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Would you be in favour of a border poll?

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    #1532
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    tomwaterford wrote: »
    Why would northern Ireland be included in the national debt of a country that has no strategic interest in it?

    This is lunacy.....what other country's debt do you want Ireland to take on....AFAIK Spain has no strategic interest in the north either :confused:

    We aren't taking on part of Spain though. Not that we're taking on part of the UK anytime soon mind but I can't see the UK giving away NI without a fair portion of its debt.


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    #1533
    Jayop
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,388 ✭✭✭✭Jayop


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    We aren't taking on part of Spain though. Not that we're taking on part of the UK anytime soon mind but I can't see the UK giving away NI without a fair portion of its debt.

    It's a spurious argument that you just pulled from your hole because most of your other arguments have already been beaten time and time again. There's no way in the world that the UK would pass on a section of it's debt to Ireland. if anything they would have to pay a dividend to Ireland to enable the process to go through smoothly.


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    #1534
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,638 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    It was an implication on nationalists for the benefit of unionists.

    It was set up to govern everybody but that's different to self determination.

    I think you need a mythbusting lesson in what 'governing everybody' means.

    Fabulously interesting this has been, an exposition of how unionists justify years of sectarian oppression. 'We were granted self determination'.

    Hope that has all helped to show you and anyone else labouring under a similar delusion that you weren't given any such thing and the responsibility for what you did, the systematic oppression of a minority lies primarily ath your door and at the door of a government who let you do it.


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    #1535
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    steddyeddy wrote: »
    You and your thawed out friend seem to have a beef with Muslims. Why not just keep it with Irish?
    Not at all, less of the bigoted assumptions there Eddy. ;)


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    #1536
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    I think you need a mythbusting lesson in what 'governing everybody' means.

    Fabulously interesting this has been, an exposition of how unionists justify years of sectarian oppression. 'We were granted self determination'.

    Hope that has all helped to show you and anyone else labouring under a similar delusion that you weren't given any such thing and the responsibility for what you did, the systematic oppression of a minority lies primarily ath your door and at the door of a government who let you do it.
    Who's the you? I'm Irish. I think you need a mythbusting lesson on what self determination is. Hint: it doesn't need to be granted by legislation.


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    #1537
    Jayop
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,388 ✭✭✭✭Jayop


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    Not at all, less of the bigoted assumptions there Eddy. ;)

    You should be more careful of the company that you keep if you don't want to be tarred with the same brush. Given you and your gang pull up everyone from the nationalist side on every single perceived slip up, I'm surprised you didn't take issue with the Islamophobic comment from Pony on the last page. Look back though all their posts since they joined up, some awful stuff posted.

    Just wanted to warn you, wouldn't like to see you being accused in the wrong.


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    #1538
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,638 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    Who's the you? I'm Irish. I think you need a mythbusting lesson on what self determination is. Hint: it doesn't need to be granted by legislation.

    sigh...well explain to us, how you can have good government while allowing one group to self determine?

    Just cut your losses here. It's embarrassing now, even A Little Pony has admitted what was done by Unionists - 'we took it'.
    'You' = unionists incl of republican partitionist unionists as well.


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    #1539
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Jayop wrote: »
    You should be more careful of the company that you keep if you don't want to be tarred with the same brush. Given you and your gang pull up everyone from the nationalist side on every single perceived slip up, I'm surprised you didn't take issue with the Islamophobic comment from Pony on the last page. Look back though all their posts since they joined up, some awful stuff posted.

    Just wanted to warn you, wouldn't like to see you being accused in the wrong.

    Northern Irish terrorism and the justification thereof is far more dangerous to me than Islamic terrorism.


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    #1540
    tomwaterford
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,768 ✭✭✭✭tomwaterford


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    We aren't taking on part of Spain though. Not that we're taking on part of the UK anytime soon mind but I can't see the UK giving away NI without a fair portion of its debt.

    This is lunacy. ...


    The British have no strategic interest in the north


    How/why would it's national debt apply there??

    Following your logic British should take on a portion of the debt for all the countries on the EU during get a Brexit


    Or deos do you pick and choose when to apply irrational logic to suit your arguemental


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    #1541
    Jayop
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,388 ✭✭✭✭Jayop


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    Northern Irish terrorism and the justification thereof is far more dangerous to me than Islamic terrorism.

    I didn't mentioned Islamic terrorism did I?

    Maybe you jumping to that conclusion speaks volumes then about your attidutes to Islam or other cultures?


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    #1542
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    sigh...well explain to us, how you can have good government while allowing one group to self determine?

    Just cut your losses here. It's embarrassing now, even A Little Pony has admitted what was done by Unionists - 'we took it'.
    'You' = unionists incl of republican partitionist unionists as well.

    I never said we could or couldn't, you introduced governance into the discussion, one of the false condition you tried to impose on the discussion.

    I said the establishment of Northern Ireland was an example of Unionist self determination. You took exception to that. No governance or legislation mentioned there.


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    #1543
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,638 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    I never said we could or couldn't, you introduced governance into the discussion, one of the false condition you tried to impose on the discussion.

    I said the establishment of Northern Ireland was an example of Unionist self determination. You took exception to that. No governance or legislation mentioned there.

    What is 'self determination' then? Deciding to go to Tesco's rather than Asda?

    You said way back that Unionists were 'GRANTED' self determination btw.


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    #1544
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Jayop wrote: »
    I didn't mentioned Islamic terrorism did I?

    Maybe you jumping to that conclusion speaks volumes then about your attidutes to Islam or other cultures?

    You didn't but the rising racism against Muslims in Europe is clearly linked to the rise in Islamic terrorism.

    In Ireland that threat also exists but Northern Ireland has a culture of exporting terrorism then defending said terrorism when it is politically expediant to do so.


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    #1545
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,638 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    You didn't but the rising racism against Muslims in Europe is clearly linked to the rise in Islamic terrorism.

    In Ireland that threat also exists but Northern Ireland has a culture of exporting terrorism then defending said terrorism when it is politically expediant to do so.

    We are in heavy spin cycle this evening. :D


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    #1546
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    What is 'self determination' then? Deciding to go to Tesco's rather than Asda?

    You said way back that Unionists were 'GRANTED' self determination btw.

    Self determination is the power to decide one's own destiny, the Unionists were granted national self determination when Northern Ireland was created at the same time Nationalists were also granted self determination by the same British government they hated.

    Nationalists couldn't abide the idea of another group of people living on the Island wanting to remain part of the United Kingdom and made illegal extra territorial claims in contradiction to the democratic wishes of the local people.


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    #1547
    Jayop
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,388 ✭✭✭✭Jayop


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    You didn't but the rising racism against Muslims in Europe is clearly linked to the rise in Islamic terrorism.

    In Ireland that threat also exists but Northern Ireland has a culture of exporting terrorism then defending said terrorism when it is politically expediant to do so.

    Absolutely gas to see you trying to reverse from this one. The mentions of Islam in the UK were fully and only relating to what they do to the culture. Pony came out with an Islamophobic remark and you then started going on about terrorism.

    Quick, call Mary, man overboard!! :pac:

    Edit: And I first said zenophobic bigots not having mentioned Muslims at all. The loyalist community has been attacking people from all different backgrounds, they aren't a discerning bigot, Polish, Catholic, Black, Asian, Muslim. All fair game.


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    #1548
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,638 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    Self determination is the power to decide one's own destiny, the Unionists were granted national self determination when Northern Ireland was created at the same time Nationalists were also granted self determination by the same British government they hated.

    Nationalists couldn't abide the idea of another group of people living on the Island wanting to remain part of the United Kingdom and made illegal extra territorial claims in contradiction to the democratic wishes of the local people.

    Nationalists and Unionists in NI were granted self determination? Curious and curiouser.
    Who granted it and how did they communicate this? Smoke signals?


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    #1549
    tomwaterford
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,768 ✭✭✭✭tomwaterford


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    Self determination is the power to decide one's own destiny, the Unionists were granted national self determination when Northern Ireland was created at the same time Nationalists were also granted self determination by the same British government they hated.

    Nationalists couldn't abide the idea of another group of people living on the Island wanting to remain part of the United Kingdom and made illegal extra territorial claims in contradiction to the democratic wishes of the local people.
    And what of nationlists (majority In 4of 6 counties btw)

    What of their right time self determination???




    Surly after near on a 100 years they've a right to vote on which country they want to be a part of



    Or deos their right to self determination not count??


  • Options
    #1550
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Nationalists and Unionists in NI were granted self determination? Curious and curiouser.
    Who granted it and how did they communicate this? Smoke signals?

    Nope. I didn't write that and you're being deliberately disingenuous. Try again.


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    #1551
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    tomwaterford wrote: »
    And what of nationlists (majority In 4of 6 counties btw)

    What of their right time self determination???




    Surly after near on a 100 years they've a right to vote on which country they want to be a part of



    Or deos their right to self determination not count??
    It wasn't four of six counties at the time.

    Nationalists were also given self determination, they were given a state in the South.


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    #1552
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,638 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    Nope. I didn't write that and you're being deliberately disingenuous. Try again.

    What did Nationalists in NI get? Overlords?


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    #1553
    tomwaterford
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,768 ✭✭✭✭tomwaterford


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    It wasn't four of six counties at the time.

    Nationalists were also given self determination, they were given a state in the South.

    And now they are a majority in the majority of the six counties....


    Surly they are entitled to self determination so and to rejoin the south???



    The state in the south is soon to get bigger :D

    Even you agree with self determination


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    #1554
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    tomwaterford wrote: »
    And now they are a majority in the majority of the six counties....


    Surly they are entitled to self determination so and to rejoin the south???



    The state in the south is soon to get bigger :D

    Even you agree with self determination

    Define soon?


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    #1555
    tomwaterford
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,768 ✭✭✭✭tomwaterford


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    Define soon?

    Tomorrow why not sure


    Why would you want to delay people's right to self determination??

    Since your such a fan


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    #1556
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    tomwaterford wrote: »
    Tomorrow why not sure


    Why would you want to delay people's right to self determination??

    Since your such a fan
    You made a statement, elaborate on it. How soon will it be until a UI, in your view


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    #1557
    tomwaterford
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,768 ✭✭✭✭tomwaterford


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    You made a statement, elaborate on it. How soon will it be until a UI, in your view

    Where did I say there'd be a UI??

    Comprehension skills could do with a brush up?


    You said there's a right to self determination. ...so by that logic in the 4 counties of the north with nationlists majorities can transfer to the South


    Unless self determination deosnt apply if your irish nationlists :eek:

    There's a word for this.....Emm colony


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    #1558
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 67,638 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    You made a statement, elaborate on it. How soon will it be until a UI, in your view

    Sure you unionists would just self determine the other way...oh wait, Britain has said you can't.

    They must've un'granted' self determination to yis :)


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    #1559
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    tomwaterford wrote: »
    Where did I say there'd be a UI??

    Comprehension skills could do with a brush up?


    You said there's a right to self determination. ...so by that logic in the 4 counties of the north with nationlists majorities can transfer to the South


    Unless self determination deosnt apply if your irish nationlists :eek:

    There's a word for this.....Emm colony

    Here:

    "The state in the south is soon to get bigger :D"

    How soon?


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    #1560
    tomwaterford
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,768 ✭✭✭✭tomwaterford


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    Here:

    "The state in the south is soon to get bigger :D"

    How soon?

    Sure as soon as the vote geos ahead :D:D:D


    Unless your one of those in favour of the parts of the north which have nationlist majority being a colony and denying self determination???



    Either you support democracy and self determination or not????


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    #1561
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    tomwaterford wrote: »
    Sure as soon as the vote geos ahead :D:D:D


    Unless your one of those in favour of the parts of the north which have nationlist majority being a colony and denying self determination???



    Either you support democracy and self determination or not????

    OK, how soon will that be? In your view


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