Dairy Chit Chat- Please read Mod note in post #1

yewtree · 24-07-2016 07:26PM

kevthegaff wrote: »

tough times ahead..

I think next February/March is when there will be really big problems on some farms. if trading accounts/over drafts are maxed out by the end of year, it might be a struggle for some of these farms to get any kind of credit. Spring is a big drain on cash and very little coming in until April.
I think a lot of over drafts will be turned into term loans to provide day to day cash.

kevthegaff · 24-07-2016 08:01PM

Alot of tillage men dabble in contracting, serious pressure I'd imagine. I pay first local businesses then contractors, then co ops.

Dawggone · 24-07-2016 09:10PM

kevthegaff wrote: »

Alot of tillage men dabble in contracting, serious pressure I'd imagine. I pay first local businesses then contractors, then co ops.

The straw supplier was usually/traditionally the last to be paid, just after the contractor...I had the great honor of being both. Not a proud owner of those t-shirts.

Thanks be to God I don't have to do the nastiest job in the world anymore...collecting money. Everything here is strictly 30 days, no matter what.

kevthegaff · 24-07-2016 09:35PM

Dawggone wrote:

Thanks be to God I don't have to do the nastiest job in the world anymore...collecting money. Everything here is strictly 30 days, no matter what.

What happens after 30 days?, under here is early

Dawggone · 24-07-2016 09:42PM

kevthegaff wrote: »

What happens after 30 days?, under here is early

You'll get pretty much shut down. All suppliers, contractors etc wouldn't do business. Shut down.

Bouncing a cheque will bring the cops to the door

kevthegaff · 24-07-2016 09:45PM

Dawggone wrote:

Bouncing a cheque will bring the cops to the door

Dawggone wrote:

You'll get pretty much shut down. All suppliers, contractors etc wouldn't do business. Shut down.

Right job!

Keepgrowing · 24-07-2016 09:47PM

rangler1 wrote: »

It's not right to leave neighbours unpaid, contractors themselves don't get much credit, yet farmers leave them waiting as if it were a right

I couldn't agree more. I've no problem doing a deal per acre or bale but always with the proviso that I'll pay on the headland. I've done that for years now and listening to other guys prices in glad I do. We also pay all invoices at months end with a dd to our vet. This gets balanced annually.

How can we expect these people to service our needs professionally if we don't pay them. I know because they don't charge interest like professionals so we use them as a bank.

Guys getting all high and mighty with principal led stands on Glanbias GAP scheme when it would serve them well to partake thus paying their bills.

Makes me laugh

jaymla627 · 24-07-2016 09:47PM

Dawggone wrote: »

You'll get pretty much shut down. All suppliers, contractors etc wouldn't do business. Shut down.

Bouncing a cheque will bring the cops to the door

What's keeping lads going who might of went and spent a fortune on robots/sheds etc going and are losing money hand over fist, as you have used examples of before, are banks simply extending overdrafts/giving new loans out to cover losses

Keepgrowing · 24-07-2016 09:50PM

Dawggone wrote: »

You'll get pretty much shut down. All suppliers, contractors etc wouldn't do business. Shut down.

Bouncing a cheque will bring the cops to the door

Correct and right

Keepgrowing · 24-07-2016 09:53PM

jaymla627 wrote: »

What's keeping lads going who might of went and spent a fortune on robots/sheds etc going and are losing money hand over fist, as you have used examples of before, are banks simply extending overdrafts/giving new loans out to cover losses

Have you considered that they may be well financed and realise that it's a one or two year thing. A business doesn't have to make a profit every year.

jaymla627 · 24-07-2016 09:59PM

Keepgrowing wrote: »

Have you considered that they may be well financed and realise that it's a one or two year thing. A business doesn't have to make a profit every year.

Define "well - financed" does that involve a bank having deeds to the farm, I wouldn't be so sure that what's being expirenced at the minute is a one our two year thing, grains still ridicously cheap and another bumper harvest is on the cards, the first hint of milk rising in price and the Americans will turn on the taps, unless trump gets the presidency and throws all the Mexicans out, America is a major issue with grain so cheap

yewtree · 24-07-2016 10:01PM

Dawggone wrote: »

You'll get pretty much shut down. All suppliers, contractors etc wouldn't do business. Shut down.

Bouncing a cheque will bring the cops to the door

It would be great to see same approach here, it would really help lads that service our industry.

Neighbour asked me once how I get contractor to bale surplus paddocks. I told him I pay at the end of month for work done, he couldn't understand why I paid so quick. He said he would often only clear bill when he was cutting following years silage.

Dawggone · 24-07-2016 10:03PM

jaymla627 wrote: »

What's keeping lads going who might of went and spent a fortune on robots/sheds etc going and are losing money hand over fist, as you have used examples of before, are banks simply extending overdrafts/giving new loans out to cover losses

Banks are anything but lenient. One late or reneged payment and they'll shut you down. The high CoP lads are living off money made in good times.
You'd go out of business here in months, whereas in Ireland it'll take years...screwing contractors, independent merchants, suppliers etc etc

Resilient?

Dawggone · 24-07-2016 10:08PM

yewtree wrote: »

He said he would often only clear bill when he was cutting following years silage.

Sadly the norm for a large percentage.

Keepgrowing · 24-07-2016 10:14PM

Dawggone wrote: »

Banks are anything but lenient. One late or reneged payment and they'll shut you down. The high CoP lads are living off money made in good times.
You'd go out of business here in months, whereas in Ireland it'll take years...screwing contractors, independent merchants, suppliers etc etc

Resilient?

Here it takes a generation or two to go broke

jaymla627 · 24-07-2016 10:21PM

Keepgrowing wrote: »

I couldn't agree more. I've no problem doing a deal per acre or bale but always with the proviso that I'll pay on the headland. I've done that for years now and listening to other guys prices in glad I do. We also pay all invoices at months end with a dd to our vet. This gets balanced annually.

How can we expect these people to service our needs professionally if we don't pay them. I know because they don't charge interest like professionals so we use them as a bank.

Guys getting all high and mighty with principal led stands on Glanbias GAP scheme when it would serve them well to partake thus paying their bills.

Makes me laugh

The GAP scheme t and c's are simply ludicrous, you really would have to be in bad bog to even consider signing up for the supposedly intrest free money, spent half a hour reading the finer print of that document and it was in the bin.....

kevthegaff · 24-07-2016 10:26PM

Dawggone wrote:

Banks are anything but lenient. One late or reneged payment and they'll shut you down. The high CoP lads are living off money made in good times. You'd go out of business here in months, whereas in Ireland it'll take years...screwing contractors, independent merchants, suppliers etc etc

Needs a big change in attitude in this country, know lads owed for 5+yrs. Domino affect

pedigree 6 · 24-07-2016 10:33PM

kevthegaff wrote: »

Needs a big change in attitude in this country, know lads owed for 5+yrs. Domino affect

Is this not used anymore?

https://www.stubbsgazette.ie/

When I was doing biz org in secondary school. They were always going on about it.

Keepgrowing · 24-07-2016 10:36PM

jaymla627 wrote: »

The GAP scheme t and c's are simply ludicrous, you really would have to be in bad bog to even consider signing up for the supposedly intrest free money, spent half a hour reading the finer print of that document and it was in the bin.....

I'm not eligible as not a supplier but if I was getting money interest free I'd be taking hand and all no matter what my circumstances were

Edit: I've read conditions and they're no more onerous than any other loan agreement

jaymla627 · 24-07-2016 10:40PM

kevthegaff wrote: »

Needs a big change in attitude in this country, know lads owed for 5+yrs. Domino affect

Large independent merchant here who would spread alot of fert had a 16 ton breadal fert spreader mothballed for all of 2014 and 15 simply because lads hadn't their bills cleared ran up in 2013, the spreader was only brought out again this year as bills had eventually being settled up....
Crunching the numbers here and even though I am prepared to work for almost noting it simply isn't stacking up, will wait it out for 2017 and 2018 but have exit plans in place and will pull the plug if milk doesn't get to our near 30 cent no point in flogging a dead horse....

jaymla627 · 24-07-2016 10:44PM

Keepgrowing wrote: »

I'm not eligible as not a supplier but if I was getting money interest free I'd be taking hand and all no matter what my circumstances were

Edit: I've read conditions and they're no more onerous than any other loan agreement

You wouldn't consider losing co-op shares for a value of five euro that are worth multiples of that when another spin - out occurs as onerous, what's your take on the relavant event clauses, our the fact they can transfer your debt to a third party that shipped up for this finance, no such thing as a free lunch especially when dealing with talbot and co

Keepgrowing · 24-07-2016 10:52PM

jaymla627 wrote: »

You wouldn't consider losing co-op shares for a value of five euro that are worth multiples of that when another spin - out occurs as onerous, what's your take on the relavant event clauses, our the fact they can transfer your debt to a third party that shipped up for this finance, no such thing as a free lunch especially when dealing with talbot and co

Those are only enacted in the event of a default

OverRide · 25-07-2016 06:44AM

Keepgrowing wrote: »

Those are only enacted in the event of a default

Which you can guarantee Glanbia expect at least 10% to do and are busy signing up the potential victims

jaymla627 · 25-07-2016 07:22AM

OverRide wrote: »

Which you can guarantee Glanbia expect at least 10% to do and are busy signing up the potential victims

I'd say they are banking on 20-30 %, imagen signing a agreement with a bank that requires them to pay you a fair and transparent price relavant to other processors in order for you to meet loan repayments on this loan while they hold the power to keep milk below 30 cent and screw suppliers in 2020 when they will be hit with massive repayments, thus meaning they will make a fortune in the event of your default which they can engineer.....
The farmer is like a one - legged man in a ass kicking contest if he signs up for the gap scheme

whelan2 · 25-07-2016 08:00AM

The main problem I see is farmers will be very reluctant to sign a ten year milk supply agreement in a month were Glanbia were one of the lowest paying in the country

whelan2 · 25-07-2016 09:15AM

yewtree wrote: »

It would be great to see same approach here, it would really help lads that service our industry.

Neighbour asked me once how I get contractor to bale surplus paddocks. I told him I pay at the end of month for work done, he couldn't understand why I paid so quick. He said he would often only clear bill when he was cutting following years silage.

Why do contractors let lads away with this. Then go back the next year for more punishment?

Keepgrowing · 25-07-2016 09:27AM

jaymla627 wrote: »

I'd say they are banking on 20-30 %, imagen signing a agreement with a bank that requires them to pay you a fair and transparent price relavant to other processors in order for you to meet loan repayments on this loan while they hold the power to keep milk below 30 cent and screw suppliers in 2020 when they will be hit with massive repayments, thus meaning they will make a fortune in the event of your default which they can engineer.....
The farmer is like a one - legged man in a ass kicking contest if he signs up for the gap scheme

Your overthinking this.

Ask yourself would you take interest free money? It's a yes or no. Can't see why you're worried about defaulters or in fact people who may die during the term and their estates will have to repay.

I fully accept your decision I'm not trying to change your mind only sorry o can't partake. If you got the money and don't need it as you clearly don't, put in post office for 5 years you'dake money as there's no interest charge.
You may be correct that price won't rise past 30c but I don't believe the that the company is conspiring to do this to steal shares.

kevthegaff · 25-07-2016 09:27AM

whelan2 wrote:

The main problem I see is farmers will be very reluctant to sign a ten year milk supply agreement in a month were Glanbia were one of the lowest paying in the country

Alot of the guys signing up may be having trouble off normal financial institutions, maybe I'm wrong

whelan2 · 25-07-2016 09:31AM

kevthegaff wrote: »

Alot of the guys signing up may be having trouble off normal financial institutions, maybe I'm wrong

Better to go to bank on day one than go for one of these schemes imo. Alot can happen in 10 years, look at what has happened in the last 2 years alone. If some one said in 2014 we would be getting 22cpl off the biggest milk processor in the country we wouldnt have believed it

Keepgrowing · 25-07-2016 09:31AM

whelan2 wrote: »

The main problem I see is farmers will be very reluctant to sign a ten year milk supply agreement in a month were Glanbia were one of the lowest paying in the country

The regret I have is that I didn't switch to Glanbia to partake in fixed price. I obviously won't change now but as soon as things start to rise I'll be in like Flynn.
No other company has such a progressive scheme with guys who took some in every scheme breaking 30c every month. I accept they lost marginally on the early schemes. You can't beat the market but you can smooth out the bumps.

Dairy Chit Chat- Please read Mod note in post #1

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