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Parent not paying tax so cannot receive grant, please help.

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2

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    #32
    Millicent
    Registered Users Posts: 4,559 ✭✭✭Millicent


    Do you know if there are any scholarships or hardship grants run through the college? I know UCD offers funding to certain students who qualify through the UCD Foundation. Not sure about other colleges but worth ringing the student union of your particular college to make enquiries.

    Sorry you're stuck in this position, OP. :(


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    #33
    Delphinium
    Closed Accounts Posts: 203 ✭✭Delphinium


    Your mother will come under scrutiny sooner or later and it's best she gets her affairs in order. If she is paying rates she must have a business premises or industrial unit rented. Commercial leases are easy for revenue to trace.
    Try to get her to face up to the reality.
    Are you the eldest? This is going to be a recurring problem if the others are younger and will face the same problem.

    Surely she recognises the work you must have done to gain a college place and she should not put obstacles in your way.

    She will pay penalties for not making returns, irrespective of any amount of tax owed.


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    #34
    Imstucklads
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭Imstucklads


    Delphinium wrote: »
    Your mother will come under scrutiny sooner or later and it's best she gets her affairs in order. If she is paying rates she must have a business premises or industrial unit rented. Commercial leases are easy for revenue to trace.
    Try to get her to face up to the reality.
    Are you the eldest? This is going to be a recurring problem if the others are younger and will face the same problem.

    Surely she recognises the work you must have done to gain a college place and she should not put obstacles in your way.

    She will pay penalties for not making returns, irrespective of any amount of tax owed.

    I'm not the eldest. There are two younger than me. One is doing the leaving next year as well. I feel so cheated by my mother, I have the chance to further myself but due to her I will now have tremendous difficulty trying to take it. I'm more worried for when she does get caught. And what will happen to my younger sibling when she's prosecuted and could face jail since he isn't even 10.

    And yes she's leasing a unit


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    #35
    sunnyt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23 ✭sunnyt


    Hi there. Depending on where you go to college you should contact the on campus/local branch of the bank affiliated with the university/college. Some offer interest free loans which may help you get started. UCD has a student hardship fund as mentioned above. I'm sure other colleges probably do too. Don't report your own mother. You're angry now and you would regret it. You sound very mature and you're obviously smart so help her do things right from here on in. It is a bit of a role reversal but being a single mam to five kids is hard. Talk to the student advisors in your college also as they might be able to help too! Good luck.


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    #36
    jimmycrackcorm
    Registered Users Posts: 14,329 ✭✭✭✭jimmycrackcorm


    Imstucklads wrote:
    He walked out on my mother and 4 brothers and sisters when I was 3. I have no contact with him what so ever. He wouldn't even know what I look like.

    There's nothing you can do without providing the details. It would be in your mother's interest to let you enter the details and she registers her income because at some point she is going to get caught out anyway.


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    #37
    LollipopJimmy
    Registered Users Posts: 5,437 ✭✭✭LollipopJimmy


    Imstucklads wrote: »
    I'm not the eldest. There are two younger than me. One is doing the leaving next year as well. I feel so cheated by my mother, I have the chance to further myself but due to her I will now have tremendous difficulty trying to take it. I'm more worried for when she does get caught. And what will happen to my younger sibling when she's prosecuted and could face jail since he isn't even 10.

    And yes she's leasing a unit

    Here, your mother is putting food on the table for a family of 5 plus herself without handouts from the state. Yes she's made errors but wind in your neck there now and catch yourself on. Help her get sorted and registered, research it and help her register the business and set herself up as a sole trader rather than threaten to report her.


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    #38
    rizdub
    Registered Users Posts: 55 ✭✭rizdub


    i think you are being harsh on your mother as u have no idea how difficult it is to take care of 5 kids .. that too being a single parent !!

    she could have easily sat at home on social welfare and 5 child benefits , instead she chose to work..
    now as a young educated child its your responsibility to help your mom sort this issue ..
    cool down and help ur mom and in turn help yourself and ur siblings


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    #39
    billybonkers
    Registered Users Posts: 2,293 ✭✭✭billybonkers


    Maybe look into a go fund me, just a suggestion


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    #40
    ace_irl
    Registered Users Posts: 274 ✭✭ace_irl


    rizdub wrote: »
    i think you are being harsh on your mother as u have no idea how difficult it is to take care of 5 kids .. that too being a single parent !!

    she could have easily sat at home on social welfare and 5 child benefits , instead she chose to work..
    now as a young educated child its your responsibility to help your mom sort this issue ..
    cool down and help ur mom and in turn help yourself and ur siblings

    It will never be the responsibility of a child to fix the mistakes of a parent, they've done their job already by going to school and getting into college. The op clearly has enough going on right now with out any added responsibility.

    Op, go to the credit union and set up an account with them. Put as much money in as you can spare to start your savings (even €100 will be plenty) Explain to them that you are going to college and you may have to get a loan to help cover your fees. Every week add a bit of money to this, even if it's only €10.

    In the meantime, have a read through this

    http://www.revenue.ie/en/starting-a-business/registering-for-tax/how-to-register-for-tax-as-a-sole-trader.aspx

    That should have all the information your mum needs to get registered. It's simple enough, explain that to her and then get her to contact an accountant. They'll do everything up, register her and prepare accounts. They can file all necessary paper work too and have her up and running and fully tax legal in no time.


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    #41
    Turnipman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 789 ✭✭✭Turnipman


    Imstucklads wrote: »
    Also, wouldn't revenue want to know why she hasn't been paying tax for a couple of years? This is what she's worried of I believe

    Ask her gently:

    (a) if she genuinely believes that she's going to get away with tax evasion for the rest of her working life;

    and

    (b) whether she thinks that depriving each of her 5 kids in turn of the opportunity to go to third level - after they have flogged themselves to achieve a good leaving cert - is good parenting.

    And point out that if she approaches Revenue before they catch her, she'll be handled in a much more gentle way.

    As a matter of interest, do you reckon that her business is profitable, or is she just about keeping her head above water? Because if she's not making much money then she really hasn't got much to worry about.


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    #42
    Imstucklads
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭Imstucklads


    Turnipman wrote: »
    Ask her gently:

    (a) if she genuinely believes that she's going to get away with tax evasion for the rest of her working life;

    and

    (b) whether she thinks that depriving each of her 5 kids in turn of the opportunity to go to third level - after they have flogged themselves to achieve a good leaving cert - is good parenting.

    And point out that if she approaches Revenue before they catch her, she'll be handled in a much more gentle way.

    As a matter of interest, do you reckon that her business is profitable, or is she just about keeping her head above water? Because if she's not making much money then she really hasn't got much to worry about.

    She makes enough to feed us and pay for rent and bills. I've seen her bank balance and it's not enough to even pay my student contribution. We're in a very rural area too. I'm going to keep at her now to get registered. She's just so worried about the backtax and not being able to pay it when she doesn't register.


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    #43
    ace_irl
    Registered Users Posts: 274 ✭✭ace_irl


    Imstucklads wrote: »
    She makes enough to feed us and pay for rent and bills. I've seen her bank balance and it's not enough to even pay my student contribution. We're in a very rural area too. I'm going to keep at her now to get registered. She's just so worried about the backtax and not being able to pay it when she doesn't register.

    She will only have tax to pay if she made a profit. As a sole trader she wont be taxed on the money she takes out and uses but the overall profit that was made.

    Revenue can be very reasonable to deal with when it comes to these things. If she had a tax bill they can organise payment plans or give her time to get a loan and pay the bill.

    She'll have to pay them eventually, best to do it on her own terms then to be audited and published on the defaulters list.

    It's hard to advise further without knowing what business she's in as there are always other taxes to consider such as VAT but speak with an accountant, Most firms, especially smaller ones will offer the initial consultation free of charge and it can be a great help.


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    #44
    marriedcouple
    Registered Users Posts: 6 ✭marriedcouple


    I'd start with the student union or advice centre in your university. And put a little away each week with the CU too as suggested. Do a balancing statement P21 at the end of the year in case you are due tax back. That might offset the Jan blues. Can the reg fee be paid in installments? Then re your mum if it's rural based there may be an enterprise centre in her locality whom you could put her in touch with and they should be able to help her out with getting her tax affairs in order. They will be very approachable and practical I their assistance.


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    #45
    august12
    Registered Users Posts: 1,275 ✭✭✭august12


    Imstucklads wrote:
    He walked out on my mother and 4 brothers and sisters when I was 3. I have no contact with him what so ever. He wouldn't even know what I look like.


    Well that makes Susi application easier, no separation agreement to provide or maintenance but you will have to prove you are not getting any assistance from him, this usually requires a p21 from revenue for pay workers or a notice of assessment and final set of accounts for 2016 for your mother. Get all.the other documents you need i.e. birth certs, proof of residency in Ireland for three of last 5 years i.e.junior cert results or something official with your name and address confirming you were living in Ireland. You might need other family members birth cert as there is an increase in income allowance for your mother's earnings if she has four or more dependent children. Get working on finding a good accountant.


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    #46
    august12
    Registered Users Posts: 1,275 ✭✭✭august12


    jimmycrackcorm wrote:
    Here does she manage to pay rates yet not be registered.


    Rates are paid to local county council, nothing to do with revenue.


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    #47
    august12
    Registered Users Posts: 1,275 ✭✭✭august12


    Imstucklads wrote:
    I'm currently in a full time job. I'll hopefully be able to stay on there for Saturdays and Sundays weekly to make money. I don't have a credit Union account either. I'm going to open one asap though. Will they grant me a loan straight away or how does it work with them?


    Be aware that your income will be added to your mother's when calculating for grant, there is some amount disallowed but any income you earn during college term is all added as far as I know, about 3000 is ignored but this is only deducted if earned during your holidays i.e. Christmas, Easter and summer if you follow, you might need to check the t and c of the grant to find this info.


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    #48
    august12
    Registered Users Posts: 1,275 ✭✭✭august12


    Sam Kade wrote:
    Either way revenue will want accounts going back 6-7 years and if there was tax due they will be demanding payment.


    This is not always the case.


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    #49
    august12
    Registered Users Posts: 1,275 ✭✭✭august12


    Imstucklads wrote:
    She makes enough to feed us and pay for rent and bills. I've seen her bank balance and it's not enough to even pay my student contribution. We're in a very rural area too. I'm going to keep at her now to get registered. She's just so worried about the backtax and not being able to pay it when she doesn't register.


    Don't worry about this, if she hasn't even enough to pay for your reg fee, then she obviously hasn't been squirreling away millions in off shore tax havens, first and foremost, get an accountant, there must be a local one with a good reputation, considering your mother has her own business, then she must have friends who are self employed, discreetly find out who their accountant is, contact them and let them do the registration. Dont waste your time looking up revenue about registration. If last year's accounts are sorted, then ye can worry about previous years later.


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    #50
    Sam Kade
    Registered Users Posts: 12,313 ✭✭✭✭Sam Kade


    august12 wrote: »
    This is not always the case.

    Are you saying they let some people off while going back years with others.


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    #51
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users Posts: 43,024 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    Rat your own mother out to revenue??

    Is this for real?


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    #52
    LionelNashe
    Registered Users Posts: 1,961 ✭✭✭LionelNashe


    Keep your job, and don't go to college. You can always go in the future (or not).


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    #53
    Delphinium
    Closed Accounts Posts: 203 ✭✭Delphinium


    How long has your mother been running her business? Looks like she is not earning a lot but she must be drawing wages of some sort. Cannot emphasise enough that it has to be sorted. I presume she doesn't have employees.
    As a tax payer, depending on the type of enterprise, she could have employed the children part time, get them to genuinely do work and pay them, on reduced rates of PRSI.
    Reduces her income and provides them with saving for college.
    You are not ratting on her. The axe will fall eventually, eg when she retires she will have to apply for pension....
    Fess up before they catch her, always better.
    Death and taxes cannot be avoided.


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    #54
    Turnipman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 789 ✭✭✭Turnipman


    Another reason for her to register is that she'll then be able to pay PRSI which, in time, will make her eligible for the State Contributory Pension.

    So as well as being in your and your siblings' short term interests, it's also in her long term interest.


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    #55
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users Posts: 43,024 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    Delphinium wrote: »
    How long has your mother been running her business? Looks like she is not earning a lot but she must be drawing wages of some sort. Cannot emphasise enough that it has to be sorted. I presume she doesn't have employees.
    As a tax payer, depending on the type of enterprise, she could have employed the children part time, get them to genuinely do work and pay them, on reduced rates of PRSI.
    Reduces her income and provides them with saving for college.
    You are not ratting on her. The axe will fall eventually, eg when she retires she will have to apply for pension....
    Fess up before they catch her, always better.
    Death and taxes cannot be avoided.

    I'm sure the mother knows exactly where she is at tax wise and has protected her children from the reality of the situation like any good parent would

    And to do all that and then be ratted out by her own flesh and blood

    Despicable behavior


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    #56
    elperello
    Registered Users Posts: 14,316 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    august12 wrote: »
    Don't worry about this, if she hasn't even enough to pay for your reg fee, then she obviously hasn't been squirreling away millions in off shore tax havens, first and foremost, get an accountant, there must be a local one with a good reputation, considering your mother has her own business, then she must have friends who are self employed, discreetly find out who their accountant is, contact them and let them do the registration. Dont waste your time looking up revenue about registration. If last year's accounts are sorted, then ye can worry about previous years later.


    +1 on this advice and don't forget to tell her that accountants fees are an allowable expense.


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    #57
    gizmo81
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,695 ✭✭✭gizmo81


    judeboy101 wrote: »
    True, but its a cheek to ask the state for financial help via susi while condoning potential tax evasion

    The OP has done nothing wrong. He is a child of the state and entitled to support just like any other.

    :mad:


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    #58
    Markiemarkso
    Registered Users Posts: 41 ✭Markiemarkso


    What kind of business does she run?
    Based on the fact that she is a single mother with children in school, she would only pay tax on her profits over €21k in the year, i.e the first 400 a week would be covered by her tax credits.


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    #59
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users Posts: 43,024 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    She will probably just get done for late filing of returns


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    #60
    CiarraiAbu2
    Registered Users Posts: 582 ✭✭✭CiarraiAbu2


    Just file 2016, its self assessment so the accountant will file whatever she tells him/her. More than likely they won't go back any further than last year. Don't have the figs here but will have about 18k tax free but will get caught for prsi and usc but as always lower is better.


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    #61
    jimmycrackcorm
    Registered Users Posts: 14,329 ✭✭✭✭jimmycrackcorm


    gizmo81 wrote:
    The OP has done nothing wrong. He is a child of the state and entitled to support just like any other.

    That's not the point, which is that the household income has to be explained. Susi share information with the revenue so it will come up on the system.

    CiarraiAbu2 wrote:
    Just file 2016, its self assessment so the accountant will file whatever she tells him/her. More than likely they won't go back any further than last year. Don't have the figs here but will have about 18k tax free but will get caught for prsi and usc but as always lower is better.

    This gets over the hurdle. Everything what can be sorted out later.


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