Underage drinking

hoody · 31-10-2005 03:34PM

doesn't this go back to the lack of facilities for young people in this country?
fair enough we have the Gah and stuff but you have to be pretty decent to be still involved at ages 16 & 17. The drinking age is ridiculous, there's no miraculous maturing the night you turn 18. I've seen people of all ages act just as dumb as any underage person when they get a few beers in them.
It's not about age, it's about the whole attitude to drink in Ireland.
We drink to get drunk and laugh about it the next day. Never mind the underage thing, it's the entire country (well those that engage in heavy drinking) that needs to grow up.

And before you think I'm preaching from the moral high ground here, I certainly include myself amongst those that drink to get drunk.

Canis Lupus · 31-10-2005 04:01PM

When I was that age I had no problems drinking and getting ****faced. It's part of growing up.

Now I'm older I look down on kids rolling about in their own vomit.

But I've been there and done that as have my friends. So I feel I have no right to criticise underage drinking. Except when they start fighting cos that wasn't something I got involved in.

ferdi · 31-10-2005 04:14PM

of course its bad, but bad things happen all the time - life is messy - stop trying to sanitize everything.

kids break the law, get in trouble and drink (etc) and i wouldnt have it any other way. how else do you learn other than through your own mistakes.

stop trying to legislate for every non-utopian aspect of society. allow society to be dysfunctional.

CerebralCortex · 31-10-2005 04:19PM

I think the teen years are a poor time to start any drug use.
Think of the implications that the kind of behaviour in Irish society will have on an already poor health system. Drinking encourages a culture of self destruction and when your 16 or maybe even 19 (speaking from my experiance of course) you are barely self conscious to realise it.
IMHO any age is a wrong age but I'm sure no one will agree with that.
"Give me my drink. It is our right to destroy ourselfs" they cry.

ferdi · 31-10-2005 04:24PM

it may sound crazy but i believe people actually DO have a right to 'destroy' themselves.

CerebralCortex · 31-10-2005 04:43PM

I agree but at the same time if a person has no respsect for themselves then there not going to have any respect for anyone else and there is whole lot of selfrespectlessness in Ireland (look at all the overweight ppl).
Also do you think a 16 year old should be aloud destroy/disrespect himself/Herself? He/She is only sixteen.

Life of course is what you make it.

Dave! · 31-10-2005 04:46PM

CerebralCortex wrote:

I agree but at the same time if a person has no respsect for themselves then there not going to have any respect for anyone else and there is whole lot of selfrespectlessness in Ireland (look at all the overweight ppl).
Also do you think a 16 year old should be aloud destroy/disrespect himself/Herself? He/She is only sixteen.

Life of course is what you make it.

Drinking alcohol does not mean you have no respect for yourself... Maybe they just have different views on the world than you?

CerebralCortex · 31-10-2005 04:48PM

DaveMcG wrote:

Drinking alcohol does not mean you have no respect for yourself... Maybe they just have different views on the world than you?

I also agree. But when people intend to get drunk they say "Lets get locked" (I hate that phrase) they should really say "Lets get braindamaged".

Dave! · 31-10-2005 04:50PM

Ok, well you don't have to do that, so just let them kill themselves allll they want, and try not to be so self-righteous.

CerebralCortex · 31-10-2005 04:56PM

DaveMcG wrote:

Ok, well you don't have to do that, so just let them kill themselves allll they want, and try not to be so self-righteous.

Thanks for being so courteous and understanding.
Do you think I am self-righteous or that I want something better for a world full of problems?

Dave! · 31-10-2005 05:08PM

CerebralCortex wrote:

Thanks for being so courteous and understanding.
Do you think I am self-righteous or that I want something better for a world full of problems?

If I'm being rude, it's because you're making snide comments and making it seem like people who drink are in some way inferior to you.

I'm sure you have good intentions, but you seem to want nobody to drink (or, I gather, do any drugs), ever. Curtailing people's rights (yes, to destroy their own[ie. not your] body) is not the answer.

You may want to live a long long life, but some people want to enjoy their life in their own way, and if that means cutting off a few years from the end, so be it.

CerebralCortex · 31-10-2005 05:12PM

DaveMcG wrote:

If I'm being rude, it's because you're making snide comments and making it seem like people who drink are in some way inferior to you.

I'm sure you have good intentions, but you seem to want nobody to drink (or, I gather, do any drugs), ever. Curtailing people's rights (yes, to destroy their own[ie. not your] body) is not the answer.

You may want to live a long long life, but some people want to enjoy their life in their own way, and if that means cutting off a few years from the end, so be it.

I agree, but now your starting sound selfrigtheous.

Dave! · 31-10-2005 05:16PM

CerebralCortex wrote:

I agree, but now your starting sound selfrigtheous.

I'm just telling you the alternative to your way of life.

wheresthebeef · 31-10-2005 05:24PM

by rights alcohol should be banned completely. when looking at the benefits and disadvantages of the social use of alcohol, the disadvantages outweigh any mild benefits by a thousand fold. looking at the situation from a "greater good" perspective, alcohol has no part to play in a society.

just because it is socially acceptable now, and is integrated into our culture does not mean it should have been or should be.

Its a toxic substance which when ingested causes varying degree's of toxicity (poisoning) which moves from stages of euphoria and pleasure quickly into nausea, vomiting, and unconsciousness. Even in small quanities it destroys the tissues of the brain and liver. It is a contributory factor in our high suicide rate, teen pregancy, spread of sexually transmitted diseases etc....

ando · 31-10-2005 05:26PM

I dont have much of a problem with underage drinking, everyone did it, its all part of growing up

Canis Lupus · 31-10-2005 05:28PM

wheresthebeef wrote:

by rights alcohol should be banned completely. when looking at the benefits and disadvantages of the social use of alcohol, the disadvantages outweigh any mild benefits by a thousand fold. looking at the situation from a "greater good" perspective, alcohol has no part to play in a society.

just because it is socially acceptable now, and is integrated into our culture does not mean it should have been or should be.

Its a toxic substance which when ingested causes varying degree's of toxicity (poisoning) which moves from stages of euphoria and pleasure quickly into nausea, vomiting, and unconsciousness. Even in small quanities it destroys the tissues of the brain and liver. It is a contributory factor in our high suicide rate, teen pregancy, spread of sexually transmitted diseases etc....

It is also a contributory factor to having a good nite out.

How boring a world we would have if alcohol never existed.

It would be like... Germany... but minus the drink obviously. *Shudders*

ando · 31-10-2005 05:37PM

wheresthebeef wrote:

just because it is socially acceptable now, and is integrated into our culture does not mean it should have been or should be.

well it is effectively a drug afterall. I tend to agree though to a certain degree. Drink can give people a great time, but also the casualty wards are full on friday and saturday nights, fights plentyfull on the streets. I myself felt myself become very agressive last night for no apparant reason which I'm kinda supprised about thinking about it today... but seriously can you ever see drink being banned

CerebralCortex · 31-10-2005 05:44PM

ando wrote:

well it is effectively a drug afterall. I tend to agree though to a certain degree. Drink can give people a great time, but also the casualty wards are full on friday and saturday nights, fights plentyfull on the streets. I myself felt myself become very agressive last night for no apparant reason which I'm kinda supprised about thinking about it today... but seriously can you ever see drink being banned

No people are like babies unless you clean their **** up for them they'll wallow in it.

I'm not saying I want to do any cleaning by the way.

Canis Lupus · 31-10-2005 05:49PM

CerebralCortex wrote:

No people are like babies unless you clean their **** up for them they'll wallow in it.

I'm not saying I want to do any cleaning by the way.

Superiority complex alert.........

wheresthebeef · 31-10-2005 05:51PM

i'm not saying it ever will be banned. cos it wont.

rather, i am just pointing out how it should be banned, if you look at it logically. there is no logical reason to consume alcohol. nobody can possibly defend alcohol to the point where all its disadvantages become a secondary concern.

I enjoy alcohol myself.

but if it was to be only invented 2moro as a new product it would never be licensed for sale.
same goes for cigarettes.

CerebralCortex · 31-10-2005 05:51PM

Canis Lupus wrote:

Superiority complex alert.........

Oh you don't know the half of it. It isn't hard to be superior in Ireland though (funny really).

Le Rack · 31-10-2005 05:54PM

it depends how underage it is though, like I'm a couple months off 18 and only started going out in the past three weeks seriously, before we'd get some cider and drink in the park... never did it much though but now I'm going out to gigs and pub crawls and stuff, yes all in three weeks, and I really don't drink much at all, and we have right craic but you see some people who are younger again and they are off their skulls drunk and it's just disgusting.

ghostchant · 31-10-2005 06:05PM

People seem to be in such a hurry to grow up, and try to everything there is to do in life before they even hit 20. It's good to have something to look forward to you know, and not trying to have 'done it all' so soon!

stormkeeper · 31-10-2005 06:22PM

Maybe the approach the Netherlands takes is a good idea? Beers and the like at 16, and the harder stuff when you're 18 and over?

Sangre · 31-10-2005 06:25PM

ghostchant wrote:

People seem to be in such a hurry to grow up, and try to everything there is to do in life before they even hit 20. It's good to have something to look forward to you know, and not trying to have 'done it all' so soon!

And if you die before you're 20?

Dave! · 31-10-2005 06:26PM

What about 16 year olds being allowed drink in pubs, but the age staying 18 at off licences...?

ghostchant · 31-10-2005 06:29PM

Sangre wrote:

And if you die before you're 20?

You could die before you're 10. Doesn't mean you need to go out and get locked at 9 years of age then does it?

31-10-2005 07:02PM

DaveMcG wrote:

What about 16 year olds being allowed drink in pubs, but the age staying 18 at off licences...?

I've always thought that it should be 21 at off licenses, and 18 in pubs?

That's just me though.

Dooom · 31-10-2005 08:47PM

I've just turned 17, and have managed to buy alcohol various times in pubs. Off Licences tend to be more strict which is why I'd stick to a pub (never been asked for ID, I've also passed for 18 and above plenty of times without any ID).
Standard procedure is pick up some booze in a pub and head back to a mates house. Granted we get plastered off our faces sometimes if there's a party, but more likely we just sit around, have a few beers (corona!) or whatnot and have a laugh.

So you can put us in the "sensible underage drinker" category.

Although I do think that the age limit shouldn't be lowered, was walking through Kilkenny city on Friday night and saw far too many drunk kids, ranging from about 12-16. Was also challenged to a few fights, which I declined.

Someone already said that sensible 16/17 year old's having a few is alright, but when you start seeing 12 and 13 year olds who haven't a clue who they are, it's just..disgusting I guess. Can't think of another word.

wheresthebeef · 31-10-2005 08:51PM

i think any plans to lower the drinking age are completely and utterly wrong. under no circumstances should a child ever be allowed to purchase alcohol. and i am sorry guys but 16 is a child, just as much as 17 is. there is no distinction, once your under 18 you are a child.

i would be all for some kind of restrictions that further restrict how young people get alcohol, but denying adults aged 18, 19 and 20 the right to purchase alcohol in an off licence is a civil rights issue. i just can't see it happening.

So basically, Adults allowed to buy drink yes, children never.
They should criminalise the underage consumption of alcohol, rather than just the supply of.

Underage drinking

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