Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Are too many teachers women?

Options
  • 28-11-2017 11:42am
    #1
    Permabear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39,022 ✭✭✭✭


    This post has been deleted.


«13456789

Comments

  • Options
    #2
    Wibbs
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,112 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    Permabear wrote: »
    This post had been deleted.
    Good luck with that in the current narrative.

    Rejoice in the awareness of feeling stupid, for that’s how you end up learning new things. If you’re not aware you’re stupid, you probably are.



  • Options
    #3
    selassie
    Registered Users Posts: 201 ✭✭selassie


    As few as six graduates are in training to be physics teachers in secondary schools, new figures indicate.


    The number of trainee teachers is also low in other key Stem subjects such as computer studies/ICT (six), applied maths (four) and technology (16).


    While more trainee maths teachers are completing postgraduate teaching courses (96), this is still far less than English (471), geography (395) and history (360).





    Gender equality is dreadful and newly trained teachers going into STEM subjects compared to others are outnumbered by around 15/16-1 at least.


  • Options
    #4
    Hector Bellend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,667 ✭✭✭Hector Bellend


    I spent more time in secondary school trying to have sex with my french teacher than I did studying. I was a big fan of women teachers


  • Options
    #5
    brevity
    Registered Users Posts: 8,508 ✭✭✭brevity


    The question I would ask is why don't more men want to be teachers?


  • Options
    #6
    Cina
    Registered Users Posts: 2,387 ✭✭✭Cina


    Hector Bellend wrote: »
    I spent more time in secondary school trying to have sex with my french teacher than I did studying. I was a big fan of women teachers
    You're so cool.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #7
    mariaalice
    Registered Users Posts: 12,415 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    That a much bigger question than the one you have posed, despite everything the vast majority of woman I know opt for a family friendly careers its possibly the top consideration for a woman with children. Its not that men do not consider family in their career options its usually not their top priority.

    Therefore woman overwhelming choose teaching and nursing as careers, why else would you see woman with a top degree in computer science or accountancy or engineering wondering if they could retain as a teacher because of the family friendly hours! this occurs after they have children.

    The second point is you can not force men to become teachers, in the past primary teaching has a high status and was often the only professional employment available in rural areas.


  • Options
    #8
    Are Am Eye
    Registered Users Posts: 2,166 ✭✭✭Are Am Eye


    I have researched some videos on line and I can confirm the
    predominance of women school teachers and male cable repair workers.


  • Options
    #9
    TheDavester
    Registered Users Posts: 3,245 ✭✭✭TheDavester


    brevity wrote: »
    The question I would ask is why don't more men want to be teachers?

    im guessing the pay


  • Options
    #10
    Hector Savage
    Registered Users Posts: 8,810 ✭✭✭Hector Savage


    brevity wrote: »
    The question I would ask is why don't more men want to be teachers?

    Men/Women are actually attracted to different areas and interests, unfortunately you can't mention this fact in society today - just look at the James Damore fiasco.


  • Options
    #11
    Assetbacked
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,969 ✭✭✭Assetbacked


    I think it would be a worthy cause to push for a more even figure of men and women as teachers, but the reason there are more women in teaching is because it is seen as a more female-suited job. Women have figured it out that it is relatively well paid and fulfilling but allows for a work/life balance like no office job which is what attracts women to a job more than men. Men, for whatever reason, don't realise that they could be doing a relatively handy number as a teacher instead of grinding out a boring office job or could not work at all and stay at home "minding your kids" (as if it is not a good thing to spend more time with your kids), not working at all. Women are decades ahead of us.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #12
    Hector Bellend
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,667 ✭✭✭Hector Bellend


    Cina wrote: »
    You're so cool.

    ah sure thanks


  • Options
    #13
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,611 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    brevity wrote: »
    The question I would ask is why don't more men want to be teachers?

    Pay is ****e. Someone with a Maths or Physics degree has a lot of high-paying career options. Someone with geography/sociology and some of the "soft" sciences, less so.

    Personally I'm considering a maths degree and go into teaching later, will be a nice transition into retirement.


  • Options
    #14
    JMNolan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,076 ✭✭✭JMNolan


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Pay is ****e. Someone with a Maths or Physics degree has a lot of high-paying career options. Someone with geography/sociology and some of the "soft" sciences, less so.

    Personally I'm considering a maths degree and go into teaching later, will be a nice transition into retirement.

    Plus the risk of being falsely accused of something as a male is higher. Chance of my life being ruined? Nah, you're alright


  • Options
    #15
    BrokenArrows
    Registered Users Posts: 7,500 ✭✭✭BrokenArrows


    brevity wrote: »
    The question I would ask is why don't more men want to be teachers?

    Because the pay is ****.

    And because a Male spending time with children is almost immediately and without cause seen by society as unsafe.
    All it takes to ruin a male teachers life is for some crazy kid to falsely accuse them of something. Society will automatically consider them guilty even if they are later found to be innocent.

    I know id never want to be a teacher. Maybe id be interested in going into 3rd level education but the pay still sucks unless you are a professor.


  • Options
    #16
    whisky_galore
    Registered Users Posts: 15,964 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    Permabear wrote: »
    This post had been deleted.

    I did better at maths with a male teacher because the female teacher I had before him never went to the trouble of explaining anything and pitched the class at her more mathematically adept 'favourites', nothing to do with her gender.


  • Options
    #17
    Speedwell
    Registered Users Posts: 3,809 ✭✭✭Speedwell


    JMNolan wrote: »
    Plus the risk of being falsely accused of something as a male is higher. Chance of my life being ruined? Nah, you're alright

    I invite you to do a Google search of "teacher charged" and "teacher convicted" (not even including "coach") and compare the ratio of men to women in the search results, despite the fact that women far outnumber men as teachers.


  • Options
    #18
    Odelay
    Registered Users Posts: 3,813 ✭✭✭Odelay


    Permabear wrote: »
    This post had been deleted.

    Sounds perfectly reasonable. There should be a gender quota to get more men involved. Let them break through the whiteboard ceiling.


  • Options
    #19
    Outkast_IRE
    Registered Users Posts: 7,515 ✭✭✭Outkast_IRE


    Easy way to get more male teachers . Run conversion courses in the evenings so those with degrees in engineering etc can train to be teachers and allow them onto the salary scale at a reasonable level. You would have a solid uptake


  • Options
    #20
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,160 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    The Department have been trying for years to get more men into teaching and also to tackle the under-performance of a large cohort of boys. They have a whole section dedicated to it.

    Scarcity of full-time jobs; payscale that takes 20 years to reach the top of; very limited promotional opportunities all have an effect.

    People hear teacher and think 'Ah, June July and August!' and 'Off at 4 every day!', but not, 'working two hours a day' (thus unable to collect social welfare or apply for any other jobs), 'signing on for mid-term breaks, Easter, Christmas, summer', not to mention the abuse some people have to take daily from some people's darlings, physical attacks, desctruction of personal property etc..


  • Options
    #21
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    Wibbs wrote: »
    Good luck with that in the current narrative.
    I think you're way off there tbh, W.

    http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/into-demands-action-to-address-teacher-gender-imbalance-424926.html

    The INTO has actually been shouting about this for years now. The problem is that it's being ignored at the government level because it's not a vote-getter.

    There are many teachers and schools who would strongly welcome a greater male presence, but the men simply don't apply for it.

    Nobody is opposed to encouraging more men into teaching, just the media isn't talking about it.

    I expect the two biggest barriers to men getting into it are social attitudes and pay. Social attitudes being that an 18/19 year old who wants to become a teacher faces the same stigma as one who wants to be an actor or a hairdresser - the implication that it's a "girly" pursuit, and that a man who wants to be around children must be a paedo.

    And by the time they grow out of that childishness and realise they'd like to become a teacher, the pay on offer for a new teacher is miles below what they're currently earning.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #22
    Speedwell
    Registered Users Posts: 3,809 ✭✭✭Speedwell


    Outkast_IRE wrote: »
    Easy way to get more male teachers . Run conversion courses in the evenings so this with degrees in engineering etc can train to be teachers and allow them onto the salary scale at a reasonable level. You would have a solid uptake

    Or female engineers and IT staff, even. Because it's really about skills and training, right?


  • Options
    #23
    whisky_galore
    Registered Users Posts: 15,964 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    mariaalice wrote: »
    you can not force men to become teachers.

    This.^^


  • Options
    #24
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,160 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    Outkast_IRE wrote: »
    Easy way to get more male teachers . Run conversion courses in the evenings so this with degrees in engineering etc can train to be teachers and allow them onto the salary scale at a reasonable level. You would have a solid uptake

    If they got full time jobs. Engineering in most schools would be a six or twelve hour gig at most.


  • Options
    #25
    BrokenArrows
    Registered Users Posts: 7,500 ✭✭✭BrokenArrows


    Speedwell wrote: »
    I invite you to do a Google search of "teacher charged" and "teacher convicted" (not even including "coach") and compare the ratio of men to women in the search results, despite the fact that women far outnumber men as teachers.

    Google search results are not a great comparison. Female teachers make the headlines because its a much better headline. 23yr old female teacher ....


  • Options
    #26
    jmayo
    Registered Users Posts: 13,180 ✭✭✭✭jmayo


    Permabear wrote: »
    This post had been deleted.

    Would you rather a school filled with priests ?
    Anyway why are you worried you don't live there anymore and you home school as well.

    Besides the important thing to note is they probably aren't racists like those over in the Gaelscoileanna. ;)

    And speaking of female teachers, I do know of one school which is "carrying" a female teacher that apart from not actually doing her job properly engages in discrimination against the male students.
    And I bet if the roles were reversed there would be more serious consequences.
    Hector Bellend wrote: »
    I spent more time in secondary school trying to have sex with my french teacher than I did studying. I was a big fan of women teachers

    Don't keep us in suspense, did you get off with him ?

    I am not allowed discuss …



  • Options
    #27
    mariaalice
    Registered Users Posts: 12,415 ✭✭✭✭mariaalice


    Teaching is just not a status career and while the pay is not bad its not fantastic either, I would say its viewed as middle of the road, plus modern society has changed from just getting on with it to one where your career has to be fulling and interesting and make you happy.


  • Options
    #28
    ShowMeTheCash
    Registered Users Posts: 2,651 ✭✭✭ShowMeTheCash


    TheDavester wrote: »
    im guessing the pay

    I think there is an argument to be hand around preference.

    Why do more women go into teaching..... Maybe because they want too!
    Why do men not go into teaching.... Maybe because they don't want too!

    The same question was made around STEM subjects. Why are more women not going into Science, Technology, Engineering and Math subjects. Again, maybe they do not want too?

    It seems we want to force people people into category's so the numbers look to be equal not sure that is what equality is all about.


  • Options
    #29
    super_furry
    Registered Users Posts: 27,322 ✭✭✭✭super_furry


    I think teacher is an unattractive profession because the pay is so poor. It requires an education level and commitment that would bring you a much higher pay-packet in other industries and even when you qualify as a teacher, it can’t take years to eventually get a full-time job.

    It’s not surprising that there’s only six people in training to be physics teachers. Someone with a degree in physics could walk into a job that would pay multiples of what teaching would.

    At the risk of sounding sexist, I’m just not sure it’s a job that appeals to highly qualified men as much as it does women. I could be wrong and totally off base but I believe that the only way to get more men teaching would be to drastically improve the wages.


  • Options
    #30
    ShowMeTheCash
    Registered Users Posts: 2,651 ✭✭✭ShowMeTheCash


    whisky_galore wrote: »
    I did better at maths with a male teacher because the female teacher I had before him never went to the trouble of explaining anything and pitched the class at her more mathematically adept 'favourites', nothing to do with her gender.

    Arguing stats with your own individual experience.....
    I take it statistical analysis or the law of averages was never discussed in this math class?


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #31
    Nekarsulm
    Registered Users Posts: 11,199 ✭✭✭✭Nekarsulm


    Our small rural National School (3 teachers, 75 pupils) has never had a male teacher since I was there in the the 1970's.
    My own daughter is there now and the amount of chopping and changing as teachers get married and have children of their own is unreal.
    However, one substitute teacher last year was a man. Our lassie liked him a lot, and he had the syllabus covered in mid April, and had started them (3rd class) on 4th class work before the holidays.
    He is still mentioned from time to time, and when the latest pregnancy was announced our girl said "I hope Mr Bann## is coming back".


Advertisement