Mass shooting in Orlando Nightclub

Saipanne · 12-06-2016 11:47PM

All it takes is for one of the forty irish based ISIS fighters to get back to Ireland, get hold of a weapon and pick a crowded area.

In this country, it would be a cake walk.

Despite this, and the FACT that ISIS declared us a target, this is somehow painted as fantasy.

I think the only thing that will wake people up is when such an attack takes place.

LorMal · 12-06-2016 11:49PM

unseenfootage wrote: »

Not sure what your point is.
You said they target all non Muslims.
I showed you an article where they only list 60 countries.
There are 200 countries in the World.

I didn't say they target all non Muslims. I said they deem all non Muslims to be infidels and as such legitimate targets (all non Sunni Muslims). That's the truth.

LightsStillOn · 12-06-2016 11:50PM

Saipanne wrote: »

All it takes is for one of the forty irish based ISIS fighters to get back to Ireland, get hold of a weapon and pick a crowded area.

In this country, it would be a cake walk.

Despite this, and the FACT that ISIS declared us a target, this is somehow painted as fantasy.

I think the only thing that will wake people up is when such an attack takes place.

So what do you suggest we do to prevent this happening?

Polo_Mint · 12-06-2016 11:51PM

The Specialist wrote: »

We are the weakest link in Europe. Look at the attack in the Regency a while back where a couple of guys shot the place up without Garda intervention. Imagine an attack on a shopping centre or public gathering here? We would likely have more casualties than this Orlando attack before even 1 ERU or Army unit would be en route to the location.

How are we the weakest link where we are surrounded by water with border controls?

Main land Europe would be the weakest link considering you can walk into nearly every country in Europe

unseenfootage · 12-06-2016 11:54PM

LorMal wrote: »

I didn't say they target all non Muslims. I said they deem all non Muslims to be infidels and as such legitimate targets (all non Sunni Muslims). That's the truth.

I don't see the point in discussing with you when you are outright lying about what you wrote two pages ago...

ISIS see all non Muslims as legitimate targets.

silverharp · 12-06-2016 11:54PM

McGruber wrote: »

The threat of an organised ISIS attack in Ireland is low.

There are 200,000+ non native Muslims residing in Ireland, the potential for radicalisation and recruitment is there.

There are some extremist Muslims who live here. They are known combatants and are of the low/medium level of leadership variety.

Ireland has been / is used as a kind of "safehouse" for extremist Muslims due to our lax security and social tolerance.

Ireland is not immune from an internal, "lone wolf" style attack on behalf of any extermist group. It's a soft easy target.

The potential is always there but we can say that about everything.

are you sure about your numbers more like 60 or 70 K I hope

The Specialist · 12-06-2016 11:55PM

Polo_Mint wrote: »

How are we the weakest link where we are surrounded by water with border controls?

Main land Europe would be the weakest link considering you can walk into nearly every country in Europe

Home grown jihadis? We do have a Muslim population here and unfortunately with them, a few venomous cretins ready to spew pro IS rhetoric.

Saipanne · 12-06-2016 11:56PM

LightsStillOn wrote: »

So what do you suggest we do to prevent this happening?

There's nothing we can do. How do you stop a lone wolf type attack?

Barry Badrinath · 12-06-2016 11:58PM

Polo_Mint wrote: »

How are we the weakest link where we are surrounded by water with border controls?

Main land Europe would be the weakest link considering you can walk into nearly every country in Europe

Simply, we are unsuspecting and ill-equipped.

If it was to happen here, it would be at the hand of someone already here. It doesn't have to be a person coming to Ireland to do it.

Can I see it happening? No
Is the potential there? Yes

Grayson · 12-06-2016 11:59PM

The Specialist wrote: »

Home grown jihadis? We do have a Muslim population here and unfortunately with them, a few venomous cretins ready to spew pro IS rhetoric.

The continuity IRA, or Real IRA or 32 county sovereignty movement or really any of the nutjobs from up north are a far, far greater threat.

Worrying about an attack by islamic extremists here is like worrying you'll get hanta virus shopping in Dunnes.

unseenfootage · 13-06-2016 12:00AM

Matt Markinson wrote: »

None of which aligns with what Christianity actually teaches.

In your opinion tho....

There are thousands of christian ministers who preach otherwise...

Hans Bricks · 13-06-2016 12:01AM

Saipanne wrote: »

It's already been established that up to 40 irish based Muslims are off being trained .

But none will attempt an attack here because reasons. Even though their propaganda video listed us as a target. Right....

Did I say they wouldn't ? What are the chances really when you actually think about it ? I'd assume these documented moolahs have surveillance on their movement through Europe like flies on Shiite. Dozens of countries were listed. I don't see it as coincidence that only France and Belgium which have major generational integration issues with its large muslim populations, have been the only European ISIS targets thus far.

The Specialist wrote: »

We are the weakest link in Europe. Look at the attack in the Regency a while back where a couple of guys shot the place up without Garda intervention. Imagine an attack on a shopping centre or public gathering here? We would likely have more casualties than this Orlando attack before even 1 ERU or Army unit would be en route to the location.

Aren't we lucky in a way then that Kinahan and Hutch are playing WW3 with each other to the alarm of the ERU.

I seriously think the Irish threat isn't something to lose sleep over. We give them too much credit.

Saipanne · 13-06-2016 12:01AM

Grayson wrote: »

The continuity IRA, or Real IRA or 32 county sovereignty movement or really any of the nutjobs from up north are a far, far greater threat.

Worrying about an attack by islamic extremists here is like worrying you'll get hanta virus shopping in Dunnes.

So the fact they listed is as a target is equivalent to that improbable event?

Right......

Polo_Mint · 13-06-2016 12:02AM

Saipanne wrote: »

There's nothing we can do. How do you stop a lone wolf type attack?

You cant, Just like you cant stop a farmer walking into a pub and blowing someones head off.

You currently have more chance of getting shot in a gangland mistaken identity then someone from ISIS shooting you.

Fore most of us the world keeps spinning here in Ireland.

Grayson · 13-06-2016 12:03AM

Saipanne wrote: »

So the fact they listed is as a target is equivalent to that improbable event?

Right......

I have no idea what you're trying to say. The sentence makes no sense.

Harry Palmr · 13-06-2016 12:04AM

If some nutter with a spiritual issue wants to run riot in ireland they will, nothing you or I can do to stop that (other than by luck/chance), worry about things like locking your doors at night and wearing seatbelts on the way to work in the morning, far more important in your actual life.

unseenfootage · 13-06-2016 12:06AM

unseenfootage wrote: »

In your opinion tho....

There are thousands of christian ministers who preach otherwise...

Like this bible thumper for instance:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCIE0vqk6Uo

13-06-2016 12:07AM

LightsStillOn wrote: »

So what do you suggest we do to prevent this happening?

First of all we need to ensure that any 'asylum seekers' coming from another EU country are returned to that country, i.e. stick to the rules around asylum seeking.

Secondly we can't just excuse every single Islamic terrorist act or mass sex attack as "it's a tiny minority, the majority of muslims are all peaceful" blah blah blah.

We know the majority of muslims are peaceful, but there is a significant enough strain that is intolerant, homophobic, misogynistic and downright violently aggressive to western liberal values. Of all the world's major religions, Islam is just not compatible with western democracy.

I also believe, albeit it's impossible to know, that behind closed doors there is a lot more hate within muslim communities over things like gay pride etc than we will ever know or they will ever admit to.

Ulysses Gaze · 13-06-2016 12:13AM

unseenfootage wrote: »

Like this bible thumper for instance:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCIE0vqk6Uo

Is it just me, or does he sound a little like Ned Flanders?

RedemptionZ · 13-06-2016 12:16AM

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

Fair enough. Can't say I disagree seeing it written like that.

Thanks, I don't want to get a reputation for something I'm not, I like to think I think reasonably enough!

My friend's family came from Bosnia on asylum and his dad had one of his friends beheaded in front of him and was extremely lucky to get out of the country when he did. I know there's so many people in Syria probably in the same situation and it's really ****ed that the genuine cases are being ruined by the actions of ISIS and it'll only play into the hands of the far right nutcases(not that they're any worse than the far left nutcases you see too)

Minderbinder · 13-06-2016 12:18AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEgd9q8ugs4

owen jones walked out of the sky press preview in disgust. i've watched it twice and i'm still not sure what they're arguing about.

Bannasidhe · 13-06-2016 12:19AM

Deleted User wrote: »

First of all we need to ensure that any 'asylum seekers' coming from another EU country are returned to that country, i.e. stick to the rules around asylum seeking.

Secondly we can't just excuse every single Islamic terrorist act or mass sex attack as "it's a tiny minority, the majority of muslims are all peaceful" blah blah blah.

We know the majority of muslims are peaceful, but there is a significant enough strain that is intolerant, homophobic, misogynistic and downright violently aggressive to western liberal values. Of all the world's major religions, Islam is just not compatible with western democracy.

I also believe, albeit it's impossible to know, that behind closed doors there is a lot more hate within muslim communities over things like gay pride etc than we will ever know or they will ever admit to.

As a middle aged Irish lesbian I have heard more intolerant, homophobic, misogynistic and downright violently aggressive BS from Christians than I have ever encountered from Muslims -and yes, I have lived in multicultural areas and worked with Muslims. Is Christian intolerant, homophobic, misogynistic and downright violently aggressive B.S. compatible with Western Liberal values or should we deport them too?

In the U.S. a culture of murderous homophobia is being fostered and not by any Imams or Mullahs but by Christian pastors. Christian Americans have taken to twitter to rejoice at the deaths.

Don't you dare use the LGBT community - my community - as justification for your islamophobia.

Bigotry is bigotry. It isn't the preserve of one religion.

Matt Markinson · 13-06-2016 12:22AM

unseenfootage wrote: »

In your opinion tho....

There are thousands of christian ministers who preach otherwise...

People can all themselves whatever they want, it doesn't mean they are, and it doesn't mean they are Christian or preaching Christianity. In contrast, there are hundreds of thousands who do though, as any genuine study of Christianity will reveal.

Matt Markinson · 13-06-2016 12:24AM

unseenfootage wrote: »

In your opinion tho....

There are thousands of christian ministers who preach otherwise...

People can all themselves whatever they want, it doesn't mean they are what they claim to be, and it doesn't mean people who claim they are Christian and preaching Christianity are. In contrast, there are hundreds of thousands who both preach and practice actual Christianity, as any genuine study of Christianity will reveal.

Sweetemotion · 13-06-2016 12:24AM

Bannasidhe wrote: »

As a middle aged Irish lesbian I have heard more intolerant, homophobic, misogynistic and downright violently aggressive BS from Christians than I have ever encountered from Muslims -and yes, I have lived in multicultural areas and worked with Muslims. Is Christian intolerant, homophobic, misogynistic and downright violently aggressive B.S. compatible with Western Liberal values or should we deport them too?

In the U.S. a culture of murderous homophobia is being fostered and not by any Imams or Mullahs but by Christian pastors. Christian Americans have taken to twitter to rejoice at the deaths.

Don't you dare use the LGBT community - my community - as justification for your islamophobia.

Bigotry is bigotry. It isn't the preserve of one religion.

A culture of murderous homophobia???

Grayson · 13-06-2016 12:27AM

Deleted User wrote: »

First of all we need to ensure that any 'asylum seekers' coming from another EU country are returned to that country, i.e. stick to the rules around asylum seeking.

Secondly we can't just excuse every single Islamic terrorist act or mass sex attack as "it's a tiny minority, the majority of muslims are all peaceful" blah blah blah.

We know the majority of muslims are peaceful, but there is a significant enough strain that is intolerant, homophobic, misogynistic and downright violently aggressive to western liberal values. Of all the world's major religions, Islam is just not compatible with western democracy.

I also believe, albeit it's impossible to know, that behind closed doors there is a lot more hate within muslim communities over things like gay pride etc than we will ever know or they will ever admit to.

Can we ban all catholics because of the number of terrorist attacks they performed in Ireland. Protestants too. Why not.

Grayson · 13-06-2016 12:28AM

Sweetemotion wrote: »

A culture of murderous homophobia???

You're talking about the DUP right?

Samaris · 13-06-2016 12:28AM

Okay, I think I'm about done with the Islam discussion. I think it's pretty damn plain that various opinions can never be reconciled and, as I said many pages ago (before I too got sucked in to the madness), fifty people are dead, and countless more damaged from this and they're all being used as a political football.

I've made my own points and it was pointless (only those willing to read them read them anyway, and it was the others I was trying to reach), so to hell with it. I'm not going to continue taking part in keeping real and hurting families as a point to squabble over. I don't say it's not a discussion to be had, but not here.

RIP to those that lost their lives. For what little it's worth, thoughts are with those recovering and grieving tonight.

Jimmy Garlic · 13-06-2016 12:30AM

Bannasidhe wrote: »

As a middle aged Irish lesbian I have heard more intolerant, homophobic, misogynistic and downright violently aggressive BS from Christians than I have ever encountered from Muslims -and yes, I have lived in multicultural areas and worked with Muslims. Is Christian intolerant, homophobic, misogynistic and downright violently aggressive B.S. compatible with Western Liberal values or should we deport them too?

As you say you are a middle aged Irish lesbian. You wouldn't have come across many Muslims until fairly recently. Where did you came across so many rabidly homophobic people identifying as Christians? What was the context? Did they threaten to kill you?

In the U.S. a culture of murderous homophobia is being fostered and not by any Imams or Mullahs but by Christian pastors. Christian Americans have taken to twitter to rejoice at the deaths.

Oh really? What's this....

13-06-2016 12:30AM

Bannasidhe wrote: »

As a middle aged Irish lesbian I have heard more intolerant, homophobic, misogynistic and downright violently aggressive BS from Christians than I have ever encountered from Muslims -and yes, I have lived in multicultural areas and worked with Muslims. Is Christian intolerant, homophobic, misogynistic and downright violently aggressive B.S. compatible with Western Liberal values or should we deport them too?

In the U.S. a culture of murderous homophobia is being fostered and not by any Imams or Mullahs but by Christian pastors. Christian Americans have taken to twitter to rejoice at the deaths.

Don't you dare use the LGBT community - my community - as justification for your islamophobia.

Bigotry is bigotry. It isn't the preserve of one religion.

You're being delusional if you think they are equal. Completely delusional.

In traditionally Christian western countries such as the US the LGBT community is tolerated and there are no serious dangers to women and gay people by and large. Compare that to the middle east. Look at the Dutch woman who was raped in Qatar and when she went to the police she is threatened with prison for adultery.

Don't throw this BS islamophobia tag at me just because I am calling a spade a spade. I don't hate muslims, I just hate the now routine acts of terror being carried out by Islamic jihadists.

Put it this way, would you feel safer in a gay pride parade in Dublin or in Saudi Arabia. By your logic they would both be equally safe. Like I said, delusional.

Mass shooting in Orlando Nightclub

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