Dublin Marathon 2016 - Mentored Novices Thread

nop98 wrote: »

Hi ligerdub -

Are you signed up for DCM this year? 72 minutes over 10M is quite a decent time. Have you ran a decent HM in recent times?

As you've seen from the posts in the last few days, marathon training is more about building up the endurance over speed - especially for a first time marathon runner. Pushing too hard at your training runs is counter-productive as it hampers recovery and doesn't train your muscles to be most efficient.

If you are interested in intermediate / advanced marathon training plans, a quick Bing/Google will help you out. The programs we use are aimed at Novices - HHN1 is the basic, tried&trusted plan, Boards is slightly more advance with some moderate speed sessions.

The simple mantra for maintaining running over longer distances is to run more miles, and run slower miles.

nop98 wrote: »

Extrasupervery - Glad someone already corrected you on the choice of pizza - any running to report? And treating your body like a casino - I am still thinking that one through..

smashiner wrote: »

davedanon wrote: »

There's probably a dozen people typing this right now: Nooooooooo.

Yes, it is the end of October, but BE WARNED. I have just four numbers for you.

2.0.1.4

Ask anyone about DCM two years ago. It was the new route, and it was unseasonably warm, up to about 19℃. Utter, utter carnage.

Aaaarrrgggghhhhh the flashbacks ....... running inside a fan oven on the Crumlin road in 2014.......whenever I see another poor soul wearing that 'lovely' lime green and blue DCM 2014 I give them the respectful 'nod' as everyone still talks about the crazy heat and the humidity that day. A lot of the pacers didn't even make their times it was so warm.:(

2015 was four seasons in a day, typical Irish Autumn weather. Pray for cool weather with a pinch of sleet and snow :eek:

You cannot control the weather so there is no point in stressing about it, just take into account the conditions on the day and don't be afraid to revise your planned time either up or down if the weather is a factor, remembering that a lot can change weather wise in Ireland within an hour!

Don't put the 'Child of Prague' statue in the window and hope for a light drop rain.....:D

Ah here now let's not tarnish the reputations of so many for the short coming of a very small minority..........3 out of 39 if my memory serves me correctly


PS and 1 of the 3 only missed it by 5secs

nop98 wrote: »

That said, some other folks haven't been so lucky. However, reading all the great reports, I would say that between you all, we can easily crowd-source a great review of the entire course. So I need some volunteers

If you have recently ran a part of the course, put your name down and describe the route, the tough parts, the easy parts, some funny anecdotes. You'll do your fellow novices a great favour. Go on, put your name down, jot down a few notes, don't be shy. :cool:

Stretch|From / To |Volunteer|Description
1-4M|Start - Dublin Zoo|?|?
4-10M|Chesterfield Ave - Castleknock - Chapelizod|?|?
10-15M|Chapelizod - Crumlin - Walkinstown|?|?
15M-20M|Kimmage - Terenure - Milltown|?|?
20M-Glory|Clonskeagh - Vincent's - Finishline|?|?
Post-Finish|Merrion Square - McGrattans|Singer|?

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Firstly: 19 Mile LSR done. Delighted.

Secondly, I included the last 9 miles of the DCM route so I thought I'd give a bit of a run down.

I joined the route on the Templeogue Road at the junction with Fortfield Road. From here it's arrow straight down to Terenure with a slight decline. After you come through the village it's on to Terenure Road East heading on towards Rathgar which is more of the same, but the slight decline is replaced by a very slight, possibly even imaginary incline.

As you approach the church there's a hard right onto Orwell Road. It's still flat here but the straight lines are replaced by a couple of twists and turns before a hard left onto Orwell Park. Half of this road is slightly uphill, followed by a nice mild descent towards Dartry Road.

This whole section from Templeogue Road to Dartry is quite pleasant and quite easy, and I suspect it will be a bit of welcome respite after 18 miles to have a couple of miles where it should be easy enough to catch your breath while holding marathon pace.

Then it's onto Milltown Road which runs along the banks of the Dodder, yet despite this is quite undulating. It's not severe at all, but there are noticeable rises and falls and it would be well worth modulating your pace along here to avoid wasting unnecessary energy as you pass through 20 miles. There's a nice glide downhill before you hit a junction with another hard right towards Clonskeagh Road and onward to the infamous Roebuck.

This stretch is part of my commute so through familiarity I'm probably a poor judge of it. I normally have a bag on my back and today I didn't so I was floating along. It's generally uphill but there are some dips as well, particularly where you cross the Dodder. Once you cross the bridge the incline does get a little steeper but it's nothing that would trouble well trained athletes like us .

Roebuck Road itself is a weird one because Clonskeagh Road feeds into it, but there's a T-junction with a left turn where it turns into Goatstown Road and Roebuck actually continues to the left of the T. I've never actually run that part of Roebuck because I continue straight so I was eager to see what all the fuss was about and, I gotta tell you, it's a total pussycat.

I ran the mile or so beforehand at around marathon pace to try and get a feel for it, but obviously there is a difference between arriving there after 10 miles and after 22. Still, the road itself is vaguely uphill most of the way but I wouldn't even describe it as a drag. The infamous 'Heartbreak Hill' appears to amount to a stretch of a 100m or so at the end where it steepens significantly but I wouldn't be worried about it at all. Goatstown Road is worse. I mean if that's the worst the DCM has to throw at us I think we'll be all right; the only obstacle you have from here on out is all the miles in your legs.

Right after you crest the rise you turn left onto Fosters Avenue and you get to just cruise downhill for a while. It's a really nice grade where you can drop into neutral, switch off the engine and just let the hill do the work for you as you roll down to the N11 / Stillorgan Road. It's a free kilometer.

Left onto Stillorgan Road and now you're heading back into the city. It's downhill for a while but only slightly and not enough to make it feel especially easy. It's boring too, for me at least, to run on big wide straight roads like these and I couldn't wait to get off it. There is a climb up to the UCD flyover, and then the corresponding drop coming down the other side before you come to the turn off for Nutley Lane. It's not too bad in general terms but I could imagine you won't be too keen to see it after 23 or so miles and it might require a bit of cement. The RTE mast will be in front of you and you take a hard right and now you're back onto a smaller, leafy green street. I felt like this was still a little downhill and enjoyable enough to run on.

Left turn onto Merrion Road and now this is it. There are still 2 miles to go, but it's pancake flat and a straight shot all the way to Merrion Square and glorious victory.

Murph_D wrote: »

Well I think Myles' post that you linked to above more than covers it.

Here's what Pfitzinger and Douglas have to say on the issue in Advanced Marathoning (note - novices are not advanced marathoners, so not all of this necessarily applies, but the bit about 10-20% slower than MP certainly does):

________________


Your ability to store glycogen and use fat for fuel tends to improve with the same types of training. Pure endurance training stimulates these adaptations and increases the capillarization of your muscles. For marathoners, the primary type of training to stimulate these adaptations is runs of 90 minutes or longer. Your total training volume, however, also contributes. ...

Long runs are the bread and butter of marathoners. For all marathoners, including the elite, the marathon distance is a formidable challenge. To prepare to race 26.2 miles (42.2 km) at a strong pace, train your body and mind to handle the distance by doing long runs at a reasonable pace.

A long run also provides psychological benefits. By running long, you simulate what your legs and body will go through in the marathon. When your hamstrings tighten 23 miles (37 km) into the race, for example, it helps to have experienced a similar feeling in training - you'll know you can shorten your stride a few inches, concentrate on maintaining your leg turnover, and keep going. More generally, you'll have experienced overcoming the sometimes overwhelming desire to do anything but continue to run.

During your long runs, you encounter many of the experiences - good and bad - that await you in the marathon. No scientific evidence will tell you the best distance for your long runs as you train. However, a clear trade-off exists between running far enough to stimulate physiological adaptations and remaining uninjured. If you regularly do runs longer than 24 miles (39 km), you'll become strong but slow because you won't be able to run your other hard workouts at as high a level of quality. You'll also increase your risk of injury because when your muscles are very fatigued, they lose their ability to absorb impact forces, greatly increasing your risk of muscle strain or tendinitis.

Experience suggests that steadily building your long runs to 21 or 22 miles (34 or 35 km) will maximize your chances of reaching the marathon in top shape while remaining healthy. ...

Long runs shouldn't be slow jogs during which you just accumulate time on your feet. The appropriate pace for a specific long run depends on the purpose of that run within your training program. The most beneficial intensity range for most of your long runs is 10 to 20 percent slower than your goal marathon race pace. ... If you use a heart monitor, your long-run pace should be roughly in the range of 74 to 84 percent of maximal heart rate or 65 to 78 percent of your heart rate reserve. This will ensure that you' re running with a similar posture and are using similar muscle patterns as when you run at marathon pace.

If you do long runs much slower than this, you risk being unprepared for the marathon. Slow long runs reinforce poor running style and do a poor job of simulating the demands of the marathon. If you run long runs too fast, of course, you risk leaving your marathon performance out on your training loops because you'll be too tired for your other important training sessions. ...

The first few miles of your long runs can be done slowly, but by 5 miles (8 km) into your long run, your pace should be no more than 20 percent slower than marathon race pace. Gradually increase your pace until you're running approximately 10 percent slower than marathon race pace during the last 5 miles (8 km) of your long runs. In terms of heart rate, run the first few miles at the low end of the recommended intensity range, and gradually increase your effort until you reach the high end of the range during the last 5 miles (8 km) . This makes for an excellent workout and provides a strong stimulus for physiological adaptations. These workouts are difficult enough that you should schedule a recovery day the day before and 1 or 2 days after your long runs.

If you do long runs in this intensity range, a 22-mile (35 km) run will take approximately the same amount of time as your marathon. By running for the length of time you hope to run the marathon, you also provide psychological reinforcement that you can run at a steady pace for that amount of time.