How do you define someone who is Irish? (multiple choice poll)

donegal. wrote: »

i definitely wouldn't consider the Irish .

I've a lot of friends and relatives that moved to america years ago , all married (mostly to other irish) and settled there with kids.

now these people follow all the gaa, irish news, read the local papers ect .
But their kids couldn't possible be more american. Even though their parents play gaa they all play basketball/baseball. One of my mates kids is a quarterback and his sister is a cheerleader(they're only about 10 but still).

Idon't care how irish their parents are these kids are 100% NOT irish.

They are not Irish because one of them plays non Irish sport and the other does cheerleading

judeboy101 wrote: »

Ok, me and the lads came up with a tiered level of irishness.

Level 1A : Born in rep of Ireland to parents born in rep of ireland

Level 1B: Born in rep of Ireland to parents, one of whom was not born in in rep of Ireland.

Level 1C: Born in rep of Ireland to parents who were not.

Level 2A: Born outside the rep of Ireland to parents who were born in the rep of Ireland.

Level 2B: Born outside the rep if Ireland to parents, one of whom was not born in rep of Ireland

Level 3: Born outside the rep of Ireland but claim Irish citizenship due to constitutional rights.

Level 4: Born outside the rep of Ireland but gain Irish citizenship through non constitutional rights.

You and the lads need to learn a bit about geography and history then come up with your tiered Irishness

donegal. wrote: »

no, that was merely an example. An example that was used previously in this thread to show how irish someone was.

There is nothing irish about these kids.

What is Irish then? Do they consider themselves Irish? At the age of 18, they can choose what they are and your angst will then be over

Deleted User wrote: »

Your definition of Irish is the legal one.

The cultural/sense of identity is a lot more complex.

Crux of the issue here. And why this thread is a disaster.

I'm legally defined as a citizen of Ireland which is fine as I was born and live within the boundaries of the country of Ireland, but I never refer to myself as being Irish. Nor would I ever wish to do so.

A person's own sense of identity and cultural involvement are the more important indicators IMO. I know several (unrelated) people who were born in England to Irish parents working there temporarily and moved to Ireland as toddlers when the parents came back. They are Irish. They have Irish accents, they speak Hiberno-English, they follow Irish traditions, grew up in Ireland, have an Irish family, went to school in Ireland, speak some Irish, have some of the general stereotypical traits of the Irish people (sense of humour, self-deprecation, mild begrudgery, a dislike of people with notions etc), shout for Irish teams, play Irish sports, read Irish media, watch Irish television, have spent 90% of their life in Ireland, etc etc. And yet some people here would insist they're English, when they have no ties to England & no involvement in English culture (beyond what all Irish people have).

That's not to say that not having/doing any one of the above makes you not Irish (I'm born and bred here and I play no Irish sports for one), just that all of them together make it very difficult to argue that these people are not Irish. Similarly, a child born to an Irish couple in France or China or the US or Dubai may well identify as Irish even if they weren't born here and didn't live here. They could grow up in an Irish home, speak Hiberno-English, follow Irish traditions, have Irish stories read to them, watch Irish television, etc and have a stronger affiliation to Irish nationality and culture than the culture of the country they're in (esp in places where the language is different).

As for people born in Ireland to foreign parents or who move here when very young, it's the same in reverse. They may stay very culturally involved with their family's home nation or they may fully embrace Irish culture and traditions, and it's really down to how they feel and which nationality they identify with most.

There's no hard-and-fast rule.

Different degrees I would say.

Born and raised in Ireland by Irish parents and have Irish grandparents? Fully Irish.

Born and raised in Ireland to by non-Irish parents. Irish, but your family's country also influences you culturally too.

Came here at an early age? Chances are you'd identify more with your home country depending on what age you are, though by this stage you've become so immersed in the Irish culture that you certainly would be Irish.

dudara wrote: »

How many generations back do you want to go in order to define Irish? I'm pretty sure all of us have some English or even Norman or Viking blood in us.

For me, it's probably grandparents, and it depends on how they've "mixed" (for lack of a better word) with the natives. If you're one French grandfather, an Irish one and two Irish grandmothers, then you're by-and-large Irish. If you've had one Irish grandfather, a French one and two French grandmothers then you're by-and-large French.

"Irish-French" or "French-Irish" is an absolutely ridiculous thing to call yourself, you should just pick one and stick with it.

Arcade_Tryer wrote: »

That's better.

Not really. Civic Nationalism.

me_right_one wrote: »

Why?

Are Paul McGrath and Phill Lynott not Irish because their ethnicity is mixed?