Why are we hating all the men?

Glenster · 19-05-2017 02:04PM

NinjaKirby wrote: »

What % of men are murderers? Do you have that statistic to hand?

How more likely am I to be killed by a man than not be killed at all?

MURDER RATES ARE LOW AS IVE SAID AND POINTED OUT OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN.

IVE NEVER SAID ALL MEN ARE MURDERERS IM SAYING ALL MURDERERS ARE MEN.

F*CK SAKE!

Glenster · 19-05-2017 02:05PM

NinjaKirby wrote: »

How more likely am I to be killed by a man than not be killed at all?

Convenient that you don't appear know, or at least won't share, those facts.

Youre not, your odds of being murdered are 16000 to 1.

SO?

Will I Am Not · 19-05-2017 02:07PM

Glenster wrote: »

MURDER RATES ARE LOW AS IVE SAID AND POINTED OUT OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN.

IVE NEVER SAID ALL MEN ARE MURDERERS IM SAYING ALL MURDERERS ARE MEN.

F*CK SAKE!

F*cking wow!!!

NinjaKirby · 19-05-2017 02:11PM

Glenster wrote: »

MURDER RATES ARE LOW AS IVE SAID AND POINTED OUT OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN.

IVE NEVER SAID ALL MEN ARE MURDERERS IM SAYING ALL MURDERERS ARE MEN.

F*CK SAKE!

How low though?

You are only offering up one set of facts. I think that's pretty convenient.

"Hey guys there is a 0.0000625% chance that you will be murdered but if you are murdered then it'll probably be a guy that does it."

I suppose it's not as eye catching.

You remind me of this giant orange American bloke who was banging on about immigrants doing bad crimes or something.

It really is a shame that some people are taken in by this kind of spin.

Outlaw Pete · 19-05-2017 02:21PM

Glenster wrote: »

Men make up 50% of people. but 95% of murderers.

The point (which you are deliberately choosing to ignore) is that men excel in almost all human pursuits be they good or bad. There are more male composers, more male Nobel Prize winners (at physics, chemistry etc) more male Fields Medal winners at mathematics and overall (and not very politically correct) there are more male geniuses............... almost more male everything is the point.

The male sex hormone testosterone results in men being far more competitive and motivated for success than women also, which unquestionably plays it's part in the above. Hence men excelling over women at almost everything.. and yes, that includes murder, but also at stuff like fire fighting, combat, surgery, policing, sports, hunting, inventing (the list is endless) and so to be highlighting specific crimes and effectively saying: 'Look, men bad!' ... is a complete absurdity.

There's a bigger picture, might be best if you took a look at it sometime.

AudreyHepburn · 19-05-2017 02:39PM

Glenster wrote: »

MURDER RATES ARE LOW AS IVE SAID AND POINTED OUT OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN.

IVE NEVER SAID ALL MEN ARE MURDERERS IM SAYING ALL MURDERERS ARE MEN.

F*CK SAKE!

I think Myra Hindley, Rose West, Aileen Wurnos, The Scissor Sisters and Catherine Nevin (to name a few) might disagree with you.

Zulu · 19-05-2017 03:01PM

Glenster wrote: »

..you people freak out about it and call me; retarded

No one called you retarded.

Glenster wrote: »

IM SAYING ALL MURDERERS ARE MEN.

Arragh you've lost the run of yourself woman. There is at least a single murderer thats a woman (Catherine Nevin). That you're trying to continue this absurdity is hilarious.

Glenster · 19-05-2017 03:08PM

The Fake Sheikh wrote: »

F*cking wow!!!

Statistically they are.

AudreyHepburn · 19-05-2017 03:11PM

Glenster wrote: »

Statistically they are.

That's not possible, I've already name 5 examples above. I'm sure there are more.

Glenster · 19-05-2017 03:12PM

NinjaKirby wrote: »

You remind me of this giant orange American bloke who was banging on about immigrants doing bad crimes or something.

It really is a shame that some people are taken in by this kind of spin.

If immigrants committed proportionally 20 times more crimes than Americans he would have had a point.

The issue we had with him wasn't that he was selectively giving facts its that the facts he was giving were incorrect.

Glenster · 19-05-2017 03:26PM

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

That's not possible, I've already name 5 examples above. I'm sure there are more.

If what you're drinking is 95% piss, its reasonable to say that what you're drinking is piss.

Zulu · 19-05-2017 03:29PM

If what you're posting is 100% horseshit, you're posting horseshit

Will I Am Not · 19-05-2017 03:35PM

Glenster wrote: »

Statistically they are.

Statistically there's no such thing as transgender people by your logic.

Glenster · 19-05-2017 03:41PM

The Fake Sheikh wrote: »

Statistically there's no such thing as transgender people by your logic.

That's not how it works.

NinjaKirby · 19-05-2017 03:49PM

Glenster wrote: »

If immigrants committed proportionally 20 times more crimes than Americans he would have had a point.

The issue we had with him wasn't that he was selectively giving facts its that the facts he was giving were incorrect.

No. He would not have a point.

Jeez. Pay attention to what I am saying here.

He would potentially have a point if 95% of a certain group were committing a given crime.

This is different from 95% of a given crime being committed by 0.00005% of a certain group.

I am hoping that at least you will admit to selectively giving facts but somehow I doubt it.

Your flawed way of thinking causes you to take facts and come to irrational conclusions.

If 95% of students were stabbing people then we would say that there is a problem with students and knife crime.

If 0.00005% of students stabbed someone then we would acknowledge that knife crime is still bad but quite rare among students. We would not try to make a big connection with knife crime and students. (unless we were determined to push some anti-student agenda, I guess)

BUT if it turned out that 95% of all knife crime was committed by students, despite only 0.00005% of students committing the crime then we would definitely make a connection between knife crime and students?

If you think that's reasonable then I have some bad news. You haven't uncovered some amazing insight into the human condition, you've exposed yourself as an utter fool.

Or maybe you are just pushing an agenda.

If you are not a complete dunce and it's actually the agenda thing then I can say I understand it. It's nice when we think the statistics support our world view.

You can take your place among the Daily Mail's and the Nigel Farrage's of the world. Well done.

Will I Am Not · 19-05-2017 03:52PM

Glenster wrote: »

That's not how it works.

So disregarding the existence of female murderers is fine because they only make up 5% of muderers but disregarding the... I'm assuming less than 1%? of transgender people isn't because that's not the way it suits your agenda?

You strike me as someone who wants to be on all the trains at once, even though some are on a collision course with each other.

RabbleRouser2k · 19-05-2017 04:03PM

Widdershins wrote: »

Yep, people like what they like, as long as old wives' tales aren't informing that and shaming women, that's great. I suspect it's women who do most of the shaming anyway.
The rest makes complete sense, naturally you'd look for a maternal instinct and a good companion in general.

Oh women are waaaaayyyy worse for shaming other women. Guarantee it. Guys will be like 'he's a tosser'-and leave it at that.
Girls will be more 'jesus, look at her bust-cover yourself up woman' even when they are covered up-as in dressed respectfully. Or the 'you can tell she's a cow' etc.

IT's all inherent jealousy, to a degree. I mean, biologically we're all competing with one another to get a mate-primal instincts and all that jazz. (And I say this as someone who would cut off his own arm rather than be a dad).

Had a lecturer one time-and the class she taught, mostly consisting of girls, were so catty towards her-sweet jebus they were bad. This lecturer was in her 40s or so-but took care of herself, like she ran to stay fit, had a great figure...and the comments made about her behind her back, by girls MUCH younger was awful. They'd even impersonate her accent (she was American) and it was so irritating to see it.

Most guys ever did was text in her class.

Widdershins · 19-05-2017 04:19PM

RabbleRouser2k wrote: »

Oh women are waaaaayyyy worse for shaming other women. Guarantee it. Guys will be like 'he's a tosser'-and leave it at that.
Girls will be more 'jesus, look at her bust-cover yourself up woman' even when they are covered up-as in dressed respectfully. Or the 'you can tell she's a cow' etc.

IT's all inherent jealousy, to a degree. I mean, biologically we're all competing with one another to get a mate-primal instincts and all that jazz. (And I say this as someone who would cut off his own arm rather than be a dad).

Had a lecturer one time-and the class she taught, mostly consisting of girls, were so catty towards her-sweet jebus they were bad. This lecturer was in her 40s or so-but took care of herself, like she ran to stay fit, had a great figure...and the comments made about her behind her back, by girls MUCH younger was awful. They'd even impersonate her accent (she was American) and it was so irritating to see it.

Most guys ever did was text in her class.

Sadly, yes. I've met the type. Bitchiness is frowned on in my circle, though.
Denigrating another, newly-married woman's ability to carry her husband's children seems particularly venomous to me. (Referring to the comments I remember being made about Kate Middleton.)
Women writing another woman-or what's likely a very big part of her femininity- off just like that. Horrible.
I could possibly understand it in the days when maternal mortality rates were higher and they didn't have the medical knowledge and assistance within reach like we do today.

mzungu · 19-05-2017 04:39PM

Glenster wrote: »

And I've seen the black one and its interesting, mainly because if you look further into the figures in America its poor black men in inner cities who commit murders. The rate of murders in predominantly Black African countries like Liberia, Sierra Leone, Burkino Faso are significantly lower than in the USA or Russia, or Lithuania.

So based on that I wouldn't consider ethnicity to be a determining factor in crime rates.

If it is "based on that", then you are travelling down a very dodgy path there. If you are following your own logic, then you are saying that if black males are involved in disproportionately high crime in both the USA and Africa, then ethnicity can be deemed a factor. That is pretty dangerous thinking on your part. As previous posters have pointed out, it is a tactic used quite a lot by the likes of the far-right.

For example, the New York Civil Liberties Union found that black males accounted for a higher proportion of Level 3 sex offenders:

New York Civil Liberties Union wrote:

As the New York State Legislature considers a bill that would authorize the state to re-incarcerate individuals who have already served sentences for sex offenses, the New York Civil Liberties Union today released a report that finds stark racial disparities between the general population and the population of persons designated as Level 3 sex offenders.

The report also charges that New York uses flawed procedures for assessing an offender's risk of re-offending.

The law designates Level 3 offenders as those who pose the greatest risk of harm to their communities. They are therefore most likely to face "civil commitment," or re-incarceration, after serving their original court-ordered sentences.

The NYCLU presented its data analysis in a letter to Governor George Pataki, Majority Leader Joseph Bruno and Assembly Speaker Sheldon Silver. The data shows that:

Blacks make up 15.9 percent of the New York State population but represent 37.2 percent of Level 3 offenders.

Blacks are overrepresented by 134 percent.

In the three upstate counties of Albany, Onondaga and Monroe, blacks are nearly three times more prevalent in the Level 3 population than in the general population.

Blacks represent 11.1 percent of the Albany County population, but 33.3 percent of the county's Level 3 offenders.

In Onondaga County, blacks represent 9.4 percent of the population, but 28 percent of Level 3 offenders.

Monroe County's black population is 13.7, but 39.1 percent of the county's Level 3 offenders are black.

On Long Island blacks are overrepresented among Level 3 offenders by 485 percent relative to their numbers in the general population.

In Suffolk county blacks represent just under 7 percent of the general population but 42 percent of persons designated Level 3 offenders.

In Nassau County blacks represent approximately 10 percent of the general population but nearly 56 percent of those designated as Level 3 offenders.

"These disparities indicate that racial bias affects the investigation and prosecution of sex crimes; the adequacy of legal representation provided the accused; and the procedures used to classify sex offenders regarding the risk they pose to public safety," said Donna Lieberman, NYCLU Executive Director. "The proposed civil commitment bill endorses misguided public policy. Now it appears the bill would promote racial bias. The legislature must say no."

Link: https://www.nyclu.org/en/press-releases/demographics-level-3-sex-offenders-reveal-gross-racial-disparities-nyclu-analysis

Your metric is as follows:

Glenster wrote: »

The rate of murders in predominantly Black African countries like Liberia, Sierra Leone, Burkino Faso are significantly lower than in the USA or Russia, or Lithuania.

So based on thatI wouldn't consider ethnicity to be a determining factor in crime rates.

Right, well, considering the cases of sexual assault in African countries are far higher than they are in the USA and it would also appear that young black men are disproportionately represented on the US sexual offenders register, then you are saying that ethnicity is a factor in sexual assaults.

That would be where your line of reasoning gets you.

Personally, I think it is a minority of asshats (across all of society) that ruin it for everybody else.

py2006 · 19-05-2017 05:24PM

Glenster wrote: »

Not all men do bad things, but the bad things that are done are done by men.

#modernfeminism

wonderfullife · 19-05-2017 05:30PM

tritium wrote: »

Only 7% of women choose to become firefighters and put put themselves in a position to save these people. Theres absolutely no reason why they cant so it its a choice inbthe same as as committing a crime is a choice

http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.517.7357&rep=rep1&type=pdf

A disproportionate amount of arson and negligent fires are committed by men.

I'm not sure why our entire gender (male) should try take any credit for being the majority of the police force or fire service when a disproportionate amount of crime and fires are committed by men.

It's like patting ourselves on the back for picking sh1t up off our neighbours front garden 2 minutes after our own dog took a massive dump on it.

In general, it's delusional to think there aren't endemic and systemic issues facing women (to this day) worldwide that men just don't face.

They've every right as a gender to think we're all a bunch of asshats. We're (obviously) not all asshats and thankfully not all women think that way but I don't blame the ones that do for thinking it.

Outlaw Pete · 19-05-2017 05:44PM

What the hell..

Think you might be taking a good few posts out of context there, wonderful, if you think the purpose of posting those counterpoints was about patting men on the back.

Will I Am Not · 19-05-2017 05:52PM

wonderfullife wrote: »

http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.517.7357&rep=rep1&type=pdf

A disproportionate amount of arson and negligent fires are committed by men.

I'm not sure why our entire gender (male) should try take any credit for being the majority of the police force or fire service when a disproportionate amount of crime and fires are committed by men.

It's like patting ourselves on the back for picking sh1t up off our neighbours front garden 2 minutes after our own dog took a massive dump on it.

In general, it's delusional to think there aren't endemic and systemic issues facing women (to this day) worldwide that men just don't face.

They've every right as a gender to think we're all a bunch of asshats. We're (obviously) not all asshats and thankfully not all women think that way but I don't blame the ones that do for thinking it.

You're saying it's ok to tar a whole section of society based on the actions of a tiny minority. Fine by you?

I take it you apply that logic when it comes to other stuff yeah?

Outlaw Pete · 19-05-2017 06:16PM

Maybe a Male Privilege Tax is in order!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7uVxHLT-aY

Alizrian Crimson · 19-05-2017 07:54PM

Glenster wrote: »

I think when I say an undisputable fact you don't like, even caveated (Which I did) by saying that the proportion of murderers in society is very small, you people freak out about it and call me; retarded, dishonest, disgusting, etc.

The reason for that is you don't want to accept that the reason some people are wary of men is because men disproportionately do bad things.

Not all men do bad things, but the bad things that are done are done by men.

A people are 20 times more likely to be killed by a man than by a woman.

Wut?

Glenster · 19-05-2017 09:14PM

NinjaKirby wrote: »

No. He would not have a point.

Jeez. Pay attention to what I am saying here.

He would potentially have a point if 95% of a certain group were committing a given crime.

If 95% of men were murderers the human race would end. I absolutely do not accept your point that the majority of a certain group of people have to be doing a terrible thing for me to be allowed to EVEN MENTION IT.

If 95% of students were stabbing people then we would say that there is a problem with students and knife crime.

If 1% of them were it would be a problem. If only people under the age of 18 murdered people it would be a problem. Just because the prevalence of murder isn't 100% among men doesn't mean its not a problem.

If 0.00005% of students stabbed someone then we would acknowledge that knife crime is still bad but quite rare among students.

Which i did in my first post and mentioned again and again and again.

BUT if it turned out that 95% of all knife crime was committed by students, despite only 0.00005% of students committing the crime then we would definitely make a connection between knife crime and students?

Of course you would, the only reason you wouldn't is if you had some sort of dogmatic "students are oppressed" agenda to push.

If half a million people were going to be murdered by students, you'd look into it, wouldn't you?

Or maybe you are just pushing an agenda.

I'm saying indisputable facts, you're the one saying those facts don't matter because they don't fit into your narrative.

If one group of people were doing 95% of anything any reasonable person would say there is a connection. Not you though.

You say those stats are selective. Yeah, they're the stats that I've selected, I cant give you all the info in the world forever

You say I'm like the alt right or the UKIPs, but they are the ones, like you, who reject facts, and who think that what they feel and what fits into their worldview is more important than what's true.

......... · 19-05-2017 09:22PM

Glenster wrote: »

Not all men do bad things, but the bad things that are done are done by men

I see the brainwashing got so bad/lazy, it's not even decent brainwashing anymore.

Can you spot your basic error in logic in what you've been programmed with ?

"not all black people do bad things, but the bad things that are done are done by black people"

Glenster · 19-05-2017 09:23PM

......... wrote: »

I see the brainwashing got so bad/lazy, it's not even decent brainwashing anymore.

Can you spot your basic error in logic ?

"not all black people do bad things, but the bad things that are done are done by black people"

They're not though.

......... · 19-05-2017 09:27PM

Glenster wrote: »

They're not though.

now can you spot the logical flaw in the following statement :

"not all white people do bad things, but the bad things that are done are done by white people"

tritium · 19-05-2017 09:37PM

wonderfullife wrote: »

http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.517.7357&rep=rep1&type=pdf

A disproportionate amount of arson and negligent fires are committed by men.

Given arson accounted for only 4.6% of all us structure fires in 2015 i think the good the firefighters do outweighs this rather disporportionaly

http://www.iii.org/issue-update/arson

I'm not sure why our entire gender (male) should try take any credit for being the majority of the police force or fire service when a disproportionate amount of crime and fires are committed by men.

It's like patting ourselves on the back for picking sh1t up off our neighbours front garden 2 minutes after our own dog took a massive dump on it.

Actually its more like acknowledging the vast amount of good done by a majority of men instead if accepting a disporportionate focus on a small minority by certain groups in society

In general, it's delusional to think there aren't endemic and systemic issues facing women (to this day) worldwide that men just don't face.

Most would concede concede the reverse is also true
Most would also concede that first world are free from a considerable number of those issues

They've every right as a gender to think we're all a bunch of asshats. We're (obviously) not all asshats and thankfully not all women think that way but I don't blame the ones that do for thinking it.

No they really dont. The internet posts of extremists and the odd self hating man wont make that true either.

Why are we hating all the men?

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