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The 100 Greatest Films
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How people can ask "why did this movie not get higher?" and "how could they put this movie higher than they put this one?" is a tad amusing to say the least.
It's simple:
It was a popular VOTE.
People VOTED on this.
People, collectively, can be terribly thick.
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Personally, I'd have to agree with seamus in that I think the Godfather movies are terribly over-rated. The first one, for example, bored me to bits, and overall I thought it was a poorly acted rendition of a badly written story with very little substance to it. More than that, it failed to entertain me - and THAT is the basic requirement of ANY good movie. ... and before anyone says it, NO, it's not that I "just didn't get it" (I hate when people say that), - I got it - I understood it - ... I just thought it was rubbish, and that other movies (such as Donnie Brasco, Casino and even True Romance, among many) tell the gangster/mafioso/"family" story far better.
Why do people call Gladiator an epic?... Consider this... Why do people continue to show off their knowledge of OLD movies (such as Ben Hur, Spartacus, etc.) and insist that nothing has or ever will beat them?
... It's a bit of a rhetorical question anyway, isn't it? ... "Why do people call Gladiator an epic?" ... The answer? "BECAUSE ITS AN EPIC!" :rolleyes: . Look up the word epic in the dictionary...
An extended narrative poem in elevated or dignified language, celebrating the feats of a legendary or traditional hero.
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Surpassing the usual or ordinary, particularly in scope or size.
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Narrated in a grand style; pertaining to or designating a kind of narrative poem, usually called an heroic poem, in which real or fictitious events, usually the achievements of some hero, are narrated in an elevated style.
Substitute "film" for "poem" there... Gladiator fits the bill in all of the above.
It would help to have an understanding of what you are denying before you deny it
... of course it's an epic... it's a tale, told in a grand style, on a large scale, of historic events featuring a heroic character.
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Yeah, I think Leon, Braveheart, Aliens, The Big Lebowski, Sixth Sense, Willy Wonka and an Indiana Jones movie (Temple of Doom, anyone?) should have featured, - but hey, I didn't vote for (and wasn't on the panel that edited) this Top 100 list. Like I said, ... popular vote - a vote by people... and one thing you can always rely on people to do..., is to be stupid
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Originally posted by OSiriS
Why people insist on calling Gladiator an epic is beyond me. Watch films like Ben Hur, Quo Vadis, Sparticus, The Ten Commandments. Gladiator attempted to emmulate the old MGM formula seen in such films, but I feel they failed to pull it off properly. Don't get me wrong I enjoyed it but itplainly borrowed heavily from Ben Hur and particularly Sparticus. The only improvement was in the coreography of the fight scenes.
Watch Peter Ustinov in the role of Nero in Quo Vadis and tell me that it is not one of the best acted roles you have ever seen.
As I have said, and CastorTroy backed me up on it, alot of these films are still fresh in peoples minds. I can guarantee that in 20 years most of these recent "greats" will be all but forgotten.
Hear hear OSi, my thoughts exactly. I can't believe people have missed how much Scott has actually taken straight from Spartacus plot-wise, or how much he's watered it down. Spartacus isn't just about fight scenes, wooden dialogue (the characters seriously look like marionettes with someone moving their lips, very unconvincing stuff) or a poorly written plot, it's far more complex than that. For one thing, it actually examines better than any other Hollywood film, the desperate struggle between the patricians and plebians of Rome that was the hallmark of that period of history.
As far as whether Gladiator's an epic or not, I would say no. I somehow feel an epic film would have more convincing characters, and a little bit more substance in between the clash of cymbals. I mean let's face it, while we call Quo Vadis, Spartacus and Ben Hur epic films, in each film there is a myriad of plot threads which are meticulously explored. Gladiator on the other hand, is a very linear film. It's plot is very thin on the ground, and it truly is hard to suspend belief. The dialogue (except that delivered by Ollie Reed, and to an extent, Phoenix's melodramatic peformance) seems dull and contrived when delivered by the actors, who seem to be doing it merely to provide information that moves the plot along. Now that really shouldn't suprise anyone- if you simply look at the quality of the actors involved. I challenge anyone to tell me that Crowe and Phoenix hold a candle to such legends as Olivier, Ustinov, Douglas, Curtis or Laughton (all in Spartacus). Ustinov won an Oscar for his role as an unscrupulous gladiator trainer (a watered down version of this character is basically Ollie Reed in Gladiator), and Olivier was unlucky not to win one as well for his stirring patriotic peformance as Marcus Crassus, the renowned patrician of Rome.
As OSi says, they attempt the MGM swords & sandals formula- they got the spectacle right, but the story, characters, actors and even the pace in parts was seriously off the mark.
I'm absolutely astonished that 12 Angry Men wasn't more highly rated, and that Leon failed to make an appearance. I didn't watch the whole thing, but I'm fairly sure Gattacca didn't feature either. I was on the whole, extremely pleased with the top 10, Star wars would be my pick for number one, the Godfather, Pulp fiction and Bladerunner are all also genre-defining films. Titanic doesn't belong in the Top 100 from a critical point of view, but this being a popular vote, I suppose we can be thankful it didn't clinch a top 10 spot :P
I understand Bard's dislike of the Godfather saga, I must confess I didn't fully understand it until I'd almost finished college. The most amazing thing about the Godfather is that it's a study of change. Much in the way Forrest Gump takes us through a man's life, the Godfather explores how changing times and changing circumstances chart the path of a man's (Al Pacino's) life. From a bright-eyed youngster determined not to take part in the family business, by the end of the second film, Pacino's pulled off an incredible transformation. It's one of those films you either love or hate I suppose
Occy0 -
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Interesting viewing... can't say I agree with it too much though...
There are certain films that are my personal favourites that I would expect to see high up in a list like this, and did. Taxi Driver, Star Wars (sad but true), Goodfellas, Pulp Fiction (have to admit it's my all time fave), Blade Runner. Oh what a sick list
There are others that I would consider incredible films, that didn't do too well in this list. Fight Club (am I the only person that was blown away by this??), Aliens, Clockwork Orange, a few more but I'm too tired to remember them, heh.
There's a whole lot of films in this list that are very very good, but shouldn't really be in the top 20 at all. This is where it shows that it's a Voting list, not decided by critics (who admittedly aren't always right). Gladiator (good, loved it, but will it stand the test of time? I can think of 10 films that are better, then again...), The Matrix (oh come on! I enjoyed it as much as anyone but #15!!!), Crouching Tiger (again... not top20 material).
Don't get me started on Titanic. What a POS. Awful story, awful acting, awful everythign. Cept the CG/fx of course. The Full Monty? Secrets and Lies? Four Weddings and a Funeral? All English, all ok-ish. Why are they in the list at all?
Blade and the Matrix are equal (I prefer Blade in some ways, and The Matrix in others), but neither deserves to be in the top20.0 -
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