New VHS Rental store in Liverpool

Sad Professor · 02-07-2018 10:09am

WhiteMemento9 wrote: »

This will obviously flop as an idea but I never got the crystal clear picture thing. I remember watching some fantasy thing. I forget the name now. It was in that crystal clear, high definition, ultra-realistic, reach out and touch it stuff. It completely broke any spell of being able to drift into a fantasy reality. It looked too real and I remember watching as a group of some wizards and the like were climbing a mountain and just laughing as my brain registered it as just a bunch of men dressed up in costumes having a laugh. People who have used virtual reality have all been saying something similar. In the more cartoon stuff, it is easier for your brain to play along and get lost in the world. The tipping point for that stuff is when you brain can't tell the difference.

Just to point out, with older films this is usually the result of bad encodes and masters that scrub away all the natural grain which would have maintained that dream-like feeling you describe. As shot and shown in the cinema, they wouldn't have looked that clear. The Predator Blu-ray is an infamous example of this.

Newer films shot on digital are another matter. The Hobbit is a pretty egregious example of how HD and higher frame rates can break the spell of a fantasy world.

pixelburp · 02-07-2018 10:18am

Whatever about vinyl records having a different range etc, I find it hard to believe VHS offers some unique visual range. I daresay if you asked 100 directors (or indeed, DPs) for their thoughts on the video cassette and what visual eccentricities it offers, they'd probably laugh at you. Especially those who shot on 35mm film and so on...

Though speaking of visual clarity, it's funny to watch some of those early-days films shot on digital; they look bloody terrible now. That lot fidelity digital look really aging quite badly.

02-07-2018 10:33am

I have quite a few VHS around the place, generally, they are for films which have never made the jump to DVD or Blu-Ray but rather than watch them back on an actual VHS player I've ripped most of them and did a bit of work on cleaning up the image as no matter how you try and dress it up, VHS is an awful format. With Vinyl the appeal is obvious though that said most modern vinyl releases are the same as the CD and digital versions making it kind of pointless in most cases. VHS has always been shit and there's no warmth or nostalgia associated with it.

WhiteMemento9 · 02-07-2018 10:39am

Sad Professor wrote: »

Just to point out, with older films this is usually the result of bad encodes and masters that scrub away all the natural grain which would have maintained that dream-like feeling you describe. As shot and shown in the cinema, they wouldn't have looked that clear. The Predator Blu-ray is an infamous example of this.

Newer films shot on digital are another matter. The Hobbit is a pretty egregious example of how HD and higher frame rates can break the spell of a fantasy world.

Funny, it was The Hobbit that I was searching for the name of and couldn't find.

It only comes into play in fantasy stuff I think although I haven't thought about it too deeply. Stuff like Space which we know to be real and awe-inspiring my brain can get on board with seeing that in the most realistic way possible.

McLoughlin · 02-07-2018 10:59am

Some films were edited or altered when released on DVD/Blu like Star Wars, ET, Muppet Christmas Carol so if you want to see those films how they were originally seen you would need to watch them on VHS.

Sad Professor · 02-07-2018 11:04am

In analog terms, I think the closest film equivalent to vinyl would be 16mm prints of movies, such as those distributed to libraries etc before home video technology existed. But obviously they are no longer produced and would be prohibitively expensive to collect.

Technocentral · 02-07-2018 11:22am

Sad Professor wrote: »

In analog terms, I think the closest film equivalent to vinyl would be 16mm prints of movies, such as those distributed to libraries etc before home video technology existed. But obviously they are no longer produced and would be prohibitively expensive to collect.

I love vinyl, its 35mm not 16mm imo.

WhiteMemento9 · 02-07-2018 11:39am

I think another angle is people love the whole idea of VHS and miss it. The whole experience of rooting around a shop trying to discover something new. Adding the fluid as someone posted and all the other bits that went with that era. It was all part of the experience. Clicking a button instantly having something playing that was suggested you would like while great for the consumption of the media has little value in the experience outside of the media if that makes sense.

Tony EH · 02-07-2018 1:29pm

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There was a certain aesthetic, for want of a better word, to going to a video shop and spending a while picking out a film to watch. There was something special about those lurid 80's video covers and the large boxes that appealed.

It never really transferred to the DVD age and when streaming came in, it really was the end.

But that's kinda the problem with the human condition isn't it? We love the idea of convenience, but when we achieve it we miss the old days where we had to put a bit of energy into what we did, because the result felt better.

These days, I can sift through a ton of films online and I never get the feeling that I want to watch any of it.

During the video days, I'd want to rent half the bloody shop.

Husker Du · 02-07-2018 1:48pm

Two brilliant posts ^. Sums it up perfectly.

I have everything I could want to watch at my finger tips, but I rarely do.

I'd actually love to have to go to a shop on the chance they have something I want to rent or ask them to hold it when it comes back.

Also back in the 80's and 90's there wasn't much news in terms of release schedules. The anticipation and the possibility of renting something like the latest Die Hard or Friday the 13th was great.

WhiteMemento9 · 02-07-2018 2:07pm

If you dare talk about these things being real pleasures in life that have been lost in an age of convenience which has happened without us understanding it diminishes our overall enjoyment of life, you are called a hipster :P

Mrcaramelchoc · 02-07-2018 2:08pm

I remember we had a vcr ,that when you pressed eject the drawer(place where you inserted the video) would rise up.sometimes that drawer got stuck and it took a few goes to get it to open.

Sure enough myself and my friend obtained a blue movie one evening.we started to watch it when we noticed my fathers car pulling up the drive.i nearly **** in my pants because the drawer would not open after numerous presses of the button.
My father's key turned in the door and the drawer rose up to save our 16 year old necks.
I don't miss vhs : )

Tony EH · 02-07-2018 2:13pm

WhiteMemento9 wrote: »

If you dare talk about these things being real pleasures in life that have been lost in an age of convenience which has happened without us understanding it diminishes our overall enjoyment of life, you are called a hipster

Well, there's a difference between hipsters and old people.

Old people like to remember something they did years ago, for nostalgic reasons.

Hipsters do it today, because they think it makes them look cool.

WhiteMemento9 · 02-07-2018 2:16pm

Tony EH wrote: »

Well, there's a difference between hipsters and old people.

Old people like to remember something they did years ago, for nostalgic reasons.

Hipsters do it today, because they think it makes them look cool.

No, you think they do it because they think it makes them look cool. That is a judgment you have made with your eyes without knowing the person. I'm sure a certain portion of them do it for those reasons but I KNOW many do it just because they enjoy doing those things. Just because you don't understand the pleasure they derive from certain things you make sense of it by saying things like the above.

Jerichoholic · 02-07-2018 2:40pm

I've seen hipsters using old fashioned typewriters in cafés and I've seen some listening to grammaphones, which is another level of pretentious. They are just looking for attention, nothing more.

Dr Brown · 02-07-2018 2:41pm

The only old video format worth bringing back is Laser Disc.

WhiteMemento9 · 02-07-2018 2:47pm

Jerichoholic wrote: »

I've seen hipsters using old fashioned typewriters in cafés and I've seen some listening to grammaphones, which is another level of pretentious. They are just looking for attention, nothing more.

Lines and all that but how the hell missing the experience that the whole video era provided is seen as hipster is what we are talking about.

Jerichoholic · 02-07-2018 3:39pm

The point is, why use something inferior when it's easier to use something normal? Video shop experience is terrible compared to Netflix. At least Netflix will have the movie you are after and not have them all out on rental.

pixelburp · 02-07-2018 3:50pm

Yeah, I think there are some serious rose tinted spectacles over the experience of the Video Shop. Between the lack of stock, crumpled tape, or those that did work not properly rewound - hell just wondering if the damn VHS tape will work - it was a tedious experience. And the video quality was, and will always remain, muck.

God the hours spent using head cleaner 'cos your VCR was skipping the video like it was having a fit. The tapes even had a weird, slightly unpleasant smell, it must have been the magnetic tape mixed with the plastic.

Netflix has its own issues, but pining after an archaic, inferior, fussy technology like VHS is a bit ... weird

WhiteMemento9 · 02-07-2018 3:51pm

Jerichoholic wrote: »

The point is, why use something inferior when it's easier to use something normal? Video shop experience is terrible compared to Netflix. At least Netflix will have the movie you are after and not have them all out on rental.

Because I enjoy the other experience? I like getting out and doing stuff. Maybe you think it is terrible which is perfectly fine. I love rummaging around a shop, looking at the different covers, reading the back for a bit of info. I hugely enjoy the connection of talking to the guy behind the counter about what I have rented. Loads of other stuff too.

Netflix as a way to consume things is far superior but while really liking the medium I enjoy all of the other stuff too. Simple pleasures in life can sometimes be the best ones. We now think about that as times wasted and how we could be using it more productively.

WhiteMemento9 · 02-07-2018 3:55pm

pixelburp wrote: »

Yeah, I think there are some serious rose tinted spectacles over the experience of the Video Shop. Between the lack of stock, crumpled tape, or those that did work not properly rewound - hell just wondering if the damn VHS tape will work - it was a tedious experience. And the video quality was, and will always remain, muck.

God the hours spent using head cleaner 'cos your VCR was skipping the video like it was having a fit. The tapes even had a weird, slightly unpleasant smell, it must have been the magnetic tape mixed with the plastic.

Netflix has its own issues, but pining after an archaic, inferior, fussy technology like VHS is a bit ... weird

I still get some of this buying books today and I would far prefer to pay the price in the shop to have all the experience that goes with it then save money and click buy it online. Not always, but often. I like convenience too at times.

Jerichoholic · 02-07-2018 3:57pm

Well enjoy it while it lasts.

WhiteMemento9 · 02-07-2018 4:03pm

Jerichoholic wrote: »

Well enjoy it while it lasts.

Ready Player One, here we come.

briany · 02-07-2018 4:43pm

Jerichoholic wrote: »

The point is, why use something inferior when it's easier to use something normal? Video shop experience is terrible compared to Netflix. At least Netflix will have the movie you are after and not have them all out on rental.

The Atari 2600: The graphics are crap, the controls are crap, the sound is crap, the gameplay is basic and the stories are almost non-existent. Everything about the Atari 2600 is crappy when you compare it to what we have in 2018, and yet you'll find a community of people out there who are enthusiastic about that console and its games. And the same is true for many old gaming platforms. There's usually very little about them that is objectively better than current technology. Still many people out there into them, though.

I suppose the point I'm making, here, is that you give any outmoded technology about 15-20 years, and you'll see some sort of spike in its use or demand once again, and it's not really a demand predicated on practicality. It's not necessarily about looking cool, either. It could as easily be about nostalgia or recapturing a certain feeling or aesthetic. There's certainly a community out there into the old VHS stuff (watch the documentary Adjust Your Tracking about VHS collectors for evidence of this), although I don't know if enough of these enthusiasts live in Liverpool or the surrounding area to keep this particular shop afloat.

Jerichoholic · 02-07-2018 5:04pm

briany wrote: »

The Atari 2600: The graphics are crap, the controls are crap, the sound is crap, the gameplay is basic and the stories are almost non-existent. Everything about the Atari 2600 is crappy when you compare it to what we have in 2018, and yet you'll find a community of people out there who are enthusiastic about that console and its games. And the same is true for many old gaming platforms. There's usually very little about them that is objectively better than current technology. Still many people out there into them, though.

I suppose the point I'm making, here, is that you give any outmoded technology about 15-20 years, and you'll see some sort of spike in its use or demand once again, and it's not really a demand predicated on practicality. It's not necessarily about looking cool, either. It could as easily be about nostalgia or recapturing a certain feeling or aesthetic. There's certainly a community out there into the old VHS stuff (watch the documentary Adjust Your Tracking about VHS collectors for evidence of this), although I don't know if enough of these enthusiasts live in Liverpool or the surrounding area to keep this particular shop afloat.

The thing is, VHS tapes are the exact same movies you can get in perfect HD now. VHS looks like absolute trash nowadays. Why would you willfully watch something on purpose with ****ty washed out, worn out quality.

Games are completely non related.

briany · 02-07-2018 5:32pm

Jerichoholic wrote: »

The thing is, VHS tapes are the exact same movies you can get in perfect HD now. VHS looks like absolute trash nowadays. Why would you willfully watch something on purpose with ****ty washed out, worn out quality.

Games are completely non related.

Games are an apt comparison to illustrate how people will still opt to use and enjoy something that is completely inferior to modern offerings. Retro gaming is quite acceptable in mainstream culture, so why not the interest in other types of old media? Yes, VHS picture quality is objectively worse than a HD video from today, but some people enjoy the grainy, gooey picture quality for certain films. I'm not about to stick in a VHS cassette to watch the original Halloween, but I can see how the relative grunginess of that might be a curious enhancement to the atmosphere. Very much the same way as colour film should be better than black and white in every way, given the greater palette, but this is not always true. Black and white is sometimes just better to put you in a certain frame of mind.

johnny_ultimate · 02-07-2018 5:49pm

VHS is mostly a redundant format rightly relegated to the dustbin of history. Still, in the right hands, the aesthetic of grainy, inconsistent image quality and the fragility of tape still has its uses... Ringu would never be as frightening if the curse was a DVD. Something like No uses the video look to place the film in a very specific time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGOcFPzx1H0

Sad Professor · 02-07-2018 5:57pm

briany wrote: »

Games are an apt comparison to illustrate how people will still opt to use and enjoy something that is completely inferior to modern offerings. Retro gaming is quite acceptable in mainstream culture, so why not the interest in other types of old media? Yes, VHS picture quality is objectively worse than a HD video from today, but some people enjoy the grainy, gooey picture quality for certain films. I'm not about to stick in a VHS cassette to watch the original Halloween, but I can see how the relative grunginess of that might be a curious enhancement to the atmosphere. Very much the same way as colour film should be better than black and white in every way, given the greater palette, but this is not always true. Black and white is sometimes just better to put you in a certain frame of mind.

You could probably make this argument for old tv shows (even ones shot on 35mm) where there was no expectation that that they would be viewed on anything larger than a 20 inch CRT television - but not films which were never designed to be watched on VHS.

I understand the appeal of vinyl and retro games. And VHS may appeal to some people for the same reasons, but they are deeply misguided reasons because VHS was always a very poor imitation of the original theatrical experience that movies were meant to be seen in.

I think most people get this which is why a VHS revival ain't gonna happen.

Jerichoholic · 02-07-2018 6:02pm

Vinyl sounds good, some old games are still good. VHS copies of films are not good when you have Blu Ray or 1080p streaming versions of the same films.

Sad Professor · 02-07-2018 6:10pm

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

VHS is mostly a redundant format rightly relegated to the dustbin of history. Still, in the right hands, the aesthetic of grainy, inconsistent image quality and the fragility of tape still has its uses... Ringu would never be as frightening if the curse was a DVD. Something like No uses the video look to place the film in a very specific time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGOcFPzx1H0

I thought the VHS aesthetic in No was unnecessary but at least Larraín went all in and shot it using old video cameras. I really hate what Trier did to Breaking the Waves in post-production, especially since that seems to have been quite nicely shot.

New VHS Rental store in Liverpool

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