All things relating to Jordan Peterson

Agreed. Some interesting viewpoints but he tends to lose me after a bit. Still, he's a semi-reputable male who can argue against Feminists or far left wingers, and that, in my mind, is gold. Everyone who seems to do the same, losses all credibility after a while. I do wish he'd leave out the dating advice though... :rolleyes:

WhiteMemento9 wrote: »

Lefties? Do you actually understand the implications of what he saying about many topics. He comes at things with an attitude I wouldn't associate with the left at all. I don't agree with boxing things into left and right as we all should have far more nuanced views but if we are using those labels I don't understand how he could be viewed through a lens of the left. If i was placing tags I would consider him far more right-wing.

This is all mixed up though as you can paint many pictures which don't make sense which is why the whole tag is a load of rubbish. You should be able to listen to someone and make a judgement through your own moral lens of where you stand without the need to paint someone into a corner.

I think you're forgetting that most of his material is aimed at the US which is far less nuanced when it comes to Left/Right, although TBH in the year I've been back in Ireland, I've noticed a serious increase in attitudes which I would normally have considered to be "American". Admittedly, I was rather shocked at how divisive the left/right labeling had become when I returned (after living in a bubble of China for ten years you kinda don't appreciate this stuff the same way as you would being exposed to it).

In many ways, I don't really see that much difference between a lot of Left/Right attitudes. They're both hellbent on shutting down discussion unless it's discussion that marches with their line of thinking. It's all become rather black or white in the west these days. Less so in mainland Europe but the English speaking western countries are very much that way.

Either you support trans rights completely or you're completely against it, and if you're against it, then you must hate them, which adds you to another "phobia". Or whichever <insert>phobia you want to look at.

And then there's massive upsurge of victimisation. Lauding being a victim (whatever the circumstances). Sure, Feminists latched on to that one quickly, but both the Left & Right are throwing their own lack of responsibility spin on everything. Utterly Bizarre to me.

Europe used to be far different from the US but that gap is disappearing fast in many areas. Not so much Ireland, but that's unlikely to last much longer considering our politicians just love to join in with whatever the bigger countries are doing...

I do have a lot of issue with what Peterson says, or perhaps more accurately how he says it. There seems to be a habit of his to overly complicate subjects as if using jargon makes him more intelligent... Still, I do welcome his views because it adds to the whole. Too many people seem to get shut down online, and we're stuck with a chorus group of speakers.

WhiteMemento9 wrote: »

Thanks, much of that post makes sense. I guess in the bigger picture I just view Peterson as an idiot who doesn't really see the world. He has found a niche in which he can bang a drum about topics but in the general sense of advancing us as a species to a better place, I think he has nothing to offer.

For the last few years I've been teaching at universities in China. I teach/lecture business/finance subjects in English, along with corporate ethics classes. Chinese people really find it difficult to truly grasp the logic behind western culture... and in many ways, I'm finding the younger generation here to be similiar. Better because they grew up surrounded by the culture, but unwilling to ask the hard questions as to why things are as they are.

Anyway, I mean to say that I've been surrounded by Professors with PHDs coming out of their ears, and loads of publications to boot. I have a MBA. That's it. The thing about academia and those with PHDs is that they tend to feel a certain contempt towards whats practical knowledge, and focus everything through the lens of their PHD discipline. Which is understandable since they've invested so much time into it, and it's all they really use on a regular basis. But there's also a lack of challenge too. Those with PHDs are supposedly experts in their field, and nobody really wants to challenge them about that expert status.

Now... I have a variety of NLP practitioner certifications, and I'm also certified to be a hypnotist although I've never used any of it on a "patient". However, I've attended dozens of seminars on NLP and Psychology. Psychologists are very much like those with PHDs I described before. They're hellbent on translating everything through the lens of their expertise, and very few are willing to think outside of that very limited box. Pseudoscience & pop "psychology" has made it's way into psychology with the rise of feminism and the massive increase of women within the industry coming from US universities.

Peterson isn't quite as bad as the others but there's elements of his talks which follow the same trend. I appreciate that he uses statistical knowledge to back up his claims/observations, but I've become less comfortable in believing statistics over the years since reporting stats comes with its own biases.

haha. I started with a clear idea of what I wanted to say, and kinda lost it.

Suffice to say that Peterson talks about the real world like he would a social experiment assigned to a class. He tends to miss out on the pain, passion, deceit, etc that is involved with living. But then, so too do his opponents. Peterson is perhaps better at this though, but I find him overly clinical at times.

I rather look towards people who are talking outside of the box about how we can actually change things for the better as a world society.

Me too... but then traditional thinking failed me in so many ways, or I failed at applying traditional thinking to my life. Everything that makes me a better person, or a happier person, I've found through non-traditional means. My life isn't "normal" compared to virtually everyone I grew up with or know (outside of the friends I have "collected"). And yet, I'm generally happier than them. Far less stress lines on my face or gray hairs too.

Some guy talking about how he helped him consider losing a few pounds to advance his life isn't really what I am looking for from great minds of our time. I am sorry by the way, I am not being flippant about your life and I am glad it has helped out

Peterson arrived a long time after I helped myself. I'd highly recommend that you listen to a variety of "Richard Bandlers" recordings on how NLP was created, and the application of it. That probably affected me more than most other recordings... but then there's the (literally) hundreds of business management books, or the "spiritual awakening" books I've read.

Improving yourself is a journey. There is never going to be one single source that does it all for you. That's why people nowadays are so unhappy... Everyone seems to want that quick fix. The magic answer that will solve their problems. Sorry, it doesn't exist, and never has. [Although, LSD does make you re-evaluate your life, and is worth doing once. Play safe. ]

but at the end of the day this guy I feel isn't someone who will help us get where we need to go as a people.

The time of great leaders or inspirational leaders is dead. I don't believe that we, as a society, are capable of trusting anyone enough for him/her/it (I'm being modern now ) to actually lead us anywhere suitable. People have become too jaded and cynical about the whole thing, tired of hearing the promises of politicians or spiritual leaders who promise the sky but deliver the sewer.

So..., I would say to not look to a person to lead (or inform) society to something better, but that society will discover a better way to perceive the world.

I'm not holding my breath though. Living in China/Japan/Korea brought a lot of clarity to my views regarding Western societies, and the accusations of other nationals describing "the west" as decadent and abusive, which made me re-examine a lot of my convictions... and I found them wanting. There is a lot of truth to the views of these peoples outside of "the west", although you'll rarely hear any of it being said inside of western countries. There really is so much of a superiority complex going on within western societies when people compare their countries to those outside, and very little of it is justified.

Globalisation may not have been my first choice but since it has happened why the hell are we still thinking isolationist as countries and not what is best for us all.

Because people are inherently selfish but taught to feel guilt at being selfish.

Most Chinese people do not understand Americans. Most Americans I know (not all mind but most) don't really understand the differences between Europeans and themselves. Most Irish people don't really understand the Poles or the Germans.

The point is that Globalisation is a bit of a propaganda piece. Considering the population of our countries, very few people really spend any time trying to get to know or appreciate other countries culture, beyond what is written in a guide book or a school book. There really is very little pressure on people to look beyond their own culture and actually appreciate the world. Oh! Some people do, but most people who travel go for short hops within very controlled circumstances.

Globalisation isn't real. It's spin. Oh, we have the internet, global communications, and relatively fast transportation links, but there has been very little actual understanding and knowledge shared. Most countries are still very isolated to the rest of the world, and there are heaps of people who never leave their own national borders (or in the case of Ireland, never leave Ireland/UK/Ibiza).

{I probably shouldn't have written all this but I'm rather drunk right now. :pac:}