How illegal is mace

iamtony · 13-05-2018 08:52PM

Eire Go Brach wrote: »

Who is the killer out of curiosity?

I'm gona guess this guy.Check out @sundayworld’;s Tweet: https://twitter.com/sundayworld/status/995433388520681472?s=09 Has been seen around coolock and people are saying he is in the pace unit called priorswood House. Not Confirmed where he is but the Sunday world say a North Dublin institute.

Conservatory · 13-05-2018 08:56PM

iamtony wrote: »

I'm gona guess this guy. Has been seen around coolock and people are saying he is in the pace unit called priorswood House. Not Confirmed where he is but the Sunday world say a North Dublin institute.

Jesus man now the police will be searching every woman’s handbag in coolock.

2Mad2BeMad · 13-05-2018 08:59PM

My da is a taxi man, he has a can of mace for protection and has used it twice since ever getting it. (Over 15 years)

Now for my da he would only use it unless he felt his life was in serious danger (crowd of youths tried robbing his car, one with a knife and another yob who had muscles on muscles choking his neck from behind because he was high on coke and took my da up wrong on something)
While I trust my da to use it, regardless of the law id rather he had it to keep him safe.
I think the law is right not to allow any citizen to have it on them. I could see it been used on petty things, like when people are having an argument in public. or been used in a busy club when some bright fuker has a great idea and sprays it once in the air.

Like I said I'd trust my da to have it, but if hes caught with it, he knows the penalties. But I could see it been wrongly used more times then right. There is just to many ejits out there that would ruin it for the people that would use it for serious life threatening situations only.

Samuel T. Cogley · 13-05-2018 08:59PM

Better to be judged by twelve than carried by six.

buried · 13-05-2018 09:05PM

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

Better to be judged by twelve than carried by six.

Amen

AllForIt · 13-05-2018 11:00PM

I love the thread title , 'how illegal...'. Well, it's quite illegal, 35% illegal, somewhat illegal, partially illegal, more or less illegal....

Conservatory · 13-05-2018 11:06PM

AllForIt wrote: »

I love the thread title , 'how illegal...'. Well, it's quite illegal, 35% illegal, somewhat illegal, partially illegal, more or less illegal....

I’ve always been a bit of a renegade. Nct is only kind of illegal. I wouldn’t be pushed to take a day off work to get one. Rape and murder is very illegal. Suppose it’s a moral issue rather than a black and white issue.
What would the punishment really be and is it worth taking the risk in the event a rapist gets you before the police.
I doubt a woman being attacked has ever said “well at least I didn’t get a 500 euro fine for being caught with mace”

Maybe wealthy people flout laws a bit more because they can afford the fines so their idea of how illegal something is changes to whether they have had a good week or not.

Hammer89 · 13-05-2018 11:56PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I got a dodgy roll in the deli there a few weeks ago..seemed like something was off there alright..

Must not have been made by a man.

Atoms for Peace · 14-05-2018 12:45AM

It's not illegal to have pepper spray for culinary use.

Glass fused light · 14-05-2018 01:01AM

Atoms for Peace wrote: »

It's not illegal to have pepper spray for culinary use.

If the wife is packing salt, and a nice steak in her handbag, she could throw in the steak knife too;)

Gravelly · 14-05-2018 01:09AM

If the wife of this "man you know" is attacked and uses the mace, do you think it would matter whether or not it is illegal?
If she was, for some reason, stopped and searched by the Gardaí (and unless she is or looks like a drug dealer, why would she be?), and she said "oh that? shure I was attacked by a dog a few months ago, and am terrified by them since, that's why I have that" do you think she'd get in a lot of trouble?

I know a fella that carries a fairly substantial knife about with him. If and when he has to account for it, he will tell the questioner the truth - he once had to cut down a man that had hung himself, and if he ever has to do so again, he doesn't want to have to root through a strangers kitchen in the dark looking for a knife to do so.

Context is everything.

Glass fused light · 14-05-2018 01:26AM

Gravelly wrote: »

If the wife of this "man you know" is attacked and uses the mace, do you think it would matter whether or not it is illegal?
If she was, for some reason, stopped and searched by the Gardaí (and unless she is or looks like a drug dealer, why would she be?), and she said "oh that? shure I was attacked by a dog a few months ago, and am terrified by them since, that's why I have that" do you think she'd get in a lot of trouble?

I know a fella that carries a fairly substantial knife about with him. If and when he has to account for it, he will tell the questioner the truth - he once had to cut down a man that had hung himself, and if he ever has to do so again, he doesn't want to have to root through a strangers kitchen in the dark looking for a knife to do so.

Context is everything.

Yes she will. You can't legally get mace in this country so it was illegally imported. She can be as frightened as she wants of dogs, cats or bears attacks, but she would be as well off arguing why she has a sawn-off shotgun in her bag.

Cookie_Monster · 14-05-2018 02:23AM

A firearm, what?

Pepper spray is banned under the 1925 Firearms Act which prohibits the manufacture, possession or sale of “weapons discharging noxious liquids”.

How is mace a firearm but deodorant is fine?

Manic Moran · 14-05-2018 04:28AM

OK, so the government's argument is that it's illegal because it's defined as illegal in the law.

Fantastic, I'm sure folks all over Ireland are ecstatic. Isn't the purpose of asking the question to prompt a re-evaluation of it?

punisher5112 · 14-05-2018 06:14AM

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

A firearm, what?

How is mace a firearm but deodorant is fine?

It's in the same class for law.

It wouldn't be a good idea for ordinary folk to have access but security, ambulance, fire could definitely do with it. Obviously Garda do have gas so they are covered but they need to move with the times and need tazers.

Glass fused light · 14-05-2018 06:24AM

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

A firearm, what?

How is mace a firearm but deodorant is fine?

Apparently deodorant is being used to self harm the joys of the Internet
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerosol_burn

Anyway with the mace
Close kitchen doors and windows.
Take out your frying pan.
place on medium heat on your cooker.
grind pepper mill over pan until it is lightly covered with ground pepper
take a seat at kitchen table, and watch the smoke rise from the pan...

Edit don't do this right now if it will set off your fire alarm

vladmydad · 14-05-2018 06:26AM

Just get one and carry it in her bag. Should she ever use it on a scumbag , just say he had it and she got hold of it and sprayed him

Conservatory · 14-05-2018 06:55AM

vladmydad wrote: »

Just get one and carry it in her bag. Should she ever use it on a scumbag , just say he had it and she got hold of it and sprayed him

That may lead the attacker to then say you were the attacker. He tried to use his mace but you took it off him and beat him with it.

vladmydad · 14-05-2018 07:13AM

But it’s for OP’s wife , so they’d hardly believe some women went and attacked a guy with mase

corner of hells · 14-05-2018 08:38AM

Gravelly wrote: »

If the wife of this "man you know" is attacked and uses the mace, do you think it would matter whether or not it is illegal?
If she was, for some reason, stopped and searched by the Gardaí (and unless she is or looks like a drug dealer, why would she be?), and she said "oh that? shure I was attacked by a dog a few months ago, and am terrified by them since, that's why I have that" do you think she'd get in a lot of trouble?

I know a fella that carries a fairly substantial knife about with him. If and when he has to account for it, he will tell the questioner the truth - he once had to cut down a man that had hung himself, and if he ever has to do so again, he doesn't want to have to root through a strangers kitchen in the dark looking for a knife to do so.

Context is everything.

Hopefully he finds a sympathetic Garda because it's possible to purpose designed knives nowadays for ligatures.
Paramedics, firemen , Gardai are starting to carry them

Discodog · 14-05-2018 08:57AM

Gravelly wrote: »

If the wife of this "man you know" is attacked and uses the mace, do you think it would matter whether or not it is illegal?
If she was, for some reason, stopped and searched by the Gardaand unless she is or looks like a drug dealer, why would she be?), and she said "oh that? shure I was attacked by a dog a few months ago, and am terrified by them since, that's why I have that" do you think she'd get in a lot of trouble?

I know a fella that carries a fairly substantial knife about with him. If and when he has to account for it, he will tell the questioner the truth - he once had to cut down a man that had hung himself, and if he ever has to do so again, he doesn't want to have to root through a strangers kitchen in the dark looking for a knife to do so.

Context is everything.

I carry a visible, sheath knife all day. I spoke to the Guards & they said that it was fine provided I have a valid use for it & I do for my work. However carrying knife on the off chance that you will come across a suicide won't work.

Gravelly · 14-05-2018 09:01AM

corner of hells wrote: »

Hopefully he finds a sympathetic Garda because it's possible to purpose designed knives nowadays for ligatures.
Paramedics, firemen , Gardai are starting to carry them

Discodog wrote: »

I carry a visible, sheath knife all day. I spoke to the Guards & they said that it was fine provided I have a valid use for it & I do for my work. However carrying knife on the off chance that you will come across a suicide won't work.

The purpose designed ligature knives are about as much use as a chocolate fireguard in many cases.
Carrying a knife "on the off chance you will come across a suicide" will work - the law I believe states valid reason. If you've ever tried to cut down someone hanging, it's more than a valid reason.

Gravelly · 14-05-2018 09:03AM

Glass fused light wrote: »

Yes she will. You can't legally get mace in this country so it was illegally imported. She can be as frightened as she wants of dogs, cats or bears attacks, but she would be as well off arguing why she has a sawn-off shotgun in her bag.

Out of curiosity, do you think a Garda or a judge would look upon a woman carrying a can of mace in the same way as someone carrying a sawn-off shotgun?

Captain Obvious · 14-05-2018 09:06AM

Gravelly wrote: »

The purpose designed ligature knives are about as much use as a chocolate fireguard in many cases.
Carrying a knife "on the off chance you will come across a suicide" will work - the law I believe states valid reason. If you've ever tried to cut down someone hanging, it's more than a valid reason.

Have you a precedent you are basing this on?

Gravelly · 14-05-2018 09:10AM

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Have you a precedent you are basing this on?

Indeed. The man I referenced in my first post has carried that knife for over two years, and has told numerous Gardaí that he carries it (he does volunteer work that causes him to interact frequently with the Gardaí). The opinion of every Guard he has spoken to is that he has a valid reason to carry it.

Captain Obvious · 14-05-2018 09:16AM

Gravelly wrote: »

Indeed. The man I referenced in my first post has carried that knife for over two years, and has told numerous Gardaí that he carries it (he does volunteer work that causes him to interact frequently with the Gardaí). The opinion of every Guard he has spoken to is that he has a valid reason to carry it.

They are wrong or, more likely, not real. Carrying a knife in case you see a body hanging is not a valid reason.

Gravelly · 14-05-2018 09:18AM

Captain Obvious wrote: »

They are wrong or, more likely, not real. Carrying a knife in case you see a body hanging is not a valid reason.

Now how did I know you would have a contrary opinion, full of misplaced self-assurance?

Have you a precedent you are basing this on?

Captain Obvious · 14-05-2018 09:22AM

Gravelly wrote: »

Now how did I know you would have a contrary opinion, full of misplaced self-assurance?

Because you often are wrong?

Gravelly wrote: »

Have you a precedent you are basing this on?

Just district and circuit court experience.

Gravelly · 14-05-2018 09:27AM

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Because you often are wrong?

Not as often as you, and unlike you, I have the self awareness to realise when I am.

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Just district and circuit court experience.

Can you fire up a few links there of district and/or circuit court cases where a defendant was prosecuted after using suicide rescue as a valid reason to keep a knife on their person? Thanks.

BarryD2 · 14-05-2018 09:28AM

Question is I guess, is there any case law yet in Ireland for the carrying of it by members of the public for self defence? Or is it just something on the statute book that's never been implemented?

How illegal is mace

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