Should men be allowed to opt out of parenthood just like women?

Sprinter Sacre · 26-05-2018 10:38PM #1

So after today's great news, women finally have full control over their bodies and if the situation arises, once legislation is clarified, they'll now have the option of terminating a pregnancy in unwanted cases. Great news. They also have the option of putting a child up for adoption once it is born if they are unable to care for it.

However should men also have some right and some protection with regards to parenthood? I feel that they should.

If a woman wants nothing to do with a child, she can get an abortion or she can seek an adoption, and she is legally entitled to those options and it is a great thing. However a man has no such options at all. If he gets a woman pregnant and he does not want to become a father, he basically has to rely on the woman to get an abortion or else he is tied to that child and is liable for child support payments even though he wants nothing to do with this child. It doesn't seem fair to me.

It definitely is a bit of a grey topic though. What are your thoughts? Should men also have the option of opting out of parenthood?

Ubbquittious · 26-05-2018 10:49PM

I know a fella who has opted out several times. Every time he gets a woman pregnant he moves onto another one.
He's on the dole, doesnt seem to have any bother with it

Pugzilla · 26-05-2018 10:52PM

A f*cking legend of gin alley.

26-05-2018 10:54PM

I feel that men (I am one) should be allowed to opt out, yes. If the woman can make the decision to abort, i don't see why the man should not have any option at all. It's a crisis pregnancy for both involved.

judeboy101 · 26-05-2018 10:55PM

If a man is raped by a woman and it results in a pregnancy, does he not have equal right to a termination?

banie01 · 26-05-2018 10:59PM

judeboy101 wrote: »

If a man is raped by a woman and it results in a pregnancy, does he not have equal right to a termination?

The legal definition of rape precludes it's actually being committed by a woman against a man n Ireland tho.

Sprinter Sacre · 26-05-2018 11:01PM

Ubbquittious wrote: »

I know a fella who has opted out several times. Every time he gets a woman pregnant he moves onto another one.
He's on the dole, doesnt seem to have any bother with it

How does that work? Why have none of the women held him accountable and not reported him to the authorities and how is he seemingly "getting away with it"?

26-05-2018 11:05PM

It will have to go back to the old fashioned idea of only sleeping with someone you would like (or not mind) having a child with. No contraception is 100% guaranteed so this needs to accepted as a risk each time and if either has an issue with this they can stop it at that stage. Obviously rape is outside of that theory.

Snugglebunnies · 26-05-2018 11:07PM

They already do all the time with zero consequences...

Conservatory · 26-05-2018 11:10PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It will have to go back to the old fashioned idea of only sleeping with someone you would like (or not mind) having a child with. No contraception is 100% guaranteed so this needs to accepted as a risk each time and if either has an issue with this they can stop it at that stage. Obviously rape is outside of that theory.

But what if your friend introduced you to her a said he wouldn’t say she’s a gold digger and you took that to mean she wasn’t a gold digger but after sleeping with her you noticed that she ain’t messing with no broke gentlemen?

Sprinter Sacre · 26-05-2018 11:12PM

Snugglebunnies wrote: »

They already do all the time with zero consequences...

Do they? Personally I wouldn't know as I wouldn't be asking men if they're paying child support or ask a single mother if she's getting payments but I do know two lads down the local who are paying monthly payments for their kid.

AtomicHorror · 26-05-2018 11:13PM

Sprinter Sacre wrote: »

So after today's great news, women finally have full control over their bodies and if the situation arises, once legislation is clarified, they'll now have the option of terminating a pregnancy in unwanted cases. Great news. They also have the option of putting a child up for adoption once it is born if they are unable to care for it.

However should men also have some right and some protection with regards to parenthood? I feel that they should.

If a woman wants nothing to do with a child, she can get an abortion or she can seek an adoption, and she is legally entitled to those options and it is a great thing. However a man has no such options at all. If he gets a woman pregnant and he does not want to become a father, he basically has to rely on the woman to get an abortion or else he is tied to that child and is liable for child support payments even though he wants nothing to do with this child. It doesn't seem fair to me.

It definitely is a bit of a grey topic though. What are your thoughts? Should men also have the option of opting out of parenthood?

No it isn't fair... because women take on the vast majority of the risk. Even when a woman is choosing to terminate primarily for financial reasons, the risk to her health and life is in the mix of that decision.

That's why she has the choice.

Anyway, the answer is no. Pay yer ****ing child support, deadbeat.

Sheeps · 26-05-2018 11:18PM

Turns out the "its my right to choose argument" falls down as soon as it doesn't suit the feminazi agenda.

Snugglebunnies · 26-05-2018 11:20PM

Sprinter Sacre wrote: »

Snugglebunnies wrote: »

They already do all the time with zero consequences...

Do they? Personally I wouldn't know as I wouldn't be asking men if they're paying child support or ask a single mother if she's getting payments but I do know two lads down the local who are paying monthly payments for their kid.

Yes unfortunately. I'm a single mother myself and so know plenty of other single mothers both online and of course in real life. There are heaps of them who the kid's father just walked away, never sees the child and won't pay a cent despite being to court neumerous times in most cases. It's depressing.

Sprinter Sacre · 26-05-2018 11:23PM

AtomicHorror wrote: »

No it isn't fair... because women take on the vast majority of the risk. Even when a woman is choosing to terminate primarily for financial reasons, the risk to her health and life is in the mix of that decision.

That's why she has the choice.

Anyway, the answer is no. Pay yer ****ing child support, deadbeat.

You raise a valid point about the health risks.

However if someone is not ready to be a parent, they shouldn't be forced to be one. Pretty barbaric to say otherwise. They also shouldn't be forced to pay money to someone who wants to be one. One parent shouldn't be forced to provide for a decision made by the other parent. It almost falls under bodily autonomy in a way.

Your last remark is a bit insensitive. God forbid a 15 or 16 year old lad gets a girl pregnant without a cent to his name.

Sheeps · 26-05-2018 11:23PM

Snugglebunnies wrote: »

Yes unfortunately. I'm a single mother myself and so know plenty of other single mothers both online and of course in real life. There are heaps of them who the kid's father just walked away, never sees the child and won't pay a cent despite being to court neumerous times in most cases. It's depressing.

One of the perks of having less rights than women when it comes to family I guess.

Snotty · 26-05-2018 11:25PM

AtomicHorror wrote: »

.

Anyway, the answer is no. Pay yer ****ing child support, deadbeat.

Ummm, should I kill this baby or force a man to support it for the next 18 years .....feminist choices there

Sprinter Sacre · 26-05-2018 11:27PM

Snugglebunnies wrote: »

Yes unfortunately. I'm a single mother myself and so know plenty of other single mothers both online and of course in real life. There are heaps of them who the kid's father just walked away, never sees the child and won't pay a cent despite being to court neumerous times in most cases. It's depressing.

But how does that work? Surely a simply court appearance stating this fella is paying no child support followed by a paternity test to confirm everything and a judge makes a judgement and orders him to pay the child support. I can't wangle my way out of paying a parking ticket, how do men wangle their way out of paying child support in court? Not doubting you at all, sorry to hear you're in that predicament I'm just genuinely interested how they get away with it. As I said the two lads I know who would be liable for child support payments are doing so, and they constantly remind me of having to give money to "her".

Sheeps · 26-05-2018 11:34PM

Sprinter Sacre wrote: »

But how does that work? Surely a simply court appearance stating this fella is paying no child support followed by a paternity test to confirm everything and a judge makes a judgement and orders him to pay the child support. I can't wangle my way out of paying a parking ticket, how do men wangle their way out of paying child support in court? Not doubting you at all, sorry to hear you're in that predicament I'm just genuinely interested how they get away with it. As I said the two lads I know who would be liable for child support payments are doing so, and they constantly remind me of having to give money to "her".

There was an article in the Irish Times about the family court. Seems lob sided against men. Women bringing cases against men to get more maintenance payments after years of divorce when the former husband got a brand new job and new source of income. Mad business all together. Men expected to pay their maintenance grants of 400 quid a week when they've lost their job.

Snugglebunnies · 26-05-2018 11:36PM

Sprinter Sacre wrote: »

Snugglebunnies wrote: »

Yes unfortunately. I'm a single mother myself and so know plenty of other single mothers both online and of course in real life. There are heaps of them who the kid's father just walked away, never sees the child and won't pay a cent despite being to court neumerous times in most cases. It's depressing.

But how does that work? Surely a simply court appearance stating this fella is paying no child support followed by a paternity test to confirm everything and a judge makes a judgement and orders him to pay the child support. I can't wangle my way out of paying a parking ticket, how do men wangle their way out of paying child support in court? Not doubting you at all, sorry to hear you're in that predicament I'm just genuinely interested how they get away with it. As I said the two lads I know who would be liable for child support payments are doing so, and they constantly remind me of having to give money to "her".

They're ordered to pay alright, something minimal in most cases. They then still refuse to pay and it back to court to enforce it and they still don't pay. Wash and repeat. Also arrears will be ordered to be paid off at a few euro a week, which surprise, surprise, doesn't happen. No wonder so many women give up.

Blacktie. · 26-05-2018 11:37PM

Sprinter Sacre wrote:

But how does that work? Surely a simply court appearance stating this fella is paying no child support followed by a paternity test to confirm everything and a judge makes a judgement and orders him to pay the child support. I can't wangle my way out of paying a parking ticket, how do men wangle their way out of paying child support in court? Not doubting you at all, sorry to hear you're in that predicament I'm just genuinely interested how they get away with it. As I said the two lads I know who would be liable for child support payments are doing so, and they constantly remind me of having to give money to "her".

I've heard it goes that the judge orders him to pay and he'll pay a few and then stop or just not pay at all. Guards can't be there every week or month or whatever to ensure he makes the transfer.

AtomicHorror · 26-05-2018 11:37PM

Sprinter Sacre wrote: »

You raise a valid point about the health risks.

However if someone is not ready to be a parent, they shouldn't be forced to be one. Pretty barbaric to say otherwise.

Paying child support is not "being a parent". You can choose to check out of being a parent. By simply walking away and not raising the child every day if its life. The sole obligation on the father is financial. It's not nothing, but it sure as **** is not anything comparable to the reality of raising kids.

Sheeps wrote: »

Turns out the "its my right to choose argument" falls down as soon as it doesn't suit the feminazi agenda.

That being because the right to choose is based on the right to bodily autonomy? The father has no such stake in the scenario? Don't worry if you haven't heard these arguments before they've only been discussed at length, incessantly, for months, on almost every national platform possible.

Glass fused light · 26-05-2018 11:38PM

Sprinter Sacre wrote: »

However should men also have some right and some protection with regards to parenthood? I feel that they should.

I totally agree sex ed should be compulsory for all males who have reached the age of puberty. No more "special seed in mammys tummy growing into babies" crap that is being taught to 5 year olds. It has to be proper lessons that properly explain why acts of sexual reproduction result in new Humans. :rolleyes:

Sprinter Sacre wrote: »

If a woman wants nothing to do with a child, she can get an abortion or she can seek an adoption, and she is legally entitled to those options and it is a great thing. However a man has no such options at all. If he gets a woman pregnant and he does not want to become a father, he basically has to rely on the woman to get an abortion or else he is tied to that child and is liable for child support payments even though he wants nothing to do with this child. It doesn't seem fair to me.

It definitely is a bit of a grey topic though. What are your thoughts? Should men also have the option of opting out of parenthood?

Totally unfair, men should have some rights and protection with regards to parenthood they should have the option to opt out.

If only there was a way .........to avoid making a baby.....

The catholic solution applies but it's so old fashioned

How about this, if both are of legal age.
Unless the male sperm donor can prove that he is aware of the facts of life when it comes to baby making activities he should be banned from all acts of sexual reproduction. A simple certification process should apply. I would vote for a simple tattoo or ear tag or the issuing of an ID card once the man has proved he understands how babies are made. If a woman fails to check that she is engaging with a certified male he gets a 50% discount and a State ordered vasectomy.

AtomicHorror · 26-05-2018 11:40PM

Snotty wrote: »

Ummm, should I kill this baby or force a man to support it for the next 18 years .....feminist choices there

If she can risk life and health to bring it into the world, you can stick your hand in your ****ing pocket.

Glass fused light · 26-05-2018 11:45PM

Sprinter Sacre wrote: »

You raise a valid point about the health risks.

However if someone is not ready to be a parent, they shouldn't be forced to be one. Pretty barbaric to say otherwise. They also shouldn't be forced to pay money to someone who wants to be one. One parent shouldn't be forced to provide for a decision made by the other parent. It almost falls under bodily autonomy in a way.

Lobby your TD for sex ed.

If parent is not ready to become a parent they should not engage in acts of sexual reproduction.

Sprinter Sacre wrote: »

Your last remark is a bit insensitive. God forbid a 15 or 16 year old lad gets a girl pregnant without a cent to his name.

So who should pay to bring the child up

Sprinter Sacre · 26-05-2018 11:46PM

AtomicHorror wrote: »

Paying child support is not "being a parent". You can choose to check out of being a parent. By simply walking away and not raising the child every day if its life. The sole obligation on the father is financial. It's not nothing, but it sure as **** is not anything comparable to the reality of raising kids.

And I'd argue that a father should not have that financial obligation if he does not want to become a father. If he clearly states during the pregnancy he does not want to be a part of that child's life and had a way of signing away his rights, he should be free of all payments and whatnot, effectively not being a father at all. Whether the mother keeps the child is her own business from then out. Of course if he decides a few months or a year into the child's life that this isn't for him and f*cks off when he said all throughout the pregnancy he'd be there for the child as an active father, then yeah throw the book at the c*nt then.

I feel a mother or a father should have the free right to opt of parenthood. Currently women have that right.

This idea of "don't stick it in unless you're willing to be a father" can be argued back with "don't spread your legs unless you're willing to be a mother". Women currently have an exit strategy so to speak, men don't. And that's unfair in my opinion.

Atoms for Peace · 26-05-2018 11:49PM

Maybe take some personal responsibility for where you stick your dick and the resulting consequences of it. Anyway as it is, there seems to be little consequences for the majority of fathers of "single parent" kids.

Sprinter Sacre · 26-05-2018 11:49PM

Glass fused light wrote: »

Lobby your TD for sex ed.

If parent is not ready to become a parent they should not engage in acts of sexual reproduction.

So who should pay to bring the child up

So you're saying people should only have sex if they're willing to be a parent? Currently a woman doesn't have to worry about that as they can avail of adoptions and very soon abortions...men have no options.

If a father could somehow sign away all his rights to that child during pregnancy, then it's up to the mother whether or not she wants to keep the child, and if so it has to be her paycheck that supports the child.

AtomicHorror · 26-05-2018 11:49PM

Sprinter Sacre wrote: »

And I'd argue that a father should not have that financial obligation if he does not want to become a father. If he clearly states during the pregnancy he does not want to be a part of that child's life and had a way of signing away his rights, he should be free of all payments and whatnot, effectively not being a father at all. Whether the mother keeps the child is her own business from then out. Of course if he decides a few months or a year into the child's life that this isn't for him and f*cks off when he said all throughout the pregnancy he'd be there for the child as an active father, then yeah throw the book at the c*nt then.

I feel a mother or a father should have the free right to opt of parenthood. Currently women have that right.

This idea of "don't stick it in unless you're willing to be a father" can be argued back with "don't spread your legs unless you're willing to be a mother". Women currently have an exit strategy so to speak, men don't. And that's unfair in my opinion.

This is beyond idiotic. Pregnancy equated to a financial pinch as consequences of spreading one's legs? ****ing hell. No more time for this.

Sprinter Sacre · 26-05-2018 11:50PM

Atoms for Peace wrote: »

Maybe take some personal responsibility for where you stick your dick and the resulting consequences of it. Anyway as it is, there seems to be little consequences for the majority of fathers of "single parent" kids.

Maybe take some personal responsibility to whom you spread your legs for and the resulting consequences.

Women have the exit strategy of abortion and adoption if an unwanted pregnancy occurs. Men have no choice, and that's not fair.

Snotty · 26-05-2018 11:51PM

AtomicHorror wrote: »

If she can risk life and health to bring it into the world, you can stick your hand in your ****ing pocket.

You make it sound like the heroic actions of a determined woman, when in reality it's the result of two stupid drunk people's actions in most cases. Now one person has a choice, but the other doesn't.

I won't be sticking my hand anywhere, I had more cop on in life.

Should men be allowed to opt out of parenthood just like women?

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