Why did Gardai destroy possible burial site of Irelands longest missing child?

Scaredy_Cat · 23-07-2016 05:43PM

Going Forward wrote: »

[QUOTE=Scaredy_Cat;100447647]

I'm so shocked after all these years to learn the true circumstances of her disappearance.

No one knows the true circumstances:) The truth has not and may not ever come out.

There are only suspicions.

Of course. Any thoughts on the rest of my post?

Going Forward · 23-07-2016 06:38PM

Scaredy_Cat wrote: »

Of course. Any thoughts on the rest of my post?

I can't say, what can anyone say really?

http://www.sundayworld.com/news/is-this-mary-boyle-s-shallow-grave

http://www.thesun.ie/irishsol/homepage/news/4863339/NYPD-We-know-who-killed-Mary-in-1977.html

There just seems to be a lack of conviction in trying to get a conviction, that sounds "clever", it's not meant to be.

Giacomo McGubbin · 23-07-2016 08:40PM

oranbhoy67 wrote: »

They are estanged because the mother believes the Gardai have been on the right track this last 39 years and she wants to continue in this vein

What track is that though ?

23-07-2016 09:40PM

Giacomo McGubbin wrote: »

What track is that though ?

Dig up the same piece of ground, rinse and repeat?

Giacomo McGubbin · 23-07-2016 09:44PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Dig up the same piece of ground, rinse and repeat?

What do you mean, can you expand, do they think she was murdered or it was an accident ?

tayto lover · 23-07-2016 09:47PM

If my little child was missing i would have dug up the entire area if i thought she was buried in that area.
I wouldn't have waited for the Garda at all especially if i thought they were reluctant to search the area.
I'd have done it myself.

Going Forward · 23-07-2016 10:20PM

tayto lover wrote: »

If my little child was missing i would have dug up the entire area if i thought she was buried in that area.
I wouldn't have waited for the Garda at all especially if i thought they were reluctant to search the area.
I'd have done it myself.

So would I.
But.
It isn't your land.
That you'd be digging up.

You might be done for trespassing.

You'd have to get consent to do it.

Technically speaking.

tayto lover · 23-07-2016 10:48PM

Going Forward wrote: »

So would I.
But.
It isn't your land.
That you'd be digging up.

You might be done for trespassing.

You'd have to get consent to do it.

Technically speaking.

I'd get it done one way or another. With or without consent.
I'd also get speaking to the suspect and afterwards i'd know if he was guilty or not. One way or another i'd know. It must be awful living near to someone who is suspected of murdering your child. I think it would drive me mad to be honest. I'd have to get to speak with him somehow.

oranbhoy67 · 23-07-2016 11:22PM

Giacomo McGubbin wrote: »

What track is that though ?

the track to nowheresville

oranbhoy67 · 23-07-2016 11:26PM

tayto lover wrote: »

I'd get it done one way or another. With or without consent.
I'd also get speaking to the suspect and afterwards i'd know if he was guilty or not. One way or another i'd know. It must be awful living near to someone who is suspected of murdering your child. I think it would drive me mad to be honest. I'd have to get to speak with him somehow.

I spoke to him, hes not the brightest spark its hard to read him at all tbh.. I also requested a dig which i was told would be granted as long as the gards are there , i never said where on the particular bit of land I want to dig & i wont until the day comes and im there.. I have my own ideas and the gards wont get a chance to get in there first this time .

tayto lover · 23-07-2016 11:31PM

oranbhoy67 wrote: »

I spoke to him, hes not the brightest spark its hard to read him at all tbh.. I also requested a dig which i was told would be granted as long as the gards are there , i never said where on the particular bit of land I want to dig & i wont until the day comes and im there.. I have my own ideas and the gards wont get a chance to get in there first this time .

I'd keep going back to him and questioning him until his story changed or he let something slip.I'd also get someone to scare the life out of him to see if he'd crack.

I agree with you on the dig. Make sure you're there.

oranbhoy67 · 23-07-2016 11:38PM

tayto lover wrote: »

I'd keep going back to him and questioning him until his story changed or he let something slip.I'd also get someone to scare the life out of him to see if he'd crack.

I agree with you on the dig. Make sure you're there.

I tried good cop/ Bad cop with him , I have it all on video I may post the transcript somewhere but with all the names etc I will have to take out then it would probably render it useless anyway , if I drove id be down every day , it's an hour and 20 minutes away and Bus Eireann charges a fortune down and then taxis etc I just can't afford it at all

tayto lover · 23-07-2016 11:52PM

oranbhoy67 wrote: »

I tried good cop/ Bad cop with him , I have it all on video I may post the transcript somewhere but with all the names etc I will have to take out then it would probably render it useless anyway , if I drove id be down every day , it's an hour and 20 minutes away and Bus Eireann charges a fortune down and then taxis etc I just can't afford it at all

How did you come to have suspicions about one particular piece of land?
Don't explain if compromises your position.

oranbhoy67 · 23-07-2016 11:55PM

tayto lover wrote: »

How did you come to have suspicions about one particular piece of land?
Don't explain if compromises your position.

it does I'm afraid, as anyone can see im a very open book on this subject, but on this i will have to remain schtum , im probably way off but its just my hunch

jenny smith · 23-07-2016 11:55PM

oranbhoy67 wrote: »

I tried good cop/ Bad cop with him , I have it all on video I may post the transcript somewhere but with all the names etc I will have to take out then it would probably render it useless anyway , if I drove id be down every day , it's an hour and 20 minutes away and Bus Eireann charges a fortune down and then taxis etc I just can't afford it at all

He is not very bright if he talks to anyone. Did you ever hear of the Reid Technique. I expect an admission to you would not hold up anyway would it? Would not be under caution

tayto lover · 24-07-2016 12:03AM

jenny smith wrote: »

He is not very bright if he talks to anyone. Did you ever hear of the Reid Technique. I expect an admission to you would not hold up anyway would it? Would not be under caution

I doubt it would matter really.
As he's not a Garda investigating the incident he would not have to caution imo.
If the information obtained from the suspect led to the discovery of the body then the Garda would have to arrest the suspect.

oranbhoy67 · 24-07-2016 12:34AM

jenny smith wrote: »

He is not very bright if he talks to anyone. Did you ever hear of the Reid Technique. I expect an admission to you would not hold up anyway would it? Would not be under caution

that is what I read up on the night before I went down and tried to apply it , but was met with the same answers , No no no I never touched that child etc just very repetitive and coached feeling about them but I honestly couldn't read him anyway ,

but I've tried to contact him and his extended family members since and their behaviour has convinced me of his guilt, innocent people shout their innocence from the rooftops they are doing the exact opposite.. and have very much circled their wagons around him

Giacomo McGubbin · 24-07-2016 01:00AM

oranbhoy67 wrote: »

the track to nowheresville

What do you mean, what track are they on, and what do they think happened the child ? This still hasn't been explained.

oranbhoy67 · 24-07-2016 01:15AM

Giacomo McGubbin wrote: »

What do you mean, what track are they on, and what do they think happened the child ? This still hasn't been explained.

you are looking for answers from Gardai on this case , join the queue

enfant terrible · 24-07-2016 10:32AM

sunbeam wrote: »

I do find it odd that her uncle would have simply told her to go home when he saw her following him across such rough terrain. Some of the land where I live is like that and even in the days when we were let out to play by ourselves all day we all knew we weren't allowed to go exploring it on our own. Certainly if any of our relatives saw one of us doing so they would immediately have escorted us home.

The uncle denies telling Mary to turn around, says she turned back herself.

Funny thing is the lead investigator in Mary's disappearance went on RTE and repeatably said the Uncle told her to turn around and head home.

You'd think the lead investigator would know this basic supposed fact.

This point was made in the documentary.

Giacomo McGubbin · 24-07-2016 10:54AM

oranbhoy67 wrote: »

you are looking for answers from Gardai on this case , join the queue

No, I'm simply asking people here, who claim to know the case, as to who does the Mother currently suspect happened Mary and who does she currently believe the killer might be.

Because recently, the Mother's current side of the story and opinion is being blanked out and not being reported, which is just as interesting. I'd like to know her current side of the story and claims as well.

Given how big a mess this case is, and the amount of inaccurate claims and counter claims, from all sides flying about, the uncle could just as easily be another Steven Avery.

The golden principle of any justice system, is that we are all entitled to be considered innocent, until proven guilty beyond doubt in a legal court of law.

Stepping Stone · 24-07-2016 11:07AM

oranbhoy67 wrote: »

I tried good cop/ Bad cop with him , I have it all on video I may post the transcript somewhere but with all the names etc I will have to take out then it would probably render it useless anyway , if I drove id be down every day , it's an hour and 20 minutes away and Bus Eireann charges a fortune down and then taxis etc I just can't afford it at all

oranbhoy67 wrote: »

that is what I read up on the night before I went down and tried to apply it , but was met with the same answers , No no no I never touched that child etc just very repetitive and coached feeling about them but I honestly couldn't read him anyway ,

but I've tried to contact him and his extended family members since and their behaviour has convinced me of his guilt, innocent people shout their innocence from the rooftops they are doing the exact opposite.. and have very much circled their wagons around him

I think that it is entirely normal behavior on his family's part. You interrogated him with a video camera and tried to get him to admit guilt and you are surprised that they aren't welcoming you back to have another go?

There seems to be a huge amount of naievity in the approach that the family are taking. Turning up to Pearse St Garda Station is like turning up to St James' Hospital and expecting someone to discuss the treatment of a relative in another hospital 30yrs previously. It is nothing to do with the rank and file Gardai who are up to their eyes in violent crime, thefts, suicides, traffic duty, etc. Totally the wrong approach.

Remembrance marches are a great idea. They highlight the issue in a dignified fashion but getting political and aligning it with water protesters is anything but a good idea. Have you seen those marches? They are inevitably attractive to the type of person who doesn't care what they are protesting; they just want to be aggressive in their own agenda. You cannot agree to allow a group that protests water charges to lead a march and expect them not to shout about water.

This questioning of a suspect is also very foolish. It will end with them making a complaint about you to the Gardai.

Do you not see how you are risking all of the good work that you have done by aligning yourselves to protest groups and risking the legal side by naming suspects and cross questioning them yourselves? My advice is to go to a solicitor and get yourself good advice before we end up reading that the Gardai's hands are tied because of revelations made here.

Also, Gemma O'Doherty is a journalist...her first priority is to promote herself, not to serve the family or the truth.

24-07-2016 11:19AM

Giacomo McGubbin wrote: »

No, I'm simply asking people here, who claim to know the case, as to who does the Mother currently suspect happened Mary and who does she currently believe the killer might be.

Because recently, the Mother's current side of the story and opinion is being blanked out and not being reported, which is just as interesting. I'd like to know her current side of the story and claims as well.

Given how big a mess this case is, and the amount of inaccurate claims and counter claims, from all sides flying about, the uncle could just as easily be another Steven Avery.

The golden principle of any justice system, is that we are all entitled to be considered innocent, until proven guilty beyond doubt in a legal court of law.

How can you ask who the mother suspects, and then finish with a statement that we are all entitled to be considered innocent until proven guilty?

It's almost as if you are encouraging people to prejudice the case that they are fighting so hard to have fully investigated......

Giacomo McGubbin · 24-07-2016 11:21AM

Deleted User wrote: »

How can you ask who the mother suspects, and then finish with a statement that we are all entitled to be considered innocent until proven guilty?

It's almost as if you are encouraging people to prejudice the case that they are fighting so hard to have fully investigated......

Because I want to hear more than one side of the story, rather than one set of allegations, and I want the case fully investigated as well, the difference is, I haven't made my mind up in advance, and I'm simply asking for both sides of the story so I can form a balanced view. A lot of people here seem strangely keen to avoid that, and have their mind made up that a certain suspect is guilty and are trying to push that view here.

tayto lover · 24-07-2016 12:16PM

I heard a retired postman, who covered that area, speaking on Newstalk this morning. From reading between the lines i'd say he has opinions on the matter that he is reluctant to speak about on radio.

ancapailldorcha · 24-07-2016 12:31PM

Giacomo McGubbin wrote: »

No, I'm simply asking people here, who claim to know the case, as to who does the Mother currently suspect happened Mary and who does she currently believe the killer might be.

Mod: Please don't name names here unless it's been reported in the media.

Giacomo McGubbin · 24-07-2016 12:33PM

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Mod: Please don't name names here unless it's been reported in the media.

Agreed. I'm not looking for specific names, unlike the many unfounded accusations that have been made here about certain relatives, guards and politicians.

24-07-2016 12:58PM

Giacomo McGubbin wrote: »

Because I want to hear more than one side of the story, rather than one set of allegations, and I want the case fully investigated as well, the difference is, I haven't made my mind up in advance, and I'm simply asking for both sides of the story so I can form a balanced view. A lot of people here seem strangely keen to avoid that, and have their mind made up that a certain suspect is guilty and are trying to push that view here.

How do you expect anyone to give you the Mothers side of the story?

As far as I am aware, she is not involved in the campaign, and doesn't post here - so how do you expect people to post her side of the story if she hasn't decided to give any further information apart from what has already been posted in the media?

I can truthfully say that I have not mentioned any names whatsoever. Nor made allegations about anyone.

Like a lot of people, I am very disturbed, and angry, about the FACTS in this case.
I would like to see a full scale enquiry, rather than a cold case review.

tayto lover · 24-07-2016 01:24PM

Stepping Stone wrote: »

I think that it is entirely normal behavior on his family's part. You interrogated him with a video camera and tried to get him to admit guilt and you are surprised that they aren't welcoming you back to have another go?

There seems to be a huge amount of naievity in the approach that the family are taking. Turning up to Pearse St Garda Station is like turning up to St James' Hospital and expecting someone to discuss the treatment of a relative in another hospital 30yrs previously. It is nothing to do with the rank and file Gardai who are up to their eyes in violent crime, thefts, suicides, traffic duty, etc. Totally the wrong approach.

Remembrance marches are a great idea. They highlight the issue in a dignified fashion but getting political and aligning it with water protesters is anything but a good idea. Have you seen those marches? They are inevitably attractive to the type of person who doesn't care what they are protesting; they just want to be aggressive in their own agenda. You cannot agree to allow a group that protests water charges to lead a march and expect them not to shout about water.

This questioning of a suspect is also very foolish. It will end with them making a complaint about you to the Gardai.

Do you not see how you are risking all of the good work that you have done by aligning yourselves to protest groups and risking the legal side by naming suspects and cross questioning them yourselves? My advice is to go to a solicitor and get yourself good advice before we end up reading that the Gardai's hands are tied because of revelations made here.

Also, Gemma O'Doherty is a journalist...her first priority is to promote herself, not to serve the family or the truth.

I totally agree with you BUT you have to remember that feck-all seems to have happened in this investigation in 40 years. Forty years - that's a lifetime to have to wait for the relatives and still not a lot happening and not much, if any, progress likely to happen. It's hard to expect people not to go making their own inquiries and digging for evidence. If it were my child i'd have been trying to get answers long before now and i wouldn't care if my methods were legal or illegal either.

Giacomo McGubbin · 24-07-2016 01:34PM

Deleted User wrote: »

How do you expect anyone to give you the Mothers side of the story?

As far as I am aware, she is not involved in the campaign, and doesn't post here - so how do you expect people to post her side of the story if she hasn't decided to give any further information apart from what has already been posted in the media?

I can truthfully say that I have not mentioned any names whatsoever. Nor made allegations about anyone.

Like a lot of people, I am very disturbed, and angry, about the FACTS in this case.
I would like to see a full scale enquiry, rather than a cold case review.

As far as I'm aware the sister doesn't post here either, and yet it's quite clear some here are only willing to consider the one side of the story only interested in accusing and pointing to one particular person ? and set of associated people ? Is that what the campaign is about ?
I'd prefer to hear the full story and all the recent facts from all sides, not just the selected ones some people are only seem interested in pushing an angle from one side or the another. I'm afraid you won't stop me asking. - Very interesting how this is panning out here though. I didn't expect this reaction here for seeking a balanced neutral view, perhaps I was naive in thinking overall I'd get a balanced view on this thread.

Why did Gardai destroy possible burial site of Irelands longest missing child?

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