"Why I did not report my rapist"

One eyed Jack · 25-02-2017 11:01PM

anna080 wrote: »

Does it matter? If he is only identifiable to one person that is one person too many.

From that described in the article, a college party where he followed her up the stairs... I don't know about you but when I was in college, that happened quite a bit. If someone were to give details of a party I was at 15 years ago where something were alleged to have happened, there isn't a hope I'd remember.

One eyed Jack · 25-02-2017 11:03PM

ibarelycare wrote: »

He's identifiable without any doubt to those who were present at the party. She also would have likely discussed him with friends at the time (they'd hooked up before, she wasn't into him, I'm sure it was a topic of conversation around that period).

I don't know, you're having to connect an awful lot of missing information to make that conclusion realistically speaking.

ibarelycare · 25-02-2017 11:05PM

One eyed Jack wrote: »

I don't know, you're having to connect an awful lot of missing information to make that conclusion realistically speaking.

I'm really not. There are people who are going to read it and know instantly who he is.

25-02-2017 11:05PM

Narkydonkey Whattado wrote: »

I don't think people here think it's ok to ignore someone when they tell you "no". I think people are saying that in order for the "no" to be meaningful, it has to be consistent with the person's actions, and I agree with that.

What would you do, bubblypop, if someone you like and are not afraid of didn't stop when you said "no"? Do you not think it's your responsibility to be more insistent?

It's not my responsibility to make anyone do anything. Everyone is responsible for their own actions.
He should have stopped when she said so, and everyone agrees.
What I don't understand is why everyone seems to blame her for what happened AFTER he ignored her?
Why is it her responsibility to stop him?

And none of us, including this girl, can possibly know what would have happened if she were more insistent. Maybe he would have become more insistent, maybe not. We can't know because he didn't stop when she told him she didn't want to have sex.

mzungu · 25-02-2017 11:12PM

ibarelycare wrote: »

He's identifiable without any doubt to those who were present at the party. She also would have likely discussed him with friends at the time (they'd hooked up before, she wasn't into him, I'm sure it was a topic of conversation around that period).

One Eyed Jack wrote:

From that described in the article, a college party where he followed her up the stairs... I don't know about you but when I was in college, that happened quite a bit. If someone were to give details of a party I was at 15 years ago where something were alleged to have happened, there isn't a hope I'd remember.

There was a poster earlier in the thread who went to college with her and had mutual friends. Ireland is a small country.

People shouldn't gossip or speculate on the identity of alleged perpetrators, but lets face it, they do. Things can spiral out of control from there if a rumour gains traction.

Neyite · 25-02-2017 11:16PM

One eyed Jack wrote: »

Just on this one thing - she didn't include any details that could possibly identify anyone. I'm guessing this was done on purpose so that it literally could be anyone who could be "identified". The thing is, nobody was in any way identified, slandered, named or defamed in the article.

I think that she included too many specifics that would narrow it down to a handful of men. She's given a time frame and a location. Alumni tend to know each other, or know each other through people. It's very likely that quite a few people have identified a few potential contenders - and therein lies a big problem.

Narkydonkey Whattado · 25-02-2017 11:16PM

bubblypop wrote: »

It's not my responsibility to make anyone do anything. Everyone is responsible for their own actions.
He should have stopped when she said so, and everyone agrees.
What I don't understand is why everyone seems to blame her for what happened AFTER he ignored her?
Why is it her responsibility to stop him?

And none of us, including this girl, can possibly know what would have happened if she were more insistent. Maybe he would have become more insistent, maybe not. We can't know because he didn't stop when she told him she didn't want to have sex.

So what's the solution then? What do you think we should teach our children? Because these situations happen all the time - they really do! One person wants to have sex, the other isn't in the mood and says "no", but the first person doesn't stop. What would you have people do - stop saying no and give in? Or take responsibility for what you want, say "no" more insistently and walk away?

retro:electro · 25-02-2017 11:22PM

Neyite wrote: »

I think that she included too many specifics that would narrow it down to a handful of men. She's given a time frame and a location. Alumni tend to know each other, or know each other through people. It's very likely that quite a few people have identified a few potential contenders - and therein lies a big problem.

Also she mentioned she had been with him a few times previously. So that narrows down the search even further. I'd have no doubt he's 100% identifiable to those who were around at the time.

25-02-2017 11:26PM

Narkydonkey Whattado wrote: »

So what's the solution then? What do you think we should teach our children? Because these situations happen all the time - they really do! One person wants to have sex, the other isn't in the mood and says "no", but the first person doesn't stop. What would you have people do - stop saying no and give in? Or take responsibility for what you want, say "no" more insistently and walk away?

Er seriously?
Which teach our children when someone says no, it means no.
That is what I was taught. In everything in life, not just intimate things!

Neyite · 25-02-2017 11:27PM

Narkydonkey Whattado wrote: »

So what's the solution then? What do you think we should teach our children? Because these situations happen all the time - they really do! One person wants to have sex, the other isn't in the mood and says "no", but the first person doesn't stop. What would you have people do - stop saying no and give in? Or take responsibility for what you want, say "no" more insistently and walk away?

To say no clearly. To remove themselves from the situation if that no does not call an instant halt to proceedings. To hear the word no and stop and checking if that's a "stop, I'm falling off the bed" or "stop, I've changed my mind" before continuing. Having sex means that you pay attention to whether or not you are giving your partner pleasure with whatever it is that you are doing.

Modern seduction needs to change. I think that the old fashioned no-meaning-yes or women pretending to be coy or putting up a mock protest for fear of sounding easy should be scrapped in this day and age and men need to stop assuming that this is what it is when she moves your hand away from somewhere. That persistence and pestering plays no part of modern seduction any more. It's safer for both parties that way. A new spin on safe sex, eh?

sara1 · 25-02-2017 11:27PM

This post has been deleted.

Narkydonkey Whattado · 25-02-2017 11:30PM

bubblypop wrote: »

Er seriously?
Which teach our children when someone says no, it means no.
That is what I was taught. In everything in life, not just intimate things!

But we are discussing the other side of the equation - what is a girl to do when she says "no" and a boy ignores it, as in this situation? I teach personal responsibility - when you are not heard, say it again. If you are still ignored - walk away. What about you, what do you advocate?

One eyed Jack · 25-02-2017 11:31PM

Narkydonkey Whattado wrote: »

So what's the solution then? What do you think we should teach our children? Because these situations happen all the time - they really do! One person wants to have sex, the other isn't in the mood and says "no", but the first person doesn't stop. What would you have people do - stop saying no and give in? Or take responsibility for what you want, say "no" more insistently and walk away?

It's difficult to be perfectly honest, because you can give some children all the advice in the world, as children, and yet some children are still going to do what they want to do, and some people as adults are going to do what they want to do, and when faced with that situation, some people are going to remember your advice, and aren't going to feel they're in a position to implement it.

Basically, advice for specific set scenarios isn't going to be of a whole lot of use to anyone, but fortunately for them, children don't grow up in an isolated bubble and they pick up on social cues from others, and they tend to follow that if they're any way independently minded. Some people just can't be made to be assertive, it's a personality trait IMO, either a person has it, or they don't, same way as they intuitively understand self-protection and personal responsibility, or they don't.

Mountainsandh · 25-02-2017 11:32PM

bubblypop wrote: »

It's not my responsibility to make anyone do anything. Everyone is responsible for their own actions.
He should have stopped when she said so, and everyone agrees.
What I don't understand is why everyone seems to blame her for what happened AFTER he ignored her?
Why is it her responsibility to stop him?
.

Because it was an inter-action up to that point. It was an exchange between two people. That's how communication works, and that's how sexual, or sensual relationships work.

Two people involved.
Two people exchanging verbal (sometimes) and non-verbal (sometimes) signals. They both send and receive messages, they are both involved in the success or failure of the interaction.

If there is a breakdown in communication during an interaction, especially so if there is touching (or bodily integrity) going on, then it is the responsibility of both actors to ensure that this is fixed. That whatever misunderstanding is currently happening does not continue.

If someone's cutting your hair, you don't like the looks of it, you say : "no, no, not like that !", but they don't get that message and keep on going.

What do you do ? Do you just sit there, silent, because they didn't take heed, wait until they're finished, and then feel really offended ?

She didn't push him away, she didn't clarify or rephrase firmly, she still kissed him, and she let him start intercourse. There was no threat to her safety.

25-02-2017 11:32PM

Narkydonkey Whattado wrote: »

But we are discussing the other side of the equation - what is a girl to do when she says "no" and a boy ignores it, as in this situation? I teach personal responsibility - when you are not heard, say it again. If you are still ignored - walk away. What about you, what do you advocate?

What I would do & what happened in this situation are completely different.
Personal responsibility has to include the boy in this instance taking responsibility for his own actions.
What are you so easy on him?

cursai · 25-02-2017 11:34PM

It probably never happened anyway.

25-02-2017 11:35PM

Mountainsandh wrote: »

Because it was an inter-action up to that point. It was an exchange between two people. That's how communication works, and that's how sexual, or sensual relationships work.

Two people involved.
Two people exchanging verbal (sometimes) and non-verbal (sometimes) signals. They both send and receive messages, they are both involved in the success or failure of the interaction.

If there is a breakdown in communication during an interaction, especially so if there is touching going on, then it is the responsibility of both actors to ensure that this is fixed. That whatever misunderstanding is currently happening does not continue.

If someone's cutting your hair, you don't like the looks of it, you say : "no, no, not like that !", but they don't get that message and keep on going.

What do you do ? Do you just sit there because they didn't take heed, wait until they're finished, and then feel really offended ?

She didn't push him away, she didn't clarify or rephrase firmly, she still kissed him, and she let him start intercourse. There was no threat to her safety.

But there was no misunderstanding when she said no, and when she said she didn't want to have sex.
Nothing needs clarifying.
That's when he should have stopped, nothing more would have happened.

Narkydonkey Whattado · 25-02-2017 11:36PM

Neyite wrote: »

To say no clearly. To remove themselves from the situation if that no does not call an instant halt to proceedings. To hear the word no and stop and checking if that's a "stop, I'm falling off the bed" or "stop, I've changed my mind" before continuing. Having sex means that you pay attention to whether or not you are giving your partner pleasure with whatever it is that you are doing.

Modern seduction needs to change. I think that the old fashioned no-meaning-yes or women pretending to be coy or putting up a mock protest for fear of sounding easy should be scrapped in this day and age and men need to stop assuming that this is what it is when she moves your hand away from somewhere. That persistence and pestering plays no part of modern seduction any more. It's safer for both parties that way. A new spin on safe sex, eh?

I agree. We need to teach young people to communicate, to clarify, to not assume. While I acknowledge that the aftermath of the event was very unpleasant to Rosemary, I don't believe it's a story about rape - to me, it's a story about immaturity and ineffective communication (on both sides).

groovyg · 25-02-2017 11:39PM

sara1 wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I can't believe how badly she is dealing with this either, it seems she only wants people posting positive ❤️ and calling her brave. Those who ask questions or disagree with her post are haters! She was tweeeting Boards about this thread and why it's still open?
How is ok to write a blog post on an alleged rape that occurred when she was in college, share it across social media and nobody is allowed to ask any questions? Ireland is a small place and people who went to college with her are going to be wondering who it was and guessing who the guy is?

shanno666 · 25-02-2017 11:40PM

bubblypop wrote: »

But there was no misunderstanding when she said no, and when she said she didn't want to have sex.
Nothing needs clarifying.
That's when he should have stopped, nothing more would have happened.

People say one thing and do another all the time, Is that enough proof giving the details she provided to call this man a rapist ? she gives very little info about the act itself whether she particapated or not so she has no right to label him a rapist.

Narkydonkey Whattado · 25-02-2017 11:43PM

bubblypop wrote: »

What I would do & what happened in this situation are completely different.
Personal responsibility has to include the boy in this instance taking responsibility for his own actions.
What are you so easy on him?

Personal responsibility is about advocating and taking action on your own behalf when someone else fails you. He failed to hear what she was trying to communicate to him - now it's up to her to take personal responsibility for herself - how, in your opinion, would a young girl go about it in this situation?

How am I easy on him? Have you read my posts?

25-02-2017 11:44PM

Massively f*cking angered right now. According to her Twitter she regrets writing about it. She thinks it was a mistake to put her head above the paraphet.

This could have been discussed hypothetically, but no. You have to name her. Analyse her movements, her social media. Call names. Propose a "public" poll that boardsies can vote on whether she was right or wrong. I reject this filth with celebrities, but I understand that behind the snarky comments by showbiz gossip mongers is a money making industry with jobs & people's livelihoods behind it. There's no one making a living here. There's no ads on her post for f*cks sake. (There are here on boards.ie though....)

Fact is the conversation needs to be had. Wherever you stand. But she didn't have to be dragged into it. (For anyone who goes "wadabout him" f*ck off. I couldn't find him nor do I want to. If you're nosey enough to go looking for him it say more about how sick you are than him or her, depending on your viewpoint) Because she was, there will be no other conversations. The boyos will keep their girls beaten down.

F*ck your "she's fair game". There's a reason anonymity is given in the courts to these cases. Her name, her life, her choices, her failures or successes are not sticks you can use to beat her with.

And also, f*ck your "personal responsibility". It's up to *you* to not get with someone who'll f*ck you over. When she doesn't want to, walk the f*ck away.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 25-02-2017 11:44PM

Every woman has the personal responsibility to look after themselves.
If I was ever to be raped again I would not think twice about stabbing the bastard. It's not her fault if she doesn't, but at the end of the day it's her body, it's her that will feel dirty within her own body, if she doesn't. You do not leave that power with another person. You do what you can to keep yourself safe

25-02-2017 11:45PM

The whole identifiable thing is getting a bit precious, no?

She's entitled to shout about what happened from the rooftops if she wishes. He is entitled to say it wasn't like that at all. He is even entitled to sue her if he feels as strongly as others, though for reasons previously stated I suspect he won't. We may object to a woman's description of an act as rape, but I'm not sure we can prevent her from even raising that suggestion, nor is that desirable, I mean she doesn't have to prove the case before making the assertion.

25-02-2017 11:45PM

shanno666 wrote: »

People say one thing and do another all the time, Is that enough proof giving the details she provided to call this man a rapist ? she gives very little info about the act itself whether she particapated or not so she has no right to label him a rapist.

FWIW, I don't believe she is right in posting this, she has too many details in her story. She could've wrote this story without indentifying factors.
I never heard of her before this, & I am not about to start following her on whatever social media platforms she posts on.

But, I'm sure everyone here must agree that if the guy just stopped when she said to, none of the rest would have happened!

cursai · 25-02-2017 11:48PM

cursai wrote: »

It probably never happened anyway.

But hey! It got the monkeys fighting over her integrity.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 25-02-2017 11:52PM

bubblypop wrote: »

FWIW, I don't believe she is right in posting this, she has too many details in her story. She could've wrote this story without indentifying factors.
I never heard of her before this, & I am not about to start following her on whatever social media platforms she posts on.

But, I'm sure everyone here must agree that if the guy just stopped when she said to, none of the rest would have happened!

Agreed and if she stopped kissing him and letting him undress her, it could have changed the outcome. A simple "i said no, and want you to stop". But she made the decision to carry on.

And now she's trying to shut down discussion on the very topic she raised?

shanno666 · 25-02-2017 11:54PM

bubblypop wrote: »

FWIW, I don't believe she is right in posting this, she has too many details in her story. She could've wrote this story without indentifying factors.
I never heard of her before this, & I am not about to start following her on whatever social media platforms she posts on.

But, I'm sure everyone here must agree that if the guy just stopped when she said to, none of the rest would have happened!

I agree and in a perfect world it would stop there,But in reality this happens day in day out across the country because people say one thing one minute and do another the next and giving the details she has provided i just cant comprehend how anybody could think this is enough evidence to label someone who can be identified as a rapist,

Mountainsandh · 25-02-2017 11:54PM

bubblypop wrote: »

But there was no misunderstanding when she said no, and when she said she didn't want to have sex.
Nothing needs clarifying.
That's when he should have stopped, nothing more would have happened.

But of course there was ! That's the whole issue !

There was a misunderstanding.
He didn't understand her word, especially when her actions (kissing, maybe other physical responses we don't know) sent a reinforcing message.
Or maybe he did, and he continued regardless.

But we won't know, because she did not give him a chance to amend his behaviour.

Look, my job involves a lot of communication with young people. Sometimes they get the message first go, sometimes they don't. At times it's frustrating, and you'd swear some do it on purpose, but it has often happened that subsequent discussions showed that really, they just didn't get the message. It didn't register, for some reason.

Sometimes the misunderstanding is deliberate, sometimes it's not.

If it's your body, your person at stake, and you don't like what's going on, it's your responsibility to protect yourself, to speak out some more maybe, or to run away.

We're human. Sometimes we just don't get it, or others just don't get what it is we're trying to tell them.

I'm a parent, and if I teach my kids that everything is going to be easy-peasy if they "just say no", and nothing else, I think I'm not preparing them well for the trials and tribulations of life.

25-02-2017 11:57PM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Agreed and if she stopped kissing him and letting him undress her, it could have changed the outcome. A simple "i said no, and want you to stop". But she made the decision to carry on.

And now she's trying to shut down discussion on the very topic she raised?

Agreed, she put it out there, she cannot control what people say now.
But cmon Lexie, if HE stopped kissing her when she said no, it would not have happened. I'm just not willing to let someone off with their actions once they have been told no.
I remember lots of times being with lads who would ask if everything is ok? Do I want to do this? It's not a big deal.
If I said no, I hope they would have stopped.

"Why I did not report my rapist"

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