Advertisement
Help Keep Boards Alive. Support us by going ad free today. See here: https://subscriptions.boards.ie/.
https://www.boards.ie/group/1878-subscribers-forum

Private Group for paid up members of Boards.ie. Join the club.
Hi all, please see this major site announcement: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058427594/boards-ie-2026

The beginning of the end for taxi drivers

24567

Comments

  • #32
    The Backwards Man
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,299 ✭✭✭✭The Backwards Man


    Jawgap wrote: »
    ....can't even remember the last time I took a taxi in any city with Uber available.....taxi drivers are like modern day Luddites, they think they can hold back the march of the technology when what they do is an absolute model for being delivered through socialised, technology driven processes.

    Uber only operate in the areas where taxis are a mass transit stopgap. Uber isn't a solution, it's just replacing one problem that's constantly kicked down the road with another


  • #33
    josip
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 16,061 ✭✭✭✭josip


    Del2005 wrote: »
    Until a corporation makes the "Will we kill the granny or child" decision autonomous driving will be like fusion power always a few years away. No corporation can make that decision and no government will allow it. What we'll have is autonomous vehicles on Motorways and high quality trunk roads, in towns and cities there will always be a human driving.

    All it will take will be be the most progressive country to allow it.
    Road fatalities/injuries/crashes will plummet in that country.
    Pressure will mount in all other countries to emulate.
    Within 10 years some country in the world will allow fully autonomous cars everywhere.
    Within 20 years every country in the world will allow fully autonomous cars everywhere.
    Within 30 years some country in the world will only allow autonomous cars and a special permit will be required for human operated cars.


  • #34
    beach_walker
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 976 ✭✭✭beach_walker


    Hmm so no more attempted gouging, taking a longer route, feigning to have no change, racist/ignorant bile on a trip home*? Wow, what a time to be alive.



    *I mean that's if they even pick take your fare to begin with...


  • #35
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,296 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    The Backwards Man wrote: »
    Uber only operate in the areas where taxis are a mass transit stopgap. Uber isn't a solution, it's just replacing one problem that's constantly kicked down the road with another

    I wouldn't see it that way - for a start it's still in the process of evolving and I think we'll see a lot of changes over the next few years including the compete socialisation of commuting and travelling.

    People will use an app to locate other people travelling to (or close to) where they are going and engage them on a peer-to-peer basis. In fact, I'd say it won't be too long before public transit and private travel is integrated so that when you tap your phone and tell it where you want to go the technology will plan, price and pay for the quickest route even if its a combination of public transport, peer-to-peer sharing and whatever other forms emerge.

    We're entering the twilight of the sPSV - and I don't doubt that there are kids alive now who will never use a taxi.


  • #36
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,296 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    beach_walker wrote: »
    Hmm so no more attempted gouging, taking a longer route, feigning to have no change, racist/ignorant bile on a trip home*? Wow, what a time to be alive.



    *I mean that's if they even pick take your fare to begin with...

    I don't know, I think all that would be selectable as an option.....you could opt for

    .....the quickest route
    .....the shortest route
    .....or the 'traditional retro experience'.....whereupon the a/c system will pump in rancid air, an assortment of litter will fall from the roof, the nanotechnology in the seats will apply 'sticky mode,' a selection of pre-recorded rants will play and you can admire the Phoenix Park on your way from the airport to Howth ;)


  • Advertisement
  • #37
    The Backwards Man
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,299 ✭✭✭✭The Backwards Man


    Jawgap wrote: »
    I wouldn't see it that way - for a start it's still in the process of evolving and I think we'll see a lot of changes over the next few years including the compete socialisation of commuting and travelling.

    People will use an app to locate other people travelling to (or close to) where they are going and engage them on a peer-to-peer basis. In fact, I'd say it won't be too long before public transit and private travel is integrated so that when you tap your phone and tell it where you want to go the technology will plan, price and pay for the quickest route even if its a combination of public transport, peer-to-peer sharing and whatever other forms emerge.

    We're entering the twilight of the sPSV - and I don't doubt that there are kids alive now who will never use a taxi.
    There's one chink in that utopian chain that will never be seamless.

    People.


  • #38
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,296 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    The Backwards Man wrote: »
    There's one chink in that utopian chain that will never be seamless.

    People.

    Well there's more people involved in the chain now - and it's not exactly running with blistering efficiency.

    Plus, while the debate may well focus on road safety, public safety is another consideration - if I had a choice at the moment I'd encourage any daughter of mine to take an automated autonomous cab instead of a male operated one.....


  • #39
    Your Face
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,275 ✭✭✭Your Face


    You talkin to me?


  • #40
    beach_walker
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 976 ✭✭✭beach_walker


    The Backwards Man wrote: »
    There's one chink in that utopian chain that will never be seamless.

    People.

    I really don't understand what is you're objecting to, or holding up as the problem with auto cars/transport. What is it that you see as the issue with it?


  • #41
    The Backwards Man
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,299 ✭✭✭✭The Backwards Man


    beach_walker wrote: »
    I really don't understand what is you're objecting to, or holding up as the problem with auto cars/transport. What is it that you see as the issue with it?

    I'm not objecting to it, I'm just telling yous it won't work! :D

    Uber, Google et al are looking at it the same way you are, get the commuters going in the same direction in our driverless cars and monorails and boxybuses, and we'll make it cheaper for them to travel and more profitable for us. Grand, everybody wins right?

    But that's not what will happen, we don't live in a dysopian 1984 where people go to work, clock in, clock out and go home. How do you get the dog to the vet? The kids to football? Your incontinent Granny to mass?


  • Advertisement
  • #42
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,296 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    The Backwards Man wrote: »
    I'm not objecting to it, I'm just telling yous it won't work! :D

    Uber, Google et al are looking at it the same way you are, get the commuters going in the same direction in our driverless cars and monorails and boxybuses, and we'll make it cheaper for them to travel and more profitable for us. Grand, everybody wins right?

    But that's not what will happen, we don't live in a dysopian 1984 where people go to work, clock in, clock out and go home. How do you get the dog to the vet? The kids to football? Your incontinent Granny to mass?

    You take out your phone - you punch in where you want to go, how many are in the party and if there is anything 'special' (like an animal, person with impaired mobility etc) and your needs will be paired with someone or somepeople who can meet them.....

    .....or you load yourself into your car, and if you've spare capacity you get on your phone tap in where you are where you are going and what you can take and if someone along the way needs that spot the technology will pair you off, you take them and payment is transferred to your account.


  • #43
    The Backwards Man
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,299 ✭✭✭✭The Backwards Man


    Jawgap wrote: »
    You take out your phone - you punch in where you want to go, how many are in the party and if there is anything 'special' (like an animal, person with impaired mobility etc) and your needs will be paired with someone or somepeople who can meet them.....

    .....or you load yourself into your car, and if you've spare capacity you get on your phone tap in where you are where you are going and what you can take and if someone along the way needs that spot the technology will pair you off, you take them and payment is transferred to your account.
    I admire both your optimism and your faith in humanity. :)


  • #44
    eeguy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,399 ✭✭✭eeguy


    The Backwards Man wrote: »
    But that's not what will happen, we don't live in a dysopian 1984 where people go to work, clock in, clock out and go home. How do you get the dog to the vet? The kids to football? Your incontinent Granny to mass?

    The same way you do now obviously. You call a taxi.

    Through only difference is you can fit one extra person in since there's no driver.
    And it's cheaper because there's no driver.
    And it's safer because there's no driver.

    What part of this poses the problem?

    Also the likes of Google et al. don't need to understand the taxi business. They just need to make the tech and let existing and new taxi companies adopt it for their own businesses.


  • #45
    NinjaTruncs
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,626 ✭✭✭NinjaTruncs


    Red_Wake wrote: »
    I'm not sure they'll catch on tbh.

    People habitually break driving standards [speeding, stopping in yellow boxes, pulling out of an oncoming car] in order to speed up their journey [in some cases they feel they could be waiting another 10-20 minutes on their journey by obeying the law]. Driverless cars would never do this, would they have some kind of intelligence to let other cars out of side roads in the event of traffic? Passengers wouldn't be pleased seeing their cars letting others out, but would also not to be happy about being stuck waiting at a junction because traffic has the right of way[where normally someone would, soonber or later let a car out onto the road] and instead have to wait for traffic to clear.

    TL:DR - driverless won't break laws which people do habitually to help themselves.

    You assume breaking the rules of the road speed you up, but perhaps they slow everyone down. Traffic jams occur on perfectly clear stretches of the motorway because someone slows down unexpectedly and that has a knock on effect of stopping traffic. Driverless wouldn't cause such stoppages to occur. At times of heavy congestion driving slower will get more cars (safely) per hour trough a stretch of road than driving fast.

    Similarly at traffic lights, all cars would move off at a uniform pace at the same time so more cars would get through a particular sequence of lights. If you know cars weren't going to break red lights you also wouldn't need wait as long to ensure the way will be clear before moving off.

    And if you're not driving the car you suddenly have the time to do other stuff, so even if you were 10-20 minutes quicker by driving yourself you would still have spent 60+ minutes driving. If the car does it all, you've actually freed up 60+ minutes to do other things, like order your shopping weekly shopping, which could be free to delivery as there is no need to pay a delivery driver.

    4.3kWp South facing PV System. South Dublin



  • #46
    Pat Mustard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,554 ✭✭✭Pat Mustard


    beach_walker wrote: »
    Hmm so no more attempted gouging, taking a longer route, feigning to have no change, racist/ignorant bile on a trip home*? Wow, what a time to be alive.



    *I mean that's if they even pick take your fare to begin with...

    If they bring in driverless cars, I won't hire taxis anymore, full stop. Just go in my own car, driven by whatever machine/computer is driving.

    Getting insurance on a driverless car will be a whole newball game though.

    Insurance fraudsters will have a field day, figuring out the blind spots/weaknesses of driverless cars.


  • #47
    beach_walker
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 976 ✭✭✭beach_walker


    The Backwards Man wrote: »
    But that's not what will happen, we don't live in a dysopian 1984 where people go to work, clock in, clock out and go home. How do you get the dog to the vet? The kids to football? Your incontinent Granny to mass?

    Err I really don't get it. What's the difference between any of the above and going to work/scheduled commutes?


  • #48
    The Backwards Man
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,299 ✭✭✭✭The Backwards Man


    beach_walker wrote: »
    Err I really don't get it. What's the difference between any of the above and going to work/scheduled commutes?

    The risk (as in damage, soilage etc) to reward ratio is much higher, Uber or whoever will charge through the nose for that type of journey or else flat out refuse it, mark my words.


  • #49
    m5ex9oqjawdg2i
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,217 ✭✭✭✭m5ex9oqjawdg2i


    No job is absolutely secure.


  • #50
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,296 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    The Backwards Man wrote: »
    I admire both your optimism and your faith in humanity. :)

    No, it's faith in technology to make the connections and handle the transaction.

    You only have to look at the success of something like ebay to see that it's a small step from selling goods to selling services (airbnb) and it's only another small step from selling services you will need in the future to services you need now (hailo) and only a small step from purchasing the service to providing the service on a peer-to-peer basis.

    Earlier in the year I was in Boston for work.....uberSUV from the airport to an airbnb apartment I'd rented. Even arranged to have a bike available through spinlister for a bit of training and to get around easier.

    The idea that we'll continue as either consumer or provider is becoming more outmoded - increasingly we'll be both, if we want to.


  • #51
    eeguy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,399 ✭✭✭eeguy


    The Backwards Man wrote: »
    The risk (as in damage, soilage etc) to reward ratio is much higher, Uber or whoever will charge through the nose for that type of journey or else flat out refuse it, mark my words.

    What damage?
    I can rent a dublin bike and f*ck it up. But they know I was the last person to have it and they have my cc details on file so I'll be charged.
    It'll be the same with a taxi, only with more cameras as evidence.

    You wouldn't happen to be a taxi driver?


  • Advertisement
  • #52
    Flint Fredstone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,519 ✭✭✭Flint Fredstone


    Autonomous vehicles in Ireland are decades away. We still have a driver for our trains that travel in one direction with absolutely no traffic to deal with.


  • #53
    The Backwards Man
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,299 ✭✭✭✭The Backwards Man


    eeguy wrote: »
    What damage?
    I can rent a dublin bike and f*ck it up. But they know I was the last person to have it and they have my cc details on file so I'll be charged.
    It'll be the same with a taxi, only with more cameras as evidence.

    You wouldn't happen to be a taxi driver?

    Nope, not a taxi driver, and I wouldn't have a lot of time for most of them either, but I know a fair wee bit about moving people about. Te whole idea of driverless taxis is that they will be more efficient and expedient and cost effective. Once their algorithms work out which journeys are taking their cars out of service for the longest times they'll cut them. One their algorithms calculate their refusing too much work, they'll raise their prices and take it on again, and be more expensive than driver operated taxis ever were.

    That's the next fifteen to twenty years of the autonomous taxi industry mapped out for you in one paragraph, if I'm wrong come back to me, I'll gladly eat humble pie. But i won't be wrong


  • #54
    eeguy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,399 ✭✭✭eeguy


    Flint Fredstone wrote: »
    Autonomous vehicles in Ireland are decades away. We still have a driver for our trains that travel in one direction with absolutely no traffic to deal with.

    Plenty of autonomous trains in the world.

    We don't have them here because IE have no interest in getting them. Cost of investing in new stock, upgrading the lines plus dealing with all the union BS.

    It's not like a private company can start it's own service either, since IE have a monopoly.

    Big difference when it comes to road. The govt own them and don't care what drives on them provided it meets EU standards.

    If Uber wanted to start here I'm sure after a few legal hurdles it wouldn't be a problem. You'd have all the taxi lads complaining, but there's not a thing they could do. If they went on strike it'd just push people into the arms of Uber or whoever.


  • #55
    eeguy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,399 ✭✭✭eeguy


    The Backwards Man wrote: »
    Nope, not a taxi driver, and I wouldn't have a lot of time for most of them either, but I know a fair wee bit about moving people about. Te whole idea of driverless taxis is that they will be more efficient and expedient and cost effective. Once their algorithms work out which journeys are taking their cars out of service for the longest times they'll cut them. One their algorithms calculate their refusing too much work, they'll raise their prices and take it on again, and be more expensive than driver operated taxis ever were.

    So no different to the current "not tonight lads, I'm staying local".


  • #56
    The Backwards Man
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,299 ✭✭✭✭The Backwards Man


    eeguy wrote: »
    So no different to the current "not tonight lads, I'm staying local".

    Now you're getting it. :) No revolution, just replacement.

    The Who sang it better than I can ever say it.


  • #57
    beach_walker
    Users Awaiting Email Confirmation Posts: 976 ✭✭✭beach_walker


    The Backwards Man wrote: »
    ...

    There are laws around the provision of providing taxi services (e.g. not being allowed to turn down a fare etc.) so I wouldn't worry about it.

    Yeah I know current taxi drivers don't give a toss about them, but they're be a paper trail (so to speak) for any such behaviour in an automated world.


  • #58
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,424 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    Del2005 wrote: »
    Until a corporation makes the "Will we kill the granny or child" decision autonomous driving will be like fusion power always a few years away. No corporation can make that decision and no government will allow it. What we'll have is autonomous vehicles on Motorways and high quality trunk roads, in towns and cities there will always be a human driving.

    Why does that question come up about a.i but a person is never expected to present an action as to what they'll do in the scenario.

    Its a scenario that rarely even occurs too!


  • #59
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,296 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    eeguy wrote: »
    So no different to the current "not tonight lads, I'm staying local".

    Or the "F*ck off!!" you get if you climb into a taxi at the airport and ask to go to Santry :D


  • #60
    Jawgap
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,296 ✭✭✭✭Jawgap


    The Backwards Man wrote: »
    Now you're getting it. :) No revolution, just replacement.

    The Who sang it better than I can ever say it.

    except you are assuming the cost base will be the same.....it won't. Automated vehicles can pretty much remain on the road 24/7 and just be taken out for refuelling and occasional maintenance.

    "Algorithms" will be able to price in the full cost of any journey (including assigning a value to the opportunity cost) and quote the punter a price before they get in - no more relying on the vagaries of the meter or the whims of the driver ;)


  • Advertisement
  • #61
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,424 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    Jawgap wrote: »
    except you are assuming the cost base will be the same.....it won't. Automated vehicles can pretty much remain on the road 24/7 and just be taken out for refuelling and occasional maintenance.

    "Algorithms" will be able to price in the full cost of any journey (including assigning a value to the opportunity cost) and quote the punter a price before they get in - no more relying on the vagaries of the meter or the whims of the driver ;)

    Vagaries of the meter?

    What don't you understand about how it works.


Advertisement
Advertisement