2016 US Presidential Race - Mod Warning in OP

KingBrian2 · 29-07-2016 11:53PM

I don't know why anyone in public life would ever enter a campaign to run for Presidential office in America. The man is being accused of rape for Christ's sake. The opponents of Hillary including those on the left have themselves being calling her a liar. So who's facts are wrong because their is a lot of mud being sling from both side. When Trump accuses Hillary of lying to the world Democrats agree with him even if they loathe the guy.

Akrasia · 29-07-2016 11:58PM

There's been another hack of clinton and DNC related emails according to Tech crunch.

Akrasia · 30-07-2016 12:00AM

KingBrian2 wrote: »

I don't know why anyone in public life would ever enter a campaign to run for Presidential office in America. The man is being accused of rape for Christ's sake. The opponents of Hillary including those on the left have themselves being calling her a liar. So who's facts are wrong because their is a lot of mud being sling from both side. When Trump accuses Hillary of lying to the world Democrats agree with him even if they loathe the guy.

If you're honest, principled and genuinely fighting for the people, you have nothing to fear..... But you'll never win the nomination

KingBrian2 · 30-07-2016 12:03AM

Akrasia wrote: »

If you're honest, principled and genuinely fighting for the people, you have nothing to fear..... But you'll never win the nomination

It happened with Obama and with previous presidents Lincoln & Roosevelt & JFK.

Billy86 · 30-07-2016 12:03AM

KingBrian2 wrote: »

I don't know why anyone in public life would ever enter a campaign to run for Presidential office in America. The man is being accused of rape for Christ's sake. The opponents of Hillary including those on the left have themselves being calling her a liar. So who's facts are wrong because their is a lot of mud being sling from both side. When Trump accuses Hillary of lying to the world Democrats agree with him even if they loathe the guy.

He has been accused of rape because he may well have raped a 13 year old girl and threatened her life if she told anyone. I assume you are also looking to absolve Trump's long term friend and notorious paedophile Jeffrey Epstein, who picked up young girls at Trump's establishments, also? Because he is part of the same law suit.

And let's not pretend this is the first, or even the second time Trump - who suggested Mike Tyson pay some money and be given a shorter sentence for raping a teenager, as chance would have - has been accused of raping a woman.

Here's the thing about Trump's well documented lies: Just because you pretend he doesn't say what he says, doesn't mean he didn't say it. This is something Trump fans seem to struggle with, the rest of us got over "deny deny deny and it might just go away" somewhere in our puberty.

KingBrian2 · 30-07-2016 12:10AM

Billy86 wrote: »

He has been accused of rape because he may well have raped a 13 year old girl and threatened her life if she told anyone. I assume you are also looking to absolve Trump's long term friend and notorious paedophile Jeffrey Epstein, who picked up young girls at Trump's establishments, also? Because he is part of the same law suit.

And let's not pretend this is the first, or even the second time Trump - who suggested Mike Tyson pay some money and be given a shorter sentence for raping a teenager, as chance would have - has been accused of raping a woman.

Here's the thing about Trump's well documented lies: Just because you pretend he doesn't say what he says, doesn't mean he didn't say it. This is something Trump fans seem to struggle with, the rest of us got over "deny deny deny and it might just go away" somewhere in our puberty.

I expect for your own sake you can substantiate those remarks. Allegations have been made a plenty about Trump during this campaign just like they were against Bill Clinton & Barack Obama. You would not want to defame a future president.

oscarBravo · 30-07-2016 12:20AM

KingBrian2 wrote: »

Allegations have been made a plenty about Trump during this campaign...

Yup. Just a few posts back, someone accused him of telling the truth! What'll they come up with next...?

OttoPilot · 30-07-2016 12:22AM

KingBrian2 wrote: »

I expect for your own sake you can substantiate those remarks. Allegations have been made a plenty about Trump during this campaign just like they were against Bill Clinton & Barack Obama. You would not want to defame a future president.

I don't know about a 13 year old girl, but there is that story Ivana Trump told about how he flew into a rage after an anti-balding surgery and forced himself on her. Sounds fairly rapey to me, even if Ivana now denies it was.

oscarBravo · 30-07-2016 12:28AM

KingBrian2 wrote: »

Perhaps it is due to the lack of truth on the Democratic side.

I can see that, as well as being in a post-truth world, we're in a post-logic world as well.

"How can you claim that an objectively dishonest person like Trump tells the truth?"

"It's the Democrats' fault."

Seriously, come on. At least pretend to make an effort. I know Donald Trump has brought debate down to kindergarten level, but is it absolutely necessary to ape him on this forum?

conditioned games · 30-07-2016 12:36AM

oscarBravo wrote: »

...but unable?

Seriously: how can anybody believe something like that? What sort of herculean effort of self-deception does it take to claim that the man who is, objectively, the least honest candidate for election this year (and, quite possibly, ever) is willing the speak the truth?

Or is this one of these dog-whistle situations, where "the truth" has come to mean "abusive, hateful and divisive rhetoric that I wish I could say myself but I'm afraid to reveal my true colours"?

Sounds like you've formed a false impression of Trump which is not surprising given how one sided the controlled media is.

The thing I like most about Trump is he says what needs to be said and doesn't allow himself to be quietened by anyone.

There is so much anger around the world including in America because of the transfer of wealth into the hands of a few. Its now time we have a serious world leader that cuts the crap with sound bites and political correctness.

The world is getting worse, people are becoming more disillusioned than ever while our current leaders try to portray a picture that's far from reality. This is Trump's time and by god does the world need him now more than ever.

Black Swan · 30-07-2016 12:40AM

Akrasia wrote: »

There's been another hack of clinton and DNC related emails according to Tech crunch.

After Donald Trump invited Russia (and the world) to hack Hillary Clinton and the DNC (by association), who would not dive-in and have fun influencing the US presidential election? There are thousands of hackers and crackers in the world today. I can hear the boasting hackers and crackers on later blogs, tweets, and other social media. And better yet, to influence the election to where the least qualified candidate wins, Donald Trump having 3 BIG ZEROES experience in governance, diplomacy, and preparation to be CIC, plus bankruptcies galore and class action suits for (alleged) "fraud, racketeering, and corruption" when attempting to compensate for no governance experience with business.

Then again I might be mistaken about Donald Trump when stating he has ZERO diplomacy experience, if you reconsider his former contacts with Miss Russia, Miss Turkey, Miss Slovenia, Miss, Miss... when he owned the Miss USA franchise. What a laughing stock will such hackers and crackers make of the US presidential election 2016! I can hear their future boasting and laughs so loud as to make a hyena jealous.

What a farce this US 2016 presidential election has become. I had no idea that it would be so when I opened this OP back in 2014. Nor did I dream that the BIGGEST CON of the 21st Century would occur by the least experientially qualified (Republican or Democrat) nominee in US history for their highest office: Donald Trump.

Billy86 · 30-07-2016 12:44AM

KingBrian2 wrote: »

I expect for your own sake you can substantiate those remarks. Allegations have been made a plenty about Trump during this campaign just like they were against Bill Clinton & Barack Obama. You would not want to defame a future president.

Keeping in mind that you want to hold this standard, I will be asking for links to every claim of yours and reporting every post where you fail to do so as otherwise the only logical conclusion is that you are being disingenuous or completely making up whatever you are claiming. Now, with that out of the way...

Which, that he has been accused of rape once? http://gawker.com/the-time-donald-trumps-ex-wife-accused-him-of-brutally-1721129617

That he has been accused twice? http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2016/07/donald-trump-sexual-assault-allegations-breaks-silence

EDIT: And the latest case, which I have linked to a number of times in this thread, for the third accusation against Trump... http://heavy.com/news/2016/06/donald-trump-rape-sexual-assault-federal-lawsuit-documents-thomas-meagher-attorney-lawyer-katie-johnson-epstein/ .

That he was good friends with Epstein? How about this quote... "I've known Jeff for fifteen years. Terrific guy, he's a lot of fun to be with. It is even said that he likes beautiful women as much as I do, and many of them are on the younger side. No doubt about it -- Jeffrey enjoys his social life."
- Donald Trump. http://nymag.com/nymetro/news/people/n_7912/

See Brian, THIS is what it is to back up your claim with facts.

eire4 · 30-07-2016 12:52AM

conditioned games wrote: »

Sounds like you've formed a false impression of Trump which is not surprising given how one sided the controlled media is.

The thing I like most about Trump is he says what needs to be said and doesn't allow himself to be quietened by anyone.

There is so much anger around the world including in America because of the transfer of wealth into the hands of a few. Its now time we have a serious world leader that cuts the crap with sound bites and political correctness.

The world is getting worse, people are becoming more disillusioned than ever while our current leaders try to portray a picture that's far from reality. This is Trump's time and by god does the world need him now more than ever.

Yes the world is calling out for a dangerous demagogue to emerge at the helm of the US. I think not to put it mildly. We are still dealing with the horrors of the Americans illegal invasion of Iraqi. The digusting levels of corruption in which the 2 corporate parites are mired so deeply in has resulted in 2 horrific candidates as their nominations for president and the completely broken and corrupt politcial system has meant that other parties with obviously better and more sane candidates (see Jill Stein of the Green Party and Gary Johnson of the Libertarian Party) are sidetracked to the detriment of the best interests of the vast majority of Americans and the world.

Billy86 · 30-07-2016 01:07AM

conditioned games wrote: »

Sounds like you've formed a false impression of Trump which is not surprising given how one sided the controlled media is.

You mean the same media that aren't doing much reporting on the fact that Donald Trump currently stands accused of raping a 13 year old girl?

Black Swan · 30-07-2016 01:13AM

oscarBravo wrote: »

Seriously, come on. At least pretend to make an effort. I know Donald Trump has brought debate down to kindergarten level, but is it absolutely necessary to ape him on this forum?

Donald Trump speaks at the 4th grade level, the lowest of all the Republican and Democratic candidates that ran for 2016 president per the Flesch-Kincaid Grade Level assessment. Sometimes lower: "Trump’s low grade at the debates wasn’t a fluke. His comments from an August 11 news conference in Michigan earned only a 3rd-grade score." Demographically speaking: "The single best predictor of Trump support in the GOP primary is the absence of a college degree." Comparatively, Bernie Sanders spoke at the high school 10th grade level and had the largest college/university degree supporter demographic.

I can see someone like Vladimir Putin being very pleased that a Donald Trump with ZERO experience in governance, diplomacy, and prep to be CIC wins the Oval Office. The highly qualified, knowledgeable, and experienced Putin will get what he wants from incompetent, big mouthed Donald Trump, especially when he plays to Donald Trump's "remarkably narcissistic" personality as Putin did last December 2015.

KingBrian2 · 30-07-2016 01:25AM

Billy86 wrote: »

Keeping in mind that you want to hold this standard, I will be asking for links to every claim of yours and reporting every post where you fail to do so as otherwise the only logical conclusion is that you are being disingenuous or completely making up whatever you are claiming. Now, with that out of the way...

Which, that he has been accused of rape once? http://gawker.com/the-time-donald-trumps-ex-wife-accused-him-of-brutally-1721129617

That he has been accused twice? http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2016/07/donald-trump-sexual-assault-allegations-breaks-silence

EDIT: And the latest case, which I have linked to a number of times in this thread, for the third accusation against Trump... http://heavy.com/news/2016/06/donald-trump-rape-sexual-assault-federal-lawsuit-documents-thomas-meagher-attorney-lawyer-katie-johnson-epstein/ .

That he was good friends with Epstein? How about this quote... "I've known Jeff for fifteen years. Terrific guy, he's a lot of fun to be with. It is even said that he likes beautiful women as much as I do, and many of them are on the younger side. No doubt about it -- Jeffrey enjoys his social life."
- Donald Trump. http://nymag.com/nymetro/news/people/n_7912/

See Brian, THIS is what it is to back up your claim with facts.

You do realize Bill Clinton is mentioned in the same article as Trump. By the way I expect nothing less although why you hold me personally to a higher standard than all the other contributors beggars belief since tones of people make salacious remarks about Trump with absolutely nothing to back them up.

PopePalpatine · 30-07-2016 01:40AM

conditioned games wrote: »

There is so much anger around the world including in America because of the transfer of wealth into the hands of a few. Its now time we have a serious world leader that cuts the crap with sound bites and political correctness.

Your "champion" of the working man is a guy who wants to cut taxes on the top ~0.1% of Americans.

As for "cutting the crap with sound bites", you would have to dig quite deep to find a candidate worse at that than Trump.

Billy86 · 30-07-2016 01:42AM

KingBrian2 wrote: »

You do realize Bill Clinton is mentioned in the same article as Trump.

And your point is?

By the way I expect nothing less although why you hold me personally to a higher standard than all the other contributors beggars belief since tones of people make salacious remarks about Trump with absolutely nothing to back them up.

Because your comments are often disingenuous and at complete odds with reality - see the "by Muslims he doesn't mean Muslims, he means jihadists. That's why he is religiously tolerant" type comments you were making a while back.

KingBrian2 · 30-07-2016 02:09AM

Billy86 wrote: »

And your point is?

Because your comments are often disingenuous and at complete odds with reality - see the "by Muslims he doesn't mean Muslims, he means jihadists. That's why he is religiously tolerant" type comments you were making a while back.

My point is you accuse Trump of crimes that have been alleged against Clinton in his private life as for "by Muslims he doesn't mean Muslims, he means jihadist." Many people are completely at odds with what is going on among the Islamic community. When Trump says he wants to deny entry to Jihadists he means just that. Many of the people who have been responsible for major atrocities had speaking tours in America. Here is an example.

http://edition.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/people/shows/zawahiri/profile.html

Not all Muslims are terrorists such talk is foolish and inaccurate but Jihadi terrorism is a threat and it is important to raise the issue of curtailing the rise of these hateful organizations.

Billy86 · 30-07-2016 02:18AM

KingBrian2 wrote: »

My point is you accuse Trump of crimes that have been alleged against Clinton in his private life

1. What office is Bill Clinton running for?

2. You had better have a good answer for this. When did Bill Clinton have charges brought up against him for raping a child?

as for "by Muslims he doesn't mean Muslims, he means jihadist." Many people are completely at odds with what is going on among the Islamic community. When Trump says he wants to deny entry to Jihadists he means just that. Many of the people who have been responsible for major atrocities had speaking tours in America. Here is an example.

http://edition.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/people/shows/zawahiri/profile.html

Not all Muslims are terrorists such talk is foolish and inaccurate but Jihadi terrorism is a threat and it is important to raise the issue of curtailing the rise of these hateful organizations.

Once more, Trump's statement...

(New York, NY) December 7th, 2015, -- Donald J. Trump is calling for a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States until our country's representatives can figure out what is going on. According to Pew Research, among others, there is great hatred towards Americans by large segments of the Muslim population. Most recently, a poll from the Center for Security Policy released data showing "25% of those polled agreed that violence against Americans here in the United States is justified as a part of the global jihad" and 51% of those polled, "agreed that Muslims in America should have the choice of being governed according to Shariah." Shariah authorizes such atrocities as murder against non-believers who won't convert, beheadings and more unthinkable acts that pose great harm to Americans, especially women.

Mr. Trump stated, "Without looking at the various polling data, it is obvious to anybody the hatred is beyond comprehension. Where this hatred comes from and why we will have to determine. Until we are able to determine and understand this problem and the dangerous threat it poses, our country cannot be the victims of horrendous attacks by people that believe only in Jihad, and have no sense of reason or respect for human life. If I win the election for President, we are going to Make America Great Again." - Donald J. Trump

Not a single mention of only banning Jihadists, quite literally calling for one on Muslims. I think you will find a Muslim and a jihadist are two separate things, just like Irish people and Republican terrorists.

KingBrian2 · 30-07-2016 02:26AM

Billy86 wrote: »

1. What office is Bill Clinton running for?

2. You had better have a good answer for this. When did Bill Clinton have charges brought up against him for raping a child?

Once more, Trump's statement...

Not a single mention of only banning Jihadists, quite literally calling for one on Muslims. I think you will find a Muslim and a jihadist are two separate things, just like Irish people and Republican terrorists.

What I was saying in regard to Clinton is that your bringing up personal material to blacken his image. If Trump did any serious offenses he would be investigated by the police long ago. You hardly expect the GOP not to vet the background of their candidate. Wow! You clearly have low standards for a lot of Americans.

As for the Islamic community in America I never said Jihadists and Muslims are the same I said America and indeed Europe has a huge problem within the Islamic community with preachers coming into our societies and inciting violence. Al Qaeda's goal was to infiltrate the west and incentivize young Muslims to rebel and they have to be stopped. That is my reading of what Trump is against.

Billy86 · 30-07-2016 02:54AM

KingBrian2 wrote: »

What I was saying in regard to Clinton is that your bringing up personal material to blacken his image.

No, you said "My point is you accuse Trump of crimes that have been alleged against Clinton in his private life".

I said Trump has a case against him for raping a 13 year old, and linked to the Epstein article citing their friendship and Trump's knowledge of him being fond on them 'a little on the young side'. You said Clinton was mentioned in the Epstein article, and that "My point is you accuse Trump of crimes that have been alleged against Clinton in his private life."

So now go and link to the time Bill Clinton had a case against him for raping an underage child. You're the one who "would expect nothing less", after all.

If Trump did any serious offenses he would be investigated by the police long ago.

Like Bill Cosby was? Jimmy Saville? The list goes on.

You hardly expect the GOP not to vet the background of their candidate. Wow! You clearly have low standards for a lot of Americans.

Wrong, and you know it. Because Trump is currently also on trial for multiple cases of mass fraud from thousands and thousands of Americans. Sure next they'll be asking for him to release his tax returns, how crazy!!

As for the Islamic community in America I never said Jihadists and Muslims are the same I said America and indeed Europe has a huge problem within the Islamic community with preachers coming into our societies and inciting violence. Al Qaeda's goal was to infiltrate the west and incentivize young Muslims to rebel and they have to be stopped. That is my reading of what Trump is against.

You said Trump was 'religiously tolerant' and tried to pretend he wasn't calling for a 'complete and utter shutdown' on Muslims to back up your point. Then tried to claim his statement was twisted by the media. Then stuck with that when it was pointed out that it came from his own website. Then changed your mind when there was a video of him saying it. Standard, really.

Black Swan · 30-07-2016 04:48AM

KingBrian2 wrote: »

You do realize Bill Clinton is mentioned in the same article as Trump.

I found this article where "Bill Clinton is mentioned in the same article as Trump:"

Donald Trump 2008 quotes:
"I know Hillary and I think she'd make a great president or vice-president."

"Hillary is smart, tough and a very nice person, so is her husband. Bill Clinton was a great president. They are fine people. Hillary was roughed up by the media, and it was a tough campaign for her, but she's a great trooper. Her history is far from being over."

FISMA. · 30-07-2016 05:01AM

Black Swan wrote: »

I can see someone like Vladimir Putin being very pleased that a Donald Trump with ZERO experience in governance, diplomacy

More likely, Putin will be sorry to see Obama go.

One has to wonder what Putin has in plan for Obama's final months in office. Between Putin and China, Obama is far too easy a lame-duck target to ignore.

Wouldn't surprise me to see another Putin power grab during the Olympics.

Black Swan · 30-07-2016 05:21AM

In addition to political figures, Donald Trump promised that a great many celebrity Stars would show and entertain at the RNC. The big Stars failed to show in Cleveland, except for some Happy Days has-been. In typical rich billionaire Donald Trump fashion, if Stars would not come to this convention voluntarily, he then tried to buy Justin Bieber to perform for only 45 minutes for $5 million dollars, which would have been the greatest payout that Justin Bieber would have made in one day, but Justin Bieber turned Donald Trump down. Why?

Black Swan · 30-07-2016 06:08AM

Donald Trump showed his famous "thin-skin" after hearing and reading about DNC speaker comments about him. Not only that, he once again talked in very personally violent terms. Repeating them several times as he so often does. Donald Trump said he wanted to "hit a number of those speakers so hard, their heads would spin," so that "They'd never recover." He repeated this a few times in similar ways. And in arch-typical bully fashion he also said "I was going to hit one guy in particular, a very little guy." Isn't that what bullies do, most of whom are cowards inside, and like picking on "a very little guy?"

Children are watching the news, and when Donald Trump says these violent things like some kid bully from a bad neighborhood, they hear and watch him say this. What a terrible role model the Republican nominee is making for American children, or teens, or adults today. Bullying is a great problem in America, and now one of the 2 nominees for US president is advocating violence against "a very little guy," as well as advocating personal violence against freedom of speech.

Brian? · 30-07-2016 07:49AM

Black Swan wrote: »

Donald Trump showed his famous "thin-skin" after hearing and reading about DNC speaker comments about him. Not only that, he once again talked in very personally violent terms. Repeating them several times as he so often does. Donald Trump said he wanted to "hit a number of those speakers so hard, their heads would spin," so that "They'd never recover." He repeated this a few times in similar ways. And in arch-typical bully fashion he also said "I was going to hit one guy in particular, a very little guy." Isn't that what bullies do, most of whom are cowards inside, and like picking on "a very little guy?"

Children are watching the news, and when Donald Trump says these violent things like some kid bully from a bad neighborhood, they hear and watch him say this. What a terrible role model the Republican nominee is making for American children, or teens, or adults today. Bullying is a great problem in America, and now one of the 2 nominees for US president is advocating violence against "a very little guy," as well as advocating personal violence against freedom of speech.

I'm wondering who the "little guy" was. Does anyone else think he meant Bloomberg? He feels betrayed by a fellow billionaire?

ECO_Mental · 30-07-2016 09:48AM

I think the Donald it's going to implode, he cannot take all this criticism he takes it all too personally. I mean yesterday he was saying that he was going hit this person and that person! then he is saying the gloves are off(didnt know he put them on!) he looked very upset

Problem is all his life he has had "yes" people surrounding him, he was the boss you only have to listen to his staff they all call him "Mr. Trump" they are his servants. They do not dare say no to him or stand up to him. That's why now he can't understand why people are being so mean to him awwww. One of these days he is going to explode can't wait for the debates.

Igotadose · 30-07-2016 09:58AM

Brian? wrote: »

I'm wondering who the "little guy" was. Does anyone else think he meant Bloomberg? He feels betrayed by a fellow billionaire?

It's Bloomberg, no doubt. My wife worked for his company in NYC. I actually stood next to him in the hallway once. I'm 5' 10", he's a couple inches shorter than me. Still, very impressive man. Don't agree with his politics most of the time, but he's been a good businessman and built an impressive company that does contribute heavily to charity and try to do good things, as much as any American corporation does.

Unlike Don the Con.

LostinKildare · 30-07-2016 10:54AM

Well it looks like Trump is already trying to weasel out of the debates. He posted this tweet: "As usual, Hillary & the Dems are trying to rig the debates so 2 are up against major NFL games. Same as last time w/ Bernie. Unacceptable!"

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/759222916387069952?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

A very obvious lie, as the debate schedule was set in September of last year:
http://www.politico.com/story/2015/09/2016-presidential-debate-schedule-set-213980

and the NFL schedule was set in April:
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000617300/article/2016-regularseason-schedule-to-be-revealed-thursday

Nice own goal, though, as no doubt it will remind his football-loving supporters of the time he destroyed the fledgling USFL:
http://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a41135/donald-trump-usfl/

2016 US Presidential Race - Mod Warning in OP

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