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Sold car, gave logbook. Owner no longer wants the car

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  • 30-08-2017 12:36pm
    #1
    mordajedna
    Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭


    I have recently sold the car.
    The car had new nct etc.
    After inspection, the new owner paid me the agreed amount.
    (bank transfer so there is a proof of it)

    Now:
    I have given the log book to the new owner. (I know, my stupid mistake!)

    Apparently, the timing chain in the car has snapped.
    The new owner now wants to return the non-working car claiming that it is still technically mine. He refuses to sign the change of ownership documents. He also wants to drop the car at my apartment.

    Has anyone been in this situation? What can I do?
    Tagged:


«134

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    #2
    oppenheimer1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,084 ✭✭✭oppenheimer1


    Could you apply for a replacement cert and transfer registration using that?


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    #3
    Cee-Jay-Cee
    Registered Users Posts: 12,235 ✭✭✭✭Cee-Jay-Cee


    When did you sell him the car?

    You can tell him that you have proof he paid you and that he had the car inspected. You are not liable for anything as you are a private seller and not a dealer. Tell him you have informed the Vehicle Registration people in Shannon of his details (which I presume you at least have) and that you do not want the vehicle as it is paid for and his.


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    #4
    TheShow
    Registered Users Posts: 1,157 ✭✭✭TheShow


    Not that it matters, but how long has the car been in the new owners possession. You cant be held responsible for what happens after you sell the car. Buyer Beware. I'm not sure how you can transfer ownership if he wont agree to sign the form. Might need some legal involvement.


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    #5
    oppenheimer1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,084 ✭✭✭oppenheimer1


    Just don't forget OP, you're in the position of strength here. He wants his money back from you. If you do nothing, nothing will happen.

    Seeing as the car is kaput it's not going to be racking up fines in your name either.


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    #6
    mordajedna
    Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭mordajedna


    I sold the car last Saturday.
    I have contacted the department of transport in Shannon and they will send me the documents to set me as me the last registered owner (car is no longer mine but no details of the new owner).

    The owner claims that somehow I must have known about the issue.

    It's a headache.


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    #7
    Isambard
    Registered Users Posts: 5,796 ✭✭✭Isambard


    oppenheimer1 wrote: »
    Just don't forget OP, you're in the position of strength here. He wants his money back from you. If you do nothing, nothing will happen.

    Seeing as the car is kaput it's not going to be racking up fines in your name either.

    If it is indeed kaput. Beware the buyer looking for some of the money back.


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    #8
    everlast75
    Registered Users Posts: 18,981 ✭✭✭✭everlast75


    Was the car (over)due a new timing belt?

    Was the buyer aware of this when the car was bought?


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    #9
    mordajedna
    Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭mordajedna


    The car has a timing chain. These normally don't need replacement but in the service record, there was a receipt from a garage that did replace the timing chain few k km ago.


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    #10
    colm_mcm
    Registered Users Posts: 73,382 ✭✭✭✭colm_mcm


    Not your problem. Chain was obviously intact when they bought it


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    #11
    godtabh
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 23,204 Mod ✭✭✭✭godtabh


    I'd sent one more text/email stating sold as seen and dont deal with him further.

    Get the change of ownership sorted with Shannon and persists just ignore him


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    #12
    Del2005
    Registered Users Posts: 18,872 ✭✭✭✭Del2005


    OSI wrote: »
    He bought the car as seen. Unless he can prove you deliberately misled him, tell him to **** off.

    Unless the car is dangerous there is no comeback on a private sale. Then they'd need to proof that the seller knew it was dangerous and for an ordinary private seller that's nearly impossible.

    The fact that the buyer is saying that the timing belt went on a car with a timing chain would lead me to think that they are trying some type of scam.


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    #13
    BrokenArrows
    Registered Users Posts: 7,500 ✭✭✭BrokenArrows


    Dont worry about anything OP. He cant force you to return money and cant force you to take the car back.

    You should get the replacement documents and register his name as a new owner.

    Secondly you should inform him of the garage details where the replacement chain was fitted and get the garage to take responsibility as they shouldnt break that quickly.


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    #14
    XsApollo
    Registered Users Posts: 2,391 ✭✭✭XsApollo


    How much did they pay for the car?
    What car was it?
    What kind of person was it?
    What kind of person are you?.
    Not being smart there just wondering the logistics of deal.
    Legally they don't have a leg to stand on.

    But if it's a couple with kids or a person that's after dropping a lot of dough on a nice car and then now being in the position of having nothing and they could be in trouble Financially and now in the Sh*t.

    Depending on the type of person you are you could say FYou and ignore them.
    Or you could offer a few quid back to help them get it fixed.
    If it genuinely snapped and they are honest people depending on the money involved you could offer something back
    Towards the repair.
    You would be facing the bill now yourself if it is genuine.

    Anyway some of the responses just seem a bit harsh.


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    #15
    MarkR
    Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators Posts: 11,054 Mod ✭✭✭✭MarkR


    XsApollo wrote: »
    How much did they pay for the car?
    What car was it?
    What kind of person was it?
    What kind of person are you?.
    Not being smart there just wondering the logistics of deal.
    Legally they don't have a leg to stand on.

    But if it's a couple with kids or a person that's after dropping a lot of dough on a nice car and then now being in the position of having nothing and they could be in trouble Financially and now in the Sh*t.

    Depending on the type of person you are you could say FYou and ignore them.
    Or you could offer a few quid back to help them get it fixed.
    If it genuinely snapped and they are honest people depending on the money involved you could offer something back
    Towards the repair.
    You would be facing the bill now yourself if it is genuine.

    Anyway some of the responses just seem a bit harsh.

    Genuine or not, he sold the car as is. If they wanted a guarantee, they should have gotten it from a dealer. I don't think anyone is going to swallow the cost of a new engine, even if it was a boatload of nuns who bought the car.


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    #16
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    XsApollo wrote: »
    If it genuinely snapped and they are honest people depending on the money

    OP can't be held responsible for their problems.


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    #17
    XsApollo
    Registered Users Posts: 2,391 ✭✭✭XsApollo


    What goes around comes around.
    If they are after dropping 20k on a 520d
    What's a grand or 2 to help them sort it.

    I wouldn't swallow the cost of a new engine either btw.
    I'm just saying I wouldn't be so quick to block their number and ignore depending on the circumstances.
    We don't know the circumstances.


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    #18
    shaunr68
    Registered Users Posts: 555 ✭✭✭shaunr68


    XsApollo wrote: »
    What's a grand or 2 to help them sort it.
    My roof is leaking. Could you send me a cheque please?

    Seriously, it's unfortunate for the buyer but the OP did absolutely nothing wrong and bears no responsibility for ongoing repairs to a car that does not belong to him/her.


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    #19
    TheShow
    Registered Users Posts: 1,157 ✭✭✭TheShow


    mordajedna wrote: »
    The car has a timing chain. These normally don't need replacement but in the service record, there was a receipt from a garage that did replace the timing chain few k km ago.

    Are you a dealer or was this a bone fide private sale?
    From what you've said above in bold it seems to suggest that you were not in possession of the car for long. Was the timing chain replaced when the car was in your possession or a previous owner? as you say a few K KM ago, few months?


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    #20
    XsApollo
    Registered Users Posts: 2,391 ✭✭✭XsApollo


    shaunr68 wrote: »
    My roof is leaking. Could you send me a cheque please?

    Seriously, it's unfortunate for the buyer but the OP did absolutely nothing wrong and bears no responsibility for ongoing repairs to a car that does not belong to him/her.

    I wouldn't send you a cheque if that's how you would return the favour. ;-)


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    #21
    XsApollo
    Registered Users Posts: 2,391 ✭✭✭XsApollo


    MarkR wrote: »
    Genuine or not, he sold the car as is. If they wanted a guarantee, they should have gotten it from a dealer. I don't think anyone is going to swallow the cost of a new engine, even if it was a boatload of nuns who bought the car.

    Legally yea.
    What would you do?
    If I bought a 20k car off yourself.
    Met at your house paid the cash, signed the logbook and on my way out the garden the chain snapped.
    Would you push me out the rest of the drive lock the gates behind me and say see ya later sucker.


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    #22
    com1
    Registered Users Posts: 458 ✭✭com1


    mordajedna wrote: »
    I have recently sold the car.

    Now:
    I have given the log book to the new owner. (I know, my stupid mistake!)



    OP can I ask why you gave the buyer the log book? did they ask for it or pressure you in any way to give it to them rather than send it to Shannon yourself?


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    #23
    Henry Ford III
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 17,620 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III


    XsApollo wrote: »
    Legally yea.
    What would you do?
    If I bought a 20k car off yourself.
    Met at your house paid the cash, signed the logbook and on my way out the garden the chain snapped.
    Would you push me out the rest of the drive lock the gates behind me and say see ya later sucker.

    I'd be a bit more sensitive but a private sale has no warranty regardless if a failure happens, or when. That's one of the reasons they are generally cheaper than a dealer sale.


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    #24
    TJJP
    Registered Users Posts: 1,523 ✭✭✭TJJP


    XsApollo wrote: »
    We don't know the circumstances.

    We do. They bought the car privately. Caveat emptor.


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    #25
    mordajedna
    Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭mordajedna


    We are not talking about 20k car.

    More like €3000. It was a private sale outside of my apartment.

    I have been driving the car daily for about a month (I am into cars and I was bored of my daily drive) without any problems. Went on few trips to Kildare/Maynooth because the roads are fun. I did the NCT just before the sale as the car needed few minor bits replaced. Talking about spark plugs, tires, brake pads and a headlamp.

    There was a receipt for timing chain replacement in the service history done about 10k or 15 000 km ago. The previous owner paid over 1.2€k for it.

    I fully understand how the buyer feels but the car was absolutely fine at the point of sale and I had no problems with it before. He tries to tell me that I somehow knew about the timing chain?! WTF.

    Also the owner never specifically said it's the timing chain. He actually said "belt" and that the car is "totalled" and "needs entire new engine".

    I gave the log book tot he owner in good faith that he will send it to Shannon. I had a proof of transaction and I thought i'd appear more genuine.I was also painting my apartment so my head was not in the right place.


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    #26
    bazz26
    Registered Users Posts: 51,114 ✭✭✭✭bazz26


    I hate dealing with buyers like this, they have no concept of a private sale, they want to buy privately because it's cheaper on their pocket than buying from a dealer but they still expect the same level of protection when something goes wrong.

    Yes it's unfortunate that the timing chain snapped but when you buy privately the risk is always higher. Also timing chains usually rattle before they snap or come off the tensioners, surely they or their mechanic would have spotted that?


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    #27
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users Posts: 28,666 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    Sold as seen.. they checked it out and were happy to hand over the cash as a result. Unfortunate that this has happened, but not your problem OP

    This stuff though (and you see a lot of these threads) is why I'd always pay more and buy/sell through a reputable dealer unless it was for money I could afford to write-off if it came to it.
    Not having to deal with some of the chancers and time-wasters I read about here - plus having some sort of actual warranty/come-back - is worth paying the extra IMO


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    #28
    Kenny Logins
    Registered Users Posts: 9,061 ✭✭✭Kenny Logins


    mordajedna wrote: »

    Also the owner never specifically said it's the timing chain. He actually said "belt" and that the car is "totalled" and "needs entire new engine".

    I find it very suspicious that a chain would break at all, never mind after just 15k km...

    As somebody said earlier, your buyer should take it up with the garage that did the chain.


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    #29
    TheShow
    Registered Users Posts: 1,157 ✭✭✭TheShow


    its a tough pill to swallow for the buyer, but swallow he will have to. the only comeback he/she may have is the garage. if it was done properly it should not snap after 10/15k km., that is if the garage will entertain the request from the second owner since they completed the work.


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    #30
    I love Sean nos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,360 ✭✭✭I love Sean nos


    mordajedna wrote: »
    After inspection, the new owner paid me the agreed amount.
    (bank transfer so there is a proof of it)
    You have his money. Keep it. There's no problem.


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    #31
    the_syco
    Registered Users Posts: 37,295 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    Del2005 wrote: »
    The fact that the buyer is saying that the timing belt went on a car with a timing chain would lead me to think that they are trying some type of scam.
    Agreed.
    XsApollo wrote: »
    Or you could offer a few quid back to help them get it fixed.
    If it genuinely snapped and they are honest people depending on the money involved you could offer something back
    Towards the repair.
    That'd be admitting liability, and could be seen as knowing there was a fault. Best off not doing this.
    Kenny Logins wrote: »
    As somebody said earlier, your buyer should take it up with the garage that did the chain.
    Garage could ask the new owner to prove that the car had regular services to ensure that there was regular oil top-ups, to ensure the oil didn't run low, and thus cause an issue with the belt. Or the garage could say that they will only deal with whomever they did the timing chain for.

    =-=

    For all we know, the new owner could have tried to do an oil change, did it badly, and caused the chain to snap. Too many unknown variables.

    OP; the car is sold. If they wanted comeback, they should have bought from a dealer.


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