Ebdons behaviour

padser

Just wondering what people think of Peter Ebdons behaviour last night? Personally i think his tactics in going out to deliberately annoy, wind up and antogonise ROS have no place in Snookers showplace event. It shows a complete lack of respect for the sport and for his opponent to act like that. I would love to see ebdon kicked out of the tournament for unsporting behaviour and his final place given to Murphy or his semi final place given to O sullivan.

bonzai bob

what did he do?

Lafortezza

What exactly did he do to annoy Ronnie? Didn't they have a run in a while back too?

Jackz

Hey m8 I was just submitting my own Thread when yours was shown! It was bollocks! It was obvious the constant white ball cleanning was also not required.

Firewalkwithme

padser wrote:

Just wondering what people think of Peter Ebdons behaviour last night? Personally i think his tactics in going out to deliberately annoy, wind up and antogonise ROS have no place in Snookers showplace event. It shows a complete lack of respect for the sport and for his opponent to act like that. I would love to see ebdon kicked out of the tournament for unsporting behaviour and his final place given to Murphy or his semi final place given to O sullivan.

Everything you just said is complete rubbish. He didn't set out to deliberately put Ronnie off his game. Anyone who watches snooker will be familiar with Ebdons style of play, it's slow and it's not pretty but it is effective. Besides, even if he did it deliberately then surely it was a good tactic since he won? What do you suggest he does next time he faces Ronnie? Play fast so Ronnie doesn't get thrown off his game and lose? If you watched the interview with Ebdon after the game you would have seen how upset he was at the suggestion that gamesmanship had come into play in the match. Ebdon is a grinder - long matches suit him perfectly and personally I hope he goes on to win his second world title. You can be certain that he wants it more than Ronnie does, he really didn't seem to care that he had been beaten. His fans, yourself included are more upset about his exit than he is but maybe you need to stop blaming Ebdon and take a closer look at Ronnie. Let's face it, the guy is not all there.

Jackz

He took along time over each shot way more time than necessary. When he came to the table the shot to take would be obvious but he would take ages looking and walking around the table. slowly chalking his cue then, then down on the ball forward and back, forward and back with cue then after i think over 5 mins (which is all long ass time in snooker) he would pot the first ball he looked at. I know your gonna say he won the ****in match maybe ronnie should have been taking that time over each shot and he would of one, but it was taking the piss and clear that he was doing it to piss off Ronnie. See the f#@$ing head on Ebdon when the referee and Ronnie both said it wasn't a touching ball at one point.

LegacyUser

I personally thought it was out of order. O'Sullivan was so dominant that Ebdon obviously knew he had to do something to throw him off, which was to slow the game down. In fairness to O'Sullivan he never complained afterwards and gave fair dues to Ebdon. The other side of the argument is that as a professional, O'Sullivan should be able to adapt his game to suit the opponent, but what Ebdon was doing seemed to be OTT. It's like playing a defensive formation in soccer when you're playing against a high scoring attacking team.

Personally I hate to see stuff like that in any sport. I guess I'm a bit of an idealist, but gamesmanship like that is proof of a lack of ability. I describe it as "small-dick-syndrome"; basically you know you aren't better based on ability and talent, so you have to find alternative tactics to win. You see it in GAA when teams will always foul an opposing player in posession when he's up in his own half, thus turning 100% into 50/50 possession when he takes the free.

Firewalkwithme

There is nothing in the rules that says a player has a certain amount of time to take a shot. Ebdon played carefully because of the huge stakes and his patience was rewarded. Ronnie can go back to crying in the bath now.

Ham Slicer

I think Ebdon played a brilliant tactical game. Whether he intentionally slowed that much is debatable. I can't see a problem with having the cue ball cleaned so often as every shot was a vital shot from Ebdons point of view.

Anyway, I think O'Sullivan started the mind games last night when he refused to conceed the first frame when about 70 points behind. He was also very disrespectful to Ebdon when asking an audience member for the time and laughing behind Ebdons back.

Well the joke is on O'Sullivan.

I hope Ebdon gets knocked out in the semi and we see a free flowing final Murphy v Stevens. Murphy to win.

aoa321

"take a closer look at Ronnie. Let's face it, the guy is not all there"

To me it looked as if neither of them were all there, it was strangely compelling stuff though wasn't it?

The problem is if everyone played like Ebdon I don't think anybody would watch snooker. To me he seems like a bizarre character, apparently on a BBC radio interview this morning the said he doesn't like watching snooker but he'd go anywhere to watch Ronnie.

what does that mean? a prospective world champion doesn't even like watching snooker ? bizarre ! like I say, if all snooker players played like that and had that attitude there would be no snooker - it's like "i'm doing me job, I hate it, but I need the money and if you want to pay to see me doing it thats your business"

have all these sports stars lost it or something? they seem to be just turning sports into a business rather than an enjoyable escape

cichlid child

He was spot on to do what he did. He is out there out to beat ronnie not play the way every one thinks he should.i am sure it annoys orther players that ronnie flies around the table and when they take their time and miss.he has a wife and 4 kids to support.ronnie said after the game he didn,t care if he won or lost it just shows peter wanted it more

bonzai bob

well if i went to play snooker with friends, i don't want to stand there and watch them play, i want to play myself. It's probably the same in ebdons case

Firewalkwithme

aoa321 wrote:

The problem is if everyone played like Ebdon I don't think anybody would watch snooker.

Yes but isn't it interesting to see what happens when contrasting styles clash?

Ronnie might look like he could blow away any other player but he clearly not yet in the league of Davis or Hendry because he lacks the mental strength to battle through tough matches all the time. If things don't go his way all the time his game falls apart dramatically.

By the way, I was watching the game last night with my dog, a hyperactive Dalmation. When Ebdon was on the table the dog was strangely calm but he got a bit agitated every time Ronnie was on.

BogOak

i'm a huge ronnie fan and i absolutely hate ebdon. normally i can't watch two minutes of him the way he takes so long and always gets the white cleaned. but in this case i thought it was brilliant. i would have loved if ronnie had just kept his head together and beat him but it was the most entertaining snooker match i've seen in years. as john parrot said it was up to ronnie to say something to the ref and he didn't. i definitely care more than ronnie that he lost and that's the annoying thing about being a fan of his. i can totally understand ebdon's other comments as well. ronnie is the only player i'd pay to watch.

padser

It is simply not true to say that ebdons style of play is slow. it is prehaps deliberate, but it is no where near as slow as he played last night. Also having the white ball cleaned 30 times is a deliberate and blantent attempt to put ronnie off his game. This is not the first time either that he has displayed questionable behaviour. 2001 vs S Lee was quite bad as well. And if i remember his play in that game he was absolutely flying around the table so obviously yesterday was not his normal style of play

padser

also when you said his fans myself included are just annoyed at ronnies exit u might have forgotten i suggested kicking ebdon out and giving murphy a by to the final. I actaully think ronnie is not blameless either, playing on with 9 snookers required isnt great either

Firewalkwithme

padser - you didn't have money on Ronnie by any chance did you?

BaZmO*

Ham Slicer wrote:

Anyway, I think O'Sullivan started the mind games last night when he refused to conceed the first frame when about 70 points behind. He was also very disrespectful to Ebdon when asking an audience member for the time and laughing behind Ebdons back

Did ROS not do that in response to Ebdon's five and a half minute break of 12 and his three and a half minutes to play a safety shot?

I really didn't agree with Ebdon's tatics (bad gamesmanship tbh and something that happens in darts a lot!) but it really was up to Ronnie to be mentally stronger than he was and to not let it get under his skin so much.

I think ROS is a fantastic player but he really needs to sort his head out. Did you see the big scrape he left on his head? :eek:

B.

DoctorEdgeWild

Ronnie is wothout a doubt the most talented snooker player playing the game today. Arguably the most talented ever. He has once again proven however, that he lacks the mental toughness to be considered a true great of the game. He is your classic flawed hero which is why he is so popular.

I think Ebdon was deliberately trying to put him off but not in a way that was illegal by the rules of snooker. Ronnie was very disrespectful, standing on Ebdons chair, asking the crowd for the time and getting up to see that touching ball just to wind up Ebdon and amuse the crowd.

I think that Ebdon was a deserved winner and lets not forget that for all the time he took, he still had to put the balls in the pockets.

Guru Maith Agut

Alright here's the way I see it; RO'S is a fast player (common knowledge) but he has to be able to adapt his game mentally to be able to keep focus when playing a slow player (and personally I believe him to be a sheer genius with a cue in his hand, all criticism aside. FACT!). The big problem with that match last night is that PE had to slow the game down to put Ronnie out of his stride because he was running away with the match at 8-2. They have played each other 26 times before last night and Ronnie won 16 of those encounters to Ebdons 10. But because of Peter slowing down his game (and in fairness, 5 mins 20 secs for a break of twelve is a farce) the poor chap lost the plot himself completely because after spending what seemed like an eternity on some shots he kept missing pots. He therefore spoiled the whole game for both players and the crowd watching. It worked in his favour but I can promise you that neither player would wish to play in such a dour affair if both were potting on song. I have played snooker for 19 years now on and off and I can honestly tell you that Ebdon deliberately slowed his play down to affect O'Sullivans mental attitude. I don't give a sh1t what he swears to after the game in front of the cameras. He lies and has done it before on more than one occasion and its not cos he can play better at a slower pace because snooker is a flowing game as has been proved over the years. You slow down too much and you break your own rythym. Anyone who plays seriously will know this is the case.
The game of snooker needs talent like O'Sullivan or it will die a death, so no matter how how mentally unstable ROS is he must be guided back into the arena again soon or all will be lost. Just look back at the era of Higgins and White and remember how well snooker was televised and watched then.

DoctorEdgeWild

I understand your post and you make some good points but in all fairness, you cant possibly know what happens inside Ebdon's head whether you have been playing snooker for 19 years or 90. For what its worth I believe he deliberatel slowed down to get his game on track AND to disrupt Ronnie's.

I agree that snooker needs Ronnie. I'm sure that his matches are the highest rating as far as TV goes. However, you can only help those who want to be helped. It's down to him to sort his head out and now that every other player on the tour knows a way to disrupt Ronnie's game, he needs to overcome the problem more than ever.

opr

aoa321 wrote:

The problem is if everyone played like Ebdon I don't think anybody would watch snooker.

Great point and i think its true. If every player took as much time as Ebdon did last night no one would watch snooker.

Is speed not something which contributes to you being a good snooker player. You often hear it being said that he has a great snooker brain because a player can see and play a shot so quickly.
Would we all think that Ronnie was one of the greatest players to have picked up a cue if he was a slow player. We all remember Ronnie's 147 but it was the speed at which it was complied that makes it stand out from others.

IMO - Ebdon is an average snooker player who makes up for a lack of all round snooker talent in other areas - these were seen last night.

DoctorEdgeWild

I think we are all pretty much Ronne fans and I know that I'll watch one of his matches over anyone else that may be playing.

The only thing is that Snooker is not there to entertain, it is a by product of the sport. The most important people are the players.

Its similar in football where the Americans tried to eliminate draws when they hosted the World Cup in 94. Its not how entertaining it is to us as viewers although I do of course accept that without us watching and being entertained, the prize money would not be so much.

weemcd

Absolutely fascinating game, I really regret not having a digital box so I could have followed the whole game. Everything about the game was bizarre, from Ronnie’s erratic behaviour- standing on the chair, asking for the time and constantly checking the sore etc. Of course Ebdon's game was also fascinating to watch, it was amazing to see how O'Sullivan completely lost his composure, missing shots that you would expect him to pot with little or no effort, clawing at his own face, occasionally stifling laughter or lying back in his seat dejected. Then watching the post game interviews, Ebdon looked as distraught as O’Sullivan did, almost reduced to tears imo. Cut to Ronnie’s press conference and he is talking about taking a year out! The whole event had me glued to the television and it was agonising when the BBC coverage stopped.

All I can say is that if Ronnie snooker is loosing it’s brightest and most entertaining star, who has the talent and a fascinating personality. God help Peter Ebdon if Ronnie O’Sullivan quits the game, because weather it’s his fault or not, the public will never forgive him.

eirebhoy

Ebdon was way out of order last night. If it all boiled down to slow play I wouldn't comment on it but what really was the final straw was pretending he thought the ball was touching.

For those that didn't see it. Ronnie rolled the cue ball up to a couple of reds and it looked like it was touching from the TV screens. The ref had a look and didn't say anything so it obviously wasn't touching. Ebdon then asked the ref to check it again and the ref said it wasn't touching. Ebdon wouldn't give in and he kept checking. He was moving his head around and putting his hand about 2 feet away from the ball, ref's usually put their hand just over the ball to block the light. Ronnie then got out of his seat and had a look. After a second he said there's a gap. Ronnie then made a joke about nudging the table. Ebdon looked again and then just took his shot.

He was lying in his interview, I am 110% sure about that. It wasn't the pressure that made him slow down to 5 1/2 minutes for a 12 break. I mean come on. He must be the slowest person (in the head) on earth if he can't decide whether to pot a pink in the middle pocket or eh, play safe. He was messing with Ronnie's head and it is riduculous if we accept that in this sport. Diving and time wasting isn't accepted in football and unsportmanship shouldn't be welcome in snooker.

Even the crowd were reluctant to clap Ebdon's shots at the end. I was switching channels when it looked like he was going to make a decent break.

As I said, it was the touching ball incident that made me realise that Ebdon was trying to mess with Ronnie and while last night was interesting because it was conterversial. If Ebdon keeps this up he won't have many fans. Would you pay £40 to see him play?

BogOak

if ronnie quits it'll be nothing to do with that game. sure he says he's going to quit or take time out in every interview he does. to the person who said ronnie will never be a great because of his temperament i totally disagree. he will be remembered as the best ever. the stats will say hendry but the word of mouth passed down will be all about ronnie. most people agree he's a genius. i've never heard anyone apply that description to hendry.

opr

BogOak wrote:

if ronnie quits it'll be nothing to do with that game. sure he says he's going to quit or take time out in every interview he does. to the person who said ronnie will never be a great because of his temperament i totally disagree. he will be remembered as the best ever. the stats will say hendry but the word of mouth passed down will be all about ronnie. most people agree he's a genius. i've never heard anyone apply that description to hendry.

I think this is true you only have to look at how everyone views Alex Higgins !

DoctorEdgeWild

I think Hendry is absolutely a genius! He has done more in the game of snooker thn Ronnie O'Sullivan. I am a big fan of ROS but facts speak for themselves and Hendry is so much more successful than ROS.

Ronnie will definitely be remembered long after the likes of Ebdon have retired but fact is, Ronnie is out of the championship because he lost the game and lost his head. Peter Ebdon is still in with a shout, in fact the only former chamion still to be in the competition so he is doing something right.

As for time wasting and diving not being accepted in football, its a different scenario. Both these things are illegal according to the rules of the sport. Looking at a shot is not illegal in snooker. According to the rules, the referee is perfectly entitled to hurry the players up. He chose not to do so.

padser

yeah but my original point is that the authorities that be in snooker should at the very least send a directives to referees telling them warn the player once, second offence he forfeits the frame and 3 he looses the match. Ebdon knew what he was doing was wrong, unsportsmanly like and (to use a soccer term) bringing the game into disprepute. To send a message to all would be cheats out there id send ebdon home, give murphy a by into final and give ebdon quarter finalists check and ROS semi finalist check. (i do realise its never going to happen im just saying id love to see it)

Firewalkwithme

Padser - the referee never warned Ebdon about the slowness of his play so how can you take the leap from a situation where there referee didn't warn him during the match to making the call after Ebdon has won, that he should be kicked out of the tournament? Besides if you want Ebdon kicked out wouldn't it make more sense to let Ronnie play the semi final match against Murphy? After all, it wouldn't be fair on the other finalist if Murphy didn't have to play a semi final and what about all the fans who bought tickets? I'm sure the BBC wouldn't be too happy about it either. As Michael Winner might say "Calm down dear - it's only a game"

Praetorian

I didn't see the match to be honest, but I'm sure Peter slowed it down to frustrate Ronnie. I also think this is a part of modern sport. Football teams will slow down / speed up the pace of a game to frustrate their opponents. Tennis players do the same. It's a part of the game. Ronnie is the best in the world, and should have been able to adapt. If Peters delay tactics were really over the top, then the referee should have said something to him.