learned that from him.

    The way she is leaking them too is quite clever, tactically. It keeps her in the headlines and keeps him responding, which gives her book publicity.

    The Trump Administration is a bunch of rats, and they are turning on each other. Its not pretty, but I have zero sympathy for any of them.
    Yes it is hard not to feel guilty when Trump and his gang are the "wronged party" and yet one enjoys their discomfort.

    Whether it will come to anything is a different matter. God help us if he comes out of it looking better than before ...

    Good news about the parade postponement ...one cringe less for now,


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    #1299
    Christy42
    Registered Users Posts: 7,885 ✭✭✭Christy42


    everlast75 wrote: »
    Apparently Omarosa has 200 tapes.

    While she is no martyr, I can't help but feel a little schadenfreude in how she has played Trump. She was fired 3 or 4 times so it takes no genius to know prior to her last firing, what was coming. On that basis, it was time to stock up on the recordings.

    Plus, she was with him for years. He made it known that he recorded conversations (or at least said he did), so she learned that from him.

    The way she is leaking them too is quite clever, tactically. It keeps her in the headlines and keeps him responding, which gives her book publicity.

    The Trump Administration is a bunch of rats, and they are turning on each other. Its not pretty, but I have zero sympathy for any of them.
    She times them well. Let's them make claims and then releases the appropriate tape like the hush money one.

    Granted if she had the big one I presume she could have just gone with that but it is obvious no one in the Trump camp is sure she doesn't.


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    #1300
    everlast75
    Registered Users Posts: 19,165 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    Christy42 wrote: »
    She times them well. Let's them make claims and then releases the appropriate tape like the hush money one.

    Granted if she had the big one I presume she could have just gone with that but it is obvious no one in the Trump camp is sure she doesn't.

    I dunno. You don't want to go with the nuke straight away. Everything is downhill from there. Gotta keep them interested...


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    #1301
    amandstu
    Registered Users Posts: 3,436 ✭✭✭amandstu


    everlast75 wrote: »
    I dunno. You don't want to go with the nuke straight away. Everything is downhill from there. Gotta keep them interested...
    Not to be a party pooper but if she is shown to be obviously lying then should there be some sort of a sanction? The so called president is actually the president
    and venal detraction from the highest office in the country is not to be encouraged.

    Also what does not kill him makes him stronger ,no?


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    #1302
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,204 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    Christy42 wrote: »
    She times them well. Let's them make claims and then releases the appropriate tape like the hush money one.

    Granted if she had the big one I presume she could have just gone with that but it is obvious no one in the Trump camp is sure she doesn't.
    everlast75 wrote: »
    I dunno. You don't want to go with the nuke straight away. Everything is downhill from there. Gotta keep them interested...

    She is beating him at his own game - She is 100% his creation and she's turned on him..

    She says something explosive , let's them jump up and deny it and then she releases a tape to confirm/validate her version of events. She's now done it 3 times and they've fallen for it each time.
    Will they learn for her next exposé ??


    His lack of understanding of the difference between his "reality TV" life and the real world is astounding.

    She was great box-office on the Apprentice because she was a volatile back-stabbing drama-queen and it made for good ratings and because he is fixated on "ratings" he brought her to the White House.

    That has now back-fired on him spectacularly..


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    #1303
    everlast75
    Registered Users Posts: 19,165 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    amandstu wrote: »
    Not to be a party pooper but if she is shown to be obviously lying then should there be some sort of a sanction? The so called president is actually the president
    and venal detraction from the highest office in the country is not to be encouraged.

    Also what does not kill him makes him stronger ,no?

    When he acts presidential, then I will consider him such.

    Re Omarosa - let me clarify.

    I wouldn't believe a word out of her mouth.

    I would not buy her book.

    I will however listen to any tapes that she releases.

    If Trump thinks she is lying, let him sue for defamation. Heaven knows, he isn't litigation shy. But I would wager he won't. Because he will know what is on the tapes is true.


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    #1304
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,204 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    amandstu wrote: »
    Not to be a party pooper but if she is shown to be obviously lying then should there be some sort of a sanction? The so called president is actually the president
    and venal detraction from the highest office in the country is not to be encouraged.

    Also what does not kill him makes him stronger ,no?

    Agreed , but so far she hasn't - Everything she has said that the the White House or Trump Campaign have denied she has produced recordings to support her side of the story..

    Don't get me wrong , she's clearly an unpleasant gold-digger who's only concern is profit/profile for herself , but given that the target of her efforts is an equally venal, self centred group of people it's extremely hard to feel any degree of sympathy.


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    #1305
    Leroy42
    Registered Users Posts: 15,531 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    amandstu wrote: »
    Not to be a party pooper but if she is shown to be obviously lying then should there be some sort of a sanction? The so called president is actually the president
    and venal detraction from the highest office in the country is not to be encouraged.

    Also what does not kill him makes him stronger ,no?

    But this is a problem of Trumps own making. He, and SHS, have actively dset out to debase the words of POTUS at every opportunity. HE didn't mean what he said, he meant it but didn't know he said it, he knew he said i but didn't mean to say it, he meant to say it but not how he said it. Etc.

    He has shown a flagrant disregard for the truth, as SHS said it, it doesn't matter if it is true once the message gets out.

    We have KAC with her 'alternative facts'

    So why is anyone is bothered if what Omarosa is 100% accurate. Its the message that is important. Trump supporters will try to pick apart little details, but then tell us that Trump isn't a details man and we can't hang up over what he actually says.


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    #1306
    DrumSteve
    Registered Users Posts: 10,799 ✭✭✭✭DrumSteve


    everlast75 wrote: »
    When he acts presidential, then I will consider him such.

    Re Omarosa - let me clarify.

    I wouldn't believe a word out of her mouth.

    I would not buy her book.

    I will however listen to any tapes that she releases.

    If Trump thinks she is lying, let him sue for defamation. Heaven knows, he isn't litigation shy. But I would wager he won't. Because he will know what is on the tapes is true.

    He's the president; everything he does is presidential.


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    #1307
    Dohnjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 17,813 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    DrumSteve wrote: »
    He's the president; everything he does is presidential.

    He is president, but he doesn't act presidential


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    #1308
    Christy42
    Registered Users Posts: 7,885 ✭✭✭Christy42


    DrumSteve wrote: »
    everlast75 wrote: »
    When he acts presidential, then I will consider him such.

    Re Omarosa - let me clarify.

    I wouldn't believe a word out of her mouth.

    I would not buy her book.

    I will however listen to any tapes that she releases.

    If Trump thinks she is lying, let him sue for defamation. Heaven knows, he isn't litigation shy. But I would wager he won't. Because he will know what is on the tapes is true.

    He's the president; everything he does is presidential.
    So if Messi goes on a massive drinking/drugs binge that counts as professional then since he is a professional footballer?

    He's a President. There have been many before and the are more across the world. Not everything they do is presidential. Presidential is more to do with the theme across multiple presidents and world leaders. An outlier is ignored.


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    #1309
    amandstu
    Registered Users Posts: 3,436 ✭✭✭amandstu


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    But this is a problem of Trumps own making. He, and SHS, have actively dset out to debase the words of POTUS at every opportunity. HE didn't mean what he said, he meant it but didn't know he said it, he knew he said i but didn't mean to say it, he meant to say it but not how he said it. Etc.

    He has shown a flagrant disregard for the truth, as SHS said it, it doesn't matter if it is true once the message gets out.

    We have KAC with her 'alternative facts'

    So why is anyone is bothered if what Omarosa is 100% accurate. Its the message that is important. Trump supporters will try to pick apart little details, but then tell us that Trump isn't a details man and we can't hang up over what he actually says.


    I was thinking in terms of a proper president who came after Trump. But it is true ,if the tapes exist ,even if wrongly procured he should have an explanation (he would not be the first to be in that invidious position -even his lawyer taped him btw:that says something).

    Maybe he is waiting for the n-tape to come out so as to respond in his usual trashy way....


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    #1310
    DrumSteve
    Registered Users Posts: 10,799 ✭✭✭✭DrumSteve


    Christy42 wrote: »
    So if Messi goes on a massive drinking/drugs binge that counts as professional then since he is a professional footballer?

    He's a President. There have been many before and the are more across the world. Not everything they do is presidential. Presidential is more to do with the theme across multiple presidents and world leaders. An outlier is ignored.

    But he is the President? So therefore everything he does will be presidential?


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    #1311
    Leroy42
    Registered Users Posts: 15,531 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    DrumSteve wrote: »
    But he is the President? So therefore everything he does will be presidential?

    So why did the GOP did so hung up about what Bill did then?


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    #1312
    Trent Houseboat
    Registered Users Posts: 1,116 ✭✭✭Trent Houseboat


    amandstu wrote: »
    Not to be a party pooper but if she is shown to be obviously lying then should there be some sort of a sanction? The so called president is actually the president
    and venal detraction from the highest office in the country is not to be encouraged.

    Also what does not kill him makes him stronger ,no?
    There was a racist game show host who spent eight years lying about the president's place of birth and eligibility to hold the office.
    He was given free reign by the mainstream media to spout his unfounded conspiracy theories regularly promising proof, though none ever came to light.
    (At least Omarosa started with some stuff that was actually true and she could prove)

    His saction was the presidency, so be careful what you wish for.


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    #1313
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 35,956 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    DrumSteve wrote: »
    But he is the President? So therefore everything he does will be presidential?

    Only from the point of view of semantics; it shouldn't need pointing out that holding the Office of the President doesn't automatically equate to 'Presidential behaviour', which means, at a minimum acting in a diplomatic, intelligent, statesman esque fashion. It also means actually knowing the rules of law and Constitution you're meant to uphold - which Trump doesn't & steadfastly refuses to learn.


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    #1314
    Christy42
    Registered Users Posts: 7,885 ✭✭✭Christy42


    DrumSteve wrote: »
    Christy42 wrote: »
    So if Messi goes on a massive drinking/drugs binge that counts as professional then since he is a professional footballer?

    He's a President. There have been many before and the are more across the world. Not everything they do is presidential. Presidential is more to do with the theme across multiple presidents and world leaders. An outlier is ignored.

    But he is the President? So therefore everything he does will be presidential?
    Not how how English works.

    Maybe if enough presidents come along who act like that presidential may become a bad word. Until then they are not going to change the meaning of the word over one person. It is a separate word from president with its own meaning (certainly derived from how world leaders have acted in the past and the word may evolve further but its definition is not dependent on a Presidents every action). Side note you can act presidential without being president of anything.

    If it was simply things done by a president the word would quickly become pointless and no longer be used.

    https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/presidential see 1.1


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    #1315
    looksee
    Registered Users Posts: 28,210 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    Trump tweet from last night
    How can “Senator” Richard Blumenthal, who went around for twenty years as a Connecticut politician bragging that he was a great Marine war hero in Vietnam (then got caught and sobbingly admitted he was neither a Marine nor ever in Vietnam), pass judgement on anyone? Loser!

    Whatever about Blumenthal, the lack of self-awareness of Trump is far beyond normal, he really does have problems.


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    #1316
    DrumSteve
    Registered Users Posts: 10,799 ✭✭✭✭DrumSteve


    Christy42 wrote: »
    Not how how English works.

    Maybe if enough presidents come along who act like that presidential may become a bad word. Until then they are not going to change the meaning of the word over one person. It is a separate word from president with its own meaning (certainly derived from how world leaders have acted in the past and the word may evolve further but its definition is not dependent on a Presidents every action). Side note you can act presidential without being president of anything.

    If it was simply things done by a president the word would quickly become pointless and no longer be used.

    https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/presidential see 1.1

    I know how English works, jesus. (Also two how's don't make sense in your first sentence if we're going there).

    The point I am making is that he (trump) is president; therefore his actions while president will be presidential actions.

    While you or I might not agree with them; there is a huge cohort of people who believe he is extremely presidential (almost by virue of the fact that he doesn't act presidential, which he has alluded to at many of his rallies).


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    #1317
    Dohnjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 17,813 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    DrumSteve wrote: »

    The point I am making is that he (trump) is president; therefore his actions while president will be presidential actions.

    Semantics. To act "presidential" can be defined. Trump doesn't fit that general definition

    What his supporters believe is subjective. They could put a pig on a ballot sheet and elect it to office, it wouldn't mean the pig was "acting presidential"


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    #1318
    DrumSteve
    Registered Users Posts: 10,799 ✭✭✭✭DrumSteve


    pixelburp wrote: »
    Only from the point of view of semantics; it shouldn't need pointing out that holding the Office of the President doesn't automatically equate to 'Presidential behaviour', which means, at a minimum acting in a diplomatic, intelligent, statesman esque fashion. It also means actually knowing the rules of law and Constitution you're meant to uphold - which Trump doesn't & steadfastly refuses to learn.

    Which is the point I was making; that his actions while president are presidential actions.

    On a side note, there is a huge section of American society that doesn't care about what is considered "presidential" behaviour and associates it with the elite. Should this cause a re-evaluation of what it means to be president as the values noted above by you seem more aspirational than reality at this stage.


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    #1319
    DrumSteve
    Registered Users Posts: 10,799 ✭✭✭✭DrumSteve


    Dohnjoe wrote: »
    Semantics. To act "presidential" can be defined. Trump doesn't fit that general definition

    What his supporters believe is subjective. They could put a pig on a ballot sheet and elect it to office, it wouldn't mean the pig was "acting presidential"

    While you say semantics, is that sentence objectively untrue? Of course, there are "presidential" actions. The question I'm putting out is that as he is president; all of his actions are presidential actions.


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    #1320
    DrumSteve
    Registered Users Posts: 10,799 ✭✭✭✭DrumSteve


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    So why did the GOP did so hung up about what Bill did then?

    Just so I'm clear; I'm being extremely literal in the question I'm asking.


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    #1321
    oscarBravo
    Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,792 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    DrumSteve wrote: »
    While you say semantics, is that sentence objectively untrue? Of course, there are "presidential" actions. The question I'm putting out is that as he is president; all of his actions are presidential actions.

    You're carving out a closely-managed definition of "presidential" to suit your argument. You're saying that anything that is of, or related to, a president is ipso facto presidential.

    So, yes: according to the pointlessly narrow definition of the word you're insisting on using, anything Trump does is "presidential". He eats "presidential" meals of overcooked steaks with ketchup and "presidentially" calls black women dogs on Twitter.

    But the analogy has already been made, and you've ignored it: if a professional person does something, does that mean that they're necessarily acting professionally?

    The words "professional" and "presidential" in normal usage have well-understood meanings. If you insist on using the Kelly-Ann Conway meaning of "presidential", fine: just don't expect anyone else to play the same stupid word game.

    There is nothing presidential about Trump, other than the tragic fact that he's the President.


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