Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2017

user2011 · 27-07-2017 09:26PM

astradave wrote: »

Oh how i wish we would sign Verratti

Can that be done on a cold wet windy night at Stoke, that's the question! :pac:

Mitch Connor · 27-07-2017 09:29PM

jayo26 wrote: »

But maybe jose does not want to spend that much on them either no one knows.

Why do you think Jose cares if we spend 40 or 50 on them? Do you think we are saving for a 5th signing?

Let's say we valued them both at 40m each, and needed to go to 50 for each - would you prefer we saved the 20m and potentially signed no one instead, or pay the 20m extra and sign the two players Jose has identified as needed in order to mount a title challenge?

Obviously signing them wouldn't mean a title tilt is a certainty never mind winning it but if Jose has indentured them as required, which would you prefer?

A further tangent on that, what if the extra 20m could be the difference between 5th and 4th or higher - so effectively that 20m buys the CL spot next season, how does that change people's opinion of paying the "crazy" fees?

Further again, with the transfer market having gone insane, what value do people put on Matic and Perisic now, and what value would they have put in them in April? If walker and mendy are going for 50, and sigburson isn't having a 40m+ bid rejected, what value are Matic and Perisic by extension?

Mitch Connor · 27-07-2017 09:39PM

A few papers flying the bale kite tomorrow. All say Jose would like him but none indicate an actual bid. Just looks like fluff pieces where they've nothing else to write, to me. Don't think any run the Castles line of Jose not believing the club would financially back such a move.

beno619 · 27-07-2017 09:49PM

jayo26 wrote: »

I think if he improves on last season he will be. Pogba needs to be over 10 goals a season and at least close to 20 goals in assists in my opinion.

For me it's simple. He has to start performing in big games.

irishman86 · 27-07-2017 09:52PM

jayo26 wrote: »

See it depends on what type of midfielder you want I think he is a top class midfielder and I am one of his biggest backers but in my opinion there are better attacking midfielders and they are better defensive midfielders.

I think pogba is probably one of the best passers but defensively he is not up there with the best.

I think hes up there in both attacking and defensive midfielders.
I dont see him playing either role mind, For me hes the middle man between those two positions
Im excited to see him with Herrera and Matic if he signs

27-07-2017 09:56PM

beno619 wrote: »

For me it's simple. He has to start performing in big games.

Like the EL final?

jayo26 · 27-07-2017 09:59PM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Why do you think Jose cares if we spend 40 or 50 on them? Do you think we are saving for a 5th signing?

Let's say we valued them both at 40m each, and needed to go to 50 for each - would you prefer we saved the 20m and potentially signed no one instead, or pay the 20m extra and sign the two players Jose has identified as needed in order to mount a title challenge?

Obviously signing them wouldn't mean a title tilt is a certainty never mind winning it but if Jose has indentured them as required, which would you prefer?

A further tangent on that, what if the extra 20m could be the difference between 5th and 4th or higher - so effectively that 20m buys the CL spot next season, how does that change people's opinion of paying the "crazy" fees?

Further again, with the transfer market having gone insane, what value do people put on Matic and Perisic now, and what value would they have put in them in April? If walker and mendy are going for 50, and sigburson isn't having a 40m+ bid rejected, what value are Matic and Perisic by extension?

It's not what I want Mitch if it was up to me I'd say pay whatever needs be as long as it didn't effect the club as most fans would but just because the club are hagling over the money i dont see it as a reason to criticise them for it.

In the short term ie this season yes it would probably be best of we did buy them but then next year when we go to sign a half decent 28 year old midfielder the selling club looks at it and says right so man United paid 50 million for perisic last season out player is nearly as good as him we want 60 or 70 million.

It's the same as paying 200 million for neymar if we go sign any half decent player next summernthenstarting price is going to be 100 million and that's exactly what will happen.

In regards to Jose I'm sure he will look at it similar too if he genuinely wants to stay at United past ten years of course he is going to try understand and work with what ed has to deal with.

Someone said mocking you earlier about reality and championship manager I don't agree with that I thought it was childish but to a certain extent it's true that every action in real life football has a good or bad outcome it's not as easy as pressing the plus sign until you buy a player.

0gac3yjefb5sv7 · 27-07-2017 10:07PM

beno619 wrote: »

For me it's simple. He has to start performing in big games.

Hate this term of playing well in big games. It's much more important to play consistently well at a very high level. Just because you play great in a semi finals or final shouldn't give you a pass to play ok at other times.

Mitch Connor · 27-07-2017 10:08PM

jayo26 wrote: »

It's not what I want Mitch if it was up to me I'd say pay whatever needs be as long as it didn't effect the club as most fans would but just because the club are hagling over the money i dont see it as a reason to criticise them for it.

In the short term ie this season yes it would probably be best of we did buy them but then next year when we go to sign a half decent 28 year old midfielder the selling club looks at it and says right so man United paid 50 million for perisic last season out player is nearly as good as him we want 60 or 70 million.

It's the same as paying 200 million for neymar if we go sign any half decent player next summernthenstarting price is going to be 100 million and that's exactly what will happen.

In regards to Jose I'm sure he will look at it similar too if he genuinely wants to stay at United past ten years of course he is going to try understand and work with what ed has to deal with.

Someone said mocking you earlier about reality and championship manager I don't agree with that I thought it was childish but to a certain extent it's true that every action in real life football has a good or bad outcome it's not as easy as pressing the plus sign until you buy a player.

Fair enough. I have a differing opinion on some of the points but I get your reasoning.

adox · 27-07-2017 10:11PM

Two things Pogba isn't.

The best midfielder in the world.

An all round midfielder.

I'm baffled how anyone can think that.

Defensively he's extremely poor if you want to look at him as a complete midfielder. His positional sense and discipline in that sense is very poor.

He's a very talented boy and can with the right set up, be our star man, but let's not get silly about it.

adox · 27-07-2017 10:12PM

Pheonix10 wrote: »

Hate this term of playing well in big games. It's much more important to play consistently well at a very high level. Just because you play great in a semi finals or final shouldn't give you a pass to play ok at other times.

He was annonymous in a lot of the big league games last season. That's not good enough.

0gac3yjefb5sv7 · 27-07-2017 10:17PM

adox wrote: »

He was annonymous in a lot of the big league games last season. That's not good enough.

I don't care if he isn't good enough in 10pc of games against any opposition once he is top class in 90. He did very well all season overall.

Robson99 · 27-07-2017 10:21PM

Sebastian Dangerfield wrote: »

Theres a big difference. The other clubs in the leagues you refer to cant possibly compete either in money or prestige, so Real and Barca only have to compete with other, and Bayern dont have to compete at all. Its not as cut and dried in England, 5-6 team can turn the race for a promising player into a case of who offers the most £, and one good season can turn a previously average player into a 50m pound one

There are only 3 teams in England who are capable of competing financially for a player. Utd city and Chelsea.
Our league positions for the past few years have been pathetic. A title challenge is a must this season with the money we will have spent.

jayo26 · 27-07-2017 10:23PM

adox wrote: »

Two things Pogba isn't.

The best midfielder in the world.

An all round midfielder.

I'm baffled how anyone can think that.

Defensively he's extremely poor if you want to look at him as a complete midfielder. His positional sense and discipline in that sense is very poor.

He's a very talented boy and can with the right set up, be our star man, but let's not get silly about it.

I'm baffled how someone says he is poor defensively.. He ain't no defensive warrior that's for sure but he can put in a good tackle and intercept very well.

adox · 27-07-2017 10:24PM

Pheonix10 wrote: »

I don't care if he isn't good enough in 10pc of games against any opposition once he is top class in 90. He did very well all season overall.

If he was top class for 90% of games it would be a minor miracle. Also with those stats he would be putting in top class performances against a lot of top teams which he didn't.

0gac3yjefb5sv7 · 27-07-2017 10:29PM

adox wrote: »

If he was top class for 90% of games it would be a minor miracle. Also with those stats he would be putting in top class performances against a lot of top teams which he didn't.

Yes he did. You seem to have an agenda against him tbh.

adox · 27-07-2017 10:33PM

jayo26 wrote: »

I'm baffled how someone says he is poor defensively.. He ain't no defensive warrior that's for sure but he can put in a good tackle and intercept very well.

He may be able to put in a good take and inter cross when in position but more often than not he isn't.

Defence is by far the weakest past of his have at the moment. His positional instinct for a traditional midfielder is poor. He needs players stilling him to do his stuff. He needs them there to compensate for his deficiencies.

It's just funny to call him a complete midfielder. He isn't. He's a highly talented footballer that is amazingly gifted but needs a team set up around him to do his stuff. That's why he was so underwhelming for chunks of the season last year and anonymous against the likes of Liverpool. We just don't have the team to accommodate him and his strengths at the moment.

If we don't sign a good DM then we wedding see the best of Pogba again next season and the team will struggle again.

Robson99 · 27-07-2017 10:39PM

Rod Munch wrote: »

It's abundantly clear we need a DM and a wide man so if we are to have ambitions at going for the PL (which given the investment so far should be the minimum) so until that happens we won't be bothering the league leaders I fear.

If Jose wants Peresic then pay the £50m, likewise with Matic or whoever.

Exactly

Who here can put an exact price on Matic or any player for that matter??
Simple answer is no one. Chelsea have a player they are happy to keep but know we want him. So they ask enough and if we want him that badly then we give it or agree close to it.
Who honestly gives a **** here whether its 45m 50m or 55m??
Is he worth it no but neither was Pogba worth his fee last year, Virgil van dyke is not a 60m player nor keita a 70m player. But we wanted Pogba and had to pay it and the Scouse will have to pay over the top if they want them two. City also paid ott for full backs buts thats the way the market is. The only real value so far was Bonucci.
So if we want the player who cares about another 10 or 20%

S.M.B. · 27-07-2017 10:39PM

jayo26 wrote: »

I'm baffled how someone says he is poor defensively.. He ain't no defensive warrior that's for sure but he can put in a good tackle and intercept very well.

It's not his inability to tackle and intercept that makes him poor at that role. As stated it's his positional sense and discipline that's currently an issue. I would also add his over confidence in some of his positive attributes often leads to loss of possession in crucial areas.

adox · 27-07-2017 10:41PM

Pheonix10 wrote: »

Yes he did. You seem to have an agenda against him tbh.

Yes he did what?

I have a different opinion than you on a player so I must have an agenda against him? Ha.

I don't have an agenda against any player. Why would I? I'm an adult.

I'm giving my opinion on him. I'm responding to the completely Ott fawning from some calling him the best midfielder in the world and a complete midfielder.

jimmytwotimes 2013 · 27-07-2017 10:42PM

Darmian flying to Milan, Perisic deal possibly includes him. Apologies if already posted. Cud be bull too. Chances of it being bull, 90+%, but shur.

https://twitter.com/utdreport/status/890702025566113792

jayo26 · 27-07-2017 10:43PM

adox wrote: »

He may be able to put in a good take and inter cross when in position but more often than not he isn't.

Defence is by far the weakest past of his have at the moment. His positional instinct for a traditional midfielder is poor. He needs players stilling him to do his stuff. He needs them there to compensate for his deficiencies.

It's just funny to call him a complete midfielder. He isn't. He's a highly talented footballer that is amazingly gifted but needs a team set up around him to do his stuff. That's why he was so underwhelming for chunks of the season last year and anonymous against the likes of Liverpool. We just don't have the team to accommodate him and his strengths at the moment.

If we don't sign a good DM then we wedding see the best of Pogba again next season and the team will struggle again.

I agree with you on most of your Points I just think calling him poor defensively is harsh but yes we do need dm to get the best out of him.

Hococop · 27-07-2017 10:43PM

jimmytwotimes 2013 wrote: »

Darmian flying to Milan, Perisic deal possibly includes him. Apologies if already posted. Cud be bull too.

https://twitter.com/utdreport/status/890702025566113792

Odd he would wear the united jacket if he was moving

jimmytwotimes 2013 · 27-07-2017 10:44PM

Hococop wrote: »

Odd he would wear the united jacket if he was moving

Yep, most likely nonsense. Said I'd throw up anyway for craic. I'm not a trusted sky source so what harm!

27-07-2017 10:51PM

That old lady looks like she is going to murder him, hope she waits till after he is sold.

clubberlang12 · 27-07-2017 11:05PM

Just when i see the term used there............who would we consider in today's game to be a complete midfielder as mentioned? Is there a such player now? I think the game has moved on a bit and players as such don't exist too much. 3 man midfields have helped form defensive players to sit and defend allowing offensive players freedom and thus weakening the defensive side of their game. In the same way that out and out wingers are becoming less and less because of systems used where wide players tend to cut in more and we see right footed players on the left flank and vice-versa
For me Pogba is a very good all-around midfielder when the emphasis on his technical and creative abilities. His physicality, athleticism and strength leads him to having defensive abilities that a lot of player's with his technique don't have. There are very few players in that similar mould currently.

Mitch Connor · 27-07-2017 11:06PM

They've deleted the tweet.

Don't think we can afford to let Darmian go, too valuable a back up imo and given blinds performances at left back he is surely first choice until Shaw can try to dislodge him.

0gac3yjefb5sv7 · 27-07-2017 11:09PM

adox wrote: »

Yes he did what?

I have a different opinion than you on a player so I must have an agenda against him? Ha.

I don't have an agenda against any player. Why would I? I'm an adult.

I'm giving my opinion on him. I'm responding to the completely Ott fawning from some calling him the best midfielder in the world and a complete midfielder.

Because you just say he didn't play well against top teams. Overall he had a great season considering it was his first and working in a new team.

I don't give a **** if he has an off day against Barcelona. Much more important he does it consistently which he does.

Hococop · 27-07-2017 11:11PM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

They've deleted the tweet.

Don't think we can afford to let Darmian go, too valuable a back up imo and given blinds performances at left back he is surely first choice until Shaw can try to dislodge him.

What way is shaw, is he our much longer?

jayo26 · 27-07-2017 11:13PM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

They've deleted the tweet.

Don't think we can afford to let Darmian go, too valuable a back up imo and given blinds performances at left back he is surely first choice until Shaw can try to dislodge him.

He is probably our best left back on recent form/Fitness and he is our second best right back I can't see him been sold or used as bait without a replacement.

Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2017

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