Ignorant Passengers

me_right_one · 08-06-2017 11:11PM

I think there should be wet and dry carriages. And silent ones.

Stephen15 · 08-06-2017 11:17PM

In Italy all trains have on-board police. Much more staffing on trains than IE I dont think I have been on train there without my ticket being checked. Although in Italy there seems to be a huge police and military presence on the streets in big cities Roma termini for example has police, carabinieri, military and private security all on patrol.

Damien360 · 08-06-2017 11:26PM

My dad used to work the galway dublin line for years as staff. He regularly ejected people but he couldn't do it on his own.

Normally 3 staff. Driver (he ain't coming back), ticket checker and guard. Catering are all part timers.

The guard is there for the train entering and exiting stations without killing someone running towards it, not for internal issues with passengers.

When there is trouble, they ring the gardai to meet the train at next station and the problem people are removed. Nobody can put their hands on a member of the public. Not sure what happens after that. Probably just sent on their way.

Losty Dublin · 09-06-2017 12:27AM

n97 mini wrote: »

Catering staff are third party contractors though? No responsibility towards the running of the train.

Yes they are third party staff but I'm not the the one calling for more on board staff

L1011 · 09-06-2017 02:32PM

Del.Monte wrote: »

I think that you're seriously mistaken on that as by the time Fastrack was abolished it was cheaper to travel with your parcel than to send it by the service - i.e. it wouldn't take long to make up the wages of an additional staff member. However, since we are talking CIE it is complete beyond the bounds of possibility.

Logical fallacy. There weren't enough parcels being sent

Rail operators have dumped this basically worldwide as it was uncompetitive and loss making

Del.Monte · 09-06-2017 02:58PM

L1011 wrote: »

Logical fallacy. There weren't enough parcels being sent

Rail operators have dumped this basically worldwide as it was uncompetitive and loss making

The service was a shambles but was still used and the primary reason for its closure was the lack of a parcels compartment in the ICRs. CIE couldn't run a piss-up in a brewery as we all know. Railcars with no parcels compartments, SDO or even opening windows...

MGWR · 09-06-2017 06:52PM

Losty Dublin wrote: »

A friend of mine worked on the catering car on the Enterprise. One Saturday night as the train zipped by Balbriggan, he refused service to a man as the bar had closed. He received a broken jaw, eye socket and four months off work for his trouble. On this basis alone it's hard to not see why staff won't tackle a lot of passengers.

And what did the thug receive?

MGWR · 09-06-2017 06:54PM

L1011 wrote: »

Logical fallacy. There weren't enough parcels being sent

Rail operators have dumped this basically worldwide as it was uncompetitive and loss making

There weren't enough parcels being sent because the service was deliberately made uncompetitive? A larger network would mean more destinations for parcels to travel to, and faster trains would be more time-competitive with road vehicles. But that would take private sector competition and the innovation that comes with it, that is for the railway to be in the private sector again, which has not been the case since 1945.

Stephen15 · 09-06-2017 08:39PM

Del.Monte wrote: »

The service was a shambles but was still used and the primary reason for its closure was the lack of a parcels compartment in the ICRs. CIE couldn't run a piss-up in a brewery as we all know. Railcars with no parcels compartments, SDO or even opening windows...

In fairness most trains these days do not have opening windows but I agree the ICRS are a heap of junk. Unsuited towards commuter operations and unsuited towards Inter city operations as another OP pointed out in either this or another thread like buses on rails.

Losty Dublin · 09-06-2017 11:54PM

MGWR wrote: »

And what did the thug receive?

The gouger got off scot free, even though he was a regular passenger on the train. Some backing for staff :rolleyes:

MGWR · 10-06-2017 03:24AM

Losty Dublin wrote: »

The gouger got off scot free, even though he was a regular passenger on the train. Some backing for staff :rolleyes:

This kind of lawlessness will result in chaos if left unpunished. Bad news.

Atlantic Dawn · 10-06-2017 04:01AM

Why do all staff on the train not have batons like any civilised country?

Del.Monte · 10-06-2017 07:42AM

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Why do all staff on the train not have batons like any civilised country?

Railway staff with batons - where have you seen that? :eek:

Del2005 · 10-06-2017 10:04AM

MGWR wrote: »

This kind of lawlessness will result in chaos if left unpunished. Bad news.

It is unpunished and we do have chaos. It took the Luas nearly a decade to get partial safety on the red line, people smoke anything they want upstairs on our buses and there's gangs of feral children running around causing mayhem on our streets and roads, a lot on scramblers, quads and horses.

About 7 years ago I had the pleasure of spending a day in the children's court in Smithfield after someone was caught in my car, with a load of silver cutlery, trying to steal it. Let me tell you that was an eye opener to a person who never had an interaction with our "justice" system.

The children in there didn't care about it. Everyone from the Gardaí, the solicitors and scumbags knew everyone else . One lad was bragging about robbing his runners for the case and another came up complaining about Garda X nabbing him on the stairs for loads of warrants for missed summons, he was still released on bail. Every case that day was postponed.

A few years later the Garda that caught the person in my car called and said that they had him again and would I go to the adult court. So took the day off work and sat in the court. The person who was caught in my car got off as he absconded and the Gardaí didn't hunt him down to bring him to court again, his solicitor argued it wasn't fair on him to be tried for stealing after such a long time. No one cared I had to get rid of a perfectly good car because of the scumbag.

fg1406 · 10-06-2017 10:21AM

I was assaulted on a train years ago by a group of drunk women who were smoking and necking back cans to beat the band. No staff on train. No security. It was a late night service into heuston so by the time the train had gotten to Dublin there were no IR staff at the station either. I was absolutely terrified. It's horrible that you can feel so unsafe on public transport in Ireland. The luas (red line) is a cesspit of scum but at least they have some security and cameras on board but when I complained to IR about the assault I was subjected to, all I got was a free train ticket (one way).

Atlantic Dawn · 10-06-2017 10:27AM

Del.Monte wrote: »

Railway staff with batons - where have you seen that? :eek:

Spain, all staff have them, including those cleaning the trains. I think the drivers are the only ones who don't have them.

Del.Monte · 10-06-2017 10:30AM

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Spain, all staff have them, including those cleaning the trains. I think the drivers are the only ones who don't have them.

Apart not liking the idea, I can imagine the number of court cases from scumbags and innocent people would be enormous.

sporty56 · 10-06-2017 01:24PM

About 4 years I made a suggestion to Irish Rail and similar on controlling anti social behaviour. Irish Rail responded saying they thought it excellent idea and would recommend it's implementation. However that was end of my proposal.

My suggestion was that in each carriage there would be notices giving a text number to inform security in real time of adjacent anti social messing. Here the texter could discretely advise of train, location, carriage number and nature of problem without messers knowing. This would allow security to direct a rapid response team to the problem by boarding at a practical following station.

I still think it's worth trying these notices to make trains safer and more friendly. It just has to work a few times(with results highlighted by company PR) for message to get out to gurriers that they're not beyond the law.

Del2005 · 10-06-2017 01:44PM

sporty56 wrote: »

About 4 years I made a suggestion to Irish Rail and similar on controlling anti social behaviour. Irish Rail responded saying they thought it excellent idea and would recommend it's implementation. However that was end of my proposal.

My suggestion was that in each carriage there would be notices giving a text number to inform security in real time of adjacent anti social messing. Here the texter could discretely advise of train, location, carriage number and nature of problem without messers knowing. This would allow security to direct a rapid response team to the problem by boarding at a practical following station.

I still think it's worth trying these notices to make trains safer and more friendly. It just has to work a few times(with results highlighted by company PR) for message to get out to gurriers that they're not beyond the law.

The problem with this is that security people have as much power as you or I and the Gardaí won't respond because it will consume loads of resources for at best a slap on the wrist. Till there are effective punishments* delivered by our courts then the problem will never be resolved.

*Punishment can be fines/compensation with deductions made at source, tagging, barring orders etc.

jippo nolan · 10-06-2017 02:36PM

me_right_one wrote: »

I think there should be wet and dry carriages. And silent ones.

And a smoking one at the back!

jippo nolan · 10-06-2017 02:40PM

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Why do all staff on the train not have batons like any civilised country?

With a rusty six inch nail on the end!

Hilly Bill · 10-06-2017 10:33PM

They will have customer service staff on board trains shortly, which trains i don't know but i think it's the likes of sligo, Galway,Waterford etc.

Stephen15 · 10-06-2017 11:03PM

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Spain, all staff have them, including those cleaning the trains. I think the drivers are the only ones who don't have them.

I find that hard to believe somehow. Never been in Spain but I looked at pictures of RENFE ticket inpectors but I didn't see any batons now. I could be wrong.

Teyla Emmagan · 10-06-2017 11:04PM

y

lxflyer wrote: »

I like to think that I'm entitled to make that decision for myself without someone else doing it for me?

And please don't make swinging judgements about me.

If I choose at the end of a long week at work to have a drink with my dinner on my way home, I think that's my business and absolutely none of yours.

If you were on the bus you wouldn't be able to have a drink, and you probably wouldn't even notice. Have you never heard of 'the greater good'?? Or are you so selfish that means nothing to you? I don't care whether or not you want a drink with your dinner (what "dinner" exactly are you having on an Iarnrod Eireann train that requires accompanying by a good burgandy?). I am also not the least bit bothered about your health, you can drink yourself to death for all it matters to me. What I think is important is that everyone else on the train (passengers and staff) can have a peaceful journey, without any boozed up gob****es ruining their 4 interminable hours across the country.

dr.fuzzenstein · 11-06-2017 12:00AM

Teyla Emmagan wrote: »

y

If you were on the bus you wouldn't be able to have a drink, and you probably wouldn't even notice. Have you never heard of 'the greater good'?? Or are you so selfish that means nothing to you? I don't care whether or not you want a drink with your dinner (what "dinner" exactly are you having on an Iarnrod Eireann train that requires accompanying by a good burgandy?). I am also not the least bit bothered about your health, you can drink yourself to death for all it matters to me. What I think is important is that everyone else on the train (passengers and staff) can have a peaceful journey, without any boozed up gob****es ruining their 4 interminable hours across the country.

You sound like you badly need a drink and a shag.

end of the road · 11-06-2017 12:13AM

Teyla Emmagan wrote: »

If you were on the bus you wouldn't be able to have a drink, and you probably wouldn't even notice.

irrelevant.

Teyla Emmagan wrote: »

Have you never heard of 'the greater good'?? Or are you so selfish that means nothing to you?

what "greater good"
there is no greater good in banning drinking/drink on trains, just a pointless waste of everyone's time as the drunks will just get drunk before they travel and there is nobody to enforce anything as all the staff are gone.

n97 mini · 11-06-2017 12:16AM

Teyla Emmagan wrote: »

y

If you were on the bus you wouldn't be able to have a drink, and you probably wouldn't even notice. Have you never heard of 'the greater good'?? Or are you so selfish that means nothing to you? I don't care whether or not you want a drink with your dinner (what "dinner" exactly are you having on an Iarnrod Eireann train that requires accompanying by a good burgandy?). I am also not the least bit bothered about your health, you can drink yourself to death for all it matters to me. What I think is important is that everyone else on the train (passengers and staff) can have a peaceful journey, without any boozed up gob****es ruining their 4 interminable hours across the country.

In fairness the greater good is the vast majority of travellers like lxflyer and myself who can have a beer or a glass of wine on the train and not go overboard. It's important not to throw the baby out with the bath water. We are the majority.

bassy · 11-06-2017 12:18AM

have the not got got shut of the bar on the train for buying drink?,all ive ever seen is a push trolly catering service on the train in recent times.but ye i know a lot bring there own drink on to the train.

Stephen15 · 11-06-2017 12:41AM

bassy wrote: »

have the not got got shut of the bar on the train for buying drink?,all ive ever seen is a push trolly catering service on the train in recent times.but ye i know a lot bring there own drink on to the train.

Only the mk4s on the Dublin to Cork route and the Enterprise have a Buffet car which serves alcohol. The ICRs which are on the majority of intercity routes do not and only have a trolley.

Del.Monte · 11-06-2017 07:58AM

Stephen15 wrote: »

Only the mk4s on the Dublin to Cork route and the Enterprise have a Buffet car which serves alcohol. The ICRs which are on the majority of intercity routes do not and only have a trolley.

Which also sells alcohol: http://www.irishrail.ie/media/table_talker_105x297mm_v5.pdf

My main gripe is the price and availability of 'anything' from the trolley. The removal of bar cars from most routes was a backward step as, like a pub, they tended to be monitored areas and not full of drunks. Obviously drunk passengers and those clutching slabs of beer should be refused admission onto trains.

Ignorant Passengers

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