Has rugby become the "people's game"?

swiwi_ · 07-03-2018 08:57AM

I'll believe it when I see obituaries mentioning "he was a highly respected member of his local GAA rugby club"

Don't think it's the people's game yet by any stretch of the imagination. But there's no doubt its popularity is on the rise.

Buer · 07-03-2018 10:11AM

Sanjuro wrote: »

Bollocks. I remember my auld fella driving us back from watching Ireland beat Romania in World Cup 90 and having to drive incredibly slowly due to the people in the streets. And I'm not talking about Dublin city centre. This was along the N11, a dual carriageway. I cant see rugby getting as big as the fever running through the country at that time.

Whilst I agree completely with the extent of those celebrations, I would also say that we will never see those scenes again regardless of the success levels of the national rugby or football team.

As a population, we have changed completely. We are far more of a cosmopolitan society, aware of our social profile and far more commercial. If Ireland won a dramatic penalty shoot out in the World Cup this summer, the scenes out on the streets wouldn't come close to matching what we had in 1990 or even 1994.

There was a level of madness in Ireland that we embraced and an attititude of not giving a flying f*ck what people thought. Think of the scenes at Gordon Hamilton's try in 1991 or Ray Houghton's winner in 1988/1994. The scenes and excitement at Robbie Brady's winner in 2016 against Italy didn't come close to matching those moments in terms of the unadultuated release of joy.

jr86 · 07-03-2018 10:16AM

There was pretty much street parties in Galway when we LOST to France at Euro 2016 and Croatia at Euro 2012.

Imagine winning a football World Cup knock-out game nowadays. Would definitely be Italia 90-esque

osarusan · 07-03-2018 10:20AM

Not a rugby fan myself, and I grew up in a part of the country that wouldn't have had the slightest interest in rugby - we didn't watch it on TV or play it in schools (either as part of a team or by ourselves). It was hurling and football only.

These days, I can see from some of the people I went to school with that support for the rugby is much more widespread. I think the successes of the national and provincial sides have made it easy (trendy?) to become a supporter. Those successes have really been capitalised on - people I know for 30 years who wouldn't ever have been interested in it, are very enthusiastic followers of the national and provincial side (Munster in our case).

But I don't think that newfound support has really trickled down to lower levels of rugby, and I don't think that it has caused a huge jump in playing numbers either (correct me if I'm wrong).

The term itself, "The people's game" is fairly vague, but if it means the sport that most people play, most people go to see, and most people watch on TV, then I think rugby is still behind football, and even farther behind GAA.

prawnsambo · 07-03-2018 10:20AM

jr86 wrote: »

There was pretty much street parties in Galway when we LOST to France at Euro 2016 and Croatia at Euro 2012.

Imagine winning a football World Cup knock-out game nowadays. Would definitely be Italia 90-esque

Isn't that just basically the default state of Galway?

jr86 · 07-03-2018 10:21AM

prawnsambo wrote: »

Isn't that just basically the default state of Galway?

Any excuse!

jr86 · 07-03-2018 10:24AM

osarusan wrote: »

I think the successes of the national and provincial sides have made it easy (trendy?) to become a supporter.

This, although in fairness I do think in a lot of cases this applies to following GAA County Teams in Croke Park also.

Bar maybe the likes of Kerry and Kilkenny who are generally always successful

I don't get this feeling with Soccer. Generalisisng here and basing it on anecdotal evidence but I'd imagine out of attendees of home Irish football matches there's a much higher ratio of 'die-hards' to bandwagon/fashion statement fans. (of course this doesn't apply to lots of travelling fans at major tournaments)

_Puma_ · 07-03-2018 10:36AM

What are we defining here. Does people sitting in a pub drinking lager watching a game on TV make a sport "the peoples game"? Think about that for a second!

If we are talking about attendances, participation, Community involvement etc... then it goes Football -> Hurling -> Soccer -> Rugby

The club rugby scenes has certainly made some inroads in the past 10 years, especially with a lot of the clubs setting up links with Tag Rugby to get people involved in clubs outside the leagues. The Provincial sides have also seen a massive increase but to get a sense of comparison what would home attendance of the combined provinces be on average compared to say a full round of the National Football League or League of Ireland.

Buer · 07-03-2018 10:51AM

jr86 wrote: »

There was pretty much street parties in Galway when we LOST to France at Euro 2016 and Croatia at Euro 2012.

Imagine winning a football World Cup knock-out game nowadays. Would definitely be Italia 90-esque

I was in Dublin city centre and there was a great buzz and feel good vibe around the place but nothing like the scenes that we've had in previous decades.

In 1990, the nation came to a stand still.

jr86 · 07-03-2018 10:58AM

Buer wrote: »

I was in Dublin city centre and there was a great buzz and feel good vibe around the place but nothing like the scenes that we've had in previous decades.

In 1990, the nation came to a stand still.

Well yes because we lost a few Euros matches

Beat Romania in a World Cup penalty shoot-out in 2018 and I'd imagine we'd have scenes on a very similar level. The whole country would completely shut down if we made a quarter.

Unless we won a RWC the scenes wouldn't come close with Rugby. Even if we did win a RWC it wouldn't be on the same scale

Zzippy · 07-03-2018 11:03AM

Are we really haveing a whole thread to discuss something stupid Daire O'Brien said? The guy's not exactly renowned for saying anything intelligent...

or honouring his bets

aloooof · 07-03-2018 11:04AM

Zzippy wrote: »

Are we really haveing a whole thread to discuss something stupid Daire O'Brien said? The guy's not exactly renowned for saying anything intelligent...

or honouring his bets

Woah, go easy!

prawnsambo · 07-03-2018 11:08AM

Zzippy wrote: »

Are we really haveing a whole thread to discuss something stupid Daire O'Brien said? The guy's not exactly renowned for saying anything intelligent...

or honouring his bets

Especially since I don't think a single person has agreed with him on this thread. TV clickbait. :rolleyes:

Buer · 07-03-2018 11:17AM

jr86 wrote: »

Well yes because we lost a few Euros matches

Beat Romania in a World Cup penalty shoot-out in 2018 and I'd imagine we'd have scenes on a very similar level. The whole country would completely shut down if we made a quarter.

We'll have to agree to disagree. 1990 was not like anything we've seen since. The whole Jackie's Army thing is unique. It was innocent joy in a country that had never experienced such a sporting event before. The Irish in London taking over Trafalgar Square, O'Connell Street shutting down, people taking loans to get out to Palermo and Cagliari, fans sleeping on the streets to stay for the extra few days and make it to Genoa etc.

prawnsambo · 07-03-2018 11:20AM

Buer wrote: »

We'll have to agree to disagree. 1990 was not like anything we've seen since. The whole Jackie's Army thing is unique. It was innocent joy in a country that had never experienced such a sporting event before. The Irish in London taking over Trafalgar Square, O'Connell Street shutting down, people taking loans to get out to Palermo and Cagliari, fans sleeping on the streets to stay for the extra few days and make it to Genoa etc.

Ah yeah. Businesses closed early so that people could go to pubs or home (unlikely

) to watch the matches. It was pure nuts.

thebaz · 07-03-2018 11:24AM

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

But for all the golden generation by and large huge proportion were still from the same background as those before but they just were successful. People do like winners but when it can be more difficult to feel a connection to players then continuing support in game is difficult.

Well I certainly have no connection to the CL Galacticos - the Neymar deal pushed me and many away from the Champion league superstars - how can any average person relate to players earning close to 1 Million a week - I do enjoy League of Ireland football, more these days. And enjoy the rugby , the Irish national team under MON is just blah, they do try , but the football is ...

Buer · 07-03-2018 11:29AM

jr86 wrote: »

Well yes because we lost a few Euros matches

Just on this, in 1990 we played some of the worst football in the tournament. We didn't win a single match. We scored two goals in 4 matches. The standard of results/football was not linked to the madness.

jr86 · 07-03-2018 11:32AM

Buer wrote: »

It was innocent joy in a country that had never experienced such a sporting event before.

That's a very valid point actually, in that it was a real novelty factor back then. In a way I felt Euro 2016 wasn't as well supported as 2012 - 'familiarity' can breed contempt and all that

I guess with the expansion of the Euros and future expansion of the World Cup, qualifying won't mean near as much in future

The Lost Sheep · 07-03-2018 11:32AM

bigpink wrote: »

It’s still a majority upper middle class and you know it is.Rugby isn’t strong in working class schools and even thworking class areas of Limerick outside of juniors
CBS and st nessans how they doing at schools rugby?

the kids play clubs Rugby as Any kids from thomondgate/moyross will go to are scoil or wherever if really into their rugby. Rugby isn't all upper middle class in limerick. Like I'd love you to walk into munsters, thomond, st Mary's or Shannon, bohs and tell some of their memmbers they're upper middlle class. Thus get some laugh out of it

Zzippy · 07-03-2018 11:43AM

Buer wrote: »

Just on this, in 1990 we played some of the worst football in the tournament. We didn't win a single match. We scored two goals in 4 matches. The standard of results/football was not linked to the madness.

5 games actually

07-03-2018 11:44AM

Haven't read back but I think GAA sports would be considered the people's game domestically but from an international point of view it's definitely rugby.

I don't rate Soccer on a par domestically or Internationally with either currently, though Historically the fever pitch around the Charlton era will be hard to match.

I think football in the 80's and 90's was unique in terms of success but also the timing. Ireland was rapidly developing and modernising / liberalising during this time period and coming much more out of the shadow of our past. We were after joining the European Union and it was having a significant impact on the quality of life in the country.

As someone else said, it was a feel good time. The early shoots of the Celtic era. It was a breakout time for Irish identity and nationalism and it was something completely new. There was no internet, most people had a handful of TV channels and life had fewer distractions. It was the biggest news of the day.

I don't think it makes Soccer the peoples game, I think it certainly was en par with GAA at the time but GAA and subsequently Rugby have moved on whereas Soccer has stagnated and become out of touch with the public. The fact that the domestic league in Soccer is completely out of the consciousness of most people and we are completely noncompetitive at club and national team level internationally doesn't help this at all.

pickarooney · 07-03-2018 11:45AM

Can someone fix the title ? It hurts mine eyes!

Zzippy · 07-03-2018 11:47AM

pickarooney wrote: »

Can someone fix the title ? It hurts mine eyes!

Better now?

young munsters man · 07-03-2018 02:44PM

quote from bigpink " It’s still a majority upper middle class and you know it is.Rugby isn’t strong in working class schools and even thworking class areas of Limerick outside of juniors
CBS and st nessans how they doing at schools rugby?""

The 3 of the main rugby schools in limerick crescent ard scoil and munchins all take their kids mainly from locality and aint fee paying
Ard scoil in fact are harty champions have won it good few times and bulk of na piarsaigh team and lot of limirck hurlers went there

Quote from "lost sheep"

"Rugby isn't all upper middle class in limerick. Like I'd love you to walk into munsters, thomond, st Mary's or Shannon, bohs and tell some of their members they're upper middlle class. Thus get some laugh out of it""

well i got some laugh out of it , come to a club game in limerick bigpink -think youll find its very much working class, weve probably made a virtue of it

that said - throughout the county hurling by far the dominant sport (im a hurling fanatic too), soccer in the city, but masive massive iterest in rugby
between rugby soccer and gaa theres a huge crossover of players/fans/coaches between the sports as well

Yeah_Right · 07-03-2018 05:31PM

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

I think not, and bloody well hope not.

The 'people' have their round ball games. It suits them fine - one, the dullest game immaginable with scores as rare as hen's teeth played by actor-divers, the other, one that in a hundred years hasnt solved its problem of having no real rules and become a jersey pulling, who's the hardest man shoulder bumping contest with not a fraction of skill being required to succeed at it. Both suit the type of people who play it - inner city bowsies supporting and wearing English club shirts despite generally hating everything English, and, country bumpkins for whom it is an extension of 'bragging rights' contesting when not at 3am outside the local town dive 'disco', when it is decided by fists, much as in the game, only its the Gardai rather than a ref looking on helplessly.

But rugby. Well. A genteman's game. Such variety of skills, tactics, teamwork, physiques, providing an endlessly enthralling contest, in a game where the rules work, moments of thrilling skill, speed, and quick thinking to take the breath away, and the best team generally wins. And played the by right sort of chaps of course.

We like it just as it is thank you very much. Hopefully it never becomes 'the peoples game'.

Absolutely 100% agree TRoL. We don't want to be the "people's game"! That would be awful. Imagine letting just anyone get involved with rugby :eek:
Keep Rugby Elite!!!!!

Question for you Paddies; a couple of posters mentioned the switch to TV3 for the 6 Nations will reduce viewing numbers. Is that true? Are there people in Ireland that can't/won't watch anything other than RTE?

swiwi_ · 07-03-2018 05:37PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Haven't read back but I think GAA sports would be considered the people's game domestically but from an international point of view it's definitely rugby.

I don't rate Soccer on a par domestically or Internationally with either currently, though Historically the fever pitch around the Charlton era will be hard to match.

I think football in the 80's and 90's was unique in terms of success but also the timing. Ireland was rapidly developing and modernising / liberalising during this time period and coming much more out of the shadow of our past. We were after joining the European Union and it was having a significant impact on the quality of life in the country.

As someone else said, it was a feel good time. The early shoots of the Celtic era. It was a breakout time for Irish identity and nationalism and it was something completely new. There was no internet, most people had a handful of TV channels and life had fewer distractions. It was the biggest news of the day.

I don't think it makes Soccer the peoples game, I think it certainly was en par with GAA at the time but GAA and subsequently Rugby have moved on whereas Soccer has stagnated and become out of touch with the public. The fact that the domestic league in Soccer is completely out of the consciousness of most people and we are completely noncompetitive at club and national team level internationally doesn't help this at all.

« After doing » something. One of those endearing Irish expressions...

irishbucsfan · 07-03-2018 05:40PM

Kiwis out

prawnsambo · 07-03-2018 05:42PM

Yeah_Right wrote: »

Question for you Paddies; a couple of posters mentioned the switch to TV3 for the 6 Nations will reduce viewing numbers. Is that true? Are there people in Ireland that can't/won't watch anything other than RTE?

We can also watch the BBC or ITV. So it's not a straight choice.

Yeah_Right · 07-03-2018 06:05PM

prawnsambo wrote: »

We can also watch the BBC or ITV. So it's not a straight choice.

That would have been the same when RTE had the rights though wouldn't it?

The Lost Sheep · 07-03-2018 06:06PM

Yeah_Right wrote: »

That would have been the same when RTE had the rights though wouldn't it?

only BBC. Rights now shared over in uk

Has rugby become the "people's game"?

Comments