Advertisement
Help Keep Boards Alive. Support us by going ad free today. See here: https://subscriptions.boards.ie/.
If we do not hit our goal we will be forced to close the site.

Current status: https://keepboardsalive.com/

Annual subs are best for most impact. If you are still undecided on going Ad Free - you can also donate using the Paypal Donate option. All contribution helps. Thank you.
https://www.boards.ie/group/1878-subscribers-forum

Private Group for paid up members of Boards.ie. Join the club.

Let's say something nice about Travellers

1…5681011

Comments

  • #212
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    end of the road wrote: »
    agreed. however we both know that it isn't simply sticking to that. hence the EU council and the UN findings that travelers are 1 of the 2 most discriminated against groups in europe.

    I started this thread and I started it with good intentions. I honestly feel awful for individual travellers who are just normal people going about their business and they meet a hard time. I've a major issue with that. But you need to stop bleating on about the UN and the Council of Europe as if they're know-alls on everything Traveller. If you asked 100 settled people what their general opinion of Travellers is, what do you think you'd hear back? I'd wager the majority would be negative comments. Is that nice? No. But why would it be the case? Is it that these people living in the same society as them are all wrong? Where does the bad rep come from?


  • #213
    2Mad2BeMad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,792 ✭✭✭2Mad2BeMad


    Theres not many of them.


  • #214
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    end of the road wrote: »
    you can't get away from, or deny the facts that their findings are accurate.

    Why not, you do it all the time?


  • #215
    PeterParker957
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,177 ✭✭✭PeterParker957


    Omackeral wrote: »
    end of the road wrote: »
    agreed. however we both know that it isn't simply sticking to that. hence the EU council and the UN findings that travelers are 1 of the 2 most discriminated against groups in europe.

    I started this thread and I started it with good intentions. I honestly feel awful for individual travellers who are just normal people going about their business and they meet a hard time. I've a major issue with that. But you need to stop bleating on about the UN and the Council of Europe as if they're know-alls on everything Traveller. If you asked 100 settled people what their general opinion of Travellers is, what do you think you'd hear back? I'd wager the majority would be negative comments. Is that nice? No. But why would it be the case? Is it that these people living in the same society as them are all wrong? Where does the bad rep come from?

    I'd say individuals are sound but certain expectations hold them back.

    My College runs a Traveller Access Programme. Basically funding a member of the travelling community into third level education. First candidate was male. He had it rough but ended up graduating. Very proud of him.

    Next year was a female. Not the best student, not the worst. She was given zero encouragement at home and couldn't study as she had "family responsibilities" and after a couple of years dropped out.

    Such a waste. I don't agree with mindless discrimination but there are times when it's not discrimination, it's just knowledge.


  • #216
    Help!!!!
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,965 ✭✭✭Help!!!!


    Omackeral wrote: »
    I started this thread and I started it with good intentions. I honestly feel awful for individual travellers who are just normal people going about their business and they meet a hard time. I've a major issue with that. But you need to stop bleating on about the UN and the Council of Europe as if they're know-alls on everything Traveller. If you asked 100 settled people what their general opinion of Travellers is, what do you think you'd hear back? I'd wager the majority would be negative comments. Is that nice? No. But why would it be the case? Is it that these people living in the same society as them are all wrong? Where does the bad rep come from?

    You could ask 100 Travellers & they would agree:D


  • Advertisement
  • #217
    end of the road
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,605 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Omackeral wrote: »
    you need to stop bleating on about the UN and the Council of Europe as if they're know-alls on everything Traveller.

    why should i stop giving the facts that 2 important groups have found that we are falling short in relation to an issue? you might not like the findings but those are the findings and it seems the irish government agree with them. i'm only giving the information, if you don't like the information given then write and complain to the UN and council of europe and your local politicians and tell them why you believe their findings are wrong with the required evidence.
    i never once stated both the council of europe and UN are know all in relation to everything traveler, but the fact is they would have gathered substantial evidence before coming to their findings.

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • #218
    Gravelly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,094 ✭✭✭Gravelly


    PeterParker957 wrote: »
    I'd say individuals are sound but certain expectations hold them back.

    My College runs a Traveller Access Programme. Basically funding a member of the travelling community into third level education. First candidate was male. He had it rough but ended up graduating. Very proud of him.

    Next year was a female. Not the best student, not the worst. She was given zero encouragement at home and couldn't study as she had "family responsibilities" and after a couple of years dropped out.

    Such a waste. I don't agree with mindless discrimination but there are times when it's not discrimination, it's just knowledge.

    TAP for short. How hilariously appropriate.

    They should call the personal injuries claims Special Cultural Activity Money.


  • #219
    PeterParker957
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,177 ✭✭✭PeterParker957


    Gravelly wrote: »
    PeterParker957 wrote: »
    I'd say individuals are sound but certain expectations hold them back.

    My College runs a Traveller Access Programme. Basically funding a member of the travelling community into third level education. First candidate was male. He had it rough but ended up graduating. Very proud of him.

    Next year was a female. Not the best student, not the worst. She was given zero encouragement at home and couldn't study as she had "family responsibilities" and after a couple of years dropped out.

    Such a waste. I don't agree with mindless discrimination but there are times when it's not discrimination, it's just knowledge.

    TAP for short. How hilariously appropriate.

    They should call the personal injuries claims Special Cultural Activity Money.

    I thought they did!


  • #220
    Hannibal_Smith
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 7,538 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    I don't mind travellers, never had an issue with them. All dealings I've had with them have been pleasant enough. They did our gutters about 10 years ago and they're still attached to the driveway (only kidding they're attached as they should be).

    However to say the discrimination against them is unfounded or isn't their fault is trying to stir a pot and it's the prejudices of other people that are totally to blame? That's just posting looking for an argument.


  • #221
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    end of the road wrote: »
    why should i stop giving the facts that 2 important groups have found that we are falling short in relation to an issue? you might not like the findings but those are the findings and it seems the irish government agree with them. i'm only giving the information, if you don't like the information given then write and complain to the UN and council of europe and your local politicians and tell them why you believe their findings are wrong with the required evidence.
    i never once stated both the council of europe and UN are know all in relation to everything traveler, but the fact is they would have gathered substantial evidence before coming to their findings.

    Wrong.


  • Advertisement
  • #222
    wakka12
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,786 ✭✭✭wakka12


    the beer revolu wrote: »
    I've been punched in the face three times in my life by Irish, white settled males. All Irish men are scumbags.

    I have never been punched in the face by a traveller. All travellers are sound.

    Am I missing something?

    thats a lot of times to get punched in the face


  • #223
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 32,956 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Hannibal_Smith wrote: »
    I don't mind travellers, never had an issue with them. All dealings I've had with them have been pleasant enough. They did our gutters about 10 years ago and they're still attached to the driveway (only kidding they're attached as they should be).

    However to say the discrimination against them is unfounded or isn't their fault is trying to stir a pot and it's the prejudices of other people that are totally to blame? That's just posting looking for an argument.

    Good post. There's always a middle ground. I work with plenty of Travellers and have great time for them and their families. However I work in a jail so they're not there for being good either. Basically, take everyone as you find them would be my advice but at the same time, I can understand why a publican might feel uneasy booking a Traveller wedding.


  • #224
    Gravelly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,094 ✭✭✭Gravelly


    Posts seem to be vanishing off this thread. If there's a specific angle we must take with posts, it might be helpful if it was posted so we know what the company line is, as it were.


  • #225
    Gravelly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,094 ✭✭✭Gravelly


    wakka12 wrote: »
    thats a lot of times to get punched in the face

    He sounds like someone that, perhaps, says or does things that earn him a punch in the face occasionally.


  • #226
    Tokyo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,655 ✭✭✭✭Tokyo


    Gravelly wrote: »
    Posts seem to be vanishing off this thread. If there's a specific angle we must take with posts, it might be helpful if it was posted so we know what the company line is, as it were.

    A particular rereg troll was banned, as were his posts. There's no angle or company line (unless of course, you count "don't create multiple accounts and be a tool" as being a company line).


  • #227
    Gravelly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,094 ✭✭✭Gravelly


    mike_ie wrote: »
    A particular rereg troll was banned, as were his posts. There's no angle or company line (unless of course, you count "don't create multiple accounts and be a tool" as being a company line).

    Mine disappeared and I'm not a rereg nor, I would like to think, a troll.


  • #228
    end of the road
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,605 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Hannibal_Smith wrote: »
    However to say the discrimination against them is unfounded or isn't their fault is trying to stir a pot and it's the prejudices of other people that are totally to blame? That's just posting looking for an argument.

    it really isn't. discrimination against someone is the fault of the person doing the discrimination. whatever issues some travelers may be involved in are separate to the discrimination travelers as a whole face. if we go with your logic then we have to conclude that any group who faced discrimination in the past (gays, blacks, single mothers) were all to blame for it. they weren't.

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • #229
    Day Lewin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,939 ✭✭✭Day Lewin


    Let's keep to the point....the OP was "Let's say something nice about Travellers"

    Some have, and some have chosen to express their negative prejudices.

    Putting somebody in jail for breaking the law, isn't discrimination: it's common justice.

    Refusing to give someone a job or a placement because you suspect they are part of a particular ethnic group - that IS discrimation. Thats what the word means.


  • #230
    Hannibal_Smith
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 7,538 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    Omackeral wrote: »
    Good post. There's always a middle ground. I work with plenty of Travellers and have great time for them and their families. However I work in a jail so they're not there for being good either. Basically, take everyone as you find them would be my advice but at the same time, I can understand why a publican might feel uneasy booking a Traveller wedding.

    It's true. I completely agree. Only not too great thing was Where I used to live, travellers moved in and were there for about 2 years. It was a beautiful picturesque riverside area. After they left, the place was destroyed. I mean absolutely destroyed.

    But, as I always say, there are plenty of settled people who live in absolute dumps so you can't tar everyone with the same brush (lol)

    If you watch the 'call outs' though on you tube, the things they say are horrific. Funny that one poster is here defending them as a community when the insults they level at each other revolve around the children of others.


  • #231
    Galwayguy35
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,571 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    end of the road wrote: »
    i'm not no .
    doesn't change the facts that travelers are 1 of the 2 most discriminated against groups in europe though.

    Who is the other group?


  • Advertisement
  • #232
    Hannibal_Smith
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 7,538 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    end of the road wrote: »
    it really isn't. discrimination against someone is the fault of the person doing the discrimination. whatever issues some travelers may be involved in are separate to the discrimination travelers as a whole face. if we go with your logic then we have to conclude that any group who faced discrimination in the past (gays, blacks, single mothers) were all to blame for it. they weren't.


    No you don't and you know it. It is not some travellers. The examples you show, clearly illustrate your misunderstanding of the discussion. The discrimination against travellers does not stem from WHAT they are, but how a lot of them have behaved. It is not fair to say only 'some' have created the image. In the same way it's not fair to say 'all' have. A lot have contributed to the image people hold.

    And I'm not sure who you're referring to when you say blacks, but if you're really as pc as you let on, surely you would never use that description?


  • #233
    end of the road
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,605 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    a
    Galwayguy35 wrote: »
    Who is the other group?


    the roma.
    Hannibal_Smith wrote: »
    No you don't and you know it. It is not some travellers. The examples you show, clearly illustrate your misunderstanding of the discussion. The discrimination against travellers does not stem from WHAT they are, but how a lot of them have behaved. It is not fair to say only 'some' have created the image. In the same way it's not fair to say 'all' have. A lot have contributed to the image people hold.

    And I'm not sure who you're referring to when you say blacks, but if you're really as pc as you let on, surely you would never use that description?

    how some travelers behave is used as the excuse for it but it's not the reason they face discrimination.
    the reasons are that people can get away with it, and some people like to have someone they feel superior to.
    i don't do pc, never have and never will. it doesn't even register to me. i treat people as i find them.

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • #234
    Hannibal_Smith
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 7,538 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    end of the road wrote: »

    how some travelers behave is used as the excuse for it but it's not the reason they face discrimination.
    the reasons are that people can get away with it, and some people like to have someone they feel superior to.
    i don't do pc, never have and never will. it doesn't even register to me. i treat people as i find them.

    Have you survey results to back up what you're saying? Have you asked people who discriminate against travellers what their basis is? What's your authority for speaking for a group of people?

    No, you sure don't do pc if you still chuck labels around like that.


  • #235
    end of the road
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,605 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    Hannibal_Smith wrote: »
    Have you survey results to back up what you're saying? Have you asked people who discriminate against travellers what their basis is? What's your authority for speaking for a group of people?

    there is no basis for the discrimination faced by travelers, especially when such discrimination is a breach of the law. one can't complain about travelers breaching the law if they are breaching the law by discriminating against travelers.

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • #236
    dinorebel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,362 ✭✭✭dinorebel


    end of the road wrote: »
    agreed. however we both know that it isn't simply sticking to that. hence the EU council and the UN findings that travelers are 1 of the 2 most discriminated against groups in europe.
    Do you ever get bored writing that.


  • #237
    Hannibal_Smith
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 7,538 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    end of the road wrote: »
    there is no basis for the discrimination faced by travelers, especially when such discrimination is a breach of the law. one can't complain about travelers breaching the law if they are breaching the law by discriminating against travelers.

    :pac: Okay, There is no basis for the discrimination faced by travellers :pac:

    Discrimination is against the law and rightly so. No one should be discriminated against, but to be so misguided about the basis of that situation is hilarious.

    I missed your 'say something nice about travellers' contribution to the thread?


  • #238
    retro:electro
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,039 ✭✭✭✭retro:electro


    Hannibal_Smith wrote: »
    :pac: Okay, There is no basis for the discrimination faced by travellers :pac:

    Discrimination is against the law and rightly so. No one should be discriminated against, but to be so misguided about the basis of that situation is hilarious.

    I missed your 'say something nice about travellers' contribution to the thread?

    He's either not going to answer you or he's writing a long list.


  • #239
    Beasty
    Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 78,485 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    Gravelly wrote: »
    Mine disappeared and I'm not a rereg nor, I would like to think, a troll.
    You were caught in the crossfire - apologies (from mike:pac:) - it's re-instated now


  • #240
    um7y1h83ge06nx
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,029 ✭✭✭um7y1h83ge06nx


    They're a better bunch of lads than the SS.


  • Advertisement
  • #241
    Gravelly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,094 ✭✭✭Gravelly


    Beasty wrote: »
    Gravelly wrote: »
    Mine disappeared and I'm not a rereg nor, I would like to think, a troll.
    You were caught in the crossfire - apologies (from mike:pac:) - it's re-instated now

    Thanks.


This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement