How do you define someone who is Irish? (multiple choice poll)

SharpshooterTom

I'm just wondering how, in your opinion, you would define somebody who is or isn't Irish and have provided a multiple choice poll for this for which you can tick as many options as you want.

As we all know we are continuously living in a more and more globalised world, with increasing mobility and better transport meaning more movement between people, more immigration within the world meaning what defines a person’s nationality is becoming more and more complex now. A lot of people however are opposed to this ongoing globalisation as we have seen throughout 2016 with brexit, Trump and the rise of anti-globalist populist parties in the world, fearing loss of cultural identity and would take the more traditional view that in order to be Irish is not only to born and bred in Ireland, but to be primarily of Irish origin/have Irish ancestry as well.

Opinions vary of course and I'm happy to hear views from all sides.

For the poll options I have included option 1, which is to be born and bred in Ireland and to have at least one Irish parent, option 2, for people born in Ireland to foreign parents (including people born prior to 2004 so would be entitled to Irish citizenship), option 3, for an immigrant who has since naturalised and now holds Irish citizenship, option 4, for someone who was born and brought up abroad to Irish parents (2nd generation).

PucaMama

Wouldn't true Irish be born in Ireland to Irish parents grandparents etc

MadDog76

For me, in order for somebody to be truly Irish then they must be born and raised in Ireland to two Irish parents who were also born and raised in Ireland and have Irish Grandparents etc. ........ your poll doesn't include that option fully.

osarusan

ThomasFlynn wrote: »

you can tick as many options as you want.

No you can't. You can only choose one option.

gifted

When they go to the bar when its their round...no prompting or dropping hints...just go themselves...pure irish like lol lol

5rtytry56

I will not vote in the thread. However, I have rated it fairly.

dudara

How many generations back do you want to go in order to define Irish? I'm pretty sure all of us have some English or even Norman or Viking blood in us.

Sonics2k

If you're born here, or your parents are Irish, then you're Irish.

endacl

The unicorn song and green beer on Patty's Day. That makes you Irish.

Eamondomc

A foreigner, a blow in, English, French, German, etc etc depending on where they're from.
Stupid poll, not nearly enough options.

Would being a holder of an Irish passport Qualify?
Being an Irish citizen, no matter where you're from?
Eligible to play for some of our national teams?

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

SharpshooterTom

osarusan wrote: »

No you can't. You can only choose one option.

Fixed it now.

Arcade_Tryer

How do you define someone who is/isn't Irish?

I don't.

Mr. CooL ICE

Depends on how good a footballer they are.

Solomon Pleasant

If you are born in the Republic of Ireland, you're Irish.

If you're not born in the Republic of Ireland then you're not Irish.

Simple really.

PucaMama

Solomon Pleasant wrote: »

If you are born in the Republic of Ireland, you're Irish.

If you're not born in the Republic of Ireland then you're not Irish.

Simple really.

If you are not born to Irish parents you are not Irish

MadDog76

Sonics2k wrote: »

If you're born here, or your parents are Irish, then you're Irish.

Solomon Pleasant wrote: »

If you are born in the Republic of Ireland, you're Irish.

If you're not born in the Republic of Ireland then you're not Irish.

Simple really.

I disagree ..............

Shenshen

Someone paying taxes in Ireland.

Eamondomc

If you go to the labour to sign on and you have difficulty.

osarusan

Thread is going to be ugly...'real' Irish, 'true' Irish, etc.

SharpshooterTom

What about someone born and bred in Ireland to English parents? I know a few of them, went through the education system here, involved in local GAA clubs, learnt Irish etc.

Would they not be Irish, even if they hold Irish citizenship?

Solomon Pleasant

PucaMama wrote: »

If you are not born to Irish parents you are not Irish

You're nationality is something that concerns you and not your parents. It's entirely based on your place of birth. To base someone else's nationality on where their parents are born is ridiculous - They're nationality can be different to their child's nationality.

TheQuietFella

I had an Asian lad one day telling me he was Irish as he had an Irish passport.

What a joke!!!

Only if you're born in Ireland in my mind makes you 100% Irish.

Irish parentage in a foreign country dilutes the credentials a little but yes, Irish!

Anything after that is heresy!

MadDog76

ThomasFlynn wrote: »

What about someone born and bred in Ireland to English parents? I know a few of them, went through the education system here, involved in local GAA clubs, learnt Irish etc.

Would they not be Irish, even if they hold Irish citizenship?

They're legally Irish of course ............ but I personally would not consider them to be Irish.

SharpshooterTom

osarusan wrote: »

Thread is going to be ugly...'real' Irish, 'true' Irish, etc.

I know, I actually hold liberal views on this myself and have a broad definition of Irishness but I didn't want to come across as overly condemning people who hold conservative views as 'racist' and labelled it as 'traditional' views. I wanted an honest reflection of what generally people think.

Avatar MIA

I'd rather give an example rather than a definition.

If someone is in Ireland from a young age, even if both their parents are foreign and go through the Irish education system, then they are Irish.

So, not a great definition, but would be ruled out by what others have described in this thread.

MadDog76

Solomon Pleasant wrote: »

You're nationality is something that concerns you and not your parents. It's entirely based on your place of birth. To base someone else's nationality on where their parents are born is ridiculous - They're nationality can be different to their child's nationality.

That's a very simplistic view to hold .........

TheQuietFella

ThomasFlynn wrote: »

I know, I actually hold liberal views on this myself and have a broad definition of Irishness but I didn't want to come across as overly condemning people who hold conservative views as 'racist' and labelled it as 'traditional' views. I wanted an honest reflection of what generally people think.

Because others don't necessarily share your viewpoint doesn't make them racists!!!

Avatar MIA

MadDog76 wrote: »

but I personally would not consider them to be Irish.

But, you're mad and a dog, so... meh.

MadDog76

Avatar MIA wrote: »

But, you're mad and a dog, so... meh.

And Irish ......... so there!

mulbot

Avatar MIA wrote: »

I'd rather give an example rather than a definition.

If someone is in Ireland from a young age, even if both their parents are foreign and go through the Irish education system, then they are Irish.

So, not a great definition, but would be ruled out by what others have described in this thread.[/QUOTE

Are you serious???

Harry Palmr

Shenshen wrote: »

Someone paying taxes in Ireland.

Ah now!

This thread will flush out the mad nationalists quickly enough

gifted

Avatar MIA wrote: »

But, you're mad and a dog, so... meh.

MadDog76 wrote: »

And Irish ......... so there!

Get a room ye two....lol lol

Avatar MIA

TheQuietFella wrote: »

Only if you're born in Ireland in my mind makes you 100% Irish.

So, James Connolly or Eamonn DeVelera weren't 100% Irish? :pac:

Shenshen

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Ah now!

This thread will flush out the mad nationalists quickly enough

Already has, from what I can see.

dudara

What if someone chooses Ireland as their country, settles here, has a family here, pays taxes here and becomes naturalised?

There's a big difference between being ethnically Irish and being legally Irish, but both are valid!

MadDog76

ThomasFlynn wrote: »

I know, I actually hold liberal views on this myself and have a broad definition of Irishness but I didn't want to come across as overly condemning people who hold conservative views as 'racist' and labelled it as 'traditional' views. I wanted an honest reflection of what generally people think.

Being logical and stating a fact does not equate to being racist ......... in any case, why would being considered Irish be some kind of great honour? If my Father was Icelandic, for example, then I would proudly tell people about my origins.

SharpshooterTom

MadDog76 wrote: »

They're legally Irish of course ............ but I personally would not consider them to be Irish.

You see the reason why I started this thread was because I am in the opposite scenario, born and brought up in England (till the age of 14) to Irish parents, I still speak with an English accent even though I now live in Ireland.

Now I'm apathetic to my nationality, and don't really strongly feel either English or Irish (I'm not at all surprised by the 4th option polling so low mind), but for those who consider option 1 only, then there's a bit of hypocrisy as they then expect native English people to accept someone with Irish parents as British/English.

Avatar MIA

mulbot wrote: »

Are you serious???

Yes, I seriously believe James Connolly and Eamon de Velera were Irish.

Do you seriously not believe they were Irish?

MadDog76

dudara wrote: »

What if someone chooses Ireland as their country, settles here, has a family here, pays taxes here and becomes naturalised?

There's a big difference between being ethnically Irish and being legally Irish, but both are valid!

Both valid but, as you said, both different .......... the distinction is the topic being discussed.

Mr. teddywinkles

Solomon Pleasant wrote: »

You're nationality is something that concerns you and not your parents. It's entirely based on your place of birth. To base someone else's nationality on where their parents are born is ridiculous - They're nationality can be different to their child's nationality.

A lot of people born to various nationality parents wise who are born in this country still see the homeland as their country. I think it takes a few generations to be honest.

MadDog76

ThomasFlynn wrote: »

You see the reason why I started this thread was because I am in the opposite scenario, born and brought up in England (till the age of 14) to Irish parents, I still speak with an English accent even though I now live in Ireland.

Now I'm apathetic to my nationality, and don't really strongly feel either English or Irish (I'm not at all surprised by the 4th option polling so low mind), but for those who consider option 1 only, then there's a bit of hypocrisy as they then expect native English people to accept someone with Irish parents as British/English.

I don't expect native English people to accept someone with Irish parents as British/English .........

mulbot

Avatar MIA wrote: »

Yes, I seriously believe James Connolly and Eamon de Velera were Irish.

Do you seriously not believe they were Irish?

I just refer to the quote of saying if someone comes here young and goes to school then they are Irish,I don't really see the reasoning there,and I think there's more to be considered than the two reasons you gave.

NoFreeGaffs

Someone paying taxes in Ireland.

So tourists are Irish? Or someone here on a work placement?

PucaMama

Solomon Pleasant wrote: »

You're nationality is something that concerns you and not your parents. It's entirely based on your place of birth. To base someone else's nationality on where their parents are born is ridiculous - They're nationality can be different to their child's nationality.

On paper maybe. But your parents and their parents descent is what makes you Irish or not. It's different to a piece of paper giving you the right to call yourself Irish.

Avatar MIA

mulbot wrote: »

I just refer to the quote of saying if someone comes here young and goes to school then they are Irish,I don't really see the reasoning there

I'm just picking two examples of many.

James Connolly was born in Scotland.
Dev was born in the US.

How would you define them as Irish?

mulbot

Avatar MIA wrote: »

I'm just picking two examples of many.

James Connolly was born in Scotland.
Dev was born in the US.

How would you define them as Irish?

Both their parents were either Irish or were of Irish descent, That's very different than just coming here at a young age and going to school.(the reasons you gave to qualify as Irish)

Mr. teddywinkles

MadDog76 wrote: »

Being logical and stating a fact does not equate to being racist ......... in any case, why would being considered Irish be some kind of great honour? If my Father was Icelandic, for example, then I would proudly tell people about my origins.

So claim to be both ? My surname isn't remotely irish but my parents, grandparents or id even go as far to say great grandparents dont know the country of origin. Unless its traced back. So Id claim I'm Irish outright. That's why id say it takes a few generations to have no affiliation with country of origin.

SharpshooterTom

MadDog76 wrote: »

I don't expect native English people to accept someone with Irish parents as British/English .........

Right so what nationality do people those people (like me) have? Now I've already stated my apathy to both, but many in my situation do generally yearn for a sense belonging and are confused.

Avatar MIA

mulbot wrote: »

Both their parents were either Irish or had Irish descent, That's very different than just coming here at a young age and going to school.(the reasons you gave to qualify as Irish)

Irish descent. Go back far enough and most of us are British or French, old chap.

grogi

PucaMama wrote: »

If you are not born to Irish parents you are not Irish

By recursion nobody is Irish then...