8th amendment referendum part 3 - Mod note and FAQ in post #1

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

where are you getting this figure of 24 weeks from?

The proposed legislation allows for termination under limited circumstances up to 'viability'. Viability is generally agreed to be about 23 or 24 weeks.
The legislation does not mention a number of weeks for that, but 24 weeks is a fair enough number.

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

But we have no measure for how many post or read here, change their minds and do not post to say so. It is certainly a greater number.

Yea very hard to estimate. I have had a number of users (not huge, like 5 or 6 maybe) PM me personally to tell me / thank me that their mind was changed by my posts and arguments.

I can only assume others users are getting the same. Some probably a lot more than me, as I am far from special or wonderful in this regard.

patrickSTARR wrote: »

I can only speak for myself, Im still going to come here with my opinion and if things change for me or if something begins to pull me one way, its best to discuss it.

I still have my reservations about voting yes, but I believe that its for the best for now.

If it’s any consolation, I genuinely think most people start out with your position. I know I did.
I’d love to be pro-life, it’s certainly the easier option to ‘save’ the unborn without a second thought for the circumstances women and families find themselves in.

I know you haven’t made your mind up yet but at least you’ve opened your mind to other eventualities and perspectives.
At least now no matter what way you choose to vote, you’ll have looked at it from both sides without a biased perspective and made a choice with all the available information.
Fair play.

NuMarvel wrote: »

These really don't sound like things a Yes canvasser would say or print in general, never mind to a young girl. But if they did, it really should be dealt with. This was either a very overzealous yes supporter, who should never be let out on a canvass again, or, more worryingly, a No campaigner masquerading as Yes.

This was exactly my thoughts.
To the OP, you should ask a neighbor to see if they have the leaflet and find out what the name of the group is. It doesn’t sound right to me.

RobertKK wrote: »

The HIQA report says if her condition had not been mismanaged the outcome may have been different.

The HIQA report did not have the jurisdiction to make any comments on the 8th amendment.

Gintonious wrote: »

https://www.newstalk.com/Bishop-of-Ossory-suggests-abortion-can-be-far-worse-than-rape

And new levels of utter stupidity have been reached.



A complete and utter moron.

:mad:

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Bishop of Ossory suggests 'abortion can be far worse than rape'

I hope more and more bishops wade into the debate. I hope every priest in Ireland spells out the bishop's position on rape, on contraception, on abstinence or the rhythm method, on fatal fetal abnormality in their sermons in detail between now and polling day.

While it was nice to hear from the Vatican after the SSM referendum that gay marriage is "a defeat for humanity", I'd like everyone to be clear on their views before this one. No more hiding behind Iona, Cóir, Youth Defence and so on - lay it out for us what the Vatican really thinks.

From a rape victim who had an abortion: “for me, it has been harder to deal with than the rape.”.



https://m.independent.ie/lifestyle/health/ccase-mum-i-grieve-for-my-lost-baby-every-day-29241584.html

RobertKK wrote: »

Calina wrote: »

Question: would Savita have died the way she did if she had been given a termination at the time she requested one?

She did not have sepsis at that point.

The HIQA report says if her condition had not been mismanaged the outcome may have been different.

That is not an answer to the question I asked.

She asked for a termination before her condition was such that it had to be managed. Woukd she have died of sepsis if she had been given a termination before she developed sepsis?

RobertKK wrote: »

From a rape victim who had an abortion: “for me, it has been harder to deal with than the rape.”.



https://m.independent.ie/lifestyle/health/ccase-mum-i-grieve-for-my-lost-baby-every-day-29241584.html

This is as good for the YES side, as John McGuirk's meltdown and those idiots outside the maternity hospitals.

ELM327 wrote: »

This is as good for the YES side, as John McGuirk's meltdown and those idiots outside the maternity hospitals.

Giving underage girls in state care an abortion against their will because the state knows best?

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

"Viability" does not mean a healthy bouncing baby, either. Even in the NICU, half those babies will die, and 1/3 of the survivors will have serious health issues.

Yes.


The proposed legislation is actually quite conservative; requiring delivery at this stage.
It says that if the child has a 50/50 chance of surviving, even with serious health problems, then abortion is not an option.


There is a lie being put out there that our government is proposing a liberal free-for-all abortion service. That is not true; abortion is available under limited conditions after 12 weeks, and once the child has a 50% chance of surviving then abortion is not permitted.

RobertKK wrote: »

From the inquest:
The former pathologist added that in his opinion the baby and placenta would have been dead before the rapid growth of this infection. "This is why it is so important to remove this tissues so quickly once the baby is dead," he said.

I do not think that means what you think it means.

RobertKK wrote: »

From a rape victim who had an abortion: “for me, it has been harder to deal with than the rape.”.



https://m.independent.ie/lifestyle/health/ccase-mum-i-grieve-for-my-lost-baby-every-day-29241584.html

Oh look, I can pull up cases of raped women who had an abortion who don't regret it.

https://www.pregnancychoicesdirectory.com/peoplesstories/abortion/2263/i-had-an-abortion-after-being-raped

Would I really want a reminder of what happened staring at me everyday? Would I ever tell this child about his/her father? Not to mention the mental and emotion stress I'd go through. So I got an abortion without my parents ever knowing. Now, over a year later, I don't regret it. I won't lie though, I think about it all the time. But I'm trying to let it go, I can't hold on to the past forever. Next year my now 'fiancée' and I are moving in together, and we're going to try to have a child of our own. I now have something to look forward to.

https://rewire.news/article/2012/10/26/survivor-an-illegal-abortion-why-it-is-important-to-keep-abortion-legal/

I can tell you, though, that I would have gotten a hundred illegal abortions before carrying that monster’s offspring and going through labor, even to give the child away. That would have been the unkindest cut of all.

For women and girls, safe legal abortions are essential. While many will choose a different path than I with their pregnancies, having that choice is essential.

This coming from someone who was raped also.

We gonna go tit for tat?

NoVoter wrote: »

I don't agree - as the treatment of the 'dissenting' Yes voter last night shows, many in the Yes camp here will not tolerate any deviation from the party line. My primary identity here is known to people in my workplace - a workplace that is 100% on message with every 'progressive' social issue and where 21st century 'tolerance' is in full effect - i.e. it would not be a wise career move to dare to admit voting No.

But surely its worth it if you get to save thousands of innocent potential lives no!? Why be so selfish, looking to maintain your career and lifestyle to the detriment of potential lives, you are a sick sick person!!

Sure what if your colleagues found out about your stance on the 8th, maybe you lose your job and career. Rest agreed there is plenty of support out there for you, unemployment benefit is a good start, don't worry, you will be looked after the same way the NO side tell women they will be looked after they have a child!

Lastly, RobertKKK!! Your ignorance of the Savita story is astounding. I have decided to make it easy for you. Now if you cant get it this time then we know you are an ignoramus and sad excuse for a man!!

Say your daughter (if you have one, or wife) was driving along a country road. She has just had the car in for a service. Now when she left the car into be serviced she mentioned that the breaks seemed a bit off and could they pay extra attention to that area. When driving homesShe is within the speed limits, taking every precaution available to be safe on the road. . Well as it happens on her way home the breaks fail (despite her asking them to make sure they are fine) and she skids and crashed head first into a tree and dies from the impact.

Now Robert, who do you blame for her death? Was it the garage that did not do as asked Re her brakes or perhaps whoever planted the tree as it was that impact that killed her? Because in the Savita case you are essentialy blaming the tree for killing her when if the doctors had looked at her breaks(gave her the termination she requested) then they would not have failed and she would not have hit the tree!!

Simples really....if you want it to be. Not simple if you are an ignoramus and failure of a man!!