El Presidente Trump

tigger123 · 11-11-2016 10:50AM

seenitall wrote: »

Oh absolutely. He looked like a 5 year old in a cathedral. Completely overwhelmed, like siht just got real. You had to wonder if we wasn't going to do a Nigel Farage/Boris Johnson at some point soon.

And Melania looked as unhappy and uncomfortable as you could possibly be. She's no Michelle!

It was after a 90 minute meeting with Obama about the current state of everything, and that's exactly what I thought looking at it, like the chickens were coming home to roost.

20Cent · 11-11-2016 10:51AM

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

Who are the religious nutjobs in Leinster house?
Besides Healy Rae.

Also why do you want to bring it up in a thread about the US?
Derail it perhaps.

Pherekydes · 11-11-2016 10:52AM

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

Two things:

We have never had separation of church and state here.
And those who oppose an American creationist Secretary of Education and an American VP who wants creationism taught in schools also oppose religious interference in schools here, in Iran, Saudi Arabia, and anywhere else you can bring up with your whataboutery

The teaching of creationism in the US should concern everyone on the planet. Could you imagine Boeing's engineers saying a prayer instead of using the latest advances in STEM subjects?

Jelle1880 · 11-11-2016 10:52AM

20Cent wrote: »

How do you know they are ignoring it at home?

There is a large movement to repeal the eighth and get religion out of schools.
Irish politicians don't have to boast about how holy they are to get nominated.
Taking the bible literally is very rare here much more common in the US.
Same sex marriage is not an issue anymore the US it is.

The US is going backwards Ireland forwards.

Spot on.

Ireland is obviously still a very religious country, but it's politicians don't have to prove they believe in God to even have a chance of being elected.

Try being openly atheist and run for President of the USA, you won't even be taken serious no matter how good your policies may be.

Have people forgotten that George W. Bush literally said 'God told me to end the tyranny in Iraq' ? That's bat**** crazy, no matter if he actually meant it or not.

20Cent · 11-11-2016 10:56AM

A cabinet position for Sarah Palin.

It's getting better.

pumpkin4life · 11-11-2016 10:57AM

gandalf wrote: »

So you are clueless then. The other posters whilst being "mean-spirited" have a point. Any person who believes the clock will be turned back and low education blue collar jobs will suddenly reappear because Trump waves a magic wand is deluded. They have a responsibility themselves to upskill themselves so they are relevant to the jobs that are available. Sometimes the real world is cruel. Do you want a hug now :rolleyes:

Sure.

If you're young(ish), don't have a family, have a high enough IQ to master technical, abstract jobs. Which is beyond the capacity of a large number of people.

Globalization/free trade has decimated working class Europeans, from my community included and to tell them just "upskill" like it's the easiest thing in the world is not going to do anything. It will cause huge resentment if anything.

There are going to be a large number of people left behind in the coming decades thanks to Obama/Merkel/globalism etc. But of course, your clothes in Pennys are a little bit cheaper now! I hope it was worth it.

Lt Dan · 11-11-2016 10:57AM

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

It never ceases to amaze me on the amount of posters who will puff up their chests and spew absolute utter ill informed rubbish on sites like this

With regard to abortion: The amount of people who oppose abortion in ALL cases in Ireland is actually an extremely low per centage. The vast majority of people ACCEPT abortion in cases where the mother's life is at risk. The problem , unfortunately , has been how to define that clause.

Secondly, a lot of those who oppose repealing the 8th Amendment, would prefer to see an AMENDMENT to the Constitutional position on abortion include extend the grounds; rather ran remove the abortion clause.

Thirdly, not every who opposes abortion basis that opposition on religious grounds.

With regard to the School - Church - A substantial part of the day is spent teaching non religious subjects. A majority of the teachers are non clergy. THe content of the religious lessons could hardly be considered Extreme or doctrinaire Catholicism - To suggest otherwise is complete and utter spoofery .

Replace a morning prayer here to the Morning citation of the American anthem and "God Bless America" in all schools, and a stars and stripes being visible in most public buildings (inside and outside) , hardly much of a difference. Big into flags over there , aren't they . So were Na...

Minister Quinn has asked parents for their in put into a replacement of the schools. A lot of parents were not too interested.! The road to non religious schools has actually STARTED, just requires time to get into place.

The religious nutjobs in the US are exactly that. We don't have groups like that now deceased Baptist Church tool who had no qualms going to funerals and protest. The odd occasion that a Bishop in Ireland opens his gob with nonsense, he gets rip to shreds by the public . We certainty sympathies with New Yorkers with the likes of Cardinal Tim Dolan around

Since you enjoy waffling about matters that you clearly appear to be lacking in knowledge, how about dealing with the fact that Ireland , when the people when asked to vote, actually voted yes to Gay Marriage. The RC clergy (as oppose to the lay people) barely bothered to get involved - how could they? Since Maynooth is full of them. In California of all places, their people voted NO! Federal Court had to over rule that vote.

You haven't a clue son

11-11-2016 10:57AM

What I can see happening is him maybe getting a year out of it before it starts to go wobbly, as he can't deliver on the issues he ranted about: the US is too diverse, the world is too connected and big business is too pragmatic.

seenitall · 11-11-2016 11:00AM

Jelle1880 wrote: »

Have people forgotten that George W. Bush literally said 'God told me to end the tyranny in Iraq' ? That's bat**** crazy, no matter if he actually meant it or not.

Meh... Blair also invoked God about Iraq, iirc. It's just standard political showmanship, white-washing and pawning off of responsibilities to somebody else (where even an imaginary friend will, fortunately, do).

Permabear · 11-11-2016 11:01AM

This post has been deleted.

Lt Dan · 11-11-2016 11:02AM

tigger123 wrote: »

It was after a 90 minute meeting with Obama about the current state of everything, and that's exactly what I thought looking at it, like the chickens were coming home to roost.

Meh, that is the look of every leader of the opposition party , when they topple the current leader of the government. He is told about the true health of the country. The now former leader goes.......... sucker! Bet you wished that you did not lie and promise that........:D Good luck with fixing the mess we made . Sure, we will be back in powa after you cleaned up (Pretty much the story of Fine Gael)

Jelle1880 · 11-11-2016 11:02AM

seenitall wrote: »

Meh... Blair also invoked God about Iraq, iirc. It's just standard political showmanship, white-washing and pawning off of responsibilities to somebody else (where even an imaginary friend will, fortunately, do).

True, I forgot about that. But Blair likely just wanted his pal George to think highly of him.

Flint Fredstone · 11-11-2016 11:03AM

seenitall wrote: »

Oh absolutely. He looked like a 5 year old in a cathedral. Completely overwhelmed, like siht just got real. You had to wonder if we wasn't going to do a Nigel Farage/Boris Johnson at some point soon.

And Melania looked as unhappy and uncomfortable as you could possibly be. She's no Michelle!

This sums up a lot of what I'm listening to and reading in this country.

20Cent · 11-11-2016 11:08AM

Permabear wrote: »

This post had been deleted.

Danny Healy Rae was roundly laughed at for saying God makes the weather and climate change doesn't exist.
These are mainstream opinions in the US.

seenitall · 11-11-2016 11:11AM

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

This sums up a lot of what I'm listening to and reading in this country.

That was an aside, though. She doesn't need to be Michelle. The guy holding her hand is the one who should have been read up on.

rob316 · 11-11-2016 11:13AM

My wife still cant get past the idea that she lost because she is a woman. Can't understand how you could elect that racist, sexist pig over a woman who has spent 40 years in politics.

seenitall · 11-11-2016 11:17AM

rob316 wrote: »

My wife still cant get past the idea that she lost because she is a woman. Can't understand how you could elect that racist, sexist pig over a woman who has spent 40 years in politics.

I take it your wife doesn't follow politics too closely, outside the main events, so to speak?

Widdershins · 11-11-2016 11:19AM

pumpkin4life wrote: »

Sure.

If you're young(ish), don't have a family, have a high enough IQ to master technical, abstract jobs. Which is beyond the capacity of a large number of people.

Globalization/free trade has decimated working class Europeans, from my community included and to tell them just "upskill" like it's the easiest thing in the world is not going to do anything. It will cause huge resentment if anything.

There are going to be a large number of people left behind in the coming decades thanks to Obama/Merkel/globalism etc. But of course, your clothes in Pennys are a little bit cheaper now! I hope it was worth it.

This would be known by now if people listened to them. It's already been said a few times just on this thread alone. If people listened it would water down the effect of throwing your hands up and exclaiming ''why did they vote for him! They must be insane, stupid or both! No wait, they're racist!''

Jelle1880 · 11-11-2016 11:20AM

rob316 wrote: »

My wife still cant get past the idea that she lost because she is a woman. Can't understand how you could elect that racist, sexist pig over a woman who has spent 40 years in politics.

She didn't lose because she's a woman. She lost because she is seen as untrustworthy and just more of the same.

gandalf · 11-11-2016 11:32AM

Widdershins wrote: »

It's not me who is clueless. Until you come off your high horse and actually absorb what those people said, instead of making a judgement on them based on a stereotype, you won't understand why they voted for him. If you can't even understand that much you're getting ahead of yourself to demand to know what the next step is.

''They need to upskill''...that's presumptuous, dismissive, naive and a little bit arrogant. But continue to think you know where everyone went 'wrong' without even listening to what they said, and how they're the architect of their own problems, far be it for anyone to suggest they're entitled to choose a leader who takes a different view.

I'm not a PR person for Trump. It's not my job to map out his plan of action or cheerlead for him. I'm replying to the poster with the ''tough sh*t'' attitude and you arrived on to demand that I do so.
He's been elected less tan two days, clearly nobody can definitively say what he's going to be able to achieve, or even how sincere he is.

But I and others here are asking a very valid question, where are the jobs for them going to come from then?

Why do I talk about upskilling because that is exactly what I am doing at the moment. I have recognised that my skills are not meeting what the market requires and I am dealing with it.

Where did I say that people were the architects of their own downfall, in a lot of cases I am sure they aren't but they do have control over their future. They have to try to make themselves more relevant to the working world as it is today and not as it was 50 years ago. That world is gone.

In reality this is what Trump and his cohort should be doing, upskilling people to meet the requirements of the new world of employment but I doubt the Republicans will grant handouts like this to the blue collar workers. In the end they will get shafted again.

11-11-2016 11:37AM

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

You never do your homework.

http://www.ndtv.com/world-news/saudi-billionaire-who-slammed-trump-sends-best-wishes-1623795?site=full

In a perverse way that is good thing it mean world leaders are a pragmatic lot, its also two faced but that is politics for you.

gandalf · 11-11-2016 11:44AM

pumpkin4life wrote: »

Sure.

If you're young(ish), don't have a family, have a high enough IQ to master technical, abstract jobs. Which is beyond the capacity of a large number of people.

Globalization/free trade has decimated working class Europeans, from my community included and to tell them just "upskill" like it's the easiest thing in the world is not going to do anything. It will cause huge resentment if anything.

There are going to be a large number of people left behind in the coming decades thanks to Obama/Merkel/globalism etc. But of course, your clothes in Pennys are a little bit cheaper now! I hope it was worth it.

Anyone working in a manual high volume manufacturing type job will be obsolete in the very near future. Globalisation isn't the threat Automation is. As the cost of robotics, sensors and other associated technologies comes down people will and already are being replaced. Your clothes won't be produced by some poor person in a sweatshop in India or China it will probably be produced in a factory in Europe like the new Adidas plant in Germany.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/may/25/adidas-to-sell-robot-made-shoes-from-2017

The only jobs that will be left in Manufacturing will be high skilled Engineering or Technicians jobs servicing the automation robots and systems. With the advent of self drive goods might not get in human hands before they hit the shops.

You are right a massive amount of people are going to be left behind but not because of Globalisation but because of Automation and Industry 4.0. Governments will have to give serious thought on how this is going to be dealt with because there is an extreme danger of societal upheaval down the road.

_Jamie_ · 11-11-2016 11:45AM

humanji wrote: »

Surely you can be outraged at both?

Yes, I wasn't aware that one couldn't be concerned about both.

Participation in religion is continually declining in Ireland and undenominational and secular schooling is on the rise. There is a lot of support for reform of abortion laws too. I don't know why someone would conclude that anyone who ridicules 'religious nutjobs' in the US isn't also concerned with the influence of Catholicism in Irish life and law. One big difference between religion in the two countries though is that evolution is much more embraced on the whole in Ireland. Religion doesn't seem to influence one's stance on it in Ireland as much as in the US, though of course not all religious Americans are evolution deniers.

rafatoni · 11-11-2016 11:49AM

Jelle1880 wrote: »

I'm so suck of this non-argument. Just because you don't live somewhere doesn't mean you can't care.

First of all: I have relatives in the US, a lot of relatives actually. Most of them in Florida and Trump-voters, some of them who rely on a lot of medication on a daily basis that seem to have no idea how this will negatively affect them. So yes, I am worried for their future.

Secondly: The US is the most powerful country in the world, what they do can have consequences to the rest of the world. If they put a religious nutter in charge of their education system then that will set them back years, if not decades. And that will always have an impact on other countries.

You sound hysterical. Are you ok?

How will their eduaction have an impact on other countries? Genuinely interested.

Are you saying Trump in power will cause issues for Harvard and MIT?

SnakePlissken · 11-11-2016 11:53AM

rob316 wrote: »

My wife still cant get past the idea that she lost because she is a woman. Can't understand how you could elect that racist, sexist pig over a woman who has spent 40 years in politics.

So she's appalled that someone with alleged sexist views was elected... But wanted Clinton elected because she is a woman?

Maybe I'm misinterpreting your post.

Widdershins · 11-11-2016 11:53AM

gandalf wrote: »

But I and others here are asking a very valid question, where are the jobs for them going to come from then?

Why do I talk about upskilling because that is exactly what I am doing at the moment. I have recognised that my skills are not meeting what the market requires and I am dealing with it.

Where did I say that people were the architects of their own downfall, in a lot of cases I am sure they aren't but they do have control over their future. They have to try to make themselves more relevant to the working world as it is today and not as it was 50 years ago. That world is gone.

In reality this is what Trump and his cohort should be doing, upskilling people to meet the requirements of the new world of employment but I doubt the Republicans will grant handouts like this to the blue collar workers. In the end they will get shafted again.

Well no you and ''others''-the one other I was responding to-weren't asking valid questions. You were dismissing them. Anther poster responded to explain to you why ''upskilling'' is less realistic for some of those people, and if you listened to their stories you would know that some of them have diversified to the best of their abilities.

Had the comment been ''where are the jobs coming from'' that would have been a fair question. That's not what I replied to.
I didn't wish to discuss the viability of rejuvenating the rust belt. I'm not yet familiar enough with his plans, since he's just been elected and the dust is still settling. My advice was to familiarise yourself with the facts of those peoples situation instead of writing them off. All you can say to that is ''upskill''

rob316 · 11-11-2016 11:53AM

seenitall wrote: »

I take it your wife doesn't follow politics too closely, outside the main events, so to speak?

She is quite educated, admittedly brighter than myself but she doesn't see the bigger picture here. Alot of women seem to have the same problem too with it.

Ignoring the very basic fact that nationalism is on the rise on a global scale and Clinton is extremely unlikable.

rob316 · 11-11-2016 11:55AM

SnakePlissken wrote: »

So she's appalled that someone with alleged sexist views was elected... But wanted Clinton elected because she is a woman?

Maybe I'm misinterpreting your post.

The irony and hypocrisy isn't lost on me don't worry your not misinterpreting anything.

brevity · 11-11-2016 11:55AM

Jelle1880 wrote: »

She didn't lose because she's a woman. She lost because she is seen as untrustworthy and just more of the same.

And because the democrats didn't come out to vote.

homerjay2005 · 11-11-2016 11:56AM

Trump is in a difficult place now as regards his pre election topics.

if he doesnt build his wall, his critics will lash him.
if he builds the wall, his critics will lash him and so on.

these people are so bitter and so jealous of the fact he won, they will just do everything in their power now to find fault from now on.

the media reaction since he won has been a disgrace - instead of trying to promote Unity and moving on, all they are doing is showing the same 3 or 4 short clips over and over again, just to incite more hatred and division, which is what they are accusing Trump of doing.

El Presidente Trump

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