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Is Hell Real ?

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    #92
    ouxbbkqtswdfaw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭ouxbbkqtswdfaw


    dr.fuzzenstein wrote:
    My theory is, the idea of hell stems from our human idea of justice. We threaten people with hell to prevent them doing misdeeds or to steer their behavior to suit the prevalent social and religious climate. It is also a wish for justice, because when someone commits a misdeed we don't like it to go unpunished, so we might feel a bit better when we think that person went to hell. Once again, it is a question of faith and belief, but how do we know only Christianity holds The One Truth? I like the idea of Shinto. There is no such thing as hell.


    Jesus said "I, am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me".


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    #93
    nozzferrahhtoo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,338 ✭✭✭nozzferrahhtoo


    qwadb78ejp260i wrote: »
    Yes, hell is real, and a distinct possibility for a great number of people, unless they repent sincerely. Your soul is eternal. An unrepentant sinner cannot enter into the joys of Heaven. An unrepentant sinner goes to hell, for all eternity.

    I assume the evidence for your series of assertions here is.... what.... forthcoming?
    qwadb78ejp260i wrote: »
    Jesus said "I, am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me".

    And in Monthy Python a guy said "I am a lumberjack and its ok" and..... wait for it..... he was not ACTUALLY a lumberjack.

    This may come as a shock to you, so I will try to break it easily........ but not everyone is who they say they are, or claim to be.


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    #94
    ouxbbkqtswdfaw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭ouxbbkqtswdfaw


    nozzferrahhtoo wrote:
    I assume the evidence for your series of assertions here is.... what.... forthcoming?


    You are driving me mad. I tell you this, hell is real, and you wouldn't want to end up there. Over the gates of hell these words are proclaimed : "Abandon hope all ye who enter here".


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    #95
    GritBiscuit
    Registered Users Posts: 440 ✭✭GritBiscuit


    qwadb78ejp260i wrote: »
    You are driving me mad. I tell you this, hell is real, and you wouldn't want to end up there. Over the gates of hell these words are proclaimed : "Abandon hope all ye who enter here".

    Same words are over my kitchen door...and I'd be the first to say you are better off taking your chances in the afterlife than with my apple strudel...:(


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    #96
    ouxbbkqtswdfaw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭ouxbbkqtswdfaw


    GritBiscuit wrote:
    Same words are over my kitchen door...and I'd be the first to say you are better off taking your chances in the afterlife than with my apple strudel...


    That's good!


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    #97
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users Posts: 34,238 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    qwadb78ejp260i wrote: »
    Yes, hell is real, and a distinct possibility for a great number of people, unless they repent sincerely. Your soul is eternal. An unrepentant sinner cannot enter into the joys of Heaven. An unrepentant sinner goes to hell, for all eternity.

    Naah.

    Fingal County Council are certainly not competent to be making decisions about the most important piece of infrastructure on the island. They need to stick to badly designed cycle lanes and deciding on whether Mrs Murphy can have her kitchen extension.



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    #98
    antiskeptic
    Registered Users Posts: 9,555 ✭✭✭antiskeptic


    qwadb78ejp260i wrote: »
    Over the gates of hell these words are proclaimed : "Abandon hope all ye who enter here".

    And from the perspective of the people you're trying to convince, over the gates of the Catholic church are the words "Arbeit macht frei"

    You are promoting a God who effectively says "behave yourselves, follow my rules. If you don't, then I'll torture you forever"

    Can you see why people would have a problem with that? They consider themselves free agents and a dictator rolls into town. Even if the cost is eternal punishment, they still won't bow to a dictator.

    Jesus said a lot of things. And a lot of the things he said paint a picture of God which is anything other than dictator.

    Perhaps you could bring the fuller picture to bear?


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    #99
    ouxbbkqtswdfaw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭ouxbbkqtswdfaw


    Mark Hamill wrote:
    So, in order to avoid the problem of a nonsensical eternal punishment that exists in standard christian interpretations, you have created a hell that is, to put it simply, existence without god or his aspects? And that the people there knowingly choose that? If they choose that, then how is hell a bad thing? Everyone seemingly wants to be there. They aren't hurting anyone in heaven. The people in heaven want to be there and they don't effect anyone in hell. Everyone gets what they want, apparently.

    Nonsensical eternal punishment! Dream on, friend.


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    #100
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,652 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    So Hell is the "bold step" where you go for doing wrong and you can't get off it.
    And people believe that "an ever-loving God" actually wants to or enjoys punishing mere mortals?? I can't believe that at all.


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    #101
    ouxbbkqtswdfaw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭ouxbbkqtswdfaw


    tayto lover wrote:
    So Hell is the "bold step" where you go for doing wrong and you can't get off it. And people believe that "an ever-loving God" actually wants to or enjoys punishing mere mortals?? I can't believe that at all.


    Read my previous post. To clarify, the people who end up in hell hate God, and they will never repent. They are Lucifer and his fallen angels, who try to disrupt the coming of the eternal kingdom of love and peace. They deserve no rest, and they will get no rest, forever.


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    #102
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,652 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    qwadb78ejp260i wrote: »
    Read my previous post. To clarify, the people who end up in hell hate God, and they will never repent. They are Lucifer and his fallen angels, who try to disrupt the coming of the eternal kingdom of love and peace. They deserve no rest, and they will get no rest, forever.
    Do you actually believe all this stuff?
    Why would anyone hate God or anyone else for that fact forever?


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    #103
    dr.fuzzenstein
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,635 ✭✭✭✭dr.fuzzenstein


    qwadb78ejp260i wrote: »
    Read my previous post. To clarify, the people who end up in hell hate God, and they will never repent. They are Lucifer and his fallen angels, who try to disrupt the coming of the eternal kingdom of love and peace. They deserve no rest, and they will get no rest, forever.

    I don't hate God, because there is no point hating an idea, or fictional concept. I might as well hate the Easter Bunny or the Tooth Fairy.
    The problem lies with people who say "do as I say or you'll go to hell forever".
    With all respect, but "because I say so" doesn't cut it. Of course you could say "God says so", but we're at square one with that one.
    Taking this one step further, imagine if there are thousands of inhabited planets in this galaxy alone with thousands upon thousands of belief systems, how do we know Christianity alone is the One True Faith?
    Answers on a postcard...


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    #104
    ouxbbkqtswdfaw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭ouxbbkqtswdfaw


    tayto lover wrote:
    Do you actually believe all this stuff? Why would anyone hate God or anyone else for that fact forever?


    The devil and his acolytes hate God.


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    #105
    ouxbbkqtswdfaw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭ouxbbkqtswdfaw


    dr.fuzzenstein wrote:
    I don't hate God, because there is no point hating an idea, or fictional concept. I might as well hate the Easter Bunny or the Tooth Fairy. The problem lies with people who say "do as I say or you'll go to hell forever". With all respect, but "because I say so" doesn't cut it. Of course you could say "God says so", but we're at square one with that one. Taking this one step further, imagine if there are thousands of inhabited planets in this galaxy alone with thousands upon thousands of belief systems, how do we know Christianity alone is the One True Faith? Answers on a postcard...


    If you don't believe in God, you cannot enter Heaven.


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    #106
    ouxbbkqtswdfaw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭ouxbbkqtswdfaw


    "Go out into the whole world and preach the Good News. He who believes and is baptised will be saved. He who does not believe will be condemned."


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    #107
    jones 19
    Registered Users Posts: 270 ✭✭jones 19


    qwadb78ejp260i wrote: »
    If you don't believe in God, you cannot enter Heaven.

    I wouldn't want to go to his heaven, not when he, the almighty allows rape, murder, genocide, child molestation, mass rape, poverty. Disease, which is on a huge level, we have hell on earth here in spades. We also have heaven on earth too, love, family, joy, fun. Nature bla bla bla, but is there hell or heaven when we die, no get a grip and focus on your brief time here on planet earth. Don't be wasting your time on books that were written 2000 + years ago when **** couldn't be disproven Ffs.


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    #108
    dr.fuzzenstein
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 16,635 ✭✭✭✭dr.fuzzenstein


    jones 19 wrote: »
    I wouldn't want to go to his heaven, not when he, the almighty allows rape, murder, genocide, child molestation, mass rape, poverty. Disease, which is on a huge level, we have hell on earth here in spades. We also have heaven on earth too, love, family, joy, fun. Nature bla bla bla, but is there hell or heaven when we die, no get a grip and focus on your brief time here on planet earth. Don't be wasting your time on books that were written 2000 + years ago when **** couldn't be disproven Ffs.

    There I have to defend God. We manage to do all that by ourselves.


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    #109
    ouxbbkqtswdfaw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭ouxbbkqtswdfaw


    dr.fuzzenstein wrote:
    There I have to defend God. We manage to do all that by ourselves.

    Good man, thank you.


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    #110
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,652 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    But why would God want revenge and punishment for eternity for sinners particularly when he tells us to turn the other cheek? Seems hypocritical.


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    #111
    PopePalpatine
    Registered Users Posts: 11,851 ✭✭✭✭PopePalpatine


    tayto lover wrote: »
    But why would God want revenge and punishment for eternity for sinners particularly when he tells us to turn the other cheek? Seems hypocritical.

    It turns out he's Christian Grey.


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    #112
    ouxbbkqtswdfaw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭ouxbbkqtswdfaw


    tayto lover wrote:
    But why would God want revenge and punishment for eternity for sinners particularly when he tells us to turn the other cheek? Seems hypocritical.


    He doesn't want revenge. He wants everyone to share in the Heavenly bliss. However, everyone is born with an eternal soul, and some decide they don't want to be with Him. They hate Him eternally. If God took a soul from hell after a thousand years, it would still hate Him. It can do no other, because it is from the devil. Many souls descending into hell utter the words "Woe that I was ever conceived! Woe that I was ever born!"


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    #113
    Professor Moriarty
    Registered Users Posts: 14,364 ✭✭✭✭Professor Moriarty


    qwadb78ejp260i wrote: »
    He doesn't want revenge. He wants everyone to share in the Heavenly bliss. However, everyone is born with an eternal soul, and some decide they don't want to be with Him. They hate Him eternally. If God took a soul from hell after a thousand years, it would still hate Him. It can do no other, because it is from the devil. Many souls descending into hell utter the words "Woe that I was ever conceived! Woe that I was ever born!"

    What is interesting is that there are very few mainstream Christian members of the clergy who would agree with this understanding of hell.


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    #114
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,652 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Professor Moriarty wrote: »
    What is interesting is that there are very few mainstream Christian members of the clergy who would agree with this understanding of hell.
    Yes. The poster's interpretation seems to be that we are all born to be punished.


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    #115
    nozzferrahhtoo
    Registered Users Posts: 9,338 ✭✭✭nozzferrahhtoo


    qwadb78ejp260i wrote: »
    You are driving me mad. I tell you this, hell is real, and you wouldn't want to end up there. Over the gates of hell these words are proclaimed : "Abandon hope all ye who enter here".

    So your evidence for hell being real is that you are telling me hell is real? Well that's a bit.... circular..... and somewhat.... empty don~t you think?

    Sure there was only a guy a few weeks ago going door to door selling some magic ointment that he swore would cure all sorts of things. His evidence was that he SWORE to me it would cure all sorts of things.

    You probably would have bought that stuff I guess?
    qwadb78ejp260i wrote: »
    If you don't believe in God, you cannot enter Heaven.

    I am going to assume at this point that your evidence for the existence of god is going to turn out to be somewhat identical to your evidence for the existence of hell? That being: your say so?


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    #116
    GritBiscuit
    Registered Users Posts: 440 ✭✭GritBiscuit


    And what's the point in threatening a forum of people who don't believe in your god with all the things you reckon your god thinks or will do? It's like telling kids in Nepal that if they aren't good santa isn't coming... :confused:


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    #117
    ouxbbkqtswdfaw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭ouxbbkqtswdfaw


    tayto lover wrote:
    Yes. The poster's interpretation seems to be that we are all born to be punished.


    No, I say that only the sons and daughters of the devil are rightly punished.


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    #118
    ouxbbkqtswdfaw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭ouxbbkqtswdfaw


    nozzferrahhtoo wrote:
    I am going to assume at this point that your evidence for the existence of god is going to turn out to be somewhat identical to your evidence for the existence of hell? That being: your say so?


    I know it because it says so in the gospels.


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    #119
    ouxbbkqtswdfaw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭ouxbbkqtswdfaw


    GritBiscuit wrote:
    And what's the point in threatening a forum of people who don't believe in your god with all the things you reckon your god thinks or will do? It's like telling kids in Nepal that if they aren't good santa isn't coming...

    I told you only unrepentant evildoers find their way into hell. Everyone else has nothing to fear.


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    #120
    GritBiscuit
    Registered Users Posts: 440 ✭✭GritBiscuit


    qwadb78ejp260i wrote: »
    I told you only unrepentant evildoers find their way into hell. Everyone else has nothing to fear.

    I don't fear anything anyway...just missing the relevance of the message, I guess.

    Thus far it appears to amount to: a god I don't believe in punishes the sons and daughters of a devil I don't believe in for not adhering to a book I don't place any literal value in whatsoever.

    Uhhh...yay?


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    #121
    ouxbbkqtswdfaw
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,253 ✭✭✭ouxbbkqtswdfaw


    Hiberno12345 wrote:
    There are perfectly normal and logical explanations for Amanda's and Raf's behaviour, even for her false confession and implication of my friend Patrick Lumumba. They have been reconvicted the third time around only for the Italian authorities to save face, but my guess is, they will find a way to exonerate Raffaele (and duly so) and they will never demand for Amanda to be extradited. Why not? Because then, the American authorities would require every single little detail about the case and its investigation which would make them an international laughing stock of incompetence and sheer and embarrassing ignorance of the most basic criminal investigation techniques.

    GritBiscuit wrote:
    Thus far it appears to amount to: a god I don't believe in punishes the sons and daughters of a devil I don't believe in for not adhering to a book I don't place any literal value in whatsoever.


    That's your own business. You are entitled not to believe. God gives you that freedom. What have you to fear? Except that you will never enter the Kingdom of God.


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