Conspiracy about the flat earth conspiracy - Thread bans in OP

The_B_Man · 02-01-2018 4:47pm #1

Is it possible that the "government" invented the flat earth theory to both discredit conspiracy theorists (make them look like absolute loonies who shouldn't be listened to), and to distract said conspiracy theorists from finding info on other theories, such as 9/11 and what not? I haven't heard a mention of 9/11 in ages but on every 2nd post on social media, there's a comment about the flat earth.

Can you even have a conspiracy theory about a conspiracy theory?? :P

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Lex Luthor

King Mob · 02-01-2018 5:05pm

The_B_Man wrote: »

Is it possible that the "government" invented the flat earth theory to both discredit conspiracy theorists (make them look like absolute loonies who shouldn't be listened to), and to distract said conspiracy theorists from finding info on other theories, such as 9/11 and what not?

No it's not possible. The modern idea of a flat earth is mostly religious in nature and comes from a selective reading of religious texts. Most believers in a flat earth do so because of religious reasons. The government wouldn't need it make up, since it's been around for a very long time.
Even then, if the government did create this or some other theory, it would still require genuine people to genuinely believe it for it to work as you say. So even if it was artificially created, it was mostly spread by true believers anyway.

And then they wouldn't need to invent such a theory as conspiracy theorists are perfectly able to create ridiculous notions all by themselves.
For a recent example see the idea of fake mass shootings and crisis actors.
Or the theorists who posit that the twin towers were taken down by detected energy weapons from space.

Even still, if the government were tricking people into believing the idea the earth is flat, what benefit does it get them?
If it's so obviously dumb and clearly fake and apparently an obvious government ploy, then what danger are the people who buy into it and why would they need to be distracted?
A person who thinks the earth is flat is not going to be able to crack the vast 9/11 conspiracy.

I haven't heard a mention of 9/11 in ages but on every 2nd post on social media, there's a comment about the flat earth.

This is just because it's old news and people saying something silly about 9/11 isn't as eye catching as someone saying something silly like the earth is flat.
You see stuff about it crop up around the anniversary, but there hasn't been anything new or exciting in years.

9/11 is just one of those old hat conspiracies like the Moon Landing hoax or JFK.

Emme · 03-01-2018 12:36am

If the earth was flat cats would have pushed everything off it by now.

The_B_Man · 03-01-2018 3:15pm

Good points.
I'm just trying to make sense of it all. It's such ridiculousness that I figure there has to be something else behind it!

I suppose my thinking was that if Flat earthers get associated with conspiracy theorists, and then a friend/family mentions they've a conspiracy about something potentially true, then they'll be inclined to go "ye whatever, go watch your flat earth videos, weirdo!" instead of "Oh thats an interesting alternative view. I might look into that, since you're a trustworthy and sane person".

So the benefit to the government here would be that less people are getting into conspiracies as a hobby, coz they see it as full of headcases. So the less people searching for answers, the less chance of answers being found. Similarly, there'll be more people willing to accept whats told to them in the news, as they won't have read into media manipulation etc.

But if it can be shown that people believe the earth is flat coz of the bible or whatever, then thats another thing...

King Mob · 03-01-2018 3:26pm

The_B_Man wrote: »

I suppose my thinking was that if Flat earthers get associated with conspiracy theorists, and then a friend/family mentions they've a conspiracy about something potentially true, then they'll be inclined to go "ye whatever, go watch your flat earth videos, weirdo!" instead of "Oh thats an interesting alternative view. I might look into that, since you're a trustworthy and sane person".

Again, conspiracy theorists are more than capable of coming up and promoting ridiculous notions all by themselves.

Maybe conspiracy theorists should do a better job of filtering out nonsense from fact and presenting their cases in logical manners that don't rely on the same kinds of arguments as flat earthers...

The_B_Man wrote: »

So the benefit to the government here would be that less people are getting into conspiracies as a hobby, coz they see it as full of headcases. So the less people searching for answers, the less chance of answers being found. Similarly, there'll be more people willing to accept whats told to them in the news, as they won't have read into media manipulation etc.

Again, this is all stuff that conspiracy theorists do to themselves. And at the same time, something that folks in the conspiracy theory media abuse to make easy cash.

If anyone is benefiting from the creation of conspiracy theories, it's folks like Alex Jones.

The_B_Man wrote: »

But if it can be shown that people believe the earth is flat coz of the bible or whatever, then thats another thing...

Go actually read up on what people believe. It's either bible literalism, or just ill-educated folks who "don't accept what's told them in the news".
The ones who promote it do so for religious reasons.

How do you think that the government created this idea?
Do you believe that no one genuinely believes in this stuff?
What separates this ridiculous idea from other ridiculous ideas promoted by conspiracy theorists, like the notion that the twin towers were destroyed by space lasers?

The_B_Man · 03-01-2018 6:41pm

What separates it is the media attention its received. Thats the first mention of the space lasers that I've heard.
If it became more "popular" then more people might buy into it, similar to flat earth. There are a lot of cabbages out there looking for a bandwagon to jump on! I suppose it gives power to whoever drives the bandwagon as they can control where the bandwagon is going.

Also, I don't believe the government created it. TBH I don't believe anything, nor do I understand it, which is the problem. If I was pushed to come up with a way the government created it, I'd say that maybe they didn't, as this theory was always around. I heard it years ago. But maybe the government, or whoever, used twitter/social media to make it go viral and become popular, with the intention of snagging a few people. To what end, who knows. Once again, if pushed I'd say something like to distract the masses from using the power of the internet to uncover some hidden truths, or blow open some real conspiracies. Or maybe its to test the power of suggestion on a mass scale. Or to test just how stupid people really are!

I dunno. I'm not standing behind this. I'm just talking (typing?) out loud. Like I said, the flat earth yoke is utter cabbagery and I'm just trying to make sense of it all. My mind is well and truly boggled. The conclusion is its somewhere between religion, and being an idiot!

King Mob · 03-01-2018 7:02pm

The_B_Man wrote: »

What separates it is the media attention its received.

It's not that surprising. It's just that 1) it's a more common belief than people realise and 2) it's obviously nonsense, so it's eye catching when someone announces on twitter they think the Earth is flat.

It's just recently more people are vocal about their absurd beliefs.

The_B_Man wrote: »

Thats the first mention of the space lasers that I've heard.

It's just one example of a belief about 9/11 that some conspiracy theorists take very seriously even though it's obviously nonsense.
There's plenty of others I can point to, like the Pizzagate stuff or crisis actors.
Point is, conspiracy theorists are more than able to make up silly stuff without government intervention.

The_B_Man wrote: »

I dunno. I'm not standing behind this. I'm just talking (typing?) out loud. Like I said, the flat earth yoke is utter cabbagery and I'm just trying to make sense of it all. My mind is well and truly boggled. The conclusion is its somewhere between religion, and being an idiot!

And this is kinda the origin of some of those silly conspiracy theories.
"I don't understand something, so maybe the government is secretly doing it for some reason..."

rightyabe · 04-01-2018 9:56am

Surely the “globe” earth is the conspiracy..?

Hector Bellend · 05-01-2018 10:56am

They've murdered 9\11 conspiracy proponents for the very belief that 9\11 was a conspiracy.

Why would they resort to such a mundane tactic as inventing stupid conspiracies?

I know which of the above two tactics I'd choose if I didnt want questions asked

marklazarcovic · 05-01-2018 11:03am

I know a couple of flat earthers, nothing to do with religion at all for them,it's never mentioned.

Not that I get into it with them.

Robert Power · 14-01-2018 12:12pm

If FE was an outright rejection of science, as much is it pure nonsense, I could somewhat understand it. But it's not, it's a devout religious belief

Dr Brown · 18-02-2018 3:59am

Interesting videos on the flat earth concept.

King Mob · 18-02-2018 4:12am

Dr Brown wrote: »

Interesting videos on the flat earth concept.

What's interesting about them that leads you to think that the idea the earth is flat is in anyway convincing, plausible or not ludicrously silly?

Dr Brown · 18-02-2018 4:20am

King Mob wrote: »

What's interesting about them that leads you to think that the idea the earth is flat is in anyway convincing, plausible or not ludicrously silly?

Not saying I believe it.

But alot of stuff that comes from nasa is fake that only adds fuel to the fire in regard to the "flat earth" concept.

King Mob · 18-02-2018 4:28am

Dr Brown wrote: »

Not saying I believe it.

But alot of stuff that comes from nasa is fake that only adds fuel to the fire in regard to the "flat earth" concept.

What stuff that comes from NASA is fake and how do you know it's fake?
How does it add fuel to the fire of something that is inherently silly, ridiculous and impossible?

You say you don't believe the Earth is flat, but you seem to entertaining it as a possibility?
What exactly did you find interesting about those videos if you don't believe in the notion of a flat earth?

NIMAN · 18-02-2018 5:38am

King Mob wrote: »

What stuff that comes from NASA is fake and how do you know it's fake?
How does it add fuel to the fire of something that is inherently silly, ridiculous and impossible?

You say you don't believe the Earth is flat, but you seem to entertaining it as a possibility?
What exactly did you find interesting about those videos if you don't believe in the notion of a flat earth?

Cos someone on Facebook said so.

The internet and the likes of Facebook has given a voice to people who shouldn't be allowed to express any point of view due to their stupidity.

It would be funny if it wasn't so serious, now with the anti-Vaxxers who are going out of their way to cause actual harm to humans, often their own children.

Dr Brown · 14-03-2018 5:09pm

King Mob wrote: »

What stuff that comes from NASA is fake and how do you know it's fake?

Just look at pictures of the earth were the continents are different sizes.

Obviously some of the pictures are fake.

King Mob · 14-03-2018 5:11pm

Dr Brown wrote: »

Just look at pictures of the earth were the continents are different sizes.

Obviously some of the pictures are fake.

Pictures such as...?
How are they obviously fake and for what reason would they be faked?

Dr Brown · 14-03-2018 5:31pm

King Mob wrote: »

Pictures such as...?
How are they obviously fake and for what reason would they be faked?

url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwiP1ZSBnuzZAhWrA8AKHfVVAKcQjRwIBg&url=https%3A%2F%2Fme.me%2Fi%2Fnotice-the-differences-nasas-official-nasas-official-earth-image-earth-12966293&psig=AOvVaw3SIkZ340VquGD0N9hPn3-C&ust=1521131346344324

Ipso · 14-03-2018 5:36pm

https://www.quora.com/Why-do-the-official-NASA-pictures-of-Earth-change-drastically-year-to-year

beefburrito · 14-03-2018 5:37pm

I've seen similar picture's, there's something seriously wrong somewhere...

Reminds me of the alien cook book episode in the Simpson's....

King Mob · 14-03-2018 5:42pm

Dr Brown wrote: »

So first, maybe not a good idea to use a site that has fun gems like holocaust denial and creationism.

Second, what are those pictures from? How did Nasa put them together and in what way specifically have they been faked?

Third, in the bizarre world where the conspiracy is true, why would Nasa make a silly mistake like make the size different?

And fourth, why would they fake it?

Don't just regurgitate crap you've seen on racist, holocaust denying websites.
Actually answer my questions and engage.

storker · 14-03-2018 5:44pm

I wouldn't be suprised at all if the whole online FE movement was started by someone as a practical joke and they're getting a great laugh out of letting it run on and on.

Dr Brown · 14-03-2018 5:59pm

King Mob wrote: »

So first, maybe not a good idea to use a site that has fun gems like holocaust denial and creationism.

Second, what are those pictures from? How did Nasa put them together and in what way specifically have they been faked?

Third, in the bizarre world where the conspiracy is true, why would Nasa make a silly mistake like make the size different?

And fourth, why would they fake it?

Don't just regurgitate crap you've seen on racist, holocaust denying websites.
Actually answer my questions and engage.

I've no idea why they would fake it.

But do you not find it weird that the continents are different sizes in the 2 images ?

King Mob · 14-03-2018 6:14pm

Dr Brown wrote: »

I've no idea why they would fake it.

But do you not find it weird that the continents are different sizes in the 2 images ?

Now first notice how you've answered zero of my questions. Why is that?

Second, no I don't find it weird at all.
There are a ton of reasons why the sizes would appear to be different. The link Ipso gave gives a comprehensive break down of this.
Additionally, for all we know, a website like Whale.to which promotes dishonest racist **** like Holocaust denial, wouldn't be above editing or manipulating the images.

And then on top of that, I have no reason to think that the images are fake as you have not shown any reason for why you think they are fake (other than a racist dishonest website told you they are different) and you cannot provide a rational explanation for why they would be faked.

So is this the best example you've got to show that the notion of a Flat Earth is in anyway worth considering.
If so, I might have a bridge to sell you...

Dr. Bre · 19-03-2018 12:50am

Why pretend the world is round? What’s to gain? I can understand moon landings being faked etc..

Hector Bellend · 13-04-2018 4:58pm

Let us assume for the sake of argument that the flat earthers are on to something here (I'm not for a second suggesting that they are but anyway)

What purpose does it serve to lie about the shape of the earth? If you think of 9\11 as an obvious example, it's easy to see why you'd want to deny involvement in that plot. Why on earth (pardon the pun) would you want to lie about the shape of our planet. I don't get it.

Hector Bellend · 13-04-2018 4:59pm

Dr. Bre wrote: »

Why pretend the world is round? What’s to gain? I can understand moon landings being faked etc..

I've just had the same thought myself. It makes no sense.

briany · 15-04-2018 7:24pm

Let's say you were arguing with a proper hardcore not-joking Flat Earth conspiracy theorist for a second, and they asked you to give them a piece of evidence that would debunk their theory. It can't be anything on a computer like a photograph or 3d model which they would of course immediately declare was faked. It has to be some physical piece of evidence that you could easily show them in person. What would it be?

For myself, I don't know what that would be. I could stammer something about the experiments of Eratosthenes, but certainly not recreate it. Even then, it would take too long to complete. Could point to the horizon and say something about that being proof but not knowing what the horizon, or lack thereof, would look like if the Earth was flat, I can't really make a comparison. I think most Flat Earthers have factored the existence of a horizon into their theory anyway and have an explanation, so that's not really a goer.

King Mob · 15-04-2018 11:13pm

briany wrote: »

Let's say you were arguing with a proper hardcore not-joking Flat Earth conspiracy theorist for a second, and they asked you to give them a piece of evidence that would debunk their theory. It can't be anything on a computer like a photograph or 3d model which they would of course immediately declare was faked. It has to be some physical piece of evidence that you could easily show them in person. What would it be?

For myself, I don't know what that would be. I could stammer something about the experiments of Eratosthenes, but certainly not recreate it. Even then, it would take too long to complete. Could point to the horizon and say something about that being proof but not knowing what the horizon, or lack thereof, would look like if the Earth was flat, I can't really make a comparison. I think most Flat Earthers have factored the existence of a horizon into their theory anyway and have an explanation, so that's not really a goer.

The fact that tall ships appear to sink over the horizon is possibly one example of something that can be directly observed and I haven't seen an excuse for it from a flat earther.

Why the stars appear to move as they do and how only some stars and constellations are only visible from the southern hemisphere is another that fairly easy to confirm with a bit of travel, or talking to someone from Australia.

Other than that, it's kind of hard to point to anything that you could show a person in a pub over a pint. I think that's part of the reason so many people are being convinced of this stuff.
You could point to the sheer silliness of the idea or the impossibility of the conspiracy or you could really dig into one of their "explanations" and point out the obvious flaws with them.
Or you can just laugh at the complete nonsense of it all.

raxy · 15-04-2018 11:39pm

It's well known that the world is actually disc shaped & propelled through space balanced on the backs of 4 elephants who in turn are on the back of a giant turtle named A'tuin.
Of course nobody knows what sex the turtle is.

ShowMeTheCash · 16-04-2018 12:22am

Dr Brown wrote: »

I've no idea why they would fake it.

But do you not find it weird that the continents are different sizes in the 2 images ?

The point you are missing.
These sites that claim you cannot trust nasa photos expect you to trust the photos they provide.

They also completely miss represent information.

I have went down a few rabit holes with this stuff, when you look at many of the images NASA has printed they clearly state the images are composites.

Composite meaning the images are not one image but many images taken and different times to give a better image resolution.

NASA do not hide this, but flat earthers hide the fact that NASA clearly state this on the images.

househero · 16-04-2018 12:32am

King Mob wrote: »

the reason so many people are being convinced of this stuff.

Idiots believe anything you tell them. Then they tell their idiot friends. In the end you end up with George Bush invading the moon cz 'of oil'.

briany · 16-04-2018 1:24am

househero wrote: »

Idiots believe anything you tell them. Then they tell their idiot friends. In the end you end up with George Bush invading the moon cz 'of oil'.

I'd say it's a little more complicated than that. If Flat Earthers are the kind who believe anything you tell them then they would have accepted the conventional view that the world is round even more readily than everyone else. After all, it's this conventional view that's pushed by most, if not all, forms of publicly funded education in the Western world, if not worldwide, as well as in almost every movie, book and TV show, so that's plenty of scope to condition the easily lead, outside of all the actual evidence for the more curious.

endacl · 16-04-2018 1:29am

The_B_Man wrote: »

Is it possible that the "government" invented the flat earth theory to both discredit conspiracy theorists (make them look like absolute loonies who shouldn't be listened to)

Would be a redundant and unnecessary move. It's not as as if they'd look like non-absolute loonies if there wasn't a flat earth 'theory'.

Sin City · 16-04-2018 11:45am

So its a flat earth
with ice walls around the edges to keep the water in with snipers on top of them
To stop people from finding out that its flat

Meanwhile the solar system satelites are all round ie sun moon and planets
Its just the earth thats flat

and Austrilia doesnt exist
Its just full of actors in South America pretending to be Aussies

Yup

Sounds legit to me

briany · 16-04-2018 5:02pm

I wonder if the Flat Earth people and the Hollow Earth people are sworn enemies?

Ipso · 17-04-2018 9:33pm

So how does day time/night time work and seasons work for these attention seekers people?
Does the sun just go behind a cuboid?

Cheerful Spring · 17-04-2018 10:52pm

briany wrote: »

I wonder if the Flat Earth people and the Hollow Earth people are sworn enemies?

When they look at the Moon shape in the night sky do they see a flat Earth instead?

Dr. Bre · 18-04-2018 8:34pm

Even David Icke doesn’t talk bout flat earth and he’s king of conspiracy

Obrienc · 24-04-2018 2:42pm

The_B_Man wrote: »

Can you even have a conspiracy theory about a conspiracy theory?? :P

I would say yes...

I listen to Richard Dolan on kgra.... He's a level headed investigator into UFOs and his opinion is that the group disclosing the tic tac UFO was like this... An attempt to steer people's attention in certain directions... That was obviously NSA led.

If it distracts then it works.

Getting investigators to investigate nonsense and to argue amongst themselves is one of the greatest ways to control the conversation

Dr Brown · 27-04-2018 5:06pm

Dr. Bre wrote: »

Even David Icke doesn’t talk bout flat earth and he’s king of conspiracy

In one of Ickes videos he said it didn't matter what shape the earth is because its a hologram.

Dr Brown · 29-04-2018 6:14pm

The whole flat earth "debate" could be put to bed if Antarctica was fully opened up to the public.

Antarctica is almost like area 51 in terms of secrecy.

King Mob · 30-04-2018 1:57am

Dr Brown wrote: »

The whole flat earth "debate" could be put to bed if Antarctica was fully opened up to the public.

Antarctica is almost like area 51 in terms of secrecy.

But it's not though.
https://oceanwide-expeditions.com/antarctica/cruises?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIi4ne4uTg2gIVQnZgCh0qyQJwEAAYASAAEgJKgvD_BwE

Barring that, why can't they just pony up for their own expedition?

Why would this convince Flat Earthers when every single other piece of logic and evidence hasn't convinced them?

mcmoustache · 30-04-2018 12:01pm

Out of curiosity, what's the Flat-Earth explanation for the live feed from the ISS that we can see on youtube?

I mean, there's a camera stuck to a craft that was shot up in the air and is now orbiting the earth and this camera is broadcasting live. As a civilisation, we can literally get off the earth and look at the damned thing. Is it all faked or something?

mcmoustache · 30-04-2018 12:04pm

Dr Brown wrote: »

The whole flat earth "debate" could be put to bed if Antarctica was fully opened up to the public.

Antarctica is almost like area 51 in terms of secrecy.

You can buy a boat in Argentina and just go there. You might be told to féck off when you get to port but you'll at least see that there is actually something there.

That still wouldn't be enough to put the flat earth thing to bed, however. The hoaxers behind it would just say that the landmass is an illusion and the marks would lap it up.

Dr Brown · 30-04-2018 2:33pm

King Mob wrote: »

But it's not though.
https://oceanwide-expeditions.com/antarctica/cruises?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIi4ne4uTg2gIVQnZgCh0qyQJwEAAYASAAEgJKgvD_BwE

Barring that, why can't they just pony up for their own expedition?

Why would this convince Flat Earthers when every single other piece of logic and evidence hasn't convinced them?

Most of the Antarctic has restricted access due to the Antarctic Treaty.

They make it very hard for ordinary civilians to fully expore the continent.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antarctic_Treaty_System

King Mob · 30-04-2018 2:37pm

Dr Brown wrote: »

Most of the Antarctic has restricted access due to the Antarctic Treaty.

They make it very hard for ordinary civilians to fully expore the continent.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antarctic_Treaty_System

But you can go there and see there's no giant wall of ice. There's nothing stopping people from exploring, but this requires investment, skill and courage.

There's thousands of reports from thousands of people who have gone there who are not affiliated with the governments.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fch483sIoMA&list=PLcUY9vudNKBNwwi2jq-9q1BCZ9RigQRdG

Also. The world isn't flat, so...

fxotoole · 30-04-2018 3:22pm

Dr. Bre wrote: »

Even David Icke doesn’t talk bout flat earth and he’s king of conspiracy

Yeah but what does Jim Corr think of it all?

The_B_Man · 01-05-2018 2:11pm

With commercial space tourism about 5 years away, this conspiracy theory will sort itself out very soon.

No point even giving it the time of day. Just wait 5 years or so and go from there.

mcmoustache · 01-05-2018 4:41pm

The_B_Man wrote: »

With commercial space tourism about 5 years away, this conspiracy theory will sort itself out very soon.

No point even giving it the time of day. Just wait 5 years or so and go from there.

I actually think that this is one of the more interesting hoaxes out there.

With something like the 911 attacks or the moon landing stuff, you can kind of see how someone could fall for them - the claims made appear to be scientific on their faces even if what underpins them isn't. There's at least an attempt at rationality.

What makes the flat earth stuff so fascinating, forgetting for a moment that it's up there with the drop-bears, Finland's non-existence and Bielfield's non-existence in terms of internet hoaxes, is the volume of evidence and the ease with which a layman can check whether or not the earth is flat or spherical.

We have multiple pictures of the earth from space. We have real time video from satellites. We had Elon Musk's car broadcasting the orbit a few months ago. Even if we exclude the photo and video evidence, the curvature of the earth can be observed with simple experimentation and trigonometry as has already been covered here. Even amateurs can tie a camera to a balloon and send it up.

The flat earth people have zero evidence that would suggest that a flat earth. Sure, they have alternative explanations for phenomena that require a spherical earth and can make stuff up about Antarctica not existing but there's no experiment that they can point to and no phenomenon that can only be explained by a flat earth. They have absolutely nothing other than an inability do discern reality from their computers. That takes a special kind of gullibility which unfortunately seems to be on the rise.

Conspiracy about the flat earth conspiracy - Thread bans in OP

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