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8th amendment referendum part 3 - Mod note and FAQ in post #1

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Comments

  • #2282
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 1,159 ✭ [Deleted User]


    RobertKK wrote: »
    My first concern is they are falling a lot and as I said before the person isn't healthy, as she said she could fall in traffic under a vehicle. Have they looked for a wheelchair or something to help with safety, I don't know if it is related to the pregnancy, or if there is pain there when not pregnant, but we see in the referendum debate that doctors differ, the repeal doctors come across as more conservative with treatment as they talk about being restricted unlike retain doctors, maybe a different doctor for a different perspective?

    Robert I was referring to Moiratat's situation. She was in an abusive relationship and had no family support - in fact she was the only real support for her siblings. Should she have subjected a child to an abusive father?


  • #2283
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,917 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    RobertKK wrote: »
    Because a mod gave their own opinion because she/he was so fed up with people crying to them and wanted it shut down.
    It was their opinion, nothing more, nothing less.

    Really

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=106799317&postcount=7991
    RobertKK wrote: »
    This always happens, so predictable. when you can't shut me down, you go back to Miss P since I can't discuss it.

    The courts in that case agreed the doctors were wrong with they did.

    No they didn’t as you were previously informed about, and now your at the same stunt with the 97% of cases in the U.K. are for lifestyle and work and not providing any evidence because you know you cannot as it simply just doesn’t exist.

    Not try to get you banned as your claiming with the victim card yet again your to valuable as an example of the lies spread by the pro life side.

    Anyway been stuck in work all day going to enjoy the sun while it lasts beside the water of leith for a while.


  • #2284
    bootpaws
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74 ✭✭bootpaws


    I understand and respect that some Yes voters need to maintain relationships with people who are firmly on the No side, be it for professional or personal reasons. But I have no respect for anyone voting No. I have none.

    Where's their respect for me when they're voting to retain an amendment that would force doctors to wait for me to literally start dying before receiving healthcare?

    Sorry, I don't care how cute you think the early stages of a foetus is. It's a foetus. It's not sitting in there for 9 months for the craic of it. It requires 9 months to develop into a baby. It's not a baby at 12 weeks.

    Meanwhile I'm a grown living breathing woman, and I deserve healthcare. I deserve to not be DYING before being taken care of.

    You're absolutely disgusting if you think that's a normal thing to overlook when voting.


  • #2285
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    bootpaws wrote: »
    I understand and respect that some Yes voters need to maintain relationships with people who are firmly on the No side, be it for professional or personal reasons. But I have no respect for anyone voting No. I have none.

    Where's their respect for me when they're voting to retain an amendment that would force doctors to wait for me to literally start dying before receiving healthcare?

    Sorry, I don't care how cute you think the early stages of a foetus is. It's a foetus. It's not sitting in there for 9 months for the craic of it. It requires 9 months to develop into a baby. It's not a baby at 12 weeks.

    Meanwhile I'm a grown living breathing woman, and I deserve healthcare. I deserve to not be DYING before being taken care of.

    You're absolutely disgusting if you think that's a normal thing to overlook when voting.

    This is why there is so many silent voters


  • #2286
    Annasopra
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,223 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    RobertKK wrote: »
    Most abortions are not what are posted about in this thread. People go for the hard cases.

    Do people want to debate the marriage referendum again? I congratulated the Yes side when they won, I was not bitter which Yes will be if they lose in this referendum. I will not congratulate Yes if they win this referendum, as I don't condone killing human life needlessly which unrestricted abortion will allow.
    The people who compare this referendum to the marriage referendum are going to be wrong.
    What did sicken me on the day the marriage referendum was won is how a section of people on twitter on that very day moved onto abortion being next as if the two were comparable.

    Yeah and to be honest I was sickened by your "this is an excuse for men to abuse children" back then.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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  • #2287
    PlaneSpeeking
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 5,106 ✭✭✭PlaneSpeeking


    bootpaws wrote: »
    I understand and respect that some Yes voters need to maintain relationships with people who are firmly on the No side, be it for professional or personal reasons. But I have no respect for anyone voting No. I have none.

    Where's their respect for me when they're voting to retain an amendment that would force doctors to wait for me to literally start dying before receiving healthcare?

    Sorry, I don't care how cute you think the early stages of a foetus is. It's a foetus. It's not sitting in there for 9 months for the craic of it. It requires 9 months to develop into a baby. It's not a baby at 12 weeks.

    Meanwhile I'm a grown living breathing woman, and I deserve healthcare. I deserve to not be DYING before being taken care of.

    You're absolutely disgusting if you think that's a normal thing to overlook when voting.

    On the "heartbeat at 22 days/yawning at 9 weeks" I reminded a No vote that both were involuntary and not a sign of viability or sentience

    When asked how I knew that I just commented it was basic medicine, basic biology - a brain stem dies not develop till 15 to 17 weeks gestation.

    The response "I don't believe in that". Like it's fairies or UFOs!

    I respect some No voters, if they know the facts but feel they must vote one way - but will debate and discuss with you - but science isn't something to 'believe" in.


  • #2288
    spookwoman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,059 ✭✭✭✭spookwoman


    This stat that 97% of abortion in Uk is for social reasons that's being peddled by the No side is bull. Do search for 97% abortion uk and its nearly all prolife anti abortion sites.

    I went down the search page which brought me to where there is an excel file. In it option C percent is 97% and the date was was 1968 to 2016 https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/report-on-abortion-statistics-in-england-and-wales-for-2016

    option C is
    C. The pregnancy has not exceeded its twenty-fourth week and that
    the continuance of the pregnancy would involve risk, greater than
    if the pregnancy were terminated, of injury to the physical or
    mental health of the pregnant woman (section 1(1)(a)).


  • #2289
    bootpaws
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74 ✭✭bootpaws


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    This is why there is so many silent voters

    Am I supposed to feel sorry for them?

    How much clearer can I make it than what I said in that post? You're voting to let me lie on a hospital bed and wait to start to die before doctors can intervene.

    No wonder they're silent. They know voting to allow that to continue is despicable, and they're right.


  • #2290
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    bootpaws wrote: »
    Am I supposed to feel sorry for them?

    How much clearer can I make it than what I said in that post? You're voting to let me lie on a hospital bed and wait to start to die before doctors can intervene.

    No wonder they're silent. They know voting to allow that to continue is despicable, and they're right.

    Not at all I respect everyone's opinion,I'm just pointing out that it's reactions like this that silence people,and why the polls will not be accurate that's all


  • #2291
    Annasopra
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,223 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Not at all I respect everyone's opinion,I'm just pointing out that it's reactions like this that silence people,and why the polls will not be accurate that's all

    Really? You've been mocking a lot of opinions around here the last few weeks.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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  • #2292
    spookwoman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,059 ✭✭✭✭spookwoman


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Not at all I respect everyone's opinion,I'm just pointing out that it's reactions like this that silence people,and why the polls will not be accurate that's all

    Maybe the other reason why they keep silent is if someone in their family does have a crises pregnancy and needs an abortion which is only available in the UK the can wipe their crocodile tears away and the person suffering wont know the real truth.


  • #2293
    PhoenixParker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,677 ✭✭✭PhoenixParker


    This idea that pregnancy is merely an inconvenience and abortion is about lifestyle choice.

    If you’re thinking along those lines maybe consider what that so-called inconvenience and lifestyle is in practice.

    Typical scenarios, not extremes.

    Maternity benefit lasts 26 weeks and is €235 a week.
    How would you do surviving with that hit to your income?

    Then at less then 6 months old you’ll have to put the baby in childcare, or take 16 weeks unpaid. There goes €800 minimum or €1000+ per month if you live in Dublin.

    Then you spend your days running from crèche to office to crèche to home, scrabbling to spend an hour a day with your baby in the time you prepare their dinner.

    Love both?

    If the priority is to prevent abortions then fixing that should be the priority but I’ve never seen anyone on the no side mention it til now.

    If you’re voting no because you can’t condone “lifestyle abortions”, then I hope you’ve made an honest effort in the past to improve the “lifestyle” of pregnant women and the mothers of young children.


  • #2294
    Zerbini Blewitt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 171 ✭✭Zerbini Blewitt


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    This is why there is so many silent voters

    Is that because these silent NO voters prefer presenting a simple black & white abstract ideological position but have no answer to the everyday mind-numbing cruelty of keeping the 8th (as we see with them largely ignoring all of the personal testimonies in this thread, of people affected by this grossly demeaning abomination of a law).

    If I was a NO voter I'd keep my mouth shut too because it is impossible to defend this (internationally illegal) law without lying copiously - which anyone with a modicum of self-respect would not do.


  • #2295
    pitifulgod
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,282 ✭✭✭pitifulgod


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Not at all I respect everyone's opinion,I'm just pointing out that it's reactions like this that silence people,and why the polls will not be accurate that's all

    People are equally less likely to mention they're voting yes in certain scenarios. Eg my mother has only told me which way she's voting. The main reason being because there's ultra Conservative elements in our family that campaigned for the 8th in 83. She's 70, there are friends of hers who have surprised her by saying that they will also voting yes.


  • #2296
    bootpaws
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 74 ✭✭bootpaws


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Not at all I respect everyone's opinion,I'm just pointing out that it's reactions like this that silence people,and why the polls will not be accurate that's all

    Interesting you weren't so worried about what people might think when people on the No side are suggesting the removal of women's wombs as punishment for abortion, of enforcement of stronger sentences for taking abortion pills, of bulldozing hospitals that perform abortions, of blocking Yes voters in their homes on referendum day.

    If silent no voters are still staying silent and not engaging at this stage, I doubt they're going to have a spontaneous change of mind in the next 3 weeks. But if they're interested in hearing the facts, then they'll hear or find them regardless. I will not apologise for my lack of respect for No voters, because everything I said is true.


  • #2297
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    pitifulgod wrote: »
    People are equally less likely to mention they're voting yes in certain scenarios. Eg my mother has only told me which way she's voting. The main reason being because there's ultra Conservative elements in our family that campaigned for the 8th in 83.

    Yes I agree with that, I just think there is more on the no side,just read through this thread and you can see what happens to people who won't change their view, but there's a vote and democracy will decide


  • #2298
    .......
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    This post has been deleted.


  • #2299
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    ....... wrote: »
    No. It's because they don't want to show their true selves in public because then people will know what kind of people they are. Controlling, misogynstic, wanting to make women suffer.

    I wouldn't admit to it myself if I held such disgusting views. It's shameful.

    Proves my point really, you do know a lot of women are voting no right ?


  • #2300
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    there is still a lot of hypocrisy around.
    my friend spoke with her father about the referendum & he said he will be voting no.
    when she reminded him that he actually paid for her to go to England & get an abortion when she was 19, in the early 90's, he said 'that was different'

    so, basically a lot of people are no voters until it actually lands on their doorstep.......hoepfully she changed his mind, but tbh, i doubt it.


  • #2301
    pitifulgod
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,282 ✭✭✭pitifulgod


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Yes I agree with that, I just think there is more on the no side,just read through this thread and you can see what happens to people who won't change their view, but there's a vote and democracy will decide

    The threads have been strongly pro repeal in fact, wouldn't classify them as representative. Although I would say the extreme positions of the no posters such as yourself is pretty representative of how atrociously they have handled the campaign to date. It's devoid of compassion and judgemental.


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  • #2302
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Proves my point really, you do know a lot of women are voting no right ?

    it is actually worse imo that women will vote no, they should be completely aware of what the 8th amendment means to womens healthcare & rights in this country.
    tbf, some men may not understand the full implications of it, but women really should know how it affects them.


  • #2303
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    pitifulgod wrote: »
    The threads have been strongly pro repeal in fact, wouldn't classify them as representative. Although I would say the extreme positions of the no posters such as yourself is pretty representative of how atrociously they have handled the campaign to date. It's devoid of compassion and judgemental.

    You could be right, only the result will prove it one way or the other


  • #2304
    Moiratat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 38 ✭Moiratat


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    You could be right, only the result will prove it one way or the other

    Hi Anne, I would like to ask you, if you were in situation what you would have done?


  • #2305
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    Moiratat wrote: »
    Hi Anne, I would like to ask you, if you were in situation what you would have done?

    Hi, honestly I'm not getting into it anymore there's no point, there is no debate,only ridicule. I've made my position clear, I'm voting no but would have voted yes under different circumstances like many,many no voters


  • #2306
    Bredabe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,390 ✭✭✭Bredabe


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Hi, honestly I'm not getting into it anymore there's no point, there is no debate,only ridicule. I've made my position clear, I'm voting no but would have voted yes under different circumstances like many,many no voters

    When you say different circumstances, do you mean different life experiences or differently proposed legislation?

    "Have you ever wagged your tail so hard you fell over"?-Brod Higgins.



  • #2307
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Hi, honestly I'm not getting into it anymore there's no point, there is no debate,only ridicule. I've made my position clear, I'm voting no but would have voted yes under different circumstances like many,many no voters
    Today really has been a throwback to 2015.


  • #2308
    AnneFrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,827 ✭✭✭AnneFrank


    Bredabe wrote: »
    When you say different circumstances, do you mean different life experiences or differently proposed legislation?

    Legislation


  • #2309
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Hi, honestly I'm not getting into it anymore there's no point, there is no debate,only ridicule. I've made my position clear, I'm voting no but would have voted yes under different circumstances like many,many no voters

    why exactly are you voting no?
    do you think the 8th amendment has some good point?
    do you believe that the 8th amendment is a different issue to abortion?
    do you believe abortion should be available under any circumstances?
    what would your choice be?

    i am currently overseas & tbh I dont get to talk through this with anyone, just this thread.
    all the men i work with are in agreement with me, so I dont honestly get to talk with pro 8th amendment people.


  • #2310
    Wrongway1985
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,488 ✭✭✭Wrongway1985


    RobertKK wrote: »
    Most abortions are not what are posted about in this thread. People go for the hard cases.

    I'm sorry, The hard cases are obviously priority I fail to understand the logic in dismissing them. My clear priority is to help those women who find themselves in such drastic circumstances and the 8th prevents that. To entertain the notion that
    women will seek abortion as a convenience? and yet then rank that above those women how could you do that?


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  • #2311
    Bredabe
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,390 ✭✭✭Bredabe


    AnneFrank wrote: »
    Legislation
    Thank you, I have spoken with a lot of people(mainly women) who say that their big reservation is that the amendment includes abortion and they would be happy to vote yes if it was the same in terms of women's health BUT excluded the abortion bit.

    Is this what you feel as well? if so, what legislation would be acceptable?

    "Have you ever wagged your tail so hard you fell over"?-Brod Higgins.



This discussion has been closed.
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