Bishop Comiskey should..

jd

Following the BBC's correspondent programme,

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/audiovideo/programmes/correspondent/newsid_1879000/1879407.stm and his behaviour afterwards
I will give my own opinion in full later..
But I think he should resign..

mike65

Resign and he will I think.

Mike.

Biffa Bacon

Whether he should resign or not it's disgraceful that he's remaining silent.

leejon

The Catholic Church appears to be a very organised, hierarchical perverts club!!!!!

Frank Grimes

Without a doubt he should go. It's just a pity that him and the other members of the church/gardai etc. that knew what was going on, or at least had some idea what was happening, will not be charged over it.
Although I'm sure if it came to it, alot would take the same way out that Fortune did.

swiss

[jumps on high horse]
It really is disgusting to think that he, and the rest of his pastoral 'cronies' have engaged in a conspiracy of silence to save their own skins, even when they knew full well what kind of horrific crimes that vile Sean Fortune engaged in.

He doesn't deserve the protection of the church, or the state for his actions. He has essentially acted as an accessory to criminal acts by his own failure to act when the matter was brought to his attention. In a society such as that in america, he could be sucessfully prosecuted for such a role.

As a person, his failure to act is contemptible. As a senior member of the clergy, he is an abomination in the face of the entity he calls god.
[/jumps on high horse]

chernobyl

He should be convicted, he covered up another priests illegal actions.

dahamsta

As above. Comiskey is a criminal in my view, he should be tried and locked up for it. If anyone outside the church did it, this wouldn't even be a matter for debate.

ADDENDUM: It was pointed out to me yesterday that "faithful Catholics" are writing to the newspapers telling them that they should be ashamed of themselves, digging this up and telling people about it. What goes on in these people's heads? How can they possibly think that?

adam

seamus

You left out a 'be burned at the stake' option. Totally unforgivable what he did. He should at least be jailed for collaboration or aiding and abetting or some spin on that. :mad:

NeRb666

The sad part is, even if he was tried and convicted (which he probably won't anyway), the sentence would be a joke.

Stephen

Comiskey has resigned.

According to RTE News, he tendered his resignation to the pope on Thursday and will be travelling to the Vatican later in the week to formalise his resignation.

Good riddance.

Shinji

Resigned? Oh *wow*. That'll teach him eh.

Bet he'll never stand trial as an accessory before and after the fact, mind. He should be spending time in jail, not a comfy early retirement.

handyandy

Originally posted by Shinji
Bet he'll never stand trial as an accessory before and after the fact

Is there something we should know about him being an accessory before the fact (i.e. conspiring to commit the act)?

Sand

Phrasing is a bit tricky but I reckon he means accessory before any abuse committed *after* he was made aware of the complaints against Fortune. Yeah that phrasing isnt great either but im tired:)

chernobyl

Originally posted by handyandy

Is there something we should know about him being an accessory before the fact (i.e. conspiring to commit the act)?

Your not fricken tellin me that you dont think he should go to jail?

So this prat finds out that a priest has sexually abused this child (effectively ending this kids chance at a productive life) and he just relocates the priest to another location...the fuking priest gets away free with a very serious crime and this Bishop is obviously an accessory.


Along with UBL and Sadam, these pedofiles deserve a slow and painful death and life without parole for his friend in crime.

How many more priests has he just "relocated" for this crime?

Xterminator

Bishop Comeskey should come clean. He should sit down and answer all the outstanding questions about the affair.

His resignation will remove the heat from the situation, and lead to an amount of sympathy being generated for him.

But at the end of the day, everybody, particularly those who have suffered as a result of this affair, deserve to know exactly what happened, who knew what, and when they knew, and what actions were taken.

If the actions of Comesky or other were found to be reckess, and endangered others needlessy, then pehaps the hurch should look at its Canon Law, which has been percived by some as a shield for the Guilty, rather than a code of behaviour.

seamus

Yes his official resignation reason was 'His remaining in the Church would only hamper efforts to clear up other similar situations'. Nice try, but no cigar.

mike65

I think they'll be many outside the catholic clergy having to answer some very hard questions before this is played out, I heard Gary O'Halleron (I think thats his name) on Morning Ireland
talking about how the South-Eastern Health Board kept kicking
this issue into touch, indeed I remember him being on the radio years ago trying to highlight the abuse but no-one was interested in turning over stones back then.

Mike.

Frank Grimes

I've just watched the programme on RTE. Hadn't seen it on BBC but I've read most of what was covered. What does everyone think?
There's alot of questions that need answer imo. The main one I have is why Comiskey is not being arrested and being made account for his actions.

dahamsta

I wanted to say the same thing yesterday, but I thought I'd be larted out of it. What really /annoyed/ me was that Comiskey had buggered off to hand his resignation officially to the Pope, when he should have been in an interview room in a Garda station answering questions. I wholly concur with Colm O'Gorman, he's a bastard. A gutless bastard.

adam

Neil3030

Ive had it with The Cathoic Church. They rape kids, they lie, they cover up, they brainwash and they are above the ****ing law. **** them. They should lob that Comiskey prick into a cell with some dude twice his size and let him feel what it was like for those poor kids at the hands of that demon.

Please excuse my language but i'm too enraged to bother being tactful.

Shinji

Perhaps someone can clear this up for me.

I was told today that in fact, even should the Gardai wish to arrest Bishop Comiskey, he can choose to claim diplomatic immunity as a member of the Roman Catholic Church; and that under some Irish law, all Church functionaries and workers are treated equally to embassy staff.

Does anyone know if this is true?

Frank Grimes

Yeah, it's true apparently. It was mentioned on that BBC programme about the whole thing (I think).
I don't know why this is the case, that's something I'd like to find out.

dahamsta

The Holy See (Vatican City) is actually viewed as a independent state internationally, because of an agreement between the Italian Government and the Church in the twenties, so presumably the Church can claim that (some of) it's representatives are ambassadors. From a poke around Google just now, it seems that the Church (or at least it's representatives) has used diplomatic immunity as a defense before, but usually only for Papal Nuncio's. If Comiskey claims diplomatic immunity, it might not stand up, but of course the Church is a powerful entity...

adam

Frank Grimes

Thanks for that dahamsta, makes a bit more sense now. It would be interesting to see (seeing as some of the victims are taking legal action) if any of their lawyers would be willing to test this.
I heard that the locals in the parish had some sort of vigil for Comiskey when he announced his resignation, kinda says it all really about the attitudes of certain people in the country.
It would be interesting to hear what people in England and further afield make of all this.

dahamsta

Thanks for that dahamsta, makes a bit more sense now.

You're welcome, but: DISCLAIMER: I only know about the Holy See being a separate state because I'm a web developer, and I always found it odd that Vatican City was listed as a "country" in SELECT boxes. So I went and found out why. I also can't speak authoritatively on the ambassador thing, I just looked it up on the web. The web is not the most reliable source of information!

It would be interesting to see (seeing as some of the victims are taking legal action) if any of their lawyers would be willing to test this.

As I said, the Church is a powerful entity. But I respect Colm O'Gorman for standing up for himself, and all the people he implicitly represents. He's taking on a mightly battle, I say good luck to him. It's about time someone started making the Catholic Church answerable for some of their actions.

I heard that the locals in the parish had some sort of vigil for Comiskey when he announced his resignation, kinda says it all really about the attitudes of certain people in the country.

Apparently, Fethard-on-Sea is the same place that waged a sectarian campaign against Protestants in the Fifties, essentially because of a mixed marriage in their parish. The campaign was waged by the local priest, and local politicians. (I knew about this, but I didn't know it was Fethard.) See, when Protestants and Catholics want to get married in Ireland, they had to ask the permission of the Catholic Church. The Protestant also had to sign a ("Ne temere") pledge to bring the children up as Catholics. I'm not sure if it still happens today.

As it happens, I'm a product of this, a Catholic from a mixed marriage. My mother, a Protestant, had to ask the Papal Nuncio for permission to get married, because the local Bishop refused. She wasn't allowed have her best friend as her bridesmaid (because she was Protestant) and I wasn't allowed have Protestant godparents. I was brought up a Catholic, although it didn't stick.

Again though, a DISCLAIMER: This isn't a denouncement of all that is Fethard. Saying that Fethard is sectarian would be akin to good ol' Davey Trimble saying that Ireland is sectarian (pot, David; kettle, David). There are probably some lovely people living in Fethard. Equally, I have nothing against the Catholic (or Protestant) Church per se. But the Church does need to pull it's head out of it's arse and face up to it's responsibilities.

As to the Protestant Church, well, I can't really accept that the Queen of England is God's representative on Earth, it's just a little too far-fetched for me. So Protestantism didn't stick either. I'm an agnostic, pleasantly content in my own ignorance.

It would be interesting to hear what people in England and further afield make of all this.

I think it's quite sad really. First Trimble tars us all with the same brush as "pathetic" and "sectarian". (I can't speak for the rest of the country, or even the population of the People's Republic, but Catholics V Protestants isn't even a topic worthy of conversation with me and most of my friends.) Then Fortune and Comiskey tar us all with their lies, deceit and ignorance. Is it any wonder the world has such a bad impression of us?

Do you know another thing that annoyed me? That it came up on the BBC, and RTE only chose to show it when pressure was on them. That's pathetic.

adam

Frank Grimes

On the ambassador point, would the Papal Nuncio not be the only person considered an ambassador from Rome? (my knowledge of the Catholic hierarchy isn't the best )

and just to add to

Is it any wonder the world has such a bad impression of us?

If I wasn't Irish, I'd have an even worse opinion of what goes on in this country than I already do.

Shinji

If I wasn't Irish, I'd have an even worse opinion of what goes on in this country than I already do.

Most people here in Britain haven't the foggiest idea about this or any of the various other political/social scandals in Ireland, to be fair.

They've all seen Father Ted though.

Frank Grimes

Most people here in Britain haven't the foggiest idea about this or any of the various other political/social scandals in Ireland, to be fair

But I can only imagine what the ones who do know about it think.

The Gopher

I actually feel a bit sorry for the bishop.As usual in Ireland somebody mistakenly yet again put the village idiot in a position of power.Sure he did wrong but that c.unt fortune was blackmailing him over his alcoholism.Comiskey is alot like Liam Lawlor-hes either a total idiot or just acts like one whenever hes in front of a camera for sympathy.

mike65

Originally posted by dahamsta

Do you know another thing that annoyed me? That it came up on the BBC, and RTE only chose to show it when pressure was on them. That's pathetic.

adam

Thats typical too, RTE are not in the business of annnoying the
powers that be, remember the Goodman/Irish Beef scandal,
that was broken by the late World In Action on ITV. The story of another prevert priest, now dead was broken by the BBC in Northern Ireland.

Mike.

Neil3030

Does anyone know if RTE are still not allowed show The Life of Brian?

dahamsta

Originally posted by The Gopher
I actually feel a bit sorry for the bishop.As usual in Ireland somebody mistakenly yet again put the village idiot in a position of power.Sure he did wrong but that c.unt fortune was blackmailing him over his alcoholism.Comiskey is alot like Liam Lawlor-hes either a total idiot or just acts like one whenever hes in front of a camera for sympathy.

"Stupidity is the weakest of defenses."

"When you fall off the wall, there's only one thing you can be."

Who said that?

adam

Excelsior

I have been buried under rocks for the last few weeks. Can some kind soul explain what Comiskey did to cover up Fortune's actions?
I know about Fortune's crimes and I have heard about Comiskey's resignation but what of these conspiracies to protect Fortune? What happened there?

jd

Five impressive people say it's time to come out now
By Patsy McGarry, Religious Affairs Correspondent



Ernest Hemmingway described courage as "grace under pressure". That quality was much in evidence at yesterday's press conference by victims of clerical sex abuse in Ferns.

Mr Colm O'Gorman, Mr Donnacha McGloinn and Mr Pat Jackman, who were abused by Father Seán Fortune, along with Jim and Josie Gahan, whose daughter was abused by Father Jim Grennan at Monageer, were articulate, dignified, generous, even funny.

They were also spontaneous, honest, and forthcoming in a way the church authorities are not. They wanted no heads on a plate, did not seek and had never sought any resignations, and they were "not interested in attacking anybody", as Mr O'Gorman put it.

What they did want was "a full and frank inquiry" because "we can't heal the wound unless it (the abuse) is acknowledged".

Mr McGloinn called on all who had been abused, and relatives of those who may have taken their lives because of abuse, to "come out now".

He knew this would be very hard, especially on families, but people had to "come forward now". They could do so by contacting www.oneinfour.org - a new website they have set up.

He had only told his own family last Christmas about the rape by Father Fortune in 1988. That was after he agreed to take part in the BBC Suing The Pope programme. His family had been devastated, especially his mother, a devout Catholic.

It was only when they talked about their families that the men became emotional. Mr O'Gorman remembered his late father's "huge support" as "the big reason why I'm here today".

And Mr Jackman spoke of his love for the church, his local choir he sang in, and the "four wonderful, young, strong, dynamic priests" in his parish.

He had had to give up his bar job in Wexford town. It had become "untenable" as more and more people came to him, after the first screening of Suing the Pope, with tales of their own abuse. He has his own "demons" to deal with.

Nevertheless, yesterday it was not anger that was evident, just five very impressive people.

Biffa Bacon

Here's a thought:
I wouldn't be surprised if sexual abuse on the scale we have seen in Ireland, the US, Australia, Canada is going on also in other parts of the world like South America and Africa. Now that the Church has been forced to recognise that this sort of thing does happen, they really should be making a huge effort to make sure it is stamped out totally in the Church throughout the world. Of course this isn't going to happen, so who knows how many more kids will be needlessly abused throughout the world over how many years before they are forced to confront the problem again?

Victor

Originally posted by Xterminator
If the actions of Comesky or other were found to be reckess, and endangered others needlessy, then pehaps the hurch should look at its Canon Law, which has been percived by some as a shield for the Guilty, rather than a code of behaviour.

Well the offenders face the direct descendant of the Spanish Inquisition, is that enough?

Victor

Originally posted by Neil3030
Ive had it with The Cathoic Church. They rape kids, they lie, they cover up, they brainwash and they are above the ****ing law.

While I don't agree and indeed condemn the actions of a few hundred criminals, I don't think blaming a few million Catholics solves anything.

jd

Originally posted by Neil3030
Ive had it with The Cathoic Church. They rape kids, they lie, they cover up, they brainwash and they are above the ****ing law. **** them. They should lob that Comiskey prick into a cell with some dude twice his size and let him feel what it was like for those poor kids at the hands of that demon.

Please excuse my language but i'm too enraged to bother being tactful.

Im an agnostic but bear in mind this

"And Mr Jackman spoke of his love for the church, his local choir he sang in, and the "four wonderful, young, strong, dynamic priests" in his parish. "

I thought myself that Comiskey should resign,for one because it was quite obvious that his "flock" had no faith in him, but I am thinking again about it. He was obviously a weak man, to allow Fortune and other priests to push him around.

However he did do some good in Wexford, where he helped bridge the gap between communities that had existed in Fethard since the 1950's. Rev Ruddock (leader of the C of I community in Wexford) was crying as Comiskey announced his resignation.

Comiskey screwed up majorly, and in the best interests of the victims of Child Abuse in Wexford he resignation should be refused by the Vatican.

I went to St Peters College in Wexford as well, and my belief is that the Seminary attached to it should have been closed down years ago.
I think that when vocations started decreasing they laxed their controls-ie it became a numbers game to keep the seminary open.
The culture was appalling amongst the authourities-we all knew that certain priests were "bent-"but who were we going to tell.
One Priest (since convicted) started asking me about my physical development while I was trying to ask advise about a scientifc project I was pursuing.
I walked out -saying my mother was waiting in the car outside..
The college had two "Deans of Discipline".
One of whom was in the lay part of the College while the aforementioned "priest" was a teacher. My abiding memory of him is going out with the other DOD and beating my brother and a friend out of a bush with hurls for trying to mitch mass (the other DOD had loads of practice-(removed as could be libellous jd)-now hes a parish priest)"..
I could go on-
anyway
what needs to be examined
Wexford garda Records
Ferns Dicese Records
St Peters College Records (whole institution-both Seminary and Secondary School)
before they burn them