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Haye vs Bellew

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    #662
    StringerBell
    Registered Users Posts: 14,056 ✭✭✭✭StringerBell


    Boxing is not ****ed.

    You need to go beyond the hyped fights to find the quality of course, but boxing itself is fine. Promoters selling a weak product and the public lapping it up is all too common these days but to take the ****e Sky, Hearn etc peddle as the best boxing has to offer is folly.

    Its a con job and the bottom will fall out at some point but there are some super boxers around at the minute and some very good fights being made, you just need to look a little harder to get beyond the theatrical bollix that sells better to the masses.

    "People say ‘go with the flow’ but do you know what goes with the flow? Dead fish."



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    #663
    casscass4444
    Registered Users Posts: 182 ✭✭casscass4444


    StringerBell wrote: »
    Boxing is not ****ed.

    You need to go beyond the hyped fights to find the quality of course, but boxing itself is fine. Promoters selling a weak product and the public lapping it up is all too common these days but to take the ****e Sky, Hearn etc peddle as the best boxing has to offer is folly.

    Its a con job and the bottom will fall out at some point but there are some super boxers around at the minute and some very good fights being made, you just need to look a little harder to get beyond the theatrical bollix that sells better to the masses.

    I hope you are right but to be honest I can't remember the last time I was looking forward to watching a fight.great were the days when you had the likes of iron mike Bruno and the rest in their prime.some great title fights back then.none of the dodgers picking their opponents and avoiding the real challengers


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    #664
    Regnen55
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 11 ✭Regnen55


    casscass4444 wrote: »
    I hope you are right but to be honest I can't remember the last time I was looking forward to watching a fight.great were the days when you had the likes of iron mike Bruno and the rest in their prime.some great title fights back then.none of the dodgers picking their opponents and avoiding the real challengers

    How about two days ago, Keith Thurman and Danny Garcia. There are plenty of top fights taking place. Golovkin vs Jacobs, Brook vs Spence and Joshua vs Klitschko are all great fights coming soon.


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    #665
    Regnen55
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 11 ✭Regnen55


    I suspect Haye went into this fight with an injured ankle/achilles, it seems to me the rumour beofre the fight was true.

    If you like at Haye's footwork even before the 6th round it looked bizarre, he was plodding forward in a very awkward looking manner. This would explain to me why his timing looked so bad. He desperately wanted to get that knock out blow in the first round, this combined with his bad ankle made him look awful.

    Initially I thought he looked so bad due to age catching up with him, but when I look at his two fights last year his movement looked much better.

    Perhaps now he is not disclosing the ankle injury to lure Bellew into a rematch.


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    #666
    A Little Pony
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,875 ✭✭✭A Little Pony


    People have such nostalgia talking about past fighters as if Tyson didn't fight tomato cans and other great fighters. I thought the Bellew Haye fight was shaping up to be a very interesting fight before Haye Achilles went. It was only interesting after the injury in a bizarre and admiration for Haye bravery.

    Anyone mocking Haye for his 'minerals' in the future are talking rubbish. He was a warrior on Saturday night, amazing that he stayed in that ring for so long.


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    #667
    MD1990
    Registered Users Posts: 11,740 ✭✭✭✭MD1990


    Didn't pay for the fight.

    But I don't understand why so many get angry about PPV. It is only €20.
    The fight was dramatic but it was a poor fight & but interesting at the same time. Haye will probably have to retire now. Before it snapped his achilles was most likely hindering him badly. He looked awful.


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    #668
    Burial.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,131 ✭✭✭Burial.


    Interesting to see what Bellew does next. Hardly retires with his name at its strongest. I'm pretty certain he'll avoid a CW fight at all costs as Usyk, Lebedev, Gassiev are the other champs and they all murder him. Briedis and Huck have been booked to fight for the interim WBC strap, a fight Briedis should win, but regardless both would beat Bellew easily. Even if Drozd comes back for his title it makes no sense for Bellew to take a beating like that against guys like that. I suppose the Joshua fight would be the biggest payday, and it'd be an easy sell to the dumb casuals in the UK...also Creed 2 is apparently in the works, would be a handy payday and I quite enjoyed Bellew's acting in the first one. It's amazing how far he's luckboxed his way since being KO'd by Adonis Stevenson.


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    #669
    Sweet Science
    Closed Accounts Posts: 890 ✭✭✭Sweet Science


    Haye got 4 million

    Bellew 2 million

    600k ppv buys and a lot of drama

    Bellew would be crazy not to give up his cruiserweight title . Go get married in the summer and wait until Haye is recovered for the rematch


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    #670
    nacho libre
    Registered Users Posts: 16,661 ✭✭✭✭nacho libre


    Sweet Science wrote: »
    Go get married in the summer and wait until Haye is recovered for the rematch

    From what i've been reading there is unlikely to be a rematch due to the length of recuperation required, before he can even being to think about training, for the injury he suffered , but then again money talks, and Haye's ego means he will defy the doctors again.


    I watched the fight again, there seemed to something a miss in the way Haye was planting his feet prior to the injury.

    If so, would that have affected his ability to land proper power shots? Is it simply the case at the higher weight Bellew had way more punch resistance than he had a light heavyweight. It must be this, as there is no way Stevenson hits harder than Haye.


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    #671
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,775 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    We can't know for sure how much force/power Haye had in those clean shots landed. They looked solid but maybe that is just aesthetics. Bellew's head snapping and face moving on shot impact. They looked flush, but how much power was possibly lost IF Haye was not getting the proper leverage/force into the shots due to his injury.


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    #672
    BorneTobyWilde
    Registered Users Posts: 35,766 ✭✭✭✭BorneTobyWilde


    What exactly was won during this fight. Bellew talks like he has made it now? Made what exactly, he beat a one legged old guy who came out of retirement.
    What there a title on the line ?


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    #673
    Sweet Science
    Closed Accounts Posts: 890 ✭✭✭Sweet Science


    nacho libre wrote: »
    From what i've been reading there is unlikely to be a rematch due to the length of recuperation required, before he can even being to think about training, for the injury he suffered , but then again money talks, and Haye's ego means he will defy the doctors again.


    I watched the fight again, there seemed to something a miss in the way Haye was planting his feet prior to the injury.

    If so, would that have affected his ability to land proper power shots? Is it simply the case at the higher weight Bellew had way more punch resistance than he had a light heavyweight. It must be this, as there is no way Stevenson hits harder than Haye.


    I've tocuhed on this . Haye was carrying this going into the fight . He couldnt pull out or his ppv career was over . He planned to get Bellew out asap before the achilles tore completely .

    Hence no footwork and wild lunges.

    It's weird . Hayes stock has actually gone up after this crazy spectacle. Its not easy staying in there with a cruiserweight when you can't walk or punch.


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    #674
    Sweet Science
    Closed Accounts Posts: 890 ✭✭✭Sweet Science


    BorneTobyWilde wrote: »
    What exactly was won during this fight. Bellew talks like he has made it now? Made what exactly, he beat a one legged old guy who came out of retirement.
    What there a title on the line ?


    Im pretty sure he means he's made it as in money wise .


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    #675
    BorneTobyWilde
    Registered Users Posts: 35,766 ✭✭✭✭BorneTobyWilde


    Sweet Science wrote: »
    Im pretty sure he means he's made it as in money wise .


    2.8 Million.

    Geez that guy could spend that in a year.
    How smart is he with money. It would do me for life.


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    #676
    HigginsJ
    Registered Users Posts: 7,317 ✭✭✭HigginsJ


    BorneTobyWilde wrote: »
    2.8 Million.

    Geez that guy could spend that in a year.
    How smart is he with money. It would do me for life.

    Is Bellew the sort who blows money? He didn't seem to be "flash" in any of the behind the ropes stuff I saw.

    I'd be amazed if he isn't lined up for Joshua, that is another decent money fight for him (aside from the fact he may get killed).


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    #677
    Morrison J
    Registered Users Posts: 3,852 ✭✭✭Morrison J


    Wouldn't be surprised to see Bellew announce his retirement then miraculously come back once Haye is fit for one last big conning of the public and mass cash in.

    Are the casual fans stupid enough that given time a rematch could do a stadium? Honestly wouldn't surprise me.


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    #678
    flatty
    Registered Users Posts: 1,089 ✭✭✭flatty


    Why the bitterness?
    I'm delighted they both made millions.
    Noone ever gave either of them a thing.
    They both went out and earned their money in a tough industry and good luck to them.
    I enjoyed the fight as a complete casual. I'd no great interest, but they seemed genuinely antagonistic.
    I hope they both get another decent payday, and don't waste their money.
    Lads on here saying they are rubbish when they have been in over and over with big hard men.


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    #679
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,775 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    If ever any athletes deserve their pay it's boxers who step in the ring risking death every time. 4 million and 2 million....pittance compared to some other sports stars who don't risk a thing!


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    #680
    Morrison J
    Registered Users Posts: 3,852 ✭✭✭Morrison J


    pac_man wrote: »
    What's wrong with a rematch?

    Doesn't interest me whatsoever. Not arsed being subjected to all that fake animosity and hype in order to fill pockets. It'll be just as much a cynical cash grab as the first fight.

    Any right minded individual knows a fully fit Haye wins that fight with ease. I don't need to see the fight again with all the bull**** that comes with it to validate that.


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    #681
    snowflaker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,922 ✭✭✭snowflaker


    walshb wrote: »
    If ever any athletes deserve their pay it's boxers who step in the ring risking death every time. 4 million and 2 million....pittance compared to some other sports stars who don't risk a thing!

    They do that voluntarily. The death risks are minimised otherwise it would be banned.
    Don't glorify dying in sport


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    #682
    Morrison J
    Registered Users Posts: 3,852 ✭✭✭Morrison J


    flatty wrote: »
    Why the bitterness?
    I'm delighted they both made millions.
    Noone ever gave either of them a thing.
    They both went out and earned their money in a tough industry and good luck to them.
    I enjoyed the fight as a complete casual. I'd no great interest, but they seemed genuinely antagonistic.
    I hope they both get another decent payday, and don't waste their money.
    Lads on here saying they are rubbish when they have been in over and over with big hard men.

    I don't think bitterness is the right word. More frustration.

    The public, as always, got conned into parting with their cash by two actors who happen to be able to fight a bit. The hatred was not genuine.

    It was a poor fight, on a horrific card that got 600K buys apparently. Once people keep paying for that rubbish, Hearn is going to keep with the WWE model and we're going to be subjected to the same nonsense time and time again. That's why I'm frustrated.

    I don't begrudge boxers making money, just wish it was done in an appropriate manner that doesn't include taking advantage of the paying customer. The same paying customer who keeps the sport afloat. Give me a fight like LSC v Frampton any day where there's no need for the manufactured build up. The fight spoke for itself.


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    #683
    Morrison J
    Registered Users Posts: 3,852 ✭✭✭Morrison J


    .


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    #684
    flatty
    Registered Users Posts: 1,089 ✭✭✭flatty


    snowflaker wrote: »
    walshb wrote: »
    If ever any athletes deserve their pay it's boxers who step in the ring risking death every time. 4 million and 2 million....pittance compared to some other sports stars who don't risk a thing!

    They do that voluntarily. The death risks are minimised otherwise it would be banned.
    Don't glorify dying in sport
    Ah here.


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    #685
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,775 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    snowflaker wrote: »
    They do that voluntarily. The death risks are minimised otherwise it would be banned.
    Don't glorify dying in sport

    Don't be so obtuse. Boxers are a breed apart. Nothing like it. Voluntary or not.


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    #686
    snowflaker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,922 ✭✭✭snowflaker


    walshb wrote: »
    Don't be so obtuse. Boxers are a breed apart. Nothing like it. Voluntary or not.

    What about other combat sports? Or Horseriders? Or swimmers apparently...


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    #687
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,775 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    snowflaker wrote: »
    What about other combat sports? Or Horseriders? Or swimmers apparently...

    What about them?


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    #688
    snowflaker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,922 ✭✭✭snowflaker


    walshb wrote: »
    What about them?

    They are at an equal or greater risk so it wouldn't make boxers a breed apart tbf


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    #689
    Alf Veedersane
    Registered Users Posts: 24,562 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    HigginsJ wrote: »
    I'd be amazed if he isn't lined up for Joshua, that is another decent money fight for him (aside from the fact he may get killed).

    I'd be very surprised if he did fight Joshua. He knows himself Joshua is a giant by comparison. Haye was a biggish cruiserweight but a cruiserweight nonetheless.

    I don't think a fight with Bellew would interest Joshua in any case. Bigger fish to fry, even if he loses to Klitschko


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    #690
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 54,775 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Bellew and Hearn are or were calling out Wilder. Knowing the dismissive attitude here from some as regards Wilder here they'd make Bellew a favourite over him..


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    #691
    Morrison J
    Registered Users Posts: 3,852 ✭✭✭Morrison J


    I'd give Bellew a decent chance against Wilder tbf. He'll definitely see those wild swings coming anyway.

    Don't see any chance Hearn makes that fight though anyway. He'll save Wilder for AJ's big USA coming out party and easy KO win. Makes no sense to give that fight to Bellew.


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