Inefficient quirks of the Irish public transport system

thelad95 · 01-09-2017 12:47PM #1

Having travelled throughout Europe it really baffles me how ridiculously inefficient nearly every part of using public transport is in Ireland, be it private or public operators. What stories do you have regarding inefficiency or what parts do you particularly hate?

For me, I absolutely detest the fact that while the NTA is pushing online or pre-purchase of rail tickets, you still have to collect them at a ticket machine by typing in a 14 digit number. If you've gone to the effort of purchasing online, you should be emailed a ticket that is valid for inspection.

Similarly, with the purchase of an online ticket for a Bus Eireann bus, you have to call out the 'MAC numbers' and the process the driver has to go through on his machine is like having to solve some ancient hyroglyphic. The irony of this situation is that it's quicker to buy a ticket using cash from the driver than present your already paid for online booking.

Cash on city buses is something that has been eliminated in some European cities since the turn of the millennium, yet here we still are counting out change. What's even more stupid is people with a leap card still having to interact with the driver in the vast majority of cases.

Don't even get me started on the 'ticket' that Aircoach send you when you book online!

Hande hoche! · 01-09-2017 12:50PM

Not bothering to link up the red and green luas lines from the start

MilesMorales1 · 01-09-2017 12:55PM

Most of Dublin bus.

WesternZulu · 01-09-2017 12:56PM

Dublin being well connected to all other majour urban areas but good luck in trying to get to and from other cities that aren't Dublin.
For instance, not being able to get a direct train from Galway to Cork.

Hueston and Connolly station not being connected properly is also a joke.

omagh776 · 01-09-2017 12:56PM

thelad95 wrote: »

Having travelled throughout Europe it really baffles me how ridiculously inefficient nearly every part of using public transport is in Ireland, be it private or public operators. What stories do you have regarding inefficiency or what parts do you particularly hate?

For me, I absolutely detest the fact that while the NTA is pushing online or pre-purchase of rail tickets, you still have to collect them at a ticket machine by typing in a 14 digit number. If you've gone to the effort of purchasing online, you should be emailed a ticket that is valid for inspection.

Similarly, with the purchase of an online ticket for a Bus Eireann bus, you have to call out the 'MAC numbers' and the process the driver has to go through on his machine is like having to solve some ancient hyroglyphic. The irony of this situation is that it's quicker to buy a ticket using cash from the driver than present your already paid for online booking.

Cash on city buses is something that has been eliminated in some European cities since the turn of the millennium, yet here we still are counting out change. What's even more stupid is people with a leap card still having to interact with the driver in the vast majority of cases.

Don't even get me started on the 'ticket' that Aircoach send you when you book online!

Your experience of Continental European public transport is generally limited to major cities, i.e. the City Center, between Cities or to and from the Airport.

France, Italy, Spain, Portugal, The Netherlands, even Germany can be really shítty in parts.

Pretty much everyone in their own country says their own public transport is shít

The Dutch Complain about the OV-Chipkaart and how expensive everything got after that.
The Germans complain the Ticket system is complete Voodoo and nobody knows what ticket to buy when they go to another city, Deutsche Bahn has constant IT problems and delays due to lack of maintenence.
The French are on strike the whole time.
The Italian trains are always late and their ticket machines suck a$$, you'd spend 20 minutes just trying to buy one ticket.
and so on ....

Owryan · 01-09-2017 12:57PM

Carlow train station, if a wheelchair user is unlucky when their train pulls in they can't dismount and have to go to the next station and get a taxi back to Carlow. I ve seen people ask strangers to them carry over the foot bridge rather than this. Surely in this day and age its no longer acceptable?

Charles Babbage · 01-09-2017 12:59PM

omagh776 wrote: »

The Dutch Complain about the OV-Chipkaart and how expensive everything got after that.
The Germans complain the Ticket system is complete Voodoo and nobody knows what ticket to buy when they go to another city, Deutsche Bahn has constant IT problems and delays due to lack of maintenence.
The French are on strike the whole time.
The Italian trains are always late and their ticket machines suck a$$, you'd spend 20 minutes just trying to buy one ticket.
and so on ....

Italian rail ticket machines are a model of simplicity, although I see what you mean about the German system, even the Germans have problems sometimes.

Wardling · 01-09-2017 12:59PM

thelad95 wrote:

Cash on city buses is something that has been eliminated in some European cities since the turn of the millennium, yet here we still are counting out change. What's even more stupid is people with a leap card still having to interact with the driver in the vast majority of cases.

This is ridiculous alright. You should tag on with your leap card as you get on and tag off when leaving. Surely it's not that difficult to deduct the correct fair when alighting.

donegaLroad · 01-09-2017 01:00PM

WesternZulu wrote: »

Dublin being well connected to all other majour urban areas but good luck in trying to get to and from other cities that aren't Dublin.
For instance, not being able to get a direct train from Galway to Cork.

Hueston and Connolly station not being connected properly is also a joke.

yep.. if you want to go from Sligo to Ballina by train, you need to go to Dublin.

Not all the expressway buses have toilet facilities.

The Bus Eireann website is all over the place.. not user friendly at all.

Dardania · 01-09-2017 01:00PM

omagh776 wrote: »

thelad95 wrote: »

Having travelled throughout Europe it really baffles me how ridiculously inefficient nearly every part of using public transport is in Ireland, be it private or public operators. What stories do you have regarding inefficiency or what parts do you particularly hate?

For me, I absolutely detest the fact that while the NTA is pushing online or pre-purchase of rail tickets, you still have to collect them at a ticket machine by typing in a 14 digit number. If you've gone to the effort of purchasing online, you should be emailed a ticket that is valid for inspection.

Similarly, with the purchase of an online ticket for a Bus Eireann bus, you have to call out the 'MAC numbers' and the process the driver has to go through on his machine is like having to solve some ancient hyroglyphic. The irony of this situation is that it's quicker to buy a ticket using cash from the driver than present your already paid for online booking.

Cash on city buses is something that has been eliminated in some European cities since the turn of the millennium, yet here we still are counting out change. What's even more stupid is people with a leap card still having to interact with the driver in the vast majority of cases.

Don't even get me started on the 'ticket' that Aircoach send you when you book online!

Your experience of Continental European public transport is generally limited to major cities, i.e. the City Center, between Cities or to and from the Airport.

France, Italy, Spain, Portugal, The Netherlands, even Germany can be really shítty in parts.

Pretty much everyone in their own country says their own public transport is shít

The Dutch Complain about the OV-Chipkaart and how expensive everything got after that.
The Germans complain the Ticket system is complete Voodoo and nobody knows what ticket to buy when they go to another city, Deutsche Bahn has constant IT problems and delays due to lack of maintenence.
The French are on strike the whole time.
The Italian trains are always late and their ticket machines suck a$, you'd spend 20 minutes just trying to buy one ticket.
and so on ....

Indeed. In Helsinki, it's not possible to have the travel card auto topup, whereas with leap, it just direct debits automatically.
Not to mention, they don't do direct debits at all in Helsinki, you have to remember to pay bills generally by yourself, and the IBAN's reference number changse every month...

oppenheimer1 · 01-09-2017 01:00PM

A driver not wanting to do a run because it will terminate a minute before their shift ends?

Dardania · 01-09-2017 01:03PM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

A driver not wanting to do a run because it will terminate a minute before their shift ends?

To be fair, that was dealt with correctly by Transdev, and upheld by the WRC

MilesMorales1 · 01-09-2017 01:07PM

WesternZulu wrote: »

Dublin being well connected to all other majour urban areas but good luck in trying to get to and from other cities that aren't Dublin.
For instance, not being able to get a direct train from Galway to Cork.

Hueston and Connolly station not being connected properly is also a joke.

.... I only just thought of that. That is weird. Why aren't they?

odyssey06 · 01-09-2017 01:09PM

The genius in Dublin Bus sends out the 29A, 31 and 32 from three different places (Baldoyle, Howth, Portmarnock) and gets them to converge within 5 minutes of each other at Killester; so if you miss one you miss them all. I think he spent too much time playing war games as a kid.

A more obvious one is the scheduling of the 42 and 43 leaving town. They share a lot of the same route, but the departures mostly happen within 5-10 minutes of each other so if you lived along its common route, you miss one you miss two...

osarusan · 01-09-2017 01:12PM

WesternZulu wrote: »

For instance, not being able to get a direct train from Galway to Cork.

Running one would be an even more inefficient thing to do.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 01-09-2017 01:14PM

Haven't lived in Dublin for a while, but do all the timetables still have only the departure times from the terminus displayed at every single stop? Meaning, if you have no idea how far you are from the terminus, or how what route the bes takes before it gets to that specifci stop, then it's impossible to deduce what time the bus actually gets to your stop at (not that it's any easier if you do and it's more than a few stops down the line)?

Always did my head in.

That and listing destinations and stops in Irish only...

MilesMorales1 · 01-09-2017 01:15PM

The real time app is chronically inaccurate.

osarusan · 01-09-2017 01:18PM

MilesMorales1 wrote: »

The real time app is chronically inaccurate.

Was just about to post that. More than once, I've seen a 'real' bus time get closer, then closer, then due, then just fall off the bottom of the screen.

ChikiChiki · 01-09-2017 01:18PM

The leap card delay when tagging on. It should be instant. It all accumulates to a serious amount of time wasted for all.

thelad95 · 01-09-2017 01:20PM

MilesMorales1 wrote: »

The real time app is chronically inaccurate.

All it essentially does is count down to the scheduled time the bus is meant to be at that stop, hence the common complaint of buses 'disappearing'.

circadian · 01-09-2017 01:22PM

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Haven't lived in Dublin for a while, but do all the timetables still have only the departure times from the terminus displayed at every single stop? Meaning, if you have no idea how far you are from the terminus, or how what route the bes takes before it gets to that specifci stop, then it's impossible to deduce what time the bus actually gets to your stop at (not that it's any easier if you do and it's more than a few stops down the line)?

Always did my head in.

That and listing destinations and stops in Irish only...

Yes this is how the timetable are. I moved to Dublin a few years ago and still don't understand why they can't timetable like everyone else.

Kimbot · 01-09-2017 01:22PM

MOD Moved to Commuting & Transport Forum as its more appropriate over there

GhostyMcGhost · 01-09-2017 01:23PM

thelad95 wrote: »

All it essentially does is count down to the scheduled time the bus is meant to be at that stop, hence the common complaint of buses 'disappearing'.

Should not be called 'real time'

It's a glorified digital timetable

Carlos Orange · 01-09-2017 01:32PM

GhostyMcGhost wrote: »

Should not be called 'real time'

It's a glorified digital timetable

The FAQ says it uses the busses current location to predict when it will arrive so it isn't just a digital timetable. Then again it also says

"The multi-operator, multi-city web service will be bilingual. This is one of the requirements for developing stage 2 of the web service. This is due to be available at the start of 2012."

so maybe the FAQ isn't quite real time either.

devnull · 01-09-2017 01:35PM

ChikiChiki wrote: »

The leap card delay when tagging on. It should be instant. It all accumulates to a serious amount of time wasted for all.

Unfortunately the big bottleneck is the ticket machines because they are based on early 90s desktop computer architecture and the ticket machines themselves were superseeded by a newer model around the same time as Dublin Bus installed the older model in 2006.

LionelNashe · 01-09-2017 01:38PM

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Haven't lived in Dublin for a while, but do all the timetables still have only the departure times from the terminus displayed at every single stop? Meaning, if you have no idea how far you are from the terminus, or how what route the bes takes before it gets to that specifci stop, then it's impossible to deduce what time the bus actually gets to your stop at (not that it's any easier if you do and it's more than a few stops down the line)?
...

Yes, but it doesn't matter any more, because a lot of stops, and every smart phone, tells you how many minutes it is until the next bus arrives, updated in real time.

Mrs OBumble · 01-09-2017 01:52PM

thelad95 wrote: »

Cash on city buses is something that has been eliminated in some European cities since the turn of the millennium, yet here we still are counting out change. What's even more stupid is people with a leap card still having to interact with the driver in the vast majority of cases

Using a Leap card to pay for a city service takes even longer than paying in cash and having change dispensed back to you.

Lack of back or middle doors on buses - makes loading/unloading time at busy stops take 25% longer than it should. (Yes, I know some in Dublin have 'em now, but 1/2 of us don't live in Dublin.)

Annie get your Run · 01-09-2017 01:59PM

osarusan wrote: »

Was just about to post that. More than once, I've seen a 'real' bus time get closer, then closer, then due, then just fall off the bottom of the screen.

Or worse, bus shows on the online realtime display and then disappears about 20 mins before it's due to arrive at that stop, but still shows up at the originally predicted time :rolleyes:. A regular occurrence on my bus route.

Edit: another bug bear of mine is that there is no information on when your bus is destined to arrive at a particular stop - it's not like the information isn't there, it just isn't shown to the customer.

LeinsterDub · 01-09-2017 02:05PM

Via i Lar

marno21 · 01-09-2017 02:15PM

Deedsie wrote: »

Buses getting caught in traffic congestion. No such thing as a bus lane in towns outside the cities. I type this sitting on a X12 "expressway" bus crawling through Portlaoise. Bus is half an hour late because of this. How much would a bus lane/cycle lane cost through Portlaoise? Absolute bull**** trying to rely on buses when they are forced to use the same infrastructure as private cars.

Where are you going to? There is a train service out of Portlaoise, and the Electric Picnic is on. You could easily have predicted this would happen

marno21 · 01-09-2017 02:18PM

Trains packed to bursting entering Dublin in the mornings leaving passengers on platforms while mostly empty carriages requiring €550 operating subsidy per passenger journey trundle through the countryside

Empty Expressway buses running parallel to rail lines with similarly timed trains

Inefficient quirks of the Irish public transport system

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