11 police shot, 4 officers dead after coordinated sniper fire at Dallas protest rally

Gatling · 08-07-2016 01:41PM

RasTa wrote: »

This shows one of the cops being killed but pauses before the shot. However this shooter obviously has more training then the police officer considering he just walks up behind him.

Wonder if these are ex military.

That wasn't military training he snook up on the cop who was already engaged with another suspect pure opportunistic by the looks of it nothing more .

LeinsterDub · 08-07-2016 01:44PM

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Yes, America has pretty much destroyed them.

Relevance?

suicide_circus · 08-07-2016 01:44PM

Some COD shít there

tritium · 08-07-2016 01:44PM

Jayop wrote: »

That's not justifying something. This is an awful tragedy but could you honestly say that in light of the videos that we've seen over the last year or two and in particular this week that you're surprised some nut jobs have decided to take revenge on these poor innocent people for the crimes of some of their colleagues?

Reasoning something isn't the same as justifying it.

That's an awfully dangerous road to go down though, pretty soon the whole world is blind. Would it be equally unsurprising that some cops are more inclned to be trigger happy when dealing with a community that displays higher levels of crime including violent crime?

Tbh, the lack of real leadership and awareness from all sides around this problem is frightening. The whole answer seems to be reduced to 'stop police racism' (which is a *part*of it). No one seems to want to explore the idea that maybe the police approach is born of their environment rather than some indigenous racism however. How does dealing with an environment where one group is a greater threat on average influence your approach. How do we identify the smaller pool of cops who this will adversely effect. How do we help the system to work better before it breaks. How do we address the reasons that bias develops, both within communities and within the police and justice systems.

Reducing it to 'the police are racist' line thats so often trotted out is as dumb as claiming this morning's events point to a plan by the black community to murder police

BorneTobyWilde · 08-07-2016 01:48PM

Did Obama's speech yesterday contribute. He went into great details about the fact that black people were indeed being targeted unfairly and killed too easily .
He spoke of ''fact's ''
I can see how some crazy person might see it as complete confirmation right from the top of the government that the police are out of control when it comes to black people in the US, and that something needed to be done.

Not this of course, but to the killer, yes , this .

LoLth · 08-07-2016 01:51PM

suicide_circus wrote: »

Some COD shít there

and strangely there are claims that video games desensitise people to violence....

imho killing innocent people to balance some cosmic karma scale because innocent people got killed is not the right way to go about being seen as anything more than violent and dangerous and providing material to be trotted out to defend the first indefensible set of acts.

I feel sorry for the police officers killed and their families. They didnt deserve to be punished for the actions of others whatever the view on circumstances or injustice.

ceegee · 08-07-2016 01:52PM

Christy42 wrote: »

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/dec/31/the-counted-police-killings-2015-young-black-men

Shockingly more white people will get killed when they make up most of the population. This is why we use proportions.

And black people are 4 times more likely to shoot police officers based on proportion. To argue that cops are just shooting people because of racism ignores the more complex reasons behind black/police relations in the US

Snickers Man · 08-07-2016 01:55PM

ceadaoin. wrote: »

I thought I saw him make that speech earlier today? Before all this

You did.

Obama's in Warsaw at the moment. These shootings would have started at about 4am his time. He would or should have been fast asleep. I doubt they would have woken him to tell him the bad news as soon as this started. They would have waited until he got up for breakfast.

Yet some people were posting here that he had already spoken on the matter before 9am (his time)

Shooting from the hip or what?

speedboatchase · 08-07-2016 01:55PM

Dallas police chief just said that the deceased they tried to negotiate with was "upset because of Black Lives Matter' and specifically wanted to kill white police officers.

screamer · 08-07-2016 01:56PM

Well it's just been reported that the shooter during the negotiations stated that he wanted to kill white people especially white police officers and expressed upset/ anger for BLM..... so there you go. Wouldn't like to be in Dallas tonight TBH.

Gatling · 08-07-2016 01:57PM

screamer wrote: »

Well it's just been reported that the shooter during the negotiations stated that he wanted to kill white people especially white police officers and expressed upset/ anger for BLM..... so there you go.

So which one was it angry at white people or black people

speedboatchase · 08-07-2016 01:58PM

Gatling wrote: »

So which one was it angry at white people or black people

Angry at white people. He specifically targeted them.

Christy42 · 08-07-2016 01:59PM

ceegee wrote: »

And black people are 4 times more likely to shoot police officers based on proportion. To argue that cops are just shooting people because of racism ignores the more complex reasons behind black/police relations in the US

Good job I didn't say that then isn't it?

I argued for the existence of BLM vs all lives matter and I argued that saying more white people are shot by the police ignores proportions.

beach_walker · 08-07-2016 01:59PM

screamer wrote: »

Well it's just been reported that the shooter during the negotiations stated that he wanted to kill white people especially white police officers and expressed upset/ anger for BLM..... so there you go. Wouldn't like to be in Dallas tonight TBH.

Wow, you mean it wasn't ISIS or white neo-nazis or government secret agents sent out by Obama? So very shocked.

Gatling wrote:

So which one was it angry at white people or black people

I think you need to reread it.

suicide_circus · 08-07-2016 01:59PM

I remember watching Boyz n the Hood when I was a kid. This was a stark and moving cautionary tale but nothing has changed in 25 odd years. Amazing.

screamer · 08-07-2016 01:59PM

Gatling wrote: »

So which one was it angry at white people or black people

Anger and upset for BLM, I presume angry at white people seeing as he wanted to and did kill them.

screamer · 08-07-2016 02:02PM

beach_walker wrote: »

Wow, you mean it wasn't ISIS or white neo-nazis or government secret agents sent out by Obama? So very shocked.

Course not, this was never leaning that way was it.............

ceegee · 08-07-2016 02:03PM

Christy42 wrote: »

Good job I didn't say that then isn't it?

I argued for the existence of BLM vs all lives matter and I argued that saying more white people are shot by the police ignores proportions.

Apologies if i misinterpreted what you were saying, busy thread and between here and twitter streams its easy to mix different peoples arguments and view points

Bob24 · 08-07-2016 02:04PM

Apparently he didn't kill himself - it was a police bomb robot (didn't know that had that).

beach_walker · 08-07-2016 02:04PM

screamer wrote: »

Course not, this was never leaning that way was it.............

Well from reading this thread...

beach_walker · 08-07-2016 02:07PM

From Guardian

The suspect was killed with a Dallas police bomb robot, which was sent in after negotiations broke down

:eek:

ScumLord · 08-07-2016 02:08PM

LoLth wrote: »

and strangely there are claims that video games desensitise people to violence....

Anyone who went into the real world with an assault rifle expecting it to be like COD would be in for a surprise. COD no more prepares you for gun fights anymore than watching wacky races turns you into a formula 1 driver.

These guys could be ex military, or they could have taken any number of courses privately with their militia. I'd say there are thousands of Americans doing advanced assault training, some of them are probably better trained than the average police officer.

The atmosphere they've created in the states is absolutely shocking for a democratic country. So many people seem completely oblivious to the democratic process.

Potatoeman · 08-07-2016 02:13PM

tritium wrote: »

That's an awfully dangerous road to go down though, pretty soon the whole world is blind. Would it be equally unsurprising that some cops are more inclned to be trigger happy when dealing with a community that displays higher levels of crime including violent crime?

Tbh, the lack of real leadership and awareness from all sides around this problem is frightening. The whole answer seems to be reduced to 'stop police racism' (which is a *part*of it). No one seems to want to explore the idea that maybe the police approach is born of their environment rather than some indigenous racism however. How does dealing with an environment where one group is a greater threat on average influence your approach. How do we identify the smaller pool of cops who this will adversely effect. How do we help the system to work better before it breaks. How do we address the reasons that bias develops, both within communities and within the police and justice systems.

Reducing it to 'the police are racist' line thats so often trotted out is as dumb as claiming this morning's events point to a plan by the black community to murder police

I've heard police are not going into hostile black neighbourhoods due to increased tension over the last few years. They are worried they will have a confrontation and have to act, then have a video missing the first initial interaction posted online and get fired. Even if their actions are justified and this has resulted in more crime in these areas.

RustyNut · 08-07-2016 02:27PM

Potatoeman wrote: »

I've heard police are not going into hostile black neighbourhoods due to increased tension over the last few years. They are worried they will have a confrontation and have to act, then have a video missing the first initial interaction posted online and get fired. Even if their actions are justified and this has resulted in more crime in these areas.

Im sure the police involved in the latest two shootings will release the involved cops body camera footage....

08-07-2016 02:28PM

Bob24 wrote: »

Apparently he didn't kill himself - it was a police bomb robot (didn't know that had that).

Really? That's mad.

Either way.. there's something rotten at America's core.

SeaFields · 08-07-2016 02:31PM

Just heard that on the latest news about that "robot bomb"... I think the jaw of everyone in the office dropped and said WTF

Gatling · 08-07-2016 02:33PM

Bob24 wrote: »

Apparently he didn't kill himself - it was a police bomb robot (didn't know that had that).

Yeah some police bomb defusal units are fitted with pistols to shoot suspect packages /devices
It's not the first time a robot has been used to shoot a suspect .

Slightly odd note the suspect who said he wanted to kill white people or officers claimed he was working "alone"

Bob24 · 08-07-2016 02:36PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Really? That's mad.

Either way.. there's something rotten at America's core.

Saw that from the Guardian (someone else posted the link) and from a French paper.

And yeah ... very rotten.

Bob24 · 08-07-2016 02:39PM

Gatling wrote: »

Slightly odd note the suspect who said he wanted to kill white people or officers claimed he was working "alone"

At this stage I think no conclusions can be drawn fro this.

I could have been lying to cover accomplices or it could be true and he could just be a criminal who happened to have a gun on him and got trigged but what the other guys were doing.

screamer · 08-07-2016 02:39PM

Bob24 wrote: »

Apparently he didn't kill himself - it was a police bomb robot (didn't know that had that).

They said they were trying to blast him out. Given that he had stated he wanted to kill more people, I'd imagine it was a very last resort in a desperate situation. if it took a robot to save lives, so be it.

11 police shot, 4 officers dead after coordinated sniper fire at Dallas protest rally

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