Teen Mum Sisters Get £30k

tinkerbell

Just read this on Sky News.

Just wondering what other people's views are on this. This is not an attack on the girls because of their situation, it is because they are blaming the schools for falling pregnant at the age of 12. Their mother is also too eager to shift the blame onto the schools as well, saying it is a lack of sex education.

Sex education is crap in schools, and they usually give sex ed to those in like sixth year, not to 12 year olds. Isn't it the responsibility of the PARENTS of the child to teach their children about sex education. Everyone always blames the teachers, whenever there is any problem, it is always the teachers that get blamed. Sex ed should be done properly in schools but at the end of the day, until this gets implemented, it's up to the parents to inform their children.

Do they expect teachers to raise their children next? Aaargh!

simu

Ultimately, it's the responsibility of the parents although it's desirable to have sex-ed in schools too. Disgraceful to see people shirking their responsibilities like that!

tinkerbell

Yup, the mother is just passing off the blame. It's the usual attitude of some parents - "my little darling", who blame everything on the school, when usually it is actually the parents that are to blame.

Dizzyblabla

But in fairness, I don't think my mother would have thought of giving me sex education at the age of 12?? maybe at 15/16, but 12? like that's just crazy!!

Sangre

Crazy? What are you like? Should that be Ditzyblabla?

You should get sex ed when you've started puberty, regardless of what age that is. You have a right to know what is happening to you body.

DublinWriter

Dizzyblabla wrote:

But in fairness, I don't think my mother would have thought of giving me sex education at the age of 12?? maybe at 15/16, but 12? like that's just crazy!!

Why not? I remember in 1982 our (brave!) primary school teacher gave us sex-ed lessons and there were nearly parents at the gates with burning torches. It wasn't on the official circumulum.

Quantum

Sangre wrote:

Crazy? What are you like? Should that be Ditzyblabla?

You should get sex ed when you've started puberty, regardless of what age that is. You have a right to know what is happening to you body.

Exactly. My son got sex ed from me when he was 6.

This mother is just another example of irresponsible, selfish, ignorant and indifferent people who have children and then shrug theri shoulders to their own responsibilities. She should have to contribute financially to the costs of this debacle !

monkeyfudge

When we got sex education in school there were already at least 5 people who were parents in my class.

It certainly needs to be thought earlier. I'm pretty sure South Park did a great episode about this.

athena 2000

Dizzyblabla wrote:

But in fairness, I don't think my mother would have thought of giving me sex education at the age of 12?? maybe at 15/16, but 12? like that's just crazy!!

Does this mean that you didn't know what was going to happen with your body by age 12 right before puberty began? Someone explain what is included in sex education as taught in Ireland, please.

I don't understand why people have children and then refuse to parent them. Children aren't pets.
It does seem like teachers are expected to do far too much.

ArthurDent

athena 2000 wrote:

Does this mean that you didn't know what was going to happen with your body by age 12 right before puberty began? Someone explain what is included in sex education as taught in Ireland, please.

I don't understand why people have children and then refuse to parent them. Children aren't pets.
It does seem like teachers are expected to do far too much.

Only aware of primary education in this area - there is a SPHE programme that covers sexuality, personal health etc - fairly rudimentary info on puberty and conception and birth, no info on contraception etc and each school is allowed develop its own policy in accordance with their ethos and parents have an opt out right

I agreee with you being a parent means you have to parent - and you have to take the responsibility on and not abdicate it to anyone else.

ArthurDent

Forgot to add - my sex education in secondary convent (yeah I know ignore the user name, I'm a girly), was the head nun showing us the sanitary towel dispenser in the toilets and telling us we got periods as a punishment for Eve's misbihaviour in the Garden of Eden :rolleyes:

We did have a student teachr in third year that tried to give us info on natural family planning methods, but funnily enough she didn't get a permenant job afterwards!

c - 13

Now maybe i'm out of sync with the times here but isnt 12 seriously young to be having sex anyway ?

I would have been 12 around the time the school gave us sex ed alright. It varies from place to place. Ultimately though I belive that its the parents responsibility to educate the child on this and not to leave it to the school.

the_syco

c - 13 wrote:

Now maybe i'm out of sync with the times here but isnt 12 seriously young to be having sex anyway ?

And 9 is too young to start drinking. But in this day and age, it happens.

=-=

Sky News wrote:

who is in a secret relationship with the baby's 38-year-old Asian father

What age is "legal" over there?

Iago

This is an interesting question, which I need to address on a very personal level soon enough.

When I was 15 I got my girlfriend of the time pregnant, my sex ed up to that point had consisted of talk from my group of friends and the occasional "borrowed" adult film that we would watch while one of us had a free house...hardly a true reflection of the world around me at the time.

I know that my parents didn't really speak to me about sex, but I thnk they honestly believed that I wasn't up to anything. After all it was my first girlfriend, I was never out after 9-10 O'clock and where would I find the time and opportunity? Parents are very naive aren't they??

Anyway my son will be 12 this summer, and while he still makes a song and dance about hating girls I am starting to wonder when I should chat with him. It's a catch 22 situation, if he is still truly at the stage where he has no interest in girls, then will talking to him set his mind on a path to start experiencing these things I talk about? On the other hand if I don't talk to him and then he gets himself in trouble I won't forgive myself.

I think I'm going to talk to him at some stage this year, he has had basic sex ed in school (so he's already ahead of me there) and I suppose I'll be looking to fill in any gaps or answer any questions he might have, but it's a more daunting idea than you might think.

In the case specified by the OP, I think it shows an amazing lack of support and care from the parents, I mean letting 13 year old boy spend the night with your 11 year old daughter. Not to mention an 18 year old daughter who gave birth at 16 and has had an abortion and two miscarraiges. I just can't fathom it to be honest. Anybody can make an error of judgement and live with the consequences, but to continually make the same error, and then allow others to repeat your mistakes?? It boggles the mind.

Having a child at any time of your life is a wonderful and heart moving experience, but while I wouldn't change anything about my son, I think it would have been better for him and for me if it had happened when I was more mature and experienced.

Lemming

I find it laughable that they're blaming the school. How about standing up and taking responsibility for their actions. The mother and daughters equally. It was teh daughters that opened their legs willingly. Whatever about the 16 year old with two miscarriages and an abortion, the other two would have gotten some "education" from their older sister's chain-of-events.

And in any case, erm ... statuatory rape anyone? At the very least for all three girls? Added to the fact the picture I saw ina paper yesterday had this beaming mother with them. Her daughters lives are effectively "over". They've not even lived yet and they've been given a grave responsibility. Another human life, and I sincerely doubt they're mentally equipped for that.

It's the daughters kids that I feel sorry for.

the_syco

Iago wrote:

Anyway my son will be 12 this summer, and while he still makes a song and dance about hating girls I am starting to wonder when I should chat with him.

Think of what your mind was like at that age, when anything to do with women was prissy/gay/"not macho". Tell him, as once the "leader", or the "popular" guy gets a girl, then they'll all(rest of the class/club/etc) try to get one. After that, they'll brag about exploits they never had... and you know the rest.

Shabadu

There are so many things wrong with this story. In the 'shouldn't happen' rather than 'innaccurate' way. I completely agree that children shoud have sex ed from pretty much the minute they become curious about their own bodies. Just the basic biological differences from the age of maybe 6 on, and maybe bringing some of the emotional side into it from 11 or so.

What really disturbs me is the Mother palming off the blame. While hormones play a large part in the girls randyness, (for want of a better word,) low self-esteem is one of the key factors in sexual activity at a young age. Self-esteem that daughters get directly from their parents. As a parent, you indirectly teach your child how to think and feel about themselves, a lot of the time on a subconcious level.

Also, as lemming said, statuatory rape ahoy.

Seraphina

stupid young mothers breed stupid young mothers tbh.
i'd say about 90% of teenage girls i see pregnant and having kids had a mother who was a teenage mum too. its a cycle of idiocy.
of course there are lots of sensible people and mistakes happen, but its all down to what you learn from your parents, and they clearly didn't learn too well

simu

The son's called T-jay. :eek:

I can see that people are reluctant to criticise teen mothers after the stigma they faced in the past but allowing 12 year olds to have kids is child abuse. Also, I wonder who the legal guardians of the babies are - surely kids can't be legal guardians?

Nevyn

With some girls now having their first period at the age of 9,
there is a huge lack of respect shown to these very young women, by not
teaching them about how thier body functions.
They also have at that age urges and unless they are tought to respect themsleves and the consequences they will simply do what feels good.

Yes thier mother should have done a better job, but the fact that this is still seen as acceptible is horrendus. Each of the fathers should have thier wages
garinished.

Age of consent in the UK is 16.

http://www.ageofconsent.com/unitedkingdom.htm

Quantum

simu wrote:

... allowing 12 year olds to have kids is child abuse. Also, I wonder who the legal guardians of the babies are - surely kids can't be legal guardians?

I believe that a parent who shows a pattern of indifference to the sexual behaviour of her underage children should be charged with facilitating the rape and abuse of that child.

tinkerbell

Yup definitely. There's something seriously wrong with that mother's parenting if all three of her girls had children at the ages of 12, 14 and 16! A girl getting pregnant at 12 is just wrong on so many levels, how could a 12 year old even get into that situation!? If there was proper parenting going on, they wouldn't be having sex at such young ages, it's sick to be honest :eek:

When I was 12, jees I didn't even know what a boy was! I was totally innocent, still playing with my Polly Pockets. I remember when I was 15 and hearing about a girl in my class who had done it with some lad, god I was horrified at the thought!

Sleepy

How she can have the nerve to go to the media and blame the school for her complete lack of parenting skills is mind-boggling. She's just another example of the "everything's society's fault, I'm not to blame for anything" gobsheen culture we live in these days.

RasTa

Its only 30g's between the three of them, not enough to live on for 3 kids with kids

RuggieBear

30k sterling and no rent is very managable

Sleepy

RasTa wrote:

Its only 30g's between the three of them, not enough to live on for 3 kids with kids

RasTa, it may be 'only' 30k, but it's 30k of taxpayers money that the state wouldn't have to waste if that woman knew what it meant to be a mother.

Altheus

I remember it was cold eving in 4th class that we got to see the 'miracle' of birth.

My first glimpse of what goes on between a womans legs followed by blood, gore and umbilical...

I would have had it in 4th class, and I'm surely I would have thought it nesscessary for women to have it around this age, dependant on their period?

simu

Altheus wrote:

I remember it was cold eving in 4th class that we got to see the 'miracle' of birth.

My first glimpse of what goes on between a womans legs followed by blood, gore and umbilical...

Gawd, no need to show all the gore all the same! I still haven't and don't intend to!

I would have had it in 4th class, and I'm surely I would have thought it nesscessary for women to have it around this age, dependant on their period?

What does this sentence mean?

8bi1ctzegfouva

did anyone else think the fact that a 38 year old asian man having a child with a child is a bit sick??

all three are slappers, the mother is a leech. they should not be getting money for not keeping their legs' closed.

I have no sympathy for them.

As for blaming lack of sex ed for her daughters being slappers, i don't think i even need to comment on that.
i didn't and the rest of my school didn't get it till we were lik 16, and no one got pregnant or made somone pregnant, so that excuse is the worst i have ever heard.

8bi1ctzegfouva

ArthurDent wrote:

the head nun showing us the sanitary towel dispenser in the toilets and telling us we got periods as a punishment for Eve's misbihaviour in the Garden of Eden :rolleyes:

Jesus, you gotta love those fukin nuns.

---

the_syco wrote:

And 9 is too young to start drinking. But in this day and age, it happens.

who the **** drinks at 9???

---

PENIS CLOSES ROAD!!!!

Maybe if the girls had seen this penis being blown up by the bomb squad then mayber they might have kept the legs closed.


http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30000-13355259,00.html

Quantum

Benson Fancy Rattan wrote:

who the **** drinks at 9???

Quick true story: Last week in Kilbogget park, Cabinteely. I was on a walk and encountered a small crowd. 9 year old unconscious on ground with two impact marks on his forehead and chin. Turned out to be unconscious due to half a bottle of vodka (ambulance then arrived). Friends swore they hadn't a clue. Father arrived and didn't even bend down to say hello to him. Later two local ladies passed us further down the path and commented "who can watch them all the time.. we can't keep them on chains .." I said... "**** that, it's the parents JOB to watch them and keep them safe !" You should have seen the blank look of puzzlement.

nesf

Benson Fancy Rattan wrote:

who the **** drinks at 9???

Hi, meet reality. Reality the Detective. I see that you two haven't met.

eth0_

Why on EARTH has that 38 year old man not been charged with rape? The girl was 12 when she gave birth, and was possible 11 years old when he had sex with her!

As for the mother of the three girls...what a total and utter scumbag. She's such a bad mother than her teenage daughter has had an abortion and two miscarriages, and it never crossed her mind to speak to her other kids about it?

One of the three girls said she's left school with no qualifications but 'It doesn't matter anyway, i'm not bothered with school, I just want to have kids. I'm on the waiting list for a council flat, I can't wait!'.

It needs to be beaten into these types of people that you can't live like this! Getting knocked up by different men isn't a role in life! Being a single (and underage) mother should not entitle you to a free flat and free money. The social welfare system in the UK practically encourages young girls to get knocked up at an early age.

8bi1ctzegfouva

um maybe its just me, but none of my mates were drinking at 9.
At age 9, we were playing with action man and being kids.

maybe in deprived areas kids aged 9 are drinking, but it is by no means the norm, and if you think it is, then you have a warped sense of reality.

FX Meister

Whata bunch of scroungey knackers. One of them had 2 miscarriages and an abortion before she then had a child, how can you blame that on the school? Surely the mother could have sat the other two down when the first one got up the duffer. And the 16 year old, her kids father is 38, dirty trollop. And as for naming you kid T Jay, she should be put in prison for that one. I'm sure they are in the burberry clothes already and are sporting piercings as many knacker babies do.

seamus

eth0_ wrote:

Why on EARTH has that 38 year old man not been charged with rape? The girl was 12 when she gave birth, and was possible 11 years old when he had sex with her!

As for the mother of the three girls...what a total and utter scumbag. She's such a bad mother than her teenage daughter has had an abortion and two miscarriages, and it never crossed her mind to speak to her other kids about it?

One of the three girls said she's left school with no qualifications but 'It doesn't matter anyway, i'm not bothered with school, I just want to have kids. I'm on the waiting list for a council flat, I can't wait!'.

It needs to be beaten into these types of people that you can't live like this! Getting knocked up by different men isn't a role in life! Being a single (and underage) mother should not entitle you to a free flat and free money. The social welfare system in the UK practically encourages young girls to get knocked up at an early age.

This is the whole reason that no matter how upper-class an area, eventually it will fill with scum and turn into a ****hole. Scumbags procreate faster. Start taxing children, then we'll see how far they get.

nesf

Benson Fancy Rattan wrote:

maybe in deprived areas kids aged 9 are drinking,

Eh. I've seen it happen in many types of areas, some quite nice actually. I know that I "sneaked" a few drinks when I was that age. Nothing too big, but was curious and all that. It's not a big jump from that to a kid getting their hands on a few can's and going somewhere with a few friends to try it out.

And when I came home smelling of drink my dad "straightened" me on the matter and I didn't feel inclined to do it again until I was much older.

And my background could not be considered deprived or dissadvantaged by any stretch of the imagination. I grew up in a normal middle class family etc.

Benson Fancy Rattan wrote:

but it is by no means the norm, and if you think it is, then you have a warped sense of reality.

No one said it was the norm, but it does happen. Kids are rebellious and curious by nature. They will, if not watched, do some incredibly stupid things. I know I did when I was young.


It's just that some people have this whole "shock" at the kids involved ages. I got a "talk" when I was 10, and another at 12 etc. Mostly just about pregnancy and how easy it was to get a girl pregnant. Then again, sex under the age of 16 wasn't exactly de rigure where I came from. A girl in my class did get pregnant at 13 though, so I had few illusions growing up.

eth0_

When I snuck a drink at 9 years old it was probably from my parents' drinks cabinet...I wasn't knacker drinking down the park and smoking hash like kids are these days.

I'm only 24 and I often look at kids today and wonder WTF has gone wrong in the space of 10 years.

RuggieBear

i didn't have my first drink till i was 16 years old. It's absolutely crazy that kids are drinking so early these days....

as for having sex at 12....christ....i still thought i'd catch girlie disease if i even talked to a girl, when i was 12

Quantum

Benson Fancy Rattan wrote:

um maybe its just me, but none of my mates were drinking at 9.
At age 9, we were playing with action man and being kids.

I agree, and that's what the vast majority of kids of nine are doing.

maybe in deprived areas kids aged 9 are drinking, but it is by no means the norm, and if you think it is, then you have a warped sense of reality.

I really don't see this. I see no correlation between deprivation and young drinking.

I do see a correlation between incompetent, indifferent, lazy, self indulgent parents and underage abuse of alcohol.

My Story above was in Kilbogget park in Cabineteely where is no deprivation whatsoever. It's nothing to do with 'society', it has to do with parents who need to be held responsible for their actions and for facilitating what essentially is child abuse.

Quantum

RuggieBear wrote:

i didn't have my first drink till i was 16 years old. It's absolutely crazy that kids are drinking so early these days....

I think we should distinguish between abuse of alcohol and simply having a drink at some stage. My son has had a drink of wine or even a few slugs of beer from time to time since he was 7 or 8 and this is something we have always done in my family going back decades. It does away with the mystique and creates a healthy attitude and a respect toward alcohol.

RuggieBear

Quantum wrote:

I think we should distinguish between abuse of alcohol and simply having a drink at some stage. My son has had a drink of wine or even a few slugs of beer from time to time since he was 7 or 8 and this is something we have always done in my family going back decades. It does away with the mystique and creates a healthy attitude and a respect toward alcohol.

ditto...my parents always allowed me to have a sip or two of wine or beer but i meant actually drink a whole pint or enough to get intoxicated

tinkerbell

Ultimately, it's the parents responsibility what their children get up to.

If a child as young as say nine goes off knacker drinking, then surely there is something wrong with the parenting to let their kid get into the situation where he has gone off with his mates unsupervised at nine years of age.

As for those three sisters on that Sky News article, my god - they are some slappers. Where did it say that one of 'em had two miscarriages, coz I didn't see that on the article I linked to? Unless I have gone blind? I mean in all fairness, what the hell was the mother thinking? She just let her 12 year old / whoever off to shag the town!

It's obvious that she should have had a talk with her girls when the first one got up the duff. But no! She waits til all three have a kid of their own, and so they can leech off the government. As someone said here - the government is giving incentives for teenage girls having babies by letting them draw off taxpayers money.

I ain't working yet, but I will be in the next few months - nearly finished uni now. I have slaved through uni, and to think that the money I pay on tax will be going to the likes of those stupid idiotic girls is just maddening! The likes of us work hard to earn a living whereas the likes of them - ah sure we'll just drop out of school, spread the aul legs, have fifty babies by the time we're 18, and we'll get loads of free stuff from tax payer's money - that is the attitude that those three and their mother have given off.

And that "mystery" 38 year old man - that's feckin sick tbh, he's a down and out pedo, it's disgusting, no wonder he's remained a mystery - sure if he wasn't, he'd be up in court for child abuse.

Just re-read the article and couldn't believe this:

"I blame the schools - sex education for young girls should be better. They have all ruined their lives because they are far too young to have children."

Ha! Well maybe you should have been a responsible parent and accepted your duties as a parent, and they wouldn't have gotten pregnant in the first place! No **** that they are far too young to have children - tiz mostly the mother's fault! What kind of an idiot is she?

Nevyn

Well it would cost a lot less to make all contraception free and all contraception related doctors visits free.

simu

They should give those babies up for adoption too otherwise it won't be long until there's a 4th generation!

Quantum

Benson Fancy Rattan wrote:

all three are slappers, the mother is a leech.

I have no sympathy for them.

I have to jump in here . . We have to think what it is we are saying.... I think we would be very very wrong to call a 12 year old and a 14 year old slappers... they are barely children, and can hardly be labelled or blamed when they grow up with such a dysfunctional and corrupt mother.

If we are angry - and we are (rightly)- we have to look at who is to blame. The blame lies 100% on the mother. A 12 year old girl is a victim, yes a REAL victim, as is the 14 year old and we should focus on that and prosecute the mother for facilitating rape and abuse.

8bi1ctzegfouva

you cannot blame the mother solely.
sure she probably screwed her kids up by the way she raised them. but she did not force her 3 daughters to have sex.

the daughters did it of their own free will(well hopefully so). even if you were brought up by the most ****ed up parents ever, you would know that having sex at such a young age, with much older men is a bad idea.

eth0_

Thaed wrote:

Well it would cost a lot less to make all contraception free and all contraception related doctors visits free.

That's a silly suggestion. Contraception and doctors visits are free in the UK and they have one of the highest rates of teen pregnancy in the WORLD!

The fact is kids under 16 shouldn't be having sex. Not only is it against the law but you're probably not clued up or emotionally ready for it. A *lot* of teenagers don't use condoms because they have a 'it won't happen to me' attitude when it comes to pregnany or STD's, not because they can't afford a pack of condoms!

simu

Benson Fancy Rattan wrote:

the daughters did it of their own free will(well hopefully so). even if you were brought up by the most ****ed up parents ever, you would know that having sex at such a young age, with much older men is a bad idea.

Free will doesn't matter - if you are under the age of consent, you are considered to be too young to be able to decide whether to have sex or not. In other societies, it might be normal for people to get married in their early teens but in the UK, having sex with an underager is rape, no matter how willing the underager appears to be.

I disagree with calling these girls slappers - no one should ever be called a slapper because people's sex lives are their own business and in this case, such name-calling is even more unfair because whether they realise it or not, these girls have been abused.

nesf

simu wrote:

Free will doesn't matter - if you are under the age of consent, you are considered to be too young to be able to decide whether to have sex or not. In other societies, it might be normal for people to get married in their early teens but in the UK, having sex with an underager is rape, no matter how willing the underager appears to be.

Yeah, people seem to get statutory rape and "regular" rape confused.

In statutory rape both parties can be more than willing, it doesn't matter. It's an age thing. They should really call it a different name so that people don't get so confused on the issue. People can be sued for statutory rape against the will of the person who was "raped" (in theory anyways).

Whether or not the state has a right to decide what age is legal is debatable. But it varies hugely from country to country.

Ages I've heard (not 100% sure about this, will look it up later) vary from 12 to 21.

nesf

eth0_ wrote:

The fact is kids under 16 shouldn't be having sex. Not only is it against the law but you're probably not clued up or emotionally ready for it. A *lot* of teenagers don't use condoms because they have a 'it won't happen to me' attitude when it comes to pregnany or STD's, not because they can't afford a pack of condoms!

Well, everyone knows it's impossible to get pregnant on your first time.