Gay Pride at work

yesto24 · 24-06-2018 09:32AM

My wife had this problem in work as well.
Now let me be clear she spent a lot of time in London in the 90s where she was a fag hag.
She is still friends with a lot of these guys now.
So when this pride nonsense rolls around each year and her company is boarding the diversity bandwagon she just ignores it.
If challenged, she just tells them she "was friends with gay people before it was cool", or more depressingly for her before you were born.

Sonics2k · 24-06-2018 09:34AM

Omackeral wrote: »

Ah look, I’m not going any deeper on this because I’d probably wear one myself. I voted Yes and absolutely support LGBT rights. My point is work and social issues probably shouldn’t cross over. If you found yourself in the minority of not supporting a cause or movement, it could lead to office talk about you and all when it probably shouldn’t even be up for discussion at all.

Nah I know you did, I remember your posts from the 2015 Ref.

I'm just pointing out it's a silly complaint and that there is a lot more discrimination aimed at LGBT people than you'd think.

Sure, it's not nearly as bad as it used to be, but is a lot more common than you'd think, especially if you're not LGBT.

edit: I know, I found this out the hard way as someone who works with young teens who are coming out or the are the children of LGBT couples.

nullzero · 24-06-2018 09:34AM

Here's the thing, very few people have antipathy towards gay or LGBT people anymore.
We voted a few years ago in a referendum which showed just how inclusive of LGBT people Ireland is.
Pride marches etc were a necessity in times when being gay was illegal and gay people were really discriminated against, these days it just feels pointless beyond being a bit of craic for the LGBT community (for want of a better term).
There will always be homophobic people in society, that's just the way it is, you can't make everyone agree with you on everything and they have their right to their opinions also, a company acting the way the OP describes seems like its coming from a place of wanting to be inclusive and progressive or if you wanted to be cynical about it you could say that they want to be SEEN to be inclusive and progressive.
In reality a person's sexual orientation has no effect on their ability to carry out the job assigned to them and in my opinion discussion of sexuality in the workplace isn't something that seems to be a reasonable use of time or resources.
These days very few people give a damn that Gary in accounts is gay and just see him as a person, not a gay person, a position I would think a lot of old school gay rights campaigners who suffered real discrimination would have only dreamed of in years gone by.
Why constantly draw attention to a person's sexuality? Why constantly outline differences? Is reinforcing the differences between people really the face of modern liberal progressive values?

leggo · 24-06-2018 09:41AM

I’d be pro-LGBT, but Pride irritates me a bit at this stage and I definitely wouldn’t be up for wearing lanyards or doing anything like that. So I’d just say that I wasn’t into the idea personally and get on with things. I wouldn’t be worried about further questioning or that it’d come off homophobic because I know I’m not and anyone who wanted to think that would eventually end up with egg on their face for being so judgemental.

How do people end up in these situations worrying? Unless you sneaky are homophobic and don’t want those views coming out? I don’t see the issue tbh.

professore · 24-06-2018 09:43AM

lawred2 wrote: »

Not sure how the decoration affects you in the slightest really...

It's easily ignored

Not easily ignored if people are at you all the time as to why you aren't wearing the lanyard...

Showing your identity with pride is one thing. Shaming people into wearing badges of your identity is something completely else and smacks of oppression and totalitarianism.

Personally I think this kind of thing is counterproductive.

somesoldiers · 24-06-2018 09:49AM

It’s ok to be gay
It’s ok to not be ok
Here’s some healthy meal tips
Do you know you can burn x calories by taking the stairs
Have you voted for the Star employee of the month yet
...I’m at work...bugger off

yesto24 · 24-06-2018 09:50AM

nullzero wrote: »

Here's the thing, very few people have antipathy towards gay or LGBT people anymore.
We voted a few years ago in a referendum which showed just how inclusive of LGBT people Ireland is.
Pride marches etc were a necessity in times when being gay was illegal and gay people were really discriminated against, these days it just feels pointless beyond being a bit of craic for the LGBT community (for want of a better term).
There will always be homophobic people in society, that's just the way it is, you can't make everyone agree with you on everything and they have their right to their opinions also, a company acting the way the OP describes seems like its coming from a place of wanting to be inclusive and progressive or if you wanted to be cynical about it you could say that they want to be SEEN to be inclusive and progressive.
In reality a person's sexual orientation has no effect on their ability to carry out the job assigned to them and in my opinion discussion of sexuality in the workplace isn't something that seems to be a reasonable use of time or resources.
These days very few people give a damn that Gary in accounts is gay and just see his a person, not a gay person, a position I would think a lot of old school gay rights campaigners who suffered real discrimination would have only dreamed of in years gone by.
Why constantly draw attention to a person's sexuality? Why constantly outline differences? Is reinforcing the differences between people really the face of modern liberal progressive values?

How long do people really spend, per week having sex with the sex they are attracted to.
Normal weeks I spend more time eating, sleeping, walking, working, reading crap on boards. Leaner times, I spend more time on the toilet.
Yet, we should define ourselves by who we want to stink our penis into. (If you are a man)
This pride nonsense is done.
We are not homophobic, its not that we don't care, we are just bored of it.
I did read the above post about young people coming out and been terrified to friends and family. Maybe they should have better friends and realise you can't choose your family but even with that I don't see how a company having pride nonsense is going to help them.

paw patrol · 24-06-2018 09:52AM

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Wonder if all the corporate stuff has taken over Pride tbh.

OP are ye allowed a Christmas crib at work during advent? Or do they celebrate any other festivals or cultural events?

I'm not sure if we're allowed but there certainly is no crib.
And bar the boozing at Christmas with a few parties. There are no organised fun like Pride.

lawred2 wrote: »

Not sure how the decoration affects you in the slightest really...

It's easily ignored

It's not really tbh. It doesn't have me crying in the jacks but it's still annoying.

Gmaximum wrote: »

I’ve worked in a a number of corporates and SMEs for 20 years all in the technology industry in Ireland. At no point was anyone discriminated for being LGBT.

I've found the same , that this stage since 1997 I've worked in banks around Dublin both national and international.. Never any discrimination.

Omackeral wrote: »

And when someone asks why you didn’t respond to an email, declined an invite or didn’t wear a rainbow lanyard? His point is he shouldn’t have to have those conversations at work. He’s there to work, not promote a cause or show solidarity or anything else.

You put that very well.

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

He's too busy in work or at home. This is silly. He is not being forced to attend any events. Ignore it all. No big deal.

You are right but in the other company , a well known place, the overt display that you are an ally is a thing.
Also given your other posts on matters I somehow don't think you'd be as blasé or casual about it , if it wasn't a matter close to your heart.
I suspect you are speaking out both sides of your mouth to be honest

Sonics2k wrote: »

Nah I know you did, I remember your posts from the 2015 Ref.

I'm just pointing out it's a silly complaint and that there is a lot more discrimination aimed at LGBT people than you'd think.

Sure, it's not nearly as bad as it used to be, but is a lot more common than you'd think, especially if you're not LGBT.

edit: I know, I found this out the hard way as someone who works with young teens who are coming out or the are the children of LGBT couples.

I don't think it's a silly compliant. It's not life threatening but it doesn't mean its' not a concern or that it;'s silly
As you describe your job it seems Pride is relevant. I work in a bank in IT . I design systems. It's not a crusading place. It's not unreasonable to let me do my work without this ra-ra nonsense...

As a previous poster said it's becoming like veterans day in the US and it seems to be to be quite false ....and a race to become more into pride than the next guy.
Omackeral in the post I quote has put it very well , those conversations aren't appropriate for the workplace

yesto24 · 24-06-2018 09:52AM

leggo wrote: »

I’d be pro-LGBT, but Pride irritates me a bit at this stage and I definitely wouldn’t be up for wearing lanyards or doing anything like that. So I’d just say that I wasn’t into the idea personally and get on with things. I wouldn’t be worried about further questioning or that it’d come off homophobic because I know I’m not and anyone who wanted to think that would eventually end up with egg on their face for being so judgemental.

How do people end up in these situations worrying? Unless you sneaky are homophobic and don’t want those views coming out? I don’t see the issue tbh.

Well you know they way the word racist is thrown around at not racist things?
And the witch-hunt that follows?

I think that might have something to do with it.

professore · 24-06-2018 09:53AM

Why not next Ash Wednesday harass anyone who doesn't have ashes on their foreheads? I'm old enough to remember this actually happening in school. To the extent that some kids would fake it. That was wrong. This is wrong too.

Flags, emails etc I'm fine with, but weraring something? That's too far.

paw patrol · 24-06-2018 09:53AM

Omackeral wrote: »

It’s something **** wear on Baggot Street after work to let ya know they work somewhere high net.

sadly , the lanyard infection has spread beyond baggot street.

paw patrol · 24-06-2018 09:57AM

lawred2 wrote: »

The only way this question can be answered is by the OP asking those within his company putting up the decorations what their reasoning is...

How is anyone on here supposed to know?

from the original OP

paw patrol wrote: »

I did ask at work and I got weird looks from HR and a bland meaningless reply about equality and diversity etc....
I think I am now guilty of wrong-think and possibly a second charge of using an outdated version of newspeak.:rolleyes: in the eyes of HR.

?

How Soon Is Now · 24-06-2018 10:02AM

It will get unfashionable and won't be cool anymore in a few years I'm sure. People will of found something else to attach themselves to.

A new logo to stick on all there social media crap etc.

Guy:Incognito · 24-06-2018 10:03AM

Gmaximum wrote: »

I’ve worked in a a number of corporates and SMEs for 20 years all in the technology industry in Ireland. At no point was anyone discriminated for being LGBT.

Can't remember the last time I heard a black person being openly called a n****r. Doesnt mean racism doesnt exist.......

professore · 24-06-2018 10:03AM

The OPs problem is he actually is interested in real equality and diversity. He thinks of people as individuals. Not "equality and diversity" rammed down his throat from above and only applied to certain select groups.

I don't like this kind of group enforcement. Never have. The Christian brothers were masters of it. It stinks.

professore · 24-06-2018 10:05AM

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Can't remember the last time I heard a black person being openly called a n****r. Doesnt mean racism doesnt exist.......

So your solution is to ask everyone to wear "I love ALL black people" lanyards and shame anyone who doesn't? That will build bridges alright

P_1 · 24-06-2018 10:06AM

I despise the corporate bolloxology that accompanies Pride these days. Piss off and advertise elsewhere because that's all it is advertisement

mailforkev · 24-06-2018 10:28AM

My company does Pride. Nobody is pressured into anything. Some people wear rainbow lanyards all year round, some don’t.

If somebody feels their work is open and tolerant then they don’t feel they need to hide their personal life in the office. They can be ‘their full self’ and just do their job to the best of their ability without worrying about anything else. It sounds a bit wanky but its true. I also have some gay workmates, they appreciate the support. Obviously this all benefits the company too.

It’s all about diversity and inclusion. We also do things for (amongst others) international women’s day, men’s health day and have a diversity day where the over 30 different nationalities in the office can wear national dress, bring in food etc.

You can engage or not, many do, many don’t.

xzanti · 24-06-2018 10:29AM

Must be horrible when December rolls around, little trees with crappy looking baubles and tinsel all over them. How can anyone work in that environment.

:pac:

24-06-2018 10:33AM

The Pride thing is becoming tacky when banks are promoting it.
The time for them to do that was pre 2000 when there was genuinely a lot of disrespect for the gay community. The battle has been won now and corporates are along for the feel good factor. Bit of reputation laundering I suspect, banks are not held in high esteem nowadays and with very good reason.

rgace · 24-06-2018 10:40AM

kneemos wrote: »

He's asking why they do it.

Similar reasons to the bank's ad campaigns, these token gestures and nice soundbites in advertisements are easier than actually changing the culture and behaviour within the bank.

Taytoland · 24-06-2018 10:40AM

It's just propaganda, that's all.

yesto24 · 24-06-2018 10:43AM

xzanti wrote: »

Must be horrible when December rolls around, little trees with crappy looking baubles and tinsel all over them. How can anyone work in that environment.

:pac:

I know you are trying to make a joke and doing it badly.
But these are not the same.
One is a holiday that is came about out of centuries of tradition and life, that is essentially a mid winter festival based on the length of the day, that by its nature is inclusive. As of you a living here you suffer the short days of winter no matter what relegion (of peace) you have or none.
The other is now a corporate event that even questioning can get you called homophobic.
That some see a propaganda and other see as just bandwagon jumping.

SEPT 23 1989 · 24-06-2018 10:47AM

The LGBT people should really distance themselves from the banking community

professore · 24-06-2018 11:23AM

mailforkev wrote: »

My company does Pride. Nobody is pressured into anything. Some people wear rainbow lanyards all year round, some don’t.

If somebody feels their work is open and tolerant then they don’t feel they need to hide their personal life in the office. They can be ‘their full self’ and just do their job to the best of their ability without worrying about anything else. It sounds a bit wanky but its true. I also have some gay workmates, they appreciate the support. Obviously this all benefits the company too.

It’s all about diversity and inclusion. We also do things for (amongst others) international women’s day, men’s health day and have a diversity day where the over 30 different nationalities in the office can wear national dress, bring in food etc.

You can engage or not, many do, many don’t.

I think it's all bollox. Ugh. So glad I don't work in a corporate environment. Being your "full self" participating in days you have no affiliation to. On a single day. I don't need reminding to be a decent human being, least of all by cynical corporate HR departments.

wakka12 · 24-06-2018 11:24AM

Well don't feel resentment towards lgbt for that. Probably not many gay people were even involved in your company creating all these events,reminds me of all the white people in america who give out that some new movie or costume is racist and the people of colour couldn't give a toss. Im gay and very against the commercialisation of pride events and commercial institutions taking advantage of it to look like they care when they don't , if society at large was unsupportive of gay rights then those exact same companies wouldn't touch any of these pride events in case they lose money

In fact Id say if you searched around theres plenty of big international chains who are pushing all the lgbt pride stuff in their irish businesses and are completely quiet about pride in other homophobic countries where they also operate

professore · 24-06-2018 11:27AM

wakka12 wrote: »

Well don't feel resentment towards lgbt for that. Probably not many gay people were even involved in your company creating all these events,reminds me of all the white people in america who give out that some new movie or costume is racist and the people of colour couldn't give a toss. Im gay and very against the commercialisation of pride events and commercial institutions taking advantage of it to look like they care when they don't , if society at large was unsupportive of gay rights then those exact same companies wouldn't touch any of these pride events in case they lose money

Very well said. If I were gay I imagine I would be very embarrassed about all this stuff. I know my gay first cousin is. There seems to be a certain type of person who thinks they know what's best for "marginalised" groups in society. And many of the supposed marginalised groups are actually the dominant voice in society now - lgbt and feminists - or at least those shouting the loudest about their membership of these groups - to name two.

TG1 · 24-06-2018 11:35AM

I work in HR. In a previous role a member of the workforce approached us about celebrating pride in the office. There was a small budget given and the employee in question organised a few decorations. All very low key, but a nice way to celebrate diversity in the company.

Another member of the workforce complained, and the CEO stepped in and refused to allow the decorations. I had to be the one to explain to the employee who had approached us that actually a colleague had gone out of their way to object to it, and as a result we couldn't celebrate our diverse workforce.

Don't be that person who complains, it's a week of decorations and lanyards, not torture...

leggo · 24-06-2018 11:48AM

professore wrote: »

Very well said. If I were gay I imagine I would be very embarrassed about all this stuff. I know my gay first cousin is. There seems to be a certain type of person who thinks they know what's best for "marginalised" groups in society. And many of the supposed marginalised groups are actually the dominant voice in society now - lgbt and feminists - or at least those shouting the loudest about their membership of these groups - to name two.

It's interesting you see it that way. I imagine to some other people, the Trump types who've shed their shame in professing their racism and misogyny are the loudest voices in society. Point being: now with social media etc you can totally turn the volume up and down on whatever area of society you like. For example, I remember around the time of the proposed Garda strike, my mate who was a Garda was like "It's amazing, this stuff is everywhere, I bet everyone in work was freaking out were they?" And I had to admit it wasn't a conversation I'd had with anyone except for him (I had a passing interest in it myself so was paying attention) and it wasn't really affecting anyone's day-to-day lives that I knew. He was baffled, but then I pointed out that the fact that he's a Garda means more of his friends and interests would be based around the Gardai.

We're all living in our own little, individual bubbles now. So if you can't get away from feminist and LGBT content, the reason is because you're clicking on or following feminist and LGBT content (case in point: this thread that you could've just not clicked on and be reading right now - it begins with the words 'Gay Pride', it wasn't misleading in any way that this would be about something LGBT based). If this winds you up, the question really is...why are you choosing to let it when the option to not do it has never, ever been easier than today?

Not aimed at you specifically btw, professore, just a general point.

professore · 24-06-2018 12:59PM

leggo wrote: »

It's interesting you see it that way. I imagine to some other people, the Trump types who've shed their shame in professing their racism and misogyny are the loudest voices in society. Point being: now with social media etc you can totally turn the volume up and down on whatever area of society you like. For example, I remember around the time of the proposed Garda strike, my mate who was a Garda was like "It's amazing, this stuff is everywhere, I bet everyone in work was freaking out were they?" And I had to admit it wasn't a conversation I'd had with anyone except for him (I had a passing interest in it myself so was paying attention) and it wasn't really affecting anyone's day-to-day lives that I knew. He was baffled, but then I pointed out that the fact that he's a Garda means more of his friends and interests would be based around the Gardai.

We're all living in our own little, individual bubbles now. So if you can't get away from feminist and LGBT content, the reason is because you're clicking on or following feminist and LGBT content (case in point: this thread that you could've just not clicked on and be reading right now - it begins with the words 'Gay Pride', it wasn't misleading in any way that this would be about something LGBT based). If this winds you up, the question really is...why are you choosing to let it when the option to not do it has never, ever been easier than today?

Not aimed at you specifically btw, professore, just a general point.

I agree with your general point. If you get all your news from Facebook and twitter then it's insane how biased it is. Also when trying to fact check something on Google is getting well nigh impossible as you get two totally conflicting accounts of the same events.

However if you look at any mainstream media outlet it IS full of all this stuff. And people ranting about how trump is the devil incarnate - he's a ****ty human being for sure, but the level of hysteria against him is ridiculous. Even innocuous things that wouldnt have been even noticed if Obama said them are blown out of all proportion.

Actually that's why I like boards - it isn't an echo chamber.

Gay Pride at work

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