Phoenix Park tunnel: 4 trains per hour from 2016

GM228 · 20-09-2016 04:23PM

L1011 wrote: »

Paddico wrote: »

So when was the last time the train ran on that line between Mullingar and Athlone. I seem to remember using tha route around 92 and it had a stop in Moate

1980s.

Regular scheduled services ceased in 1987. Freight continued until mid 90s.

A few specials operated over the line in the late 80s and early 90s and loco hauled PWD trains continued to use the line until 2001.

Last movement over the line was about 6 years ago when the annual inspection car run ceased.

Infini · 20-09-2016 05:22PM

GM228 wrote: »

Regular scheduled services ceased in 1987. Freight continued until mid 90s.

A few specials operated over the line in the late 80s and early 90s and loco hauled PWD trains continued to use the line until 2001.

Last movement over the line was about 6 years ago when the annual inspection car run ceased.

Kinda a waste of a line that its just left like that unfortunately. All it would take is planning some decent sized towns along the line and it could be made viable too expecially with the price of housing so high in Dublin. Biggest kicker is most of that is a double track line as well if im not mistaken. Looked at the map there as well you got Moate disconnected from the rail network yet theres a decent sized town there. All this talk of building more houses and such but theres places like that that could be seriously expanded and made viable with joined up thinking but yet nothing happens.

ClovenHoof · 20-09-2016 05:51PM

MrMorooka wrote: »

If there is any proof or info on this history of CIE management mindset,

Buy a monthly commuter ticket.

ClovenHoof · 20-09-2016 05:54PM

Infini2 wrote: »

Kinda a waste of a line that its just left like that unfortunately. All it would take is planning some decent sized towns along the line and it could be made viable too expecially with the price of housing so high in Dublin. Biggest kicker is most of that is a double track line as well if im not mistaken. Looked at the map there as well you got Moate disconnected from the rail network yet theres a decent sized town there. All this talk of building more houses and such but theres places like that that could be seriously expanded and made viable with joined up thinking but yet nothing happens.

The WRC shower kept playing down the Athlone-Mullingar line potential claiming it was full of curves.

It was a double track line with about 1% of the severe curvature of the WRC north of Tuam.

They knew if a case for reopening for Athlone-Millingar was made (and it was indeed viable), it would be death of the Swinford Supertrain.

ClovenHoof · 20-09-2016 05:57PM

Back on topic: any dates on the PPT start up announced yet?

Jamie2k9 · 20-09-2016 10:43PM

ClovenHoof wrote: »

Back on topic: any dates on the PPT start up announced yet?

Last I heard is within first 3 weeks of November, they will usually take 4-6 weeks from yesterday to review feedback and agree rosters etc.

XPS_Zero · 21-09-2016 08:28PM

Currently I have to go to CC and take a packed wet uncomfortable bus winding and swerving for over an hour to get to Adamstown OR go DART-Luas-Heuston-Adamstown.

When this is done can I just swap trains in GCD and go str8 to Adamstown?

Also would the local DART station give you a Killiney to Adamstown return? Now and when PPT is open, and would one now inc Luas transfer?

I find trains way more comfortable than the bus and just swapping in GCD would be ideal especially with winter coming up

Jamie2k9 · 21-09-2016 08:44PM

XPS_Zero wrote: »

Currently I have to go to CC and take a packed wet uncomfortable bus winding and swerving for over an hour to get to Adamstown OR go DART-Luas-Heuston-Adamstown.

When this is done can I just swap trains in GCD and go str8 to Adamstown?

Also would the local DART station give you a Killiney to Adamstown return? Now and when PPT is open, and would one now inc Luas transfer?

I find trains way more comfortable than the bus and just swapping in GCD would be ideal especially with winter coming up

Use Leap Card

Grandeeod · 21-09-2016 08:45PM

XPS_Zero wrote: »

Currently I have to go to CC and take a packed wet uncomfortable bus winding and swerving for over an hour to get to Adamstown OR go DART-Luas-Heuston-Adamstown.

When this is done can I just swap trains in GCD and go str8 to Adamstown?

Also would the local DART station give you a Killiney to Adamstown return? Now and when PPT is open, and would one now inc Luas transfer?

I find trains way more comfortable than the bus and just swapping in GCD would be ideal especially with winter coming up

Maybe next year. The launch appears to be focused on inbound from Kildare during morning peak and outbound during evening peak. It takes CIE a lot longer to realise the potential.....because they can't get enough money from the Government apparently.

LXFlyer · 21-09-2016 08:53PM

Grandeeod wrote: »

Maybe next year. The launch appears to be focused on inbound from Kildare during morning peak and outbound during evening peak. It takes CIE a lot longer to realise the potential.....because they can't get enough money from the Government apparently.

To be fair - the three outbound (effectively) positioning journeys from GCD in the morning all stop at Parkwest which would be the main potential morning destination on the line given the business park there, and arrive there at times that are reasonable for commuters starting work at 08:00, 08:30 and 09:00. The turnaround times for trips back are probably too tight to allow any more stops.

Similarly in the afternoon the positioning trips inbound to GCD all call at Parkwest offering the ability to commute from and to the city or Drumcondra.

I seriously doubt that would have happened some years back - those trains would have been out of service, so we are seeing some signs of change.

The issue with not operating the full all day timetable is down to insufficient driver numbers at present from what I understand.

XPS_Zero · 21-09-2016 10:57PM

I haven't looked at the draft timetable - are they proposing just rush hour in rush hour out only for now? So like no tunnel journeys between 10am and 5pm?

ClovenHoof · 21-09-2016 11:01PM

XPS_Zero wrote: »

Currently I have to go to CC and take a packed wet uncomfortable bus winding and swerving for over an hour to get to Adamstown OR go DART-Luas-Heuston-Adamstown.

When this is done can I just swap trains in GCD and go str8 to Adamstown?

Also would the local DART station give you a Killiney to Adamstown return? Now and when PPT is open, and would one now inc Luas transfer?

I find trains way more comfortable than the bus and just swapping in GCD would be ideal especially with winter coming up

Amazing how the opening of the PPT and the options you describe almost makes it sounds like Dublin has an integrated rail network for first time.

Whoda thunked it!

NiallBoo · 21-09-2016 11:48PM

GM228 wrote: »

Regular scheduled services ceased in 1987. Freight continued until mid 90s.

A few specials operated over the line in the late 80s and early 90s and loco hauled PWD trains continued to use the line until 2001.

Last movement over the line was about 6 years ago when the annual inspection car run ceased.

Isn't it now being used as a greenway?

tabbey · 21-09-2016 11:48PM

XPS_Zero wrote: »

Currently I have to go to CC and take a packed wet uncomfortable bus winding and swerving for over an hour to get to Adamstown OR go DART-Luas-Heuston-Adamstown.

When this is done can I just swap trains in GCD and go str8 to Adamstown?

It would be more comfortable to change train in Pearse, under the overall roof, at least if it is wet.

XPS_Zero · 21-09-2016 11:59PM

Imagine if we'd built the damn DU and Metro North. I keep hearing the moronic point by uninformed people "this isn't New York we don't have the population density for. Subway".

1. YES WE DO - in some key areas
2. You're meant to built infrastructure based on future population trends and projections not how things are THIS MINUTE... you'd think they'd have learned that from the M50, Luas, DART UPGRADE, Port Tunnel all rushed in a panic when we suddenly realised were not Wales anymore but actually a developing country (lots of key people I know in politics to my frequent facepalming say, when I ask "why can't we have west coast fishing and wave power like Norway? At least a v small number of military jets like Belgum, a rail link to the airport like every other capital in w.europe, a basic underground etc), compare us to "more of a Wales than a Norway, and by that standard were doing well").

Well fear not out of shape guys out there, you're not in bad health, stop benchmarking yourself against Hollister models and Men's Health covers, compared to the chain smoking guy in a moo moo who has to use an electric wheelchair, your beer belly is no indication you're out of shape!

Going from Killiney to Adamstown via bus is uncomfortable.

So I tried it by train. It was definitely wayyyyy more comfortable (esp since the train had a Premier carriage attached) but the Luas transfer is a bit of a pain in the ass especially when I look longingly at the ICR parked at GCD on the tunnels platform. Also hearing on the Luas "jayzuz i schwearrr if you don't shur up in gonna bate de bleedin bollix outta ye roite? Let me roll me bleedin smokes in peace...jayzuz de noize eh ye dya ever stop ****in outta ye ye tic" and other just lovely conversations in the background was off putting....a quick train change instead of....

1. Getting off in Connoly
2. Doing the long walk through it to the escalators
3. Waiting for Luas
4. Waiting for the Luas to crrraaawwl through CC (thru which it would speed if they'd put it underground thru cc as was original suggestion)
5. Getting off at Heuston
6. Walking thru Heuston allll the way to platform 8 ******ing miles away from the door then wayyyy past the first ICR parked at 8 to the one BEHIND it
7. Going to Adamstown.....

....just walking across one platform to another train at GCD compared to that....my God id love it

XPS_Zero · 22-09-2016 12:05AM

tabbey wrote: »

It would be more comfortable to change train in Pearse, under the overall roof, at least if it is wet.

My theory was getting on at GCD at least at rush hour would be better in terms of getting a seat as going towards PPT would be busier at Pearse and Tara.

Often coming back from CC at rush hour I notice Connoly is better to wait at as way more people coming off work seem to get on at Tara and Pearse and so I've already got my seat at Connoly. Maybe there's more offices around the other stations

Vic_08 · 22-09-2016 02:06AM

XPS_Zero wrote: »

Going from Killiney to Adamstown via bus is uncomfortable.

So I tried it by train. It was definitely wayyyyy more comfortable (esp since the train had a Premier carriage attached) but the Luas transfer is a bit of a pain in the ass especially when I look longingly at the ICR parked at GCD on the tunnels platform. Also hearing on the Luas "jayzuz i schwearrr if you don't shur up in gonna bate de bleedin bollix outta ye roite? Let me roll me bleedin smokes in peace...jayzuz de noize eh ye dya ever stop ****in outta ye ye tic" and other just lovely conversations in the background was off putting....a quick train change instead of....

1. Getting off in Connoly
2. Doing the long walk through it to the escalators
3. Waiting for Luas
4. Waiting for the Luas to crrraaawwl through CC (thru which it would speed if they'd put it underground thru cc as was original suggestion)
5. Getting off at Heuston
6. Walking thru Heuston allll the way to platform 8 ******ing miles away from the door then wayyyy past the first ICR parked at 8 to the one BEHIND it
7. Going to Adamstown.....

From the southside Tara St to Abbey St Luas would be quicker than changing in Connolly

Or alighting at Pearse and taking any of the 25/26/66/67 routes to Heuston would mean less walking and less chance of running into Deco and his mot fightin over the methodone.

LXFlyer · 22-09-2016 06:36AM

XPS_Zero wrote: »

I haven't looked at the draft timetable - are they proposing just rush hour in rush hour out only for now? So like no tunnel journeys between 10am and 5pm?

As above - only at rush hour.

http://www.irishrail.ie/media/00a_-_heuston_2016_draft.pdf

ClovenHoof · 22-09-2016 10:26AM

XPS_Zero wrote: »

Imagine if we'd built the damn DU and Metro North. I keep hearing the moronic point by uninformed people "this isn't New York we don't have the population density for. Subway".

New York? How about a valid comparison: Amsterdam, Helsinki, Prague, Munich, Frankfurt (oh dear), Oslo, Boston etc...

All cross-crossed with numerous metros, tram lines and heavy rail commuter lines and all about the same size and density as Dublin.

Banjoxed · 22-09-2016 10:33AM

ClovenHoof wrote: »

New York? How about a valid comparison: Amsterdam, Helsinki, Prague, Munich, Frankfurt (oh dear), Oslo, Boston etc...

All cross-crossed with numerous metros, tram lines and heavy rail commuter lines and all about the same size and density as Dublin.

Bet they didn't have comment writers in their papers having a Mickey fit about any PT other than buses..

GM228 · 22-09-2016 11:24AM

NiallBoo wrote: »

Isn't it now being used as a greenway?

Yes, but the tracks are still in situ with the cycle track running parallel.

end of the road · 22-09-2016 01:38PM

NiallBoo wrote: »

Isn't it now being used as a greenway?

yes. however the track is still existing (it would need to be replaced and the lot upgraded if services were ever to return) . the greenway might have to be re-routed though as i can't see the authorities allowing a cycle way right beside a live railway. it's a mute point though sadly as it's unlikely the line would reopen (it should have over the WRC, but then again navan should be opened also but whatever) we are where we are.

ChannelNo5 · 22-09-2016 05:44PM

XPS_Zero wrote: »

When this is done can I just swap trains in GCD and go str8 to Adamstown?

Yes!

NiallBoo · 22-09-2016 05:59PM

end of the road wrote: »

it's a mute point though sadly as it's unlikely the line would reopen.

Was it the original route for Dublin-Galway services? Seems like the mire obvious route? Was it closed in the first place to ease demand on Connolly?

LXFlyer · 22-09-2016 06:06PM

NiallBoo wrote: »

Was it the original route for Dublin-Galway services? Seems like the mire obvious route? Was it closed in the first place to ease demand on Connolly?

The Galway trains originally ran from Broadstone via Mullingar.

They switched to Connolly after Broadstone closed.

However when the upgrade of the Dublin-Cork line was completed in the 1970s, CIE switched the bulk of them to Heuston to take advantage of the higher speeds on that line and to consequently reduce journey times. Nothing more than that.

The station in Athlone was also subsequently relocated from the western side of the river to the eastern side, on the line to Portarlington, which frankly is much closer to the town centre.

tabbey · 22-09-2016 07:10PM

lxflyer wrote: »

The Galway trains originally ran from Broadstone via Mullingar.

They switched to Connolly after Broadstone closed.

However when the upgrade of the Dublin-Cork line was completed in the 1970s, CIE switched the bulk of them to Heuston to take advantage of the higher speeds on that line and to consequently reduce journey times. Nothing more than that.

The station in Athlone was also subsequently relocated from the western side of the river to the eastern side, on the line to Portarlington, which frankly is much closer to the town centre.

In 1937 Broadstone closed to passenger traffic.Former MGWR services to Sligo, Mayo and Galwayvia Mullingar, were diverted to Westland Row, now Pearse.

As Amiens Street, now Connolly was primarily a GNR station, the GSR (Great Southern Railway) stopped only those Midland line trains arriving in Dublin, at Amiens Street. Trains from Westland Row to the west, passed through platform 6 or 7 at Amiens Street, without stopping. Passengers had to board at Westland Row where the GSR had their own booking office and restaurant facilities. So passengers from Galway to Drogheda for example, could transfer from platform 5 to platform 4 or 3 or 2, but on their return journey had to go from Connolly to Pearse to get their westbound train.

The same was true for passengers from Rosslare, they could make a convenient change from the up morning train to platform 2 for the 1100 train to Belfast, but coming south had to change stations..

The GSR, later CIE had arrangements for the issue of local tickets at connolly, but kept Pearse for mainline departures.

This also was for operational convenience, the Rosslare trains arriving in Connolly ran around there and returned to Pearse for servicing and would wait in platform 5 (a bay platform at the eastern end of the southbound platform)until it was time to depart for the sunny southeast.

Del.Monte · 22-09-2016 07:33PM

The location of the MGWR station in Athlone was not a problem given that most people arrive at country stations in a car/bus etc. rather than commuter stations where a lot/majority of people walk to and from the station. The pointless closure and relocation of the station was done to facilitate a termination of rail services east of the Shannon and to make the reopening of the Mullingar/Athlone line even more expensive.

Vic_08 · 22-09-2016 08:33PM

Del.Monte wrote: »

The location of the MGWR station in Athlone was not a problem given that most people arrive at country stations in a car/bus etc. rather than commuter stations where a lot/majority of people walk to and from the station. The pointless closure and relocation of the station was done to facilitate a termination of rail services east of the Shannon and to make the reopening of the Mullingar/Athlone line even more expensive.

So now stations are better off away from town 'cause nobody walks to them anyways. :rolleyes:

What's the betting that if it had been the other way around you'd be moaning that you can no longer use the train to Athlone because the station is to far a walk from the town?

Athlone midland is poorly located, has very limited car parking space and not nearly enough space for co-locating a bus station, not that the bus company would want to locate there anyway because it is too far from the town centre.

https://www.google.com/maps/@53.4270698,-7.9483665,3a,75y,225.14h,76.1t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sNFhgH11A5Ga9K3v3WmazOQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Southern meanwhile is closer to the town, had much more space for car parking and a co-located bus station.

Once the logical decision to run Galway/Westport to Heuston was made it was a very good decision to switch to Athlone Southern. If those routes had been kept on the MGWR where would the extra paths and platform space in Connolly come from?

Del.Monte · 22-09-2016 08:44PM

Vic_08 wrote: »

So now stations are better off away from town 'cause nobody walks to them anyways. :rolleyes:

What's the betting that if it had been the other way around you'd be moaning that you can no longer use the train to Athlone because the station is to far a walk from the town?

Athlone midland is poorly located, has very limited car parking space and not nearly enough space for co-locating a bus station, not that the bus company would want to locate there anyway because it is too far from the town centre.

https://www.google.com/maps/@53.4270698,-7.9483665,3a,75y,225.14h,76.1t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sNFhgH11A5Ga9K3v3WmazOQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Southern meanwhile is closer to the town, had much more space for car parking and a co-located bus station.

Once the logical decision to run Galway/Westport to Heuston was made it was a very good decision to switch to Athlone Southern. If those routes had been kept on the MGWR where would the extra paths and platform space in Connolly come from?

Another person who refuses to read what is written. It is fairly obvious that the nature of travel from rural/provincial stations is radically different to that on commuter lines but you know best. I don't know where the logical conclusion to relocate everything into Heuston comes in but I'll bow to your superior knowledge.

Sam Russell · 22-09-2016 09:01PM

When did the Athlone station move to its current location?

Phoenix Park tunnel: 4 trains per hour from 2016

Comments