ISIS Terrorist Attack in Barcelona

tomwaterford wrote: »

I know Japanese and they have a different word for Japanese heritage and people from it vs citizenship :D:D

Thanks for backing up my point that Japanese don't consider someone who is not of the Yamato race Japanese even if they have Japanese citizenship or were born in Japan.

gitzy16v wrote: »

My parents are bringing my 2 young boys to Spain tomorrow for a weeks holiday.

i know the phrase is a tired old cliche but you cant let terrorists stop your life,now dont get me wrong Im very nervous because I wont be there myself but my parents got me this far in life alive and well so I trust them to not take any silly risk and be extra vigilant.
Life goes on and to be honest Spain will probably be safer than any other country in Europe for the next few weeks.

I hope that is the case, I will just feel I'm going to be on edge over there next week but I know the Spanish authorities will be on high alert for the next while

prinzeugen wrote: »

Once again, a nutjob goes and kills.

It was for religious reasons.

You are uneducated if you think otherwise.

You're a fool if you think it was

There is no doubt that this is another despicable act committed by a corrupt and morally bankrupt religion. There is no doubt that Europe and the wider world has a problem with extremist Islam and it requires an exceptional response. I'm not going to cry whataboutism, we can condemn extremist islam alongside Nazism/Fascism/Marxism and any other deplorable ism. However be very wary of quick and easy sounding solutions to what is an extremely complex problem.

Stopping all muslim migration from today will do little to stem the spate of terror attacks. Granted it might have some minor positive effect, however it won't make it easier to lock up and deport Islamic extremists already in western countries. You could try interment but that is likely to embolden them give them a greater sense of injustice and serve as a recruitment tool just as it did in NI (and no I'm not trying to correlate the troubles with Islam terrorism). It won't stop ISIS or another of it's ilk ascending in middle the middle east, it may also destabilise places like Saudi Arabia and turn it into a North Korea on our doorstep. The trouble with giving the government the power to arrest, intern and deport people without due legal process, is that government is the most powerful institution on earth. It only needs to go a little wrong for it to do far more damage than Islamic terrorism could do on it's own. We have countless examples of governments born out of civil strife that end up far more brutal than what they rose up against.

We should also not stop helping those people in genuine need. It would be a deep moral failure if we are willing to let desperate people drown or starve to death fleeing the same terror we are now confronted with. We can help these people but we don't need to make them permanent residents. We can do alot more to set up refugee camps near conflict zone and improve conditions in them.

We need to attack the problem at it's root, which like it or not is fundamentalist Islam. Freedom of speech is not absolute in Europe, many European countries have laws against holocaust denial and Nazi symbology. You can serve time in prison for it, be deported and banned from entering certain countries. At it's core Islamism is essentially the same as fascism, it is composed of ethno religious supremacism and totalitarianism. Advocating sharia law, female and homosexual subjugation, forced conversions and other such repugnant ideas should merit the same treatment as fascist ideologies. Funding from the middle east of mosques should be outlawed. If muslims want to practice their religion they should fund it from within their own communities in Europe without nefarious influence from despotic middle eastern regimes. Cutting them off will to alot to allow them to evolve in a more moderate westernised direction.

Even that approach will take time to have an appreciable effect. Unfortunately we will see many more atrocities before the tide starts to turn, but there are no easy solutions.

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Some of the people who formed Isis were once members of the Baath party ( Saddam party) The set it up as insurgency against the Americans who invaded the country and to bring down the newly elected Iraq government. Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi was part of the Sunni insurgency and he got locked up by the Americans.

This attempt to blame the Yanks for everything really doesn't do anything to disprove my point of the origins of ISIS and Al Qaeda being the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan and their major figures having fought as Mujahideen in that conflict

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

He probably met more bad guys while in prison and they planned out the future of Isis. The Arab Spring in Syria supported by the West gave a platform for Isis to fight and gain more supporters and fighters.

Probably? Really? So the enlightenment of the Arab world and the realisation that they no longer have to live as slaves to theocratic regimes, thanks to technology and social media, is all the fault of the west? If anything that's a positive IMO.

By the very nature of the attacks, it would seem like it's a suicide mission to murder as many people as possible, before being killed.
When a guy goes on the 'run' he/she has some what failed their mission?

I wonder how many of these attacks are self motivated and not planned by a group.


Unfortunately there is no deterrent. We hear the term 'loan wolf' from the likes of CNN. I'd be in favour of some harsher punishments and extending the punishments to family. Not just for terrorist attacks. But if you have a little 14yr old **** with 50 convictions, then start looking up the parents.
if your son or daughter (regardless of age) goes on a rampage, then you get deported/arrested/fined. If you are a member of a church or group, then the heads of group/church are arrested until you can prove no involvement.

Sure you will upset people, USC upsets me, but it's for the good of the nation right???

Arghus wrote: »

The kind of scaremongering bullsh*t that you read in threads like this is exactly the stuff that leaves "terrorists" licking their lips.

Explain that a bit more.