New England Patriots Thread Mod Warning Post #253

TOss Sweep · 01-12-2016 08:52PM

eagle eye wrote: »

If we hold onto the HFA then we have seven weeks before our first playoff game. I wouldn't be giving up hope on having him for the playoffs.

He has a herniated Disc apparently and post surgery recovery for minimal movement is 6-8 weeks. After those 6-8 weeks depending on the person and rehab it can take another 3-4 weeks to regain full movement to where your back is good shape to do anything useful like sports or heavy lifting. I am sure Doc SOV will confirm this but this comes from experience with a family member that went through herniated disc surgery.

Even if Gronk is back in the playoffs he wont be 100% and probably wont be playoff ready and effective and as much as I want him to play he would be stupid to risk his whole career on a handful of games.

Tristram · 01-12-2016 11:25PM

Sad to hear the news about Gronk. Such a unique talent and joy to watch when fit and in action. Hope he comes back, the NFL is surely more exciting when he plays.

AbusesToilets · 02-12-2016 03:04AM

There goes the season. How many years has a Gronk injury sunk us? Probably cost us at least 1, if not more SBs.

BizzyC · 02-12-2016 07:55AM

No Gronk...but I think with Bennet, Lewis and Hogan we have enough better tools available to succeed without him that we didn't have in previous years he was out

Son Of A Vidic · 02-12-2016 12:47PM

JaMarcusHustle wrote: »

Not one criticism of Collins here while he was a Patriot, but now that he's gone, he's the reason we didn't win the Super Bowl last year.

Did you even watch the Superbowl? Because if you saw how shít The Panthers were, you'd see how costly those 14 points that Collins gave up actually were. I've already said that I was as guilty as any of overlooking that at the time. And it's only when a Pats fan in another Pats forum, posted the TD's Collins gave up, that opened my eyes.

JaMarcusHustle wrote: »

Jesus Christ, no wonder our fans have such a bad rep on here. What poisonous, nonsensical drivel that is.

Poisonous, nonsensical drivel? You seem to be incapable of making a contribution in here, without some form of predictable baiting language, when someone expresses an opinion you don't share. Just get over it, everybody else here does.

TOss Sweep · 02-12-2016 01:14PM

Son Of A Vidic wrote: »

Did you even watch the Superbowl? Because if you saw how shít The Panthers were, you'd see how costly those 14 points that Collins gave up actually were. I've already said that I was as guilty as any of overlooking that at the time. And it's only when a Pats fan in another Pats forum, posted the TD's Collins gave up, that opened my eyes.

I am sorry but this is actual nonsense. Players make mistakes and give up points all the time but to throw them under the bus and say they were the reason we lost games and didn't make the bowl is just pure bs. It doesn't matter who the player is it is a team sport and unless he gave up the scores in the last second of the game to lose it you can't say any player is the reason we lost. and even then that is a stretch.

By your logic we should offload our whole secondary when they get burned at this point and while we are at it lets ship our offensive linemen for all the sacks on Brady that stumble drives hell lets go one step further and dump RBs for fumbles. Fook it lets kick Brady out for INTs that cost us on a possible scoring drive.

It's a team sport and all of the pieces need to go together and sometimes players get beat but blaming them and throwing them under the bus when they get shipped is just typical fan nonsense. Delusion really.

Such predictable hindsight nonsense really.

Son Of A Vidic · 02-12-2016 01:16PM

TOss Sweep wrote: »

No the kind of fan who all of a sudden throws players under the bus when Bill ships them.

TO, you're a Pats fan as long as I am. You can read between the lines as well as I can. My take is that something has gone on that we will never know about for a very long time. Bill doesn't pull these kind of moves very often, my take is that Collins was sent to the Browns as a punishment. Now considering Bill will retire as the greatest HC of all time, I trust his judgement that he has done the right thing for the team. Now if it was Watt or Von Miller that was moved on? Then I wouldn't feel the same way about it.

TOss Sweep wrote: »

He has a herniated Disc apparently and post surgery recovery for minimal movement is 6-8 weeks. After those 6-8 weeks depending on the person and rehab it can take another 3-4 weeks to regain full movement to where your back is good shape to do anything useful like sports or heavy lifting. I am sure Doc SOV will confirm this but this comes from experience with a family member that went through herniated disc surgery.I am sure Doc SOV will confirm this but this comes from experience with a family member that went through herniated disc surgery.

Doc SOV? Thanks but I have I never told anyone here that I am a Doctor, Nurse, Physio, or Paramedic ect. And with the harassment & agendas I've endured on here, the last thing I'm ever going to do is to share such information publicly.

The time scale you gave is pretty accurate, but I would just add that there are 5 different types of surgery used to treat herniated discs and it depends on the level of disc herniation. So the rehab period can add an extra 4-6 weeks for the stages you mentioned, dependent again on the type of surgical technique.

TOss Sweep wrote: »

Even if Gronk is back in the playoffs he wont be 100% and probably wont be playoff ready and effective and as much as I want him to play he would be stupid to risk his whole career on a handful of games.

Competely agree with you there. Gronk wouldn't be anywhere near 100% and I don't think any Pats would want to see his long term health & career compromised by trying to rush him back.

TOss Sweep · 02-12-2016 01:16PM

Son Of A Vidic wrote: »

Did you even watch the Superbowl? Because if you saw how shít The Panthers were, .

What has any of this got to do with the Pats? It really doesn't matter how bad the NFC team is as that has no bearing on Von Miller and that Broncos defense raping Brady over and over and over in the AFC Championship game. Such a horrible comparison to make.

TOss Sweep · 02-12-2016 01:24PM

Son Of A Vidic wrote: »

TO, you're a Pats fan as long as I am. You can read between the lines as well as I can. My take is that something has gone on that we will never know about for a very long time. Bill doesn't pull these kind of moves very often, my take is that Collins was sent to the Browns as a punishment. Now considering Bill will retire as the greatest HC of all time, I trust his judgement that he has done the right thing for the team. Now if it was Watt or Von Miller that was moved on? Then I wouldn't feel the same way about it.

I trust Bill knows what he is doing but that doesn't always make him right or give Pats fans carte blanche to the become hindsight kings and throw players under the bus as if they were always **** or we were blinded by their athleticism. I really hate when when people pretend Bill is perfect and one can't make any constructive criticism on him. If anything Pats fans get blinded by the in Bill we trust nonsense all the time.

We all have a faith in he knows what is he is doing after all it is his team and his plan and sometimes that is all we can have but he is not always right and for anyone to say he is they are naive at best and so far up his hole it becomes a sh1t debate. We are all human including Bill and I said it before I bet you if you were to talk to him one on one as a close friend in confidence he would admit some of his mistakes. What makes him great though is that he sticks to his convictions whether right or wrong and commits to his own ideas and that is what makes him the best coach in the NFL.

Doc SOV? Thanks but I have I never told anyone here that I am a Doctor, Nurse, Physio, or Paramedic ect. And with the harassment & agendas I've endured on here, the last thing I'm ever going to do is to share such information publicly.

Joke dude joke.

Son Of A Vidic · 02-12-2016 01:31PM

TOss Sweep wrote: »

What has any of this got to do with the Pats? It really doesn't matter how bad the NFC team is as that has no bearing on Von Miller and that Broncos defense raping Brady over and over and over in the AFC Championship game. Such a horrible comparison to make.

And despite all that defense, despite Brady being in that game, the most battered QB in playoff history, we only lost by two points. Man, if Collins only hadn't failed his assignment against Owen Daniels. Ya that's right, Owen fecking Daniels. And anybody who thinks Cam Newton would have outplayed Tom Brady, the greatest Superbowl player of all time. Then I think they'd be very much with a minority of Pats fans who would even think that. So no, my earlier comparison is quite valid

Son Of A Vidic · 02-12-2016 01:33PM

TO, I see your point and I respect your opinion, but I'm going to move on from the whole Collins discussion.

AbusesToilets · 02-12-2016 01:53PM

Son Of A Vidic wrote: »

And despite all that defense, despite Brady being in that game, the most battered QB in playoff history, we only lost by two points. Man, if Collins only hadn't failed his assignment against Owen Daniels. Ya that's right, Owen fecking Daniels. And anybody who thinks Cam Newton would have outplayed Tom Brady, the greatest Superbowl player of all time. Then I think they'd be very much with a minority of Pats fans who would even think that. So no, my earlier comparison is quite valid

Surely the defensive scheme for those plays has to be called into question too though. We are the Masters at exploiting mismatches with our TEs, we shouldn't be getting caught out like that.

BizzyC · 02-12-2016 02:29PM

AbusesToilets wrote: »

Surely the defensive scheme for those plays has to be called into question too though. We are the Masters at exploiting mismatches with our TEs, we shouldn't be getting caught out like that.

In fairness, Owen Daniels is nowhere near the same mismatch issue that Gronk is, and also Collins was supposed to be a superstar in coverage.
He was caught watching the QB and not paying attention to an average TE on those plays, not outplayed by a potential HOFer.

I still think he is a great talent, but I wont miss him if the cap space saved by moving him on locks in Hightower and Butler to long term deals.

dh1985 · 02-12-2016 10:10PM

Son Of A Vidic wrote: »

And despite all that defense, despite Brady being in that game, the most battered QB in playoff history, we only lost by two points. Man, if Collins only hadn't failed his assignment against Owen Daniels. Ya that's right, Owen fecking Daniels. And anybody who thinks Cam Newton would have outplayed Tom Brady, the greatest Superbowl player of all time. Then I think they'd be very much with a minority of Pats fans who would even think that. So no, my earlier comparison is quite valid

Yeah patriots only lost by two.points but the Broncos controlled that game start to finish. It was a late td by gronk that put a gloss on that scoreline. Brady was under pressure all day and threw a couple.of interceptions. Blaming Collins solely is harsh.
As for the Patriots v Panthers superbowl been a gimme, Broncos defense dominated against the Panthers offense but I don't think the Patriots would have been able to handle them in the same manner. Think that would have been a high scoring game and who knows who would win.
People are criticising the waste of drafts picks on defence over the years instead of arming brady with more talent but the superbowls the Patriots have won have been down to defence as much as offence. The addition of revis and browner with mc courty in a rich vein of form made a huge difference two years ago and was the difference compared to other years. In 07 when brady had Moss and Welker and an unstoppable offence, we fell short too. Defense has a larger part in winning the superbowl than offense and we are not where we need to be in that regards.and I don't think the loss of Collins helps that. Also thinl the loss of chandler Jones doesn't help either.

Hazys · 03-12-2016 03:49AM

Good to see Pimp Daddy Rob in good spirits

eagle eye · 03-12-2016 09:41AM

I know you can't really tell much from that video but it'd be easy to make me believe that Gronk won't be out too long after seeing it.

JaMarcusHustle · 03-12-2016 11:13PM

eagle eye wrote: »

I know you can't really tell much from that video but it'd be easy to make me believe that Gronk won't be out too long after seeing it.

He's being put on IR.

TOss Sweep · 04-12-2016 03:45AM

JaMarcusHustle wrote: »

He's being put on IR.

Best move. As I said earlier family member had it done and like Gronk was walking around not long after but the healing time does take the 8 to 10 weeks and even then your back and body needs further rehab. It would be foolish of Gronk to return.

JaMarcusHustle · 04-12-2016 04:17AM

Yeah, and though I'd imagine the physios in New England would be able to have him running at 80-90% of his mobility, I doubt he could take anything like the hits and contact be usually does.

We should really limit Bennett tomorrow if he's not 100%. His importance in a Super Bowl run just skyrocketed.

j8wk2feszrnpao · 04-12-2016 08:26AM

Agreed. We've seen a less than healthy Gronk in the SB and it didn't benefit us. Get healthy and come back next year.
While we've been fortunate enough this year with season ending injures, this along with the general health of the team (a lot of guys are carrying knocks), it lessens my hopes of a SB run. It's still possible, but losing Gronk hurts big time against the other contenders.

eagle eye · 04-12-2016 11:32AM

JaMarcusHustle wrote: »

He's being put on IR.

Being put on IR only means he won't play in the regular season, it doesn't affect the playoffs.

eagle eye · 04-12-2016 11:42AM

I realise that the chances of Gronk being available in the playoffs are not very high but I'll hold out hope all the same.

I mentioned a couple of weeks ago and again a couple of days ago that I'm looking forward to seeing Matt Lengel in action. He looks like a serious run blocker and he was a decent receiver in college too.

I noticed we picked up DT Darius Kilgo off of waivers on November 28th but that was before they Gronk was officially out. We have 53 on the roster now and Kilgo looks like the only addition. I'm just wondering how that worked out?

JaMarcusHustle · 04-12-2016 11:46AM

eagle eye wrote:

Being put on IR only means he won't play in the regular season, it doesn't affect the playoffs.

Yes it does.

Only one player on IR is allowed return. Brissett has already taken that spot.

Gronk cannot play again this season even if he is healthy.

eagle eye · 04-12-2016 11:55AM

JaMarcusHustle wrote: »

Yes it does.

Only one player on IR is allowed return. Brissett has already taken that spot.

Gronk cannot play again this season even if he is healthy.

The designated for return rule is gone. You can change that player now so while Brisset may have had it tagged on him it doesn't have to stay on him.

Tristram · 04-12-2016 12:03PM

Taken from ESPN.

The Patriots used their injured reserve/return designation on quarterback Jacoby Brissett on Wednesday, so the team is not able to activate Gronkowski off injured reserve if it makes a deep playoff run. Each team is allowed to designate only one player to return.

Running back D.J. Foster was brought up from the practice squad to take Gronkowski's spot on the 53-man roster.

JaMarcusHustle · 04-12-2016 12:46PM

eagle eye wrote:

The designated for return rule is gone. You can change that player now so while Brisset may have had it tagged on him it doesn't have to stay on him.

It's not gone. You just don't have to decide in advance who you want to return, you can decide when they're ready to return. And Brissett returned to practice earlier this week so that's our allowance used up.

eagle eye · 04-12-2016 01:19PM

Brisset hasn't been taken off IR yet. They have 21 days to decide whether to bring him back or not. If they don't bring him back they can put the designation on somebody else.

JaMarcusHustle · 04-12-2016 01:45PM

No, they have 21 days to decide if they want to put him back on IR again. They've already used his designation to return by having him practice. That's been burned now. They can't send him back to IR and have a second player return instead, that's not how it works.

eagle eye · 04-12-2016 03:27PM

JaMarcusHustle wrote: »

No, they have 21 days to decide if they want to put him back on IR again. They've already used his designation to return by having him practice. That's been burned now. They can't send him back to IR and have a second player return instead, that's not how it works.

Well we'll have to see about that. The rule changed in May and I thought that you could change the designated player as many times as you want up until one goes off IR.

If it is the case that there is no way he can come back then it's obvious that there is no chance of him recovering to play any part in the playoffs because I don't think BB would shut the door on that if he wasn't certain.

TOss Sweep · 04-12-2016 03:32PM

Look EE face facts Gronk is done for the season and there is no way in hell he plays in the playoffs with a back injury. You are being way to overly optimistic with his injury. 8-10 weeks minimum and there is no way even after then he will be 100%. The PAts and Gronk would be fooking nuts to chance it as it could be the end of his career. Anyways as others have pointed out he is on IR now and can't be taken off it.

New England Patriots Thread Mod Warning Post #253

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