March for Science, Dublin, 22/04

suicide_circus · 21-04-2017 10:41AM

So is this march an actual attempt to promote a logical evidence based approach to global affairs with reference to government policies such as climate change,blaspheme laws and education or is it going to be hijacked by the usual hoards right2water, lgbtq, sinn fein, erigi, repeal the eigth what ever issue is de rigueur?

keano_afc · 21-04-2017 11:41AM

skankkuvhima wrote: »

It this another march just for slagging of Trump again?

Pretty much, just with bunsen burners instead of pussy hats.

ScumLord · 21-04-2017 11:56AM

I'm not walking anywhere for science, the whole point of science is so I don't have walk to places.

Snickers Man · 21-04-2017 12:34PM

bnt wrote: »

Oh, I hope the identity politics / social justice crowd don't muscle in on this march. It's supposed to be about science, innit?

Don't worry! They've got their own march elsewhere that day.

Ulysses Gaze · 21-04-2017 12:52PM

Fr_Dougal · 21-04-2017 01:00PM

My sign is ready.

Biggest lickspittle on boardz · 21-04-2017 02:00PM

riffmongous wrote: »

Most of my colleagues, academics, are planning to go to the one where I live.. not sure I'll go myself, not quite certain what it can achieve. Would I take a job in the US in environmental science at the moment though? No, heard nothing good from there since Trump took over, lots of uncertainty and negativity over funding and research directions

I would be concerned that academics would be this gullible without researching exactly who is leading this march tomorrow, and how it will be hijacked to promote leftist agendas.
It suggests there is a flaw in their decision making process, as they can't separate logic from emotion.

This march is nothing more than a thinly veiled anti-Trump campaign, and there's no point in pretending otherwise. If you want to campaign against Trump go right ahead, just don't try pretending that it's a science issue. There are valid arguments regarding the administrations approach to science; this isn't one of them.

Science is about truth, each and every time.

AtomicHorror · 21-04-2017 02:19PM

Biggest lickspittle on boardz wrote: »

I would be concerned that academics would be this gullible without researching exactly who is leading this march tomorrow, and how it will be hijacked to promote leftist agendas.
It suggests there is a flaw in their decision making process, as they can't separate logic from emotion.

Could you break down the logic for us? Not sure what you're getting at.

AtomicHorror · 21-04-2017 02:25PM

bnt wrote: »

This piece on the RTÉ website is pretty good. This is not about Trump specifically: he's only the latest reflection of a long-running anti-science agenda, and not just in the USA. It's not just about nuns getting control of a state-funded maternity hospital. It's not just about climate change denial in the face of tangible evidence.

In my view it's about the wilful ignorance of the real world in favour of financial gain (against which politics and religion are mere tools). Look at the world and you see the impact of stupidity in everything that's going wrong - war famine, pestilence, we're doing it to ourselves because we can't see past our own selfish, short-term interests. It's about the pressing global need for everyone to be smarter about everything. :cool:

Yes, this has been going on for decades globally. Politicians have used what truth serves them and ignored all else, that's when they're not simply fabricating or reinterpreting the facts. Trump, due to his reach and potential to do harm, will necessarily be a lighting rod. So we can expect that many will see this as specifically "anti-Trump", which of course is sufficient for them to dismiss the entire affair.

diomed · 21-04-2017 02:39PM

https://cdn1.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/cdRv1O8Rg-_aVC7N81Z6ROrV6_A=/0x0:524x349/1310x873/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/25006307/moran.0.jpg

21-04-2017 02:44PM

Science research is woefully underfunded in Ireland at the moment, that is reason enough to march for me. Holding our government and world governments to task about issues such as climate change, antibiotic resistance etc is just as important. I never thought of it as an anti-Trump event at all, although the rise of dismissal of 'experts' in recent years is worrying and obviously linked to recent political upheavals...

silverharp · 21-04-2017 04:12PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Science research is woefully underfunded in Ireland at the moment, that is reason enough to march for me. Holding our government and world governments to task about issues such as climate change, antibiotic resistance etc is just as important. I never thought of it as an anti-Trump event at all, although the rise of dismissal of 'experts' in recent years is worrying and obviously linked to recent political upheavals...

we want some hard science though that generates some excitement. A manned mission to Mars, a breakthrough in Fusion power, a moon base.

21-04-2017 05:00PM

Biggest lickspittle on boardz wrote: »

I would be concerned that academics would be this gullible without researching exactly who is leading this march tomorrow, and how it will be hijacked to promote leftist agendas.
It suggests there is a flaw in their decision making process, as they can't separate logic from emotion.

This march is nothing more than a thinly veiled anti-Trump campaign, and there's no point in pretending otherwise. If you want to campaign against Trump go right ahead, just don't try pretending that it's a science issue. There are valid arguments regarding the administrations approach to science; this isn't one of them.

Science is about truth, each and every time.

Eh we are not in Ireland

So you can piss of with your anti academic nonsense

Pherekydes · 21-04-2017 05:20PM

diomed wrote: »

https://cdn1.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/cdRv1O8Rg-_aVC7N81Z6ROrV6_A=/0x0:524x349/1310x873/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/25006307/moran.0.jpg

I had a FB friend (ex-colleague) called Brian Moran. He died. :eek:

Capt'n Midnight · 21-04-2017 06:01PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Science research is woefully underfunded in Ireland at the moment, .

And even then the funding goes mostly to stuff likely to produce a quick return. Think of as state subsidised commercial R&D rather than pure science.

bnt · 21-04-2017 07:34PM

I'm going to go, take a look, and if I don't like what I see, I'll walk the other way. I particularly don't to see any bolshie socialist stuff. It's got to be about science, first and foremost, if I'm going to take part.

Biggest lickspittle on boardz · 21-04-2017 08:39PM

AtomicHorror wrote: »

Could you break down the logic for us? Not sure what you're getting at.

From what I'm seeing, most people haven't a clue about who is organising this event, what the agenda is, and how it is being hijacked. The march is being promoted as one concerned about the Trump administrations policies on science. In reality, it is probably a front organisation for the usual radical rent-a-mob that will show up, push their agendas, and maybe burn a few things and break windows. This women's march wasn't much different, every nutbag with an axe to grind was allowed up on stage and promoted. Including one notable woman who served time for torturing a man to death, then boasting about raping him with an iron bar. It was more of a politically narcissistic bandwagon that didn't even seem to have a real message, apart from "BOO Trump!"

Essentially, I am saying that a lot of people will be attending because they 'feel' a resentment to Donald Trump, rather than having any real understanding of the problems and issues involved. Also, what the hell is this supposed to achieve? America has no influence on Irish science policy, so why bother? It's not a logical or rational thing to do. Once again, this is simply another anti-American, anti-Trump circus act.

Recently, Vladimir Putin suggested that climate skeptics may not be that silly. Where is the march and uproar about that?
http://www.cnbc.com/2017/03/30/vladimir-putin-russia-trump-us-climate-policy.html

Also, the March For Science states that one of it's missions is to celebrate diversity. Ok, what the fcuk has that got to do with science? Do you really need a march to let the world know how diverse you are? I don't think so.

https://sciencemarchie.wordpress.com/mission/

Then there's this chestnut from the main page:

Inclusion, diversity, equity, and accessibility are central to the mission and principles of the March for Science. Scientists and people who care about science are an intersectional group, embodying a diverse range of races, sexual orientations, gender identities, abilities, religions, ages, socioeconomic and immigration statuses. We, the march organizers, represent and stand in solidarity with historically underrepresented scientists and science advocates. We are united by our passion to pursue and share knowledge.

Science is now about "intersectional groups, socioeconomic and immigration statuses?" My arse, this movement has an agenda that you can read with your eyes closed.
Read more here: https://www.marchforscience.com/diversity-principles/

riffmongous wrote: »

Eh we are not in Ireland So you can piss of with your anti academic nonsense

You've lost me. Who is not in Ireland?

bnt · 22-04-2017 02:29PM

So far, so sensible. Minimal dreadlocks ...

twill · 22-04-2017 04:17PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Science research is woefully underfunded in Ireland at the moment, that is reason enough to march for me. Holding our government and world governments to task about issues such as climate change, antibiotic resistance etc is just as important. I never thought of it as an anti-Trump event at all, although the rise of dismissal of 'experts' in recent years is worrying and obviously linked to recent political upheavals...

So is the lack of funding for scientific research what the march is about? I still have no idea.

hungry hypno toad · 22-04-2017 04:25PM

twill wrote: »

So is the lack of funding for scientific research what the march is about? I still have no idea.

It is an anti-Trump match, plain and simple.

The_Valeyard · 22-04-2017 04:28PM

Unless I'm wrong I was under the impression that science has never been in a more popular, well funded, supported, influential position in this country.

22-04-2017 06:21PM

twill wrote: »

So is the lack of funding for scientific research what the march is about? I still have no idea.

It's a reaction in general to anti-science rhetoric that has risen in popularity in recent years, the extremely pressing need to actually start taking climate change seriously, but also highlighting the need for increased investment in research. Particularly 'blue skies' research where most actual discoveries come from.

I'm just back from it and saw one or two posters that mentioned Trump but generally it was all just science themed posters. Saw the Green Party out marching and one guy handed me a People Before Profit leaflet but I couldn't detect any sort of leftist agenda from the march itself!

22-04-2017 06:24PM

The_Valeyard wrote: »

Unless I'm wrong I was under the impression that science has never been in a more popular, well funded, supported, influential position in this country.

Sure, but that's not really saying much given our past! I work as a scientist and have noticed a significant rise in anti-academic, anti-science rhetoric in recent years. For example, uptake of the HPV vaccine has dropped to only 50%, which is insufficient to provide immunity to the population.

The_Valeyard · 22-04-2017 06:46PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Sure, but that's not really saying much given our past! I work as a scientist and have noticed a significant rise in anti-academic, anti-science rhetoric in recent years. For example, uptake of the HPV vaccine has dropped to only 50%, which is insufficient to provide immunity to the population.

Maybe that's sciences and scientists failing for not getting the message through or presenting a clear enough argument to convince people of scientific studies and evidence.

pjohnson · 22-04-2017 06:52PM

The_Valeyard wrote: »

Maybe that's sciences and scientists failing for not getting the message through or presenting a clear enough argument to convince people of scientific studies and evidence.

Well some people are suckling firmly on the teat of "I don't like it so it's not true" or "Facebook told me".

You're more likely to get some false rubbish going viral than an actual scientific result.

The_Valeyard · 22-04-2017 07:08PM

pjohnson wrote: »

Well some people are suckling firmly on the teat of "I don't like it so it's not true" or "Facebook told me".

You're more likely to get some false rubbish going viral than an actual scientific result.

I agree. And maybe the scientific community needs to find a way to get the message across on abmore successful medium or way of interpretation.

Protesting for science isn't helping the cause in my opinion.

CatFromHue · 22-04-2017 07:13PM

The_Valeyard wrote: »

Maybe that's sciences and scientists failing for not getting the message through or presenting a clear enough argument to convince people of scientific studies and evidence.

I dunno if that's true.

If you take how many people are going or eating a lot of gluten free food even though they're not coeliac alludes to something else driving people than what scientists are telling them.

The MMR vaccine causing Autism has been massively massively massively debunked and yet some choose to believe it anyway.

pjohnson · 22-04-2017 07:16PM

The_Valeyard wrote: »

I agree. And maybe the scientific community needs to find a way to get the message across on abmore successful medium or way of interpretation.

Protesting for science isn't helping the cause in my opinion.

Probably not. But unless they manage to get some sort of celeb blogger or socialite to tweet the results it likely wont change. I cant see Kim Kardashian or Joey Essex suddenly becoming scientists so it makes educating the social media lot extremely difficult.

Billy86 · 22-04-2017 07:17PM

That damn March for Science better not try to criticise those who openly stand against science! :mad:

Atoms for Peace · 22-04-2017 07:18PM

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

Have seen that episode a good few times, but just now noticed that the rioters are burning down a Christian science reading room behind Kent Brockman. classic Simpsons.

March for Science, Dublin, 22/04

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