The 8th Amendment Part 2 - Mod Warning in OP

29-04-2018 01:16AM

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

Ive noticed this slogan "healthy women and healthy babies" a lot recently. Is that a message they are pushing?

Yep well save8th are

https://www.save8.ie/press-release-save-the-8th-issues-position-paper-outlining-how-yes-will-introduce-abortion-for-healthy-babies-at-six-months/

29-04-2018 01:24AM

Reading the above it has a John McGuirk like tone to it, bullsh1t basically.
No one is forced to abort or provided with substandard care in the U.K. as suggested by the piece and the same will apply if repeal if successful.

RobertKK · 29-04-2018 03:01AM

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

Ive noticed this slogan "healthy women and healthy babies" a lot recently. Is that a message they are pushing?

That is the majority of abortions, not the hard cases.

conorhal · 29-04-2018 04:42AM

PhoenixParker wrote: »

I am a human, fully formed, living with a right to life as are you. Let's suppose for a moment a foetus is too.

Imagine for instance that I need a blood donation. You are the only match. Without your blood I will die. My right to life does not trump your right to bodily autonomy.

It’s a procedure that would take maybe an hour and register as barely more than a scratch but the HSE will not have you hauled in, pinned down and your blood extracted. You can say no. Everyone might think you’re horrible for saying no, curse you, ostracize you whatever, but the courts or medical system wouldn’t force you

A fetus may indeed have a right to life just as much as you or I, but just as I don’t have a right to bits of your body, while fetus needs somebody else’s womb to survive, it is the person whose womb it is who gets to decide if she will carry it.

A fetus’s right to life (or any other conceivable rights) shouldn’t preclude a woman from having an abortion.

No you can't be strapped down and forced to donate blood to save the life of the one person who needs your blood type to save them, but what kind of sociopath wouldn't? What's your point? That if another persons death is the slightest inconvenience to you the F!£$% them?
Repeal the 8th, because F!"£& it I don't care about anything that inconveniences me. Well, that poster would at least be honest.

You should also stop paying taxes so, because think of all those people in hospitals or that are unemployed you're forced to help, how dare people expect you contribute to society or have consideration to anything but your own navel.
All your post has to say is that narcissism should be your only value. Yeah, that will work out well for society. This is possibly the most retarded argument for abortion yet. It's the argument of a whiny teenager. The kind of argument made by people that think they're smart but in reality, they're only pointing out that they think their the center of the universe.

NuMarvel · 29-04-2018 08:02AM

RobertKK wrote: »

That is the majority of abortions, not the hard cases.

The people pushing it don't care about the hard cases, so it rings a little hollow.

frag420 · 29-04-2018 08:05AM

conorhal wrote: »

No you can't be strapped down and forced to donate blood to save the life of the one person who needs your blood type to save them, but what kind of sociopath wouldn't? What's your point? That if another persons death is the slightest inconvenience to you the F!£$% them?
Repeal the 8th, because F!"£& it I don't care about anything that inconveniences me. Well, that poster would at least be honest.

You should also stop paying taxes so, because think of all those people in hospitals or that are unemployed you're forced to help, how dare people expect you contribute to society or have consideration to anything but your own navel.
All your post has to say is that narcissism should be your only value. Yeah, that will work out well for society. This is possibly the most retarded argument for abortion yet. It's the argument of a whiny teenager. The kind of argument made by people that think they're smart but in reality, they're only pointing out that they think their the center of the universe.

If you’re going to assume someone is a retard or not smart it’s probaly best to check your spelling/grammar correct!

You know sometimes it’s best to keep your mouth shut and let the pro choice side think you're a fool than to open it and remove all doubt for us!

Annasopra · 29-04-2018 08:06AM

Killester1 wrote: »

The unborn deserve rights and respect too.

Im not sure that answered the question about why some people view women mysogynistically as incubators and pretty much sluts and whores?

ELM327 · 29-04-2018 08:19AM

frag420 wrote: »

If you’re going to assume someone is a retard or not smart it’s probaly best to check your spelling/grammar correct!

You know sometimes it’s best to keep your mouth shut and let the pro choice side think you're a fool than to open it and remove all doubt for us!

I think anyone using the word "retard" in 2018, it speaks volumes about the user of the word more than anything.

Igotadose · 29-04-2018 08:31AM

Yuck. Some thinly veiled anti-choice site, u n d e c i d e d 8 dot o r g, has shown up on Facebook in an account I have that hasn't (at least, I didn't think it did) any info about me being in Ireland in it. Evil freaking facebook and their endless snooping.

Anyway, warn your pro-choice friends about the site. It's slick, and very anti-choice starting with the logo.

Seems like every website I hit has anti-choice ads popping up. Never have seen a pro-choice ad show. Maybe there aren't any.

circadian · 29-04-2018 08:35AM

Thank Christ I'm blocking all trackers/ads and social media. Don't think I could maintain a constant cynicism browsing the internet these days.

Seem the RTE debate, did Wendy Grace actually answer a question? Seems like she just dodged the questions with hysteria.

smokingman · 29-04-2018 09:12AM

erica74 wrote: »

Ah I probably missed all of that, I was in town earlier in the day and the prochoice and antichoice groups were right next to each other hanging out leaflets so I can definitely imagine that it got heated.

This was a different group:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/3LgoexSQ4bafKuuYLfjgGlVFErAKylANpZ25IQXndARnGBCfPYusoMwGMGYNdpVBlj0qh185d9poxt9ktsvM_DmJLg3fa3cvtn5J2vOLsXk1qFTVFkcra7mZlP8ZmAvfieYl59soGiv5w9nlnSm9C_ljJyMq_oNe2N8MSuxBeGhs6T-qxXnia1PLCO3AFELdMvz0O4vV2TnED1ouipF6wgZEOHDajSoHSfxXof48bRIPqY3kTSrIL8O9jGlrrHy4vnXVpWE48BZBhn1L7B7ApHNh4ri4lDE5PinKPnZms88bloqnrN2l90RNKXvNnauI8eVkxjpnTLQ-_kOPaEEWbI7zLsztNp04q3hGK5TIZFCF_HF6wFeS39DLsw5BL68D3jikWUZUtGECqTfhPkpkDnYWt6XlyFHkdIhMAvZiTORL9tAFkAN7S_3iVPdOmSj10KUr9QyR4VxQmdowm2BuQPLvyPk_EMADjKfF1sW32PJWLZ5jkZ7wnlxgl2IC68iM9uvI408lquzD64Mw9TtTaH349w8IrPDamyfV25I5ulfj62yj8lcK7lc03nxeKCI3nNZUXwm-JsEQRNbN82eppEj7Ny08AVqSdcvA-On2eU2WOK2cNuhUqvKjMbJNTqQvM_iKhtQXxVB4N4MmbRPZkxlXSdVidWci=w795-h599-no

Warning, don't open if you feel queasy.

PhoenixParker · 29-04-2018 09:20AM

conorhal wrote: »

No you can't be strapped down and forced to donate blood to save the life of the one person who needs your blood type to save them, but what kind of sociopath wouldn't? What's your point? That if another persons death is the slightest inconvenience to you the F!£$% them?
Repeal the 8th, because F!"£& it I don't care about anything that inconveniences me. Well, that poster would at least be honest.

My point is that in general we allow people to decide what level of inconvenience they’re willing to undergo to save someone’s life, only in the case of pregnancy do we make an exception.

Your hatred shines through.
Dismissing pregnancy as a minor inconvenience, and those wishing to have a choice about their bodies as narcissistic and whiny teenagers.

The reality is different, hopes, dreams, health struggles, lifetime commitments, existing children needing care . . . Real women, real lives. You have to dismiss them and belittle them to convince yourself they don’t matter.

Pregnancy is not a slight inconvenience, nor is childbirth or raising a child.
It’s months of exhaustion and sickness, pain, years of sleepless nights and a lifelong commitment to another human being. When it’s wanted and wished for it’s the most fantastic thing, when it’s not it’s a life sentence of misery for both

You’re staring so hard at the belly you can’t see the woman.

erica74 · 29-04-2018 09:55AM

smokingman wrote: »

This was a different group:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/3LgoexSQ4bafKuuYLfjgGlVFErAKylANpZ25IQXndARnGBCfPYusoMwGMGYNdpVBlj0qh185d9poxt9ktsvM_DmJLg3fa3cvtn5J2vOLsXk1qFTVFkcra7mZlP8ZmAvfieYl59soGiv5w9nlnSm9C_ljJyMq_oNe2N8MSuxBeGhs6T-qxXnia1PLCO3AFELdMvz0O4vV2TnED1ouipF6wgZEOHDajSoHSfxXof48bRIPqY3kTSrIL8O9jGlrrHy4vnXVpWE48BZBhn1L7B7ApHNh4ri4lDE5PinKPnZms88bloqnrN2l90RNKXvNnauI8eVkxjpnTLQ-_kOPaEEWbI7zLsztNp04q3hGK5TIZFCF_HF6wFeS39DLsw5BL68D3jikWUZUtGECqTfhPkpkDnYWt6XlyFHkdIhMAvZiTORL9tAFkAN7S_3iVPdOmSj10KUr9QyR4VxQmdowm2BuQPLvyPk_EMADjKfF1sW32PJWLZ5jkZ7wnlxgl2IC68iM9uvI408lquzD64Mw9TtTaH349w8IrPDamyfV25I5ulfj62yj8lcK7lc03nxeKCI3nNZUXwm-JsEQRNbN82eppEj7Ny08AVqSdcvA-On2eU2WOK2cNuhUqvKjMbJNTqQvM_iKhtQXxVB4N4MmbRPZkxlXSdVidWci=w795-h599-no

Warning, don't open if you feel queasy.

Holy shit, what is wrong with these people???

BabysCoffee · 29-04-2018 10:04AM

smokingman wrote: »

This was a different group:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/3LgoexSQ4bafKuuYLfjgGlVFErAKylANpZ25IQXndARnGBCfPYusoMwGMGYNdpVBlj0qh185d9poxt9ktsvM_DmJLg3fa3cvtn5J2vOLsXk1qFTVFkcra7mZlP8ZmAvfieYl59soGiv5w9nlnSm9C_ljJyMq_oNe2N8MSuxBeGhs6T-qxXnia1PLCO3AFELdMvz0O4vV2TnED1ouipF6wgZEOHDajSoHSfxXof48bRIPqY3kTSrIL8O9jGlrrHy4vnXVpWE48BZBhn1L7B7ApHNh4ri4lDE5PinKPnZms88bloqnrN2l90RNKXvNnauI8eVkxjpnTLQ-_kOPaEEWbI7zLsztNp04q3hGK5TIZFCF_HF6wFeS39DLsw5BL68D3jikWUZUtGECqTfhPkpkDnYWt6XlyFHkdIhMAvZiTORL9tAFkAN7S_3iVPdOmSj10KUr9QyR4VxQmdowm2BuQPLvyPk_EMADjKfF1sW32PJWLZ5jkZ7wnlxgl2IC68iM9uvI408lquzD64Mw9TtTaH349w8IrPDamyfV25I5ulfj62yj8lcK7lc03nxeKCI3nNZUXwm-JsEQRNbN82eppEj7Ny08AVqSdcvA-On2eU2WOK2cNuhUqvKjMbJNTqQvM_iKhtQXxVB4N4MmbRPZkxlXSdVidWci=w795-h599-no

Warning, don't open if you feel queasy.

These were on display outside where I work. My colleague came back from lunch flustered and visibly upset after seeing them. She said a man called the guards about them. She was worried that her teenage children were going to pass by when school was out.

amdublin · 29-04-2018 10:27AM

lillycakes2 wrote: »

.....

Too many people will continue to have sex irresponsibly and use abortion then to avoid having a baby- which is a human life.
I would vote yes if it was for specific cases but seen as this referendum is just going to open up the flood gates to abortion for any reason at all, I will be voting no.
I would vote yes if the criteria was different.

Ouch!

Is this your opinion of Irish women and people?

"Jaysis this is great I can have irresponsible sex all I like now that the magic pile are available. Pop down to me dr and get them. Sure what's a bit of haemorrhaging, uterine pain and cramping, hormonal upset and physical bodily trauma. If it means I can have me irresponsible sex sure isn't it grand".

It makes me sad that people think we would do this.

erica74 · 29-04-2018 10:29AM

amdublin wrote: »

Ouch!

Is this your opinion of Irish women and people?

"Jaysis this is great I can have irresponsible sex all I like now that the magic pile are available. Pop down to me dr and get them. Sure what's a bit of haemorrhaging, uterine pain and cramping, hormonal upset and physical bodily trauma. If it means I can have me irresponsible sex sure isn't it grand".

It makes me sad that people think we would do this.

And unfortunately, a lot of people do still think this way, the only women who have abortions are sluts who don't use contraception.

amdublin · 29-04-2018 10:29AM

smokingman wrote: »

This was a different group:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/3LgoexSQ4bafKuuYLfjgGlVFErAKylANpZ25IQXndARnGBCfPYusoMwGMGYNdpVBlj0qh185d9poxt9ktsvM_DmJLg3fa3cvtn5J2vOLsXk1qFTVFkcra7mZlP8ZmAvfieYl59soGiv5w9nlnSm9C_ljJyMq_oNe2N8MSuxBeGhs6T-qxXnia1PLCO3AFELdMvz0O4vV2TnED1ouipF6wgZEOHDajSoHSfxXof48bRIPqY3kTSrIL8O9jGlrrHy4vnXVpWE48BZBhn1L7B7ApHNh4ri4lDE5PinKPnZms88bloqnrN2l90RNKXvNnauI8eVkxjpnTLQ-_kOPaEEWbI7zLsztNp04q3hGK5TIZFCF_HF6wFeS39DLsw5BL68D3jikWUZUtGECqTfhPkpkDnYWt6XlyFHkdIhMAvZiTORL9tAFkAN7S_3iVPdOmSj10KUr9QyR4VxQmdowm2BuQPLvyPk_EMADjKfF1sW32PJWLZ5jkZ7wnlxgl2IC68iM9uvI408lquzD64Mw9TtTaH349w8IrPDamyfV25I5ulfj62yj8lcK7lc03nxeKCI3nNZUXwm-JsEQRNbN82eppEj7Ny08AVqSdcvA-On2eU2WOK2cNuhUqvKjMbJNTqQvM_iKhtQXxVB4N4MmbRPZkxlXSdVidWci=w795-h599-no

Warning, don't open if you feel queasy.

Oh no that's not right. We all know what abortions look like. We don't need to see it.

No one decides to have an abortion lightly.

Why would that group do that??

kylith · 29-04-2018 10:51AM

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

Ive noticed this slogan "healthy women and healthy babies" a lot recently. Is that a message they are pushing?

It’s their way of ignoring the many people who have medical reasons for needing termination. They want the make the public forget about them so they can pretend it’s all about irresponsible women.

kylith · 29-04-2018 10:52AM

smokingman wrote: »

This was a different group:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/3LgoexSQ4bafKuuYLfjgGlVFErAKylANpZ25IQXndARnGBCfPYusoMwGMGYNdpVBlj0qh185d9poxt9ktsvM_DmJLg3fa3cvtn5J2vOLsXk1qFTVFkcra7mZlP8ZmAvfieYl59soGiv5w9nlnSm9C_ljJyMq_oNe2N8MSuxBeGhs6T-qxXnia1PLCO3AFELdMvz0O4vV2TnED1ouipF6wgZEOHDajSoHSfxXof48bRIPqY3kTSrIL8O9jGlrrHy4vnXVpWE48BZBhn1L7B7ApHNh4ri4lDE5PinKPnZms88bloqnrN2l90RNKXvNnauI8eVkxjpnTLQ-_kOPaEEWbI7zLsztNp04q3hGK5TIZFCF_HF6wFeS39DLsw5BL68D3jikWUZUtGECqTfhPkpkDnYWt6XlyFHkdIhMAvZiTORL9tAFkAN7S_3iVPdOmSj10KUr9QyR4VxQmdowm2BuQPLvyPk_EMADjKfF1sW32PJWLZ5jkZ7wnlxgl2IC68iM9uvI408lquzD64Mw9TtTaH349w8IrPDamyfV25I5ulfj62yj8lcK7lc03nxeKCI3nNZUXwm-JsEQRNbN82eppEj7Ny08AVqSdcvA-On2eU2WOK2cNuhUqvKjMbJNTqQvM_iKhtQXxVB4N4MmbRPZkxlXSdVidWci=w795-h599-no

Warning, don't open if you feel queasy.

Ah, they’ve got the old banners from College Green out.

amdublin · 29-04-2018 11:28AM

Fyi I was canvassing in the ranelagh/Rathmines area yesterday.

80/20% say Yes to repeal.

Edit. I'd even go as far as saying 90/10

pitifulgod · 29-04-2018 11:34AM

amdublin wrote: »

Fyi I was canvassing in the ranelagh/Rathmines area yesterday.

80/20% say Yes to repeal.

Edit. I'd even go as far as saying 90/10

Big factor there is, I'd expect as much on this side of Dublin. Dublin in general will be heavily repeal I'm guessing. Outside of Dublin is key in terms of persuading. Guessing you feel exact same about it, I'm very paranoid about complacency. :P

mohawk · 29-04-2018 11:37AM

kylith wrote: »

It’s their way of ignoring the many people who have medical reasons for needing termination. They want the make the public forget about them so they can pretend it’s all about irresponsible women.

Agreed it is very misleading. Firstly majority of abortions happen before week 10. Until pregnancy hits week 12 then the miscarriage rate is 25%. Therefore it is not unreasonable to assert that some of those abortions would of ended in miscarriage had no abortion taken place.

Regarding women's health I don't quite believe that either. Many of us know women who look perfectly healthy but are have very serious illnesses. Is survival of the pregnancy really how we want to measure success?

I can see why some refer to pro-life side as pro-birth. The health and welfare of the mother and newborn don't seem to matter.

ancapailldorcha · 29-04-2018 11:38AM

I've largely but not entirely avoided this topic partly because I'm not following it terribly closely because I live in the UK and partly because of the sheer amount of poison that it seems to stir up which seems to be almost entirely from the "No" side.

I completely understand that some people perceive abortion as the killing of a child. I used to be one of these people myself. I think I might still be. I don't like the idea of abortion at all. However, the eighth amendment seems to be causing more harm than good. Women shouldn't be prohibited from having abortions simply because I don't feel that it's right. And then there are cases of medical complications, rape, etc. Cases that no state can legislate for preemptively so doctors will find their hands tied unnecessarily leading to all kinds of suffering for the women involved. The 12-week limit seems strict to me when compared to other countries but it's better than nothing.

And then there is the other half of the "No" brigade. The people who spew hate and bile at everyone else. The sheer amount of misogyny this has stirred up is appalling but not surprising given some of the homophobic vitriol I saw in the leadup SSM referendum. They seem to be motivated entirely by the hatred they hold for everyone who is different from them in any way. They're not driven by concern for children or women. If a woman is forced to have the child and she can't provide for it, they simply resort to the usual lines of scroungers needing to make better life choices. Ditto if she wants help from the state for anything at all. She should be able to pay for everything her child needs herself without handouts. Then there are the caricatures of the girls having an abortion so they can look better for their beach holidays, to drop a size, to avoid the consequences of their life choices as if the procedure is over in an instant with no trauma whatsoever. They're psychotic as they don't care for their children since they can just be rid of them so easily. When they're done with this, they'll find the next demographic that dares try to achieve equality or parity in human rights and they'll be spewing poison around all over again.

Ultimately, I research my vote before I cast it. However, a useful tool I've found is to simply find the poison, hatred and prejudice and vote against that and in this case it's definitely in the "No" side. I won't be voting as I am an expat but I dearly hope that the eighth is repealed so that Irish women can enjoy at least some of the rights of bodily autonomy of women in other countries.

Achasanai · 29-04-2018 11:38AM

amdublin wrote: »

Fyi I was canvassing in the ranelagh/Rathmines area yesterday.

80/20% say Yes to repeal.

Edit. I'd even go as far as saying 90/10

How do we think it will go over all though? Should we be getting worried about the polls or is this normal for this period of a campaign?

taserfrank · 29-04-2018 11:45AM

Looking at the Sunday Business Post/Red C poll today, the support for yes has dropped again while the no side remains unchanged, and the number of undecideds has increased. I think if this keeps up, the no side will hopefully have it, as people come to realize that abortion on demand is not desirable.

ELM327 · 29-04-2018 11:47AM

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I've largely but not entirely avoided this topic partly because I'm not following it terribly closely because I live in the UK and partly because of the sheer amount of poison that it seems to stir up which seems to be almost entirely from the "No" side.

I completely understand that some people perceive abortion as the killing of a child. I used to be one of these people myself. I think I might still be. I don't like the idea of abortion at all. However, the eighth amendment seems to be causing more harm than good. Women shouldn't be prohibited from having abortions simply because I don't feel that it's right. And then there are cases of medical complications, rape, etc. Cases that no state can legislate for preemptively so doctors will find their hands tied unnecessarily leading to all kinds of suffering for the women involved. The 12-week limit seems strict to me when compared to other countries but it's better than nothing.

And then there is the other half of the "No" brigade. The people who spew hate and bile at everyone else. The sheer amount of misogyny this has stirred up is appalling but not surprising given some of the homophobic vitriol I saw in the leadup SSM referendum. They seem to be motivated entirely by the hatred they hold for everyone who is different from them in any way. They're not driven by concern for children or women. If a woman is forced to have the child and she can't provide for it, they simply resort to the usual lines of scroungers needing to make better life choices. Ditto if she wants help from the state for anything at all. She should be able to pay for everything her child needs herself without handouts. Then there are the caricatures of the girls having an abortion so they can look better for their beach holidays, to drop a size, to avoid the consequences of their life choices as if the procedure is over in an instant with no trauma whatsoever. They're psychotic as they don't care for their children since they can just be rid of them so easily. When they're done with this, they'll find the next demographic that dares try to achieve equality or parity in human rights and they'll be spewing poison around all over again.

Ultimately, I research my vote before I cast it. However, a useful tool I've found is to simply find the poison, hatred and prejudice and vote against that and in this case it's definitely in the "No" side. I won't be voting as I am an expat but I dearly hope that the eighth is repealed so that Irish women can enjoy at least some of the rights of bodily autonomy of women in other countries.

Finally, a logical post written by someone anti-abortion but yet leaning towards repeal. A well written post and explanation of reasoning behind it.
It's a pity you don't have a vote though.

Achasanai wrote: »

How do we think it will go over all though? Should we be getting worried about the polls or is this normal for this period of a campaign?

I can see a close run result, perhaps not quite as close as the divorce referendum but with approx 5% spread at most. There's going to be a lot of silent no votes from old dears on deaths door, from the brainwashed, the simple, and the occasional well meaning rational post from someone misinformed.

I am happy to see the extremes of the no side, from the out and out lies on billboards, to incendiary debate avoidance and pulling down of posters, as it confirms what I already thought, they don't believe they will win a straight fight.

Sofiztikated · 29-04-2018 11:47AM

mohawk wrote: »

Agreed it is very misleading. Firstly majority of abortions happen before week 10. Until pregnancy hits week 12 then the miscarriage rate is 25%. Therefore it is not unreasonable to assert that some of those abortions would of ended in miscarriage had no abortion taken place.

Regarding women's health I don't quite believe that either. Many of us know women who look perfectly healthy but are have very serious illnesses. Is survival of the pregnancy really how we want to measure success?

I can see why some refer to pro-life side as pro-birth. The health and welfare of the mother and newborn don't seem to matter.

My sister in law is pregnant again, this will be her third.

She's had 2 major knee surgeries recently, and has lost weight to take some stress of her joints. It's possible that this pregnancy could leave her needing crutches.

Now, even it abortion was available, I doubt she'd have one, but that's her choice. If she didn't want to continue with it, **** me, how could you blame her?

ancapailldorcha · 29-04-2018 11:48AM

ELM327 wrote: »

Finally, a logical post written by someone anti-abortion but yet leaning towards repeal. A well written post and explanation of reasoning behind it.
It's a pity you don't have a vote though.

I could grab a flight home but I'd be breaking the law. I'd likely start up a war with my family as well.

ELM327 · 29-04-2018 11:49AM

taserfrank wrote: »

Looking at the Sunday Business Post/Red C poll today, the support for yes has dropped again while the no side remains unchanged, and the number of undecideds has increased. I think if this keeps up, the no side will hopefully have it, as people come to realize that abortion on demand is not desirable.

First line of the article

[quote= https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/abortion-poll-shows-yes-side-hold-considerable-lead-despite-slight-fall-in-support-839879.html] The latest opinion poll out today shows a considerable lead for the 'Yes' campaign.[/quote]

53% YES 26% NO 19% Undecided
I'm happy with that.

pitifulgod · 29-04-2018 11:54AM

taserfrank wrote: »

Looking at the Sunday Business Post/Red C poll today, the support for yes has dropped again while the no side remains unchanged, and the number of undecideds has increased. I think if this keeps up, the no side will hopefully have it, as people come to realize that abortion on demand is not desirable.

The fact that the no side aren't having any gains is a pretty terrible indication for them. All their posters and outrageous tactics are having zero influence. Yes side in all referendums tend to drop before it. I'm feeling pretty hopeful about repeal.

The 8th Amendment Part 2 - Mod Warning in OP

Comments