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All things relating to Jordan Peterson

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    #92
    jobbridge4life
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,759 ✭✭✭jobbridge4life


    klqhz513ec7rai wrote: »
    I looked at her blog, Jaysus, she's not easy on the eye ... I think she should be careful what she wishes for - I'd imagine that Peterson would destroy her on live radio

    You would, would you? Did you listen to today's interview? His shrill emotional shrieking against Ireland's most famously perpetually unprepared interviewer doesn't bode well.


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    #93
    glic71rods46t0
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,074 ✭✭✭glic71rods46t0


    jobbridge4life wrote: »
    You would, would you? Did you listen to today's interview? His shrill emotional shrieking against Ireland's most famously perpetually unprepared interviewer doesn't bode well.

    In your opinion ... I hold a different one


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    #94
    Pug160
    Registered Users Posts: 1,088 ✭✭✭Pug160


    I watched it and saw a rather unremarkable interview which wasn't particularly confrontational. I'm not sure if it was intentional, but at the end she was reading out listeners' responses but didn't give him a chance to retort.


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    #95
    Brae100
    Closed Accounts Posts: 322 ✭✭Brae100


    I still don't get the hate. He seems to be a huge target, but why? I enjoyed his takedown of Cathy Newman for what it was, and then watched a bit more of him. There's nothing really controversial there. Why are the SJWs hell bent on taking him down? What message is he giving that so enrages them?


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    #96
    splinter65
    Registered Users Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    Brae100 wrote: »
    I still don't get the hate. He seems to be a huge target, but why? I enjoyed his takedown of Cathy Newman for what it was, and then watched a bit more of him. There's nothing really controversial there. Why are the SJWs hell bent on taking him down? What message is he giving that so enrages them?

    They’re terrified of anyone getting a platform to tell the truth and state facts in a calm rational manner.
    They’ve worked so hard to replace common sense and science with bunkum and nonsense and they’ve pretty much brain washed a huge chunk of society so when someone like Peterson or Shapiro can pack huge venues just to hear them speak then that is ultra threatening and must be halted.


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    #97
    DickSwiveller Returns
    Closed Accounts Posts: 752 ✭✭✭DickSwiveller Returns


    Brae100 wrote: »
    I still don't get the hate. He seems to be a huge target, but why? I enjoyed his takedown of Cathy Newman for what it was, and then watched a bit more of him. There's nothing really controversial there. Why are the SJWs hell bent on taking him down? What message is he giving that so enrages them?

    They despise people who expose them for the nasty ideologues they are. It happens to anyone who dares speak out against them.


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    #98
    DickSwiveller Returns
    Closed Accounts Posts: 752 ✭✭✭DickSwiveller Returns


    The right on "journalists" don't like him so he must be doing something right.

    https://twitter.com/colettebrowne/status/1018083311321673728


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    #99
    SkepticQuark
    Registered Users Posts: 501 ✭✭✭SkepticQuark


    splinter65 wrote: »
    They’re terrified of anyone getting a platform to tell the truth and state facts in a calm rational manner.
    They’ve worked so hard to replace common sense and science with bunkum and nonsense and they’ve pretty much brain washed a huge chunk of society so when someone like Peterson or Shapiro can pack huge venues just to hear them speak then that is ultra threatening and must be halted.

    I wouldn't say Peterson or Shapiro are the pinnacles of common sense and science though. Go watch Peterson and Dillahunty together a few months ago, after I watched that I just can't like the guy. In fact, a lot of the stuff Peterson has parroted makes about as much sense as the "SJWs" people here are attacking.

    Now sure people might watch the more sensible parts of Peterson, his interview with Cathy Newman or his rather innocent statements about cleaning up rooms but that isn't the whole story here and once you start digging as I did over the last few months you quickly realise Peterson isn't the person his almost cult-like following seems to suggest.

    I might expand my thoughts on him some other time, depends on the reaction to this honestly.


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    #100
    Wibbs
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,074 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    roddy15 wrote: »
    you quickly realise Peterson isn't the person his almost cult-like following seems to suggest.
    Yep, though this is a defining feature of anybody who reaches cult like status. People just love their personal, philosophical and political "messiahs" and will them into positions of moral authority that nobody can hold for very long, while detractors scream feet of clay at them. Most such messiahs have a few very sensible points to make and that would be that, and great, if it was left at that, but people want to believe in more. Can't be a very comfortable position to be in. He seems aware of it mind you. I read where he noted that his current position is untenable in the longterm and he'll say or do something, likely off the cuff and unguarded and that will be his end in the spotlight.

    Rejoice in the awareness of feeling stupid, for that’s how you end up learning new things. If you’re not aware you’re stupid, you probably are.



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    #101
    glic71rods46t0
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,074 ✭✭✭glic71rods46t0


    Wibbs wrote: »
    Yep, though this is a defining feature of anybody who reaches cult like status. People just love their personal, philosophical and political "messiahs" and will them into positions of moral authority that nobody can hold for very long, while detractors scream feet of clay at them. Most such messiahs have a few very sensible points to make and that would be that, and great, if it was left at that, but people want to believe in more. Can't be a very comfortable position to be in. He seems aware of it mind you. I read where he noted that his current position is untenable in the longterm and he'll say or do something, likely off the cuff and unguarded and that will be his end in the spotlight.

    I think that might have been the C4 interview - it seems to infuriate his opposition that he doesn't hide his humanity and its basic truths (like making mistakes is human). Its fun watching the reactions of the women studies academics and others getting triggered!


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    #102
    DickSwiveller Returns
    Closed Accounts Posts: 752 ✭✭✭DickSwiveller Returns


    jobbridge4life wrote: »
    You would, would you? Did you listen to today's interview? His shrill emotional shrieking against Ireland's most famously perpetually unprepared interviewer doesn't bode well.

    Would still dismantle a gender studies professor. My dog could.


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    #103
    DickSwiveller Returns
    Closed Accounts Posts: 752 ✭✭✭DickSwiveller Returns


    roddy15 wrote: »
    I wouldn't say Peterson or Shapiro are the pinnacles of common sense and science though. Go watch Peterson and Dillahunty together a few months ago, after I watched that I just can't like the guy. In fact, a lot of the stuff Peterson has parroted makes about as much sense as the "SJWs" people here are attacking.

    Now sure people might watch the more sensible parts of Peterson, his interview with Cathy Newman or his rather innocent statements about cleaning up rooms but that isn't the whole story here and once you start digging as I did over the last few months you quickly realise Peterson isn't the person his almost cult-like following seems to suggest.

    I might expand my thoughts on him some other time, depends on the reaction to this honestly.

    I think the fame has gone to Peterson's head and he thinks he's an expert in lots of different fields. I wish he would stick with the psychology and opposing left wing ideologues. The religious stuff is very tedious.


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    #104
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    Was at the 3 Arena with my wife last night. First thing she said was there must be some other event on at the same time as she couldn't believe the crowd - to be honest I couldn't either.

    Really enjoyed the evening, debate was good and I thought Sam Harris and Douglas Murray were great. The Pangburn guy was a pain though and badly organised.

    Peterson rambled a bit too much IMO but made some good points.

    The male/female ratio was somewhere between 80% to 90% male. That's not what people have been saying online but this is the reality.


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    #105
    Eric Cartman
    Registered Users Posts: 26,283 ✭✭✭✭Eric Cartman


    professore wrote: »
    Was at the 3 Arena with my wife last night. First thing she said was there must be some other event on at the same time as she couldn't believe the crowd - to be honest I couldn't either.

    Really enjoyed the evening, debate was good and I thought Sam Harris and Douglas Murray were great. The Pangburn guy was a pain though and badly organised.

    Peterson rambled a bit too much IMO but made some good points.

    The male/female ratio was somewhere between 80% to 90% male. That's not what people have been saying online but this is the reality.

    I was there too and can agree with that ratio, but its politics/political based discussion, the interest curve is just that way.

    that said I felt some of it got quite rambly in places and unfortunately I was sitting quite near some 'neckbeard' type character for whom a shower and deodorant were lacking. A few lads with trump hats and flags that thought it was going to be a lot more 'right wing rhetoric' than philosophical discussion.


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    #106
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Eric Cartman wrote: »
    I was there too and can agree with that ratio, but its politics/political based discussion, the interest curve is just that way.

    Maybe there needs to be gender quotas then... :D


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    #107
    Brae100
    Closed Accounts Posts: 322 ✭✭Brae100


    Wibbs wrote: »
    Yep, though this is a defining feature of anybody who reaches cult like status. People just love their personal, philosophical and political "messiahs" and will them into positions of moral authority that nobody can hold for very long, while detractors scream feet of clay at them. Most such messiahs have a few very sensible points to make and that would be that, and great, if it was left at that, but people want to believe in more. Can't be a very comfortable position to be in. He seems aware of it mind you. I read where he noted that his current position is untenable in the longterm and he'll say or do something, likely off the cuff and unguarded and that will be his end in the spotlight.

    I get all that, but why the hatred? He is offering nothing more than the likes of Tony Robbins, but he never got this sort of grief. JBP is being de-platformed and accused of being an alt-right misogynist. Why? What's going on here?


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    #108
    Eric Cartman
    Registered Users Posts: 26,283 ✭✭✭✭Eric Cartman


    Brae100 wrote: »
    I get all that, but why the hatred? He is offering nothing more than the likes of Tony Robbins, but he never got this sort of grief. JBP is being de-platformed and accused of being an alt-right misogynist. Why? What's going on here?

    he explained it pretty well, on the right hand side of the political scale you have the first click of 'id like to pay less taxes' and after that it falls off a cliff into being a nazi , on the left nobody ever decided where the cliff edge is so you can go pretty far before being an extremist. So everyone on the left just sees the cliff and for fear of nazi's ever coming back they label everyone even vaguely on the right as a nazi so if they fall off that short cliff then everyone was prepared.


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    #109
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Brae100 wrote: »
    I get all that, but why the hatred? He is offering nothing more than the likes of Tony Robbins, but he never got this sort of grief. JBP is being de-platformed and accused of being an alt-right misogynist. Why? What's going on here?

    He made a TV interviewer look retarded. Most news/opinion shows these days are incredibly leftist and/or feminist especially when there's a woman in the seat (plenty of male presenters waving that flag too), and I suspect he receives so much negative attention, because they don't want to have to interview him.

    Doing so would require them to have their facts properly researched, and that would have them highlighting the inequalities that they don't want to show. So, it's just easier for them to downplay, backstab (after interview remarks) or insult him.


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    #110
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,276 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Peterson has disagreed and the Left, as it has become more and more Middle Class has become puritanical in its attitude to those who commit heresy.

    That he is such a highly cited Professor, who has taught in two of the finest Psychology Depts in the world, makes it worse. That he is articulate, strangely charismatic and compelling in awkward passion further adds to it.

    They have all the answers and analysis, the issue is settled and here is this gangly canuck with a take that people are responding to.

    The crazy thing is much of what he says would not have raised an eyebrow for the left thirty years ago. Back when you were more likely to have lads with dirt under the nails at the meeting.

    He is undermining their entire world view, how they conceive themselves, their faith, who they imagine themselves to be.

    It cannot be stressed enough how the Left today has become like a religion, a community of believers in a world of Sin.

    It is a great tragedy as people need a Left that is relevant andand mu h of what has made Europe great was off the back of the Left.


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    #111
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    Brae100 wrote: »
    I get all that, but why the hatred? He is offering nothing more than the likes of Tony Robbins, but he never got this sort of grief. JBP is being de-platformed and accused of being an alt-right misogynist. Why? What's going on here?

    He first sprung to widespread "fame" when he objected to bill C16 which forced by law that people address trans and others such as furries (or people taking the piss pretending to be one of these groups) by their preferred pronouns. Rightly in my opinion, he objected to being forced by law to speak in a certain way. It was interpreted as some sort of transphobic attack. Since the trans are high up on the oppression hierarchy, he had committed the cardinal sin of seeming to attack them.

    Never mind that the same people condemning him have no issue publically actually attacking "cisgendered white men" and blaming them as a group for everything that is wrong in society.

    People like me and lots of others was listening to his excellent YouTube psychology lectures when he was just a humble professor for over a year before this happened - and there was NOTHING like this or political in there - unless you think saying that a lot of women in high paying careers choose to ease back and have children in their 30s is somehow sexist and controversial. He was actually very fair and balanced to both men and women. My daughter thinks he's great for example and she's not a shrinking violet. If you like blaming everything and everyone except yourself for your problems, and believe you have all the rights and someone else has all the responsibilities then he's not for you. If you think you should get your **** together and make something of yourself then he will sound like a breath of fresh air.

    I was quite amazed how he was portrayed by the media. Made me wonder if anything you read can be trusted and that actually Donald Trump has a point about "fake news".


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    #112
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 37,244 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    I'm noticing that there seems to be a disturbing trend of people seeming more and more inclined to sign upto cults centred around people like Donald Trump, Jordan Peterson and Elon Musk to the point where they seem intent on outsourcing their own thinking to these figures. Anyone who dissents gets set upon and any actual debate about what they say is forbidden.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



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    #113
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    Just had a thought - he could use bill C16 to force people by law to refer to him as "The Patriarchial Ruler of all womankind" and they would have to comply :D:D:D


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    #114
    maximoose
    Registered Users Posts: 9,196 ✭✭✭maximoose


    Just added a Dublin date to his tour, Olympia on 21st Oct


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    #115
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    I'm noticing that there seems to be a disturbing trend of people seeming more and more inclined to sign upto cults centred around people like Donald Trump, Jordan Peterson and Elon Musk to the point where they seem intent on outsourcing their own thinking to these figures. Anyone who dissents gets set upon and any actual debate about what they say is forbidden.

    That's human nature. It's no different than the cults around feminism, LGBTQ+, celebrity culture etc.

    I would distinguish between people who agree with many of the ideas of a particular figure or ideology and someone who slavishly follows everything they say.

    I'm not sure if the likes of Peterson or Musk have anything approaching an ideology. Maybe you have a point though. When people are marching down the street shouting catchy lobster slogans or getting to Mars then I'll start to worry about it.


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    #116
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 37,244 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    professore wrote: »
    That's human nature. It's no different than the cults around feminism, LGBTQ+, celebrity culture etc.

    I would distinguish between people who agree with many of the ideas of a particular figure or ideology and someone who slavishly follows everything they say.

    I'm not sure if the likes of Peterson or Musk have anything approaching an ideology. Maybe you have a point though. When people are marching down the street shouting catchy lobster slogans or getting to Mars then I'll start to worry about it.

    The ideologies you mention are a set of beliefs. I was referring to specific figures.

    I'd also stress that Peterson himself has no interest in such a cult as I see it. It's a chunk of his followers.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



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    #117
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    I'm noticing that there seems to be a disturbing trend of people seeming more and more inclined to sign upto cults centred around people like Donald Trump, Jordan Peterson and Elon Musk to the point where they seem intent on outsourcing their own thinking to these figures. Anyone who dissents gets set upon and any actual debate about what they say is forbidden.

    This is it..the whole cult of personality..it appears people struggle to think for themselves..or is it something to do with the whole identity politics..it becomes something by which they define themselves..


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    #118
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 37,244 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Deleted User wrote: »
    This is it..the whole cult of personality..it appears people struggle to think for themselves..or is it something to do with the whole identity politics..it becomes something by which they define themselves..

    Identity politics is likely helping to fuel it as is hyper-individualism. People feel lost because of the latter and besieged because of the former.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



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    #119
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,276 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    I'm noticing that there seems to be a disturbing trend of people seeming more and more inclined to sign upto cults centred around people like Donald Trump, Jordan Peterson and Elon Musk to the point where they seem intent on outsourcing their own thinking to these figures. Anyone who dissents gets set upon and any actual debate about what they say is forbidden.

    There is a push back against the Left and self described progressives. It certainly would be a mistake to replicate their tactics and approach as that has only brought electoral disaster to the Left.

    Debate is not forbidden, outside of Antifa trust fund kids who is blocking debates or disrupting talks. Who outside of Middle Class activists who have taken over the Left view No Platforming as a valid and positive tactic, well, maybe shock jocks or several Youtube commentators who became famous off it?

    If there is a problem and I think there is more than there was, it is on all sides of politics at the moment. People are separating in to camps.

    Nationalists vs Internationalists/Globalists, Old status quo vs newer forces, to a smaller degree Left vs Right.


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    #120
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 37,244 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Danzy wrote: »
    There is a push back against the Left and self described progressives.

    Debate is not forbidden, outside of Antifa trust fund kids who is blocking debates or disrupting talks. Who outside of Middle Class activists who have taken over the Left view No Platforming as a valid and positive tactic?

    If there is a problem and I think there is, it is on all sides of politics at the moment. People are separating in to camps.

    Nationalists vs Internationalists, Old status quo vs newer forces, etc etc

    You've only called out one side though.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



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    #121
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,276 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    ancapailldorcha wrote: »
    You've only called out one side though.

    True, the problem for the last decade was largely on the Left though, as it sunk deeper in to a cultish miasma and took positions so far removed from its base and history that it found itself sharing views with extreme Libertarians and CEOs.

    Maybe the Pendulum has now swung the other way that the Priest like mob will be on the other side for the next decade.


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