Mass shooting in Orlando Nightclub

RobertKK · 12-06-2016 08:37PM

rjpf1980 wrote: »

The euros have only just begun.

How do we know there won't be attacks?

I am just reporting what was said on CNN.

The US were warning their citizens who were traveling to Europe about possible terrorist attacks.
The person on CNN said US officials didn't believe the US would be attacked.

Snake Plisken · 12-06-2016 08:38PM

Billy86 wrote: »

I'm an atheist, why do you ask? And what's with the paranoid obsession of attempting to create an 'us and them/with us or against us' dynamic?

Because it's weird for an Atheist to be defending a backwards religion like Islam while trying to deflect thread by saying oh but what about some obscure Christian sect! Stop deflecting and face the facts that the main threat in the west is followers of Islam be they line or organised who want to destroy our ordinary western way of life!

Samaris · 12-06-2016 08:38PM

rjpf1980 wrote: »

A crowd filing out of a stadium after watching a filthy haram game or crowds drinking alcohol and the opposite sexes mixing in clubs and bars during celebrations that insult the Prophet are not soft targets?

In Paris right now, with the massive security operation in place? Not as soft as a lone nut going into a nightclub which was utterly unaware of danger and shooting it up.

BorneTobyWilde · 12-06-2016 08:39PM

They clearly said they would attack Florida. And they did.

rjpf1980 · 12-06-2016 08:41PM

Billy86 wrote: »

You seem under the impression that every Muslim is an Islamic extremist. I shouldn't have to tell you this, but they're not.

I never said all Muslims were extremists. Millions of them clearly are extremist and they are at war with the West.

Matt Markinson · 12-06-2016 08:41PM

rjpf1980 wrote: »

A crowd filing out of a stadium after watching a filthy haram game or crowds drinking alcohol and the opposite sexes mixing in clubs and bars during celebrations that insult the Prophet are not soft targets?

Because the chances of success are still less
All terrorist targets are soft by their very nature.
But some are a lot a softer than others.
The attack in the niteclub, or any where else it's not expected, is getting just as much coverage and creating just as much, if not more, terrorism as any attack at the Euro's would.

smurgen · 12-06-2016 08:42PM

funny thing is there's many christian americans that would see this as some sort of punishment from god on the gay community.absolutely mental that one dude killed so many.I wonder what sort of weaponry he had?

PucaMama · 12-06-2016 08:43PM

the worst thing ive read all day about it is how the responders are having to cope with going in to retrieve the bodies and hearing their phones ringing and ringing. maybe have a think about those poor peoples families trying to get to them before launching into defending ISIS and their "sympathisers".

Billy86 · 12-06-2016 08:44PM

Snake Plisken wrote: »

Because it's weird for an Atheist to be defending a backwards religion like Islam while trying to deflect thread by saying oh but what about some obscure Christian sect!

No, it's not actually. Being atheist, I don't have "a side" - you seem to have mistaken this for a football match. I don't like Islamic extremist, just like I don't like Christian extremism or any extremism. That does not mean I do not look at all Muslims as extremists, just like I do not look at all Christians as extremists. I also don't brush aside and try to ignore the actions of one group in order to further villify the followers of the other.

Stop deflecting and face the facts that the main threat in the west is followers of Islam be they line or organised who want to destroy our ordinary western way of life!

Yeah, the ex who just sent me a picture of the coffee and bagel she's having on South William Street is probably plotting how to murder as many people as possible in between her fashion blog tomorrow morning and studying for her QFA certification in the afternoon.

Islamic and all religious extremists are the problem, not all followers of Islam, and not all followers of any religion.

JPNelsforearm · 12-06-2016 08:45PM

Snake Plisken wrote: »

Because it's weird for an Atheist to be defending a backwards religion like Islam while trying to deflect thread by saying oh but what about some obscure Christian sect! Stop deflecting and face the facts that the main threat in the west is followers of Islam be they line or organised who want to destroy our ordinary western way of life!

Ah, but the christians you see, they stopped some lad getting a wedding cake for him and his bf, wanting to talk about muslims committing terrorism, and linking with islam after they explicitly say they did it for islam, is just right wing islamophobia.

Matt Markinson · 12-06-2016 08:46PM

smurgen wrote: »

funny thing is there's many christian americans that would see this as some sort of punishment from god on the gay community.

And in truth there is far more that wouldn't . . . but at least you found a way of using the attack for another agenda.

20Cent · 12-06-2016 08:46PM

PucaMama wrote: »

the worst thing ive read all day about it is how the responders are having to cope with going in to retrieve the bodies and hearing their phones ringing and ringing. maybe have a think about those poor peoples families trying to get to them before launching into defending ISIS and their "sympathisers".

Who's defending Isis?
People are only saying that all Muslims should not be blamed for the actions of a tiny extreme minority.

Severard · 12-06-2016 08:47PM

Matt Markinson wrote: »

And yet the less restrictive firearms policy in the USA hasn't worked out so well for all the regular gun lover massacres over there. There's been far more in the USA alone, than there ever has been in France, or all the European countries put together for that matter.

In other countries throughout the world where guns are easy to come by, their murder rates via firearms is very low -

At rates of 100,000 [1]:

Russia (2002) Murder rate of 20.54 and a gun ownership rate of 4,000

Germany (2003) Murder rate of 0.93 and a gun ownership rate of 30,000

Norway (2001) Murder rate of 0.81 and a gun ownership rate of 36,000

Russia is in the comparison to show that even with low gun ownership, a high murder rate via firearms is possible.

The majority of crimes commited with guns is from gang-related [2]. When you manage to figure out keeping guns out of the hands of people who should not be having them in the first place that would be great. But to take away rights from people who are not criminals in the vain hope that it might stop actual criminals from gun violence is rather short-sighted.

[1] http://www.law.harvard.edu/students/orgs/jlpp/Vol30_No2_KatesMauseronline.pdf

[2] http://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/171576/america-doesnt-have-gun-problem-it-has-gang-daniel-greenfield

rjpf1980 · 12-06-2016 08:47PM

Billy86 wrote: »

No, it's not actually. Being atheist, I don't have "a side" - you seem to have mistaken this for a football match. I don't like Islamic extremist, just like I don't like Christian extremism or any extremism. That does not mean I do not look at all Muslims as extremists, just like I do not look at all Christians as extremists. I also don't brush aside and try to ignore the actions of one group in order to further villify the followers of the other.

Yeah, the ex who just sent me a picture of the coffee and bagel she's having on South William Street is probably plotting how to murder as many people as possible in between her fashion blog tomorrow morning and studying for her QFA certification in the afternoon.

Islamic and all religious extremists are the problem, not all followers of Islam, and not all followers of any religion.

Your beating a strawman. Nobody said all Muslims were terrorists.

What we are saying is that at the moment Islamic extremism is the leading terrorist threat and PC brigade refuses to call it what it is.

Polo_Mint · 12-06-2016 08:47PM

RobertKK wrote: »

I am just reporting what was said on CNN.

The US were warning their citizens who were traveling to Europe about possible terrorist attacks.
The person on CNN said US officials didn't believe the US would be attacked.

In my opinion this wasnt a planned ISIS attack.

I believe this was a muslim who took offence to 2 guys kissing and lost it.

A Muslim with a fucked up head.

He planned what he was going to do himself and made the call to cops to make it as if he was a member of Isis which i dont believe he was.

Jimmy Garlic · 12-06-2016 08:47PM

Billy86 wrote: »

You seem under the impression that every Muslim is an Islamic extremist. I shouldn't have to tell you this, but they're not.

Where is the outrage and protest from Muslims about these homicidal rampages and bombings carried out in their name? I don't see any. Silence gives consent.

Samaris · 12-06-2016 08:48PM

PucaMama wrote: »

the worst thing ive read all day about it is how the responders are having to cope with going in to retrieve the bodies and hearing their phones ringing and ringing. maybe have a think about those poor peoples families trying to get to them before launching into defending ISIS and their "sympathisers".

Er, no-one, not one person that I've seen is defending ISIS or their sympathisers. The absolute closest is suggesting that maybe not witch-hunting anyone that is Muslim would be appropriate right now.

Seriously, how can Irish people not see this? It's not that long since the IRA were blowing up places. Were all Irish, or even "millions of Irish" responsible, or did they support it? Sure, there's morons that did. There's moron Muslims that do. But things would have been pretty different here if, as some people are suggesting the US and Europe do to other innocent people, the UK had deported/arrested all the Irish, second and third gen Irish and anyone who wore green in the 1970s. Or invaded.

Apparently merely the suggestion not to tar and feather several million people because of their religion is "defending ISIS". People never bloody learn.

PucaMama · 12-06-2016 08:50PM

Samaris wrote: »

Er, no-one, not one person that I've seen is defending ISIS or their sympathisers. The absolute closest is suggesting that maybe not witch-hunting anyone that is Muslim would be appropriate right now.

Seriously, how can Irish people not see this? It's not that long since the IRA were blowing up places. Were all Irish, or even "millions of Irish" responsible, or did they support it? Sure, there's morons that did. There's moron Muslims that do. But things would have been pretty different here if, as some people are suggesting the US and Europe do to other innocent people, the UK had deported/arrested all the Irish, second and third gen Irish and anyone who wore green in the 1970s. Or invaded.

Apparently merely the suggestion not to tar and feather several million people because of their religion is "defending ISIS". People never bloody learn.

the irish were treated like **** during the troubles and noone cared

Timberrrrrrrr · 12-06-2016 08:50PM

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

Where is the outrage and protest from Muslims about these homicidal rampages and bombings carried out in their name? I don't see any. Silence gives consent.

Maybe read back a few pages and you will see the condemnation from them, Or are you one of these chaps that insists each and every one of the billion+ Muslims apologises individually for the actions of a few?

Lyaiera · 12-06-2016 08:51PM

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

Where is the outrage and protest from Muslims about these homicidal rampages and bombings carried out in their name? I don't see any. Silence gives consent.

You were linked to a load of examples a few pages ago!

Jimmy Garlic · 12-06-2016 08:52PM

Polo_Mint wrote: »

In my opinion this wasnt a planned ISIS attack.

I believe this was a muslim who took offence to 2 guys kissing and lost it.

A Muslim with a fucked up head.

He planned what he was going to do himself and made the call to cops to make it as if he was a member of Isis which i dont believe he was.

In other words, nothing to see here, move along. Islam is a religion of peace and anyone who thinks otherwise is racist/Islamophobic blah blah blah. The usual old tripe.

LightsStillOn · 12-06-2016 08:52PM

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

Where is the outrage and protest from Muslims about these homicidal rampages and bombings carried out in their name? I don't see any. Silence gives consent.

Did you not see the multiple quotes from multiple Muslims a few pages back then? Not very silent..

12-06-2016 08:52PM

smurgen wrote: »

I wonder what sort of weaponry he had?

Probably an AR-16 and a sh*tload of 30 round clips. Some police forces wanted to ban them in favour of the 10 round clip, but the NRA objected as usual.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2012-12-16/ban-on-30-round-gun-magazines-in-connecticut-died-after-pressure

Billy86 · 12-06-2016 08:52PM

rjpf1980 wrote: »

I never said all Muslims were extremists. Millions of them clearly are extremist and they are at war with the West.

He asked if I was Muslim, I effectively said no I am not and asked why he is trying to create an 'us and them' dynamic with Muslims, and you replied that Islamic extremists are trying to kill as many people as possible and are against all of us.

My point was that you appear to be conflating Muslims and Islamic extremists.

stefanovich · 12-06-2016 08:53PM

Polo_Mint wrote: »

In my opinion this wasnt a planned ISIS attack.

I believe this was a muslim who took offence to 2 guys kissing and lost it.

A Muslim with a fucked up head.

He planned what he was going to do himself and made the call to cops to make it as if he was a member of Isis which i dont believe he was.

He was in contact with known terrorists in the past and was investigated by the FBI.

Samaris · 12-06-2016 08:54PM

PucaMama wrote: »

the irish were treated like **** during the troubles and noone cared

Yis'd think that would give some people a pause for thought as to whether they were advocating exactly the same against another group then, but apparently not.

rjpf1980 · 12-06-2016 08:54PM

Samaris wrote: »

Er, no-one, not one person that I've seen is defending ISIS or their sympathisers. The absolute closest is suggesting that maybe not witch-hunting anyone that is Muslim would be appropriate right now.

Nobody is witch hunting Muslims.
We should be witch hunting Islamic extremists.

Seriously, how can Irish people not see this? It's not that long since the IRA were blowing up places. Were all Irish, or even "millions of Irish" responsible, or did they support it? Sure, there's morons that did. There's moron Muslims that do. But things would have been pretty different here if, as some people are suggesting the US and Europe do to other innocent people, the UK had deported/arrested all the Irish, second and third gen Irish and anyone who wore green in the 1970s. Or invaded.

Military force was used against the IRA which forced them to choose a democratic route and give up the gun.

Military force is needed to wipe out Islamic terrorists and force Islamic extremists in general to moderate their views.

Apparently merely the suggestion not to tar and feather several million people because of their religion is "defending ISIS". People never bloody learn.

Who is tarring a feathering all Muslims? Nobody. You are just deflecting from admitting 1) Islamic extremism is the leading terrorist threat right now 2) A brutal fight is ahead if the global Islamic extremist movement is to be stopped.

Superhorse · 12-06-2016 08:55PM

Unbelievable the apologists for the Islamics on here. They'll do anything to deflect. They are as dangerous to our freedoms as the Islamics themselves.

Timberrrrrrrr · 12-06-2016 08:55PM

Superhorse wrote: »

Unbelievable the apologists for the Islamics on here. They'll do anything to deflect. They are as dangerous to our freedoms as the Islamics themselves.

LMAO :pac::pac::pac::pac::pac:

RobertKK · 12-06-2016 08:56PM

Polo_Mint wrote: »

In my opinion this wasnt a planned ISIS attack.

I believe this was a muslim who took offence to 2 guys kissing and lost it.

A Muslim with a fucked up head.

He planned what he was going to do himself and made the call to cops to make it as if he was a member of Isis which i dont believe he was.

But he had make contact with a known terrorist in the past, and had expressed ISIS leanings.

Mass shooting in Orlando Nightclub

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